Thailand agrees to British police help over murders

[kkup]

Let's hope those Pommie cops aren't just coming over for a few "shorttimes" and get some real work done.

[BangkokHank]

Run Nomsod run....

Thus far still just words.. Keep at them people.... You local islanders out there who truly know what happened keep e-mailing and spreading the word. Here's your chance.

There's plenty more that needs looking into. We should start a list.

Firstly all the missing CCTV footage.

Everybody's phone records that day. No doubt Nomsod used his FROM THE ISLAND.

Keep them coming people that's just a start..

I think this is a good idea: to make a list of discrepancies for the British police to look into. But we need to find a way to get such a list to the investigators. We can't just rely on hoping that they will read it here on Thai Visa. Can someone find out how people with information / ideas can contact these investigators directly? It would be good if they would set up some kind of "hotline". Just a dedicated email address for the case would be sufficient.

I think you can be fairly sure anything posted on this site is seen by both of the police forces.

Probably. But what about things that people know that don't get posted on this website? For that reason I think an anonymous hotline should be established.

[draftvader]

Does anyone know if they cremated the female victim yet?

The British forensic need to take their own fresh DNA from inside her.

If the Burmese sperm dna are in there and no sign of tampering its a closed case

What i would like to know is did the UK police do a forensic check on the 2 body's when the returned to the UK. This will be the deciding factor as the police in Thailand could tamper with samples.

Does anyone know if they cremated the female victim yet?

Yes, everyone who reads the news knows.

On the other hand, this thread illustrates fortune-telling at its worst, about what the British police WILL DO. As I write, Gen Prayut will return to Thailand in about two hours (mid-afternoon Saturday in Bangkok) and he will explain why about 95% of this thread is silly and non-operative.

So far the only people reporting this development about how British police are going to "help" are the British media. The Thai media is reporting what the British media is saying - and being quite whimsical and self-satisfied about it. This story from Cameron's spin doctors is not what most of you crime-solvers think it is. Stand by for a few hours, then recommence the comments, that's my thought.

.

To answer all of these questions. It is standard procedure for deaths in suspicious circumstances to do complete a coroner's report. This will include all the relevant evidence taking AND autopsy. At the moment the bodies arrived in England they knew this was a vicious crime so that would have happened. Even if, for some bizarre reason, it hadn't they did not release the bodies to the families for a number of weeks, during which time these forums have been alight with calls for justice. I doubt they would have missed those hints.

They have NOT been cremated as bodies HAVE to be buried when there is an unsolved crime. This allows for the body to be exhumed for further investigation. When I was younger a good friend "died" in suspicious circumstances (the case is still open nearly 20 years later) on his way home. We had to bury him due to this.

Edited October 18, 2014 by draftvader

[kinmaew]

God bless the poms and long live freedom of expression and human rights

[Krenjai]

Very good news. Good Luck to the British Police.

Have any of you read this translation regarding the primary witness Maung Maung, friend of the accussed ? I found this on the facebook page. I find his account of the time that he found his room mates asleep very interesting as the CCTV camera that captures the runner shows the time as 5:41.

MC Ko Myo Ko RFA : Where are you now ,Ko Mg Mg ?

KMM(Ko Mg Mg) : I am now Sou....(not clear)

RFA : hello . . hello . .(over the phone)

KMM : There were polices at least two or three to guard me .But last night there was no police at Sa... bangalow .So I think I am not safe and went to embassy .

RFA : What did the ask you at pre-trail yesterday ?

KMM : They asked me how much I know about the case.I answered I know what I know and I don't know what I don't know .I don't tell anything that I am not sure and tell everything what I know surely.I think they satisfied with me and accepted what I told them are truth.

RFA : why did they order you to appear as a witness and how much do you know about the case?

KMM : Because Win and Zaw are my friends and I drank beer with them near the crime scene that night.I went to my girlfriend after I finished beer .It was around 2AM .They stayed there. When I came back to my room about 5:40 ,they were sleeping. I did not know anything about the crime that night .Even in the next morning I didn't know what was happening although I saw many polices when I went to work and thought it was not my business . Polices said my hair style is like the running man on CCTV and asked me to run in front of CCTV .They released me then saying it is not me. At 1st October ,two police came to call me .I went along with them with no worries as I didn't do any wrong. Later I become a witness as I am friends of Win and Zaw and drank beer together with them.

RFA : While you were detained , were you beaten?

KMM : Yes.I was beaten three times. And I was given only two meal , a box of milk and two pieces of chaquay in three day while I was detained in Koh Tao.

RFA : How do you think about the translator when you were detained ? Can you please tell how he is?

KMM : I told him "I know I will be killed if somebody want ,but I will tell you what I know and I can't tell what I don't known.",at the very first.So, he did not threaten me and do nothing although polices beat me.

RFA : Now Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Tun are arrested for the murder .How do you think of them?

KMM : I don't believe they kill .Yesterday at court too ,I did not tell anything that is not true although they confessed at first .I don't believe they kill a human .And ,if you compare them with the two victims,they are a lot weaker in everything than the victims.

RFA : How do you feel about this case when your two friends are arrested and you were also detained ?

KMM : We asked Myanmars who are not concern with the case to go away before they arrest because me and many Myanmar nationals are arrested and torture by police.It is worst if you don't have a passport ,especially to Myanmars who run when they see a police as they don't have any legal documents .I have tried hard at my work,but now nothing of my hope for my life happens.

RFA : Now what do you plan to do and do you have a contact with your family?

KMM : I have determined to go back to Myanmar.My father ,mother and family are also willing me to come back and want to see me.I will go back to my village.

RFA : Where were you born ,Ko Mg Mg?

KMM : I am from Yathay Taung ,Rakhine State.

RFA : Thank you ,Ko Mg Mg for telling us .

Deplorable.

What is there left to say about the treatment of these lads.

"KMM : Because Win and Zaw are my friends and I drank beer with them near the crime scene that night.I went to my girlfriend after I finished beer .It was around 2AM .They stayed there. When I came back to my room about 5:40 ,they were sleeping."

EXACTLY, you brutally kill someone and then you go to sleep like a baby with no scratches, no bruises, no blood trail like OJ, nothing! Right yes?

Of course all posts on this forum are pure speculation what exactly the British officers can or are allowed to do on Koh Tao. but one thing I am convinced of: some people must be scared sh*tless they are coming. If the RTP obstruct them I am sure we will here ALL about it and that means this will not go away until justice has been served.

Hopefull!

[mrdome]

There might be hope left still... If the investigators are not hindered in their efforts. A lot of evidence been tampered with already, though.

[Number 3]

There might be hope left still... If the investigators are not hindered in their efforts. A lot of evidence been tampered with already, though.

The 'real deal' boys won't be on the ground here for another two weeks is the advised eta. Why the delay and is this not tantamount to giving the Thai coppers and mafia a head start? Not that they haven't had that already but straight up, expect mass destruction and loss of all evidence now.

[car720]

About bl00dy time!

It remains to be seen just how much 'help' will be permitted.

Exactly. I'm sure they will only be shown as little as possible, especially the contentious material, and requests for access met with ' no have ', ' cannot ' and other suitably weak excuses.

If it doesn't go well I sincerely hope the visitors don't get bound up by diplomacy and if appropriate make it clear they were not permitted to operate as they would have liked so their report is not as comprehensive as it should be.

One of my usual dumb questions I know but........

if they don't exhume the bodies then how will they know which DNA they are getting in the first place?

[mikosan]

OH YEAA

This is what we wanted all along, objective reached.

BIG thanks to everyone who made a fuss and helped get the word out.

For once its one up to the good guys.

It's not over till the fat lady sings!

I hope that the Brits will subject the alleged perpetrators AND the Thai Police who conducted the "interrogations" to a bona-fide Lie-Detector for starters. This will give them a very quick & accurate indication of what transpired. Then it is of the utmost importance to verify the integrity of the DNA testing process. After this, we will all know the truth.

The British Police do not use lie detectors, there is no provision in UK law for their use.

[Sviss Geez]

Advice for the Yard: screen detectives who

i) have visited SE Asia (e.g. travelled, holidayed), so that they are not distracted by culture shock

ii) are not susceptible to temptation (e.g. offers of money/girls/boys/trannies/drugs) to combat possible blackmail

iii) are resilient (so they are not easily fobbed off by road blocks, wild goose chases, delaying tactics, physical threats)

And let the local British Embassy appoint the detectives' own interpreters (so the detectives do not rely on Thai police interpreters)

The British police really do need advice from ThaiVisa posters about how to conduct whatever it is they will be allowed to conduct here. They may even be officially enlisting the help of a few people from this forum to their investigation.

[JLCrab]

Very good news. Good Luck to the British Police.

Have any of you read this translation regarding the primary witness Maung Maung, friend of the accussed ? I found this on the facebook page. I find his account of the time that he found his room mates asleep very interesting as the CCTV camera that captures the runner shows the time as 5:41.

<snip>

Deplorable.

What is there left to say about the treatment of these lads.

"KMM : Because Win and Zaw are my friends and I drank beer with them near the crime scene that night.I went to my girlfriend after I finished beer .It was around 2AM .They stayed there. When I came back to my room about 5:40 ,they were sleeping."

EXACTLY, you brutally kill someone and then you go to sleep like a baby with no scratches, no bruises, no blood trail like OJ, nothing! Right yes?

Of course all posts on this forum are pure speculation what exactly the British officers can or are allowed to do on Koh Tao. but one thing I am convinced of: some people must be scared sh*tless they are coming. If the RTP obstruct them I am sure we will here ALL about it and that means this will not go away until justice has been served.

Hopefull!

Guys always go to sleep after sex.

[scorecard]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I reckon those investigators are the ones who will need helmets and bullet proof vests. They will have a target painted on them for sure...

Does that mean they will be wearing a specific category of rubber wrist bands?

[Carrerakiss]

My rating for both David Cameron and General Prayuth Chan-o-cha has just stepped up a notch, very sensible approach by both men - they have done the right thing and IMO Thailand has restored "face"

Lets see how this pans out

The general was backed in to a corner and this is huge loss of face on his part.

Probably one of the worst things that can happen to Thai elite and on the world stage!

Personally, I disagree that this is a huge loss of face. If he did this willingly, then he has my respect.

He would have had more of my respect if he had done it before this point and if I didn't feel that he has only agreed because the British PM told him that the British have some conclusive evidence and if not invited in, they would publish and be damned.

[Krenjai]

There might be hope left still... If the investigators are not hindered in their efforts. A lot of evidence been tampered with already, though.

I don't think it will go like this, or....?

British Officer: We would like to interview the persons who refused to give a DNA sample.

RTP: Why? No need.

British Officer: Yes, but we still would like to do that.

RTP: Same same, no need.

British Officer: Can we also see all CCTV footage you have, including the Bangkok tapes?

RTP: No have.

British Officer: You don't have them anymore?

RTP: Yes.

British Officer: Ok, can we see them?

RTP: No have, all same same, no need.

If so, what will happen on Social Media? They have no choice and MUST collaborate IMHO.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Krenjai

[HughJass]

Cameron obviously said to Prayuth that the British forensic team has retrieved two sets of Asian DNA from the body of Hannah and have now taken swabs from the parents of the two Burmese lads in custody and there is no match so the game is up..there is no other option for Prayuth now than to let the Brits in and throw the RTP on Kao Tao to the wolves while stating that he was only acting on information given to him by police....looks like Somyot is toast

[docshock13]

If this report is true, it appears there may be some divisions forming between the police and the military government as both the Nation and BP report that Somyot will "bar" investigators (in one report) and that allowing foreign investigators to become involved is "tantamount to a breach of Thailand's sovereignty" (in the other report). Pretty strong words. Wondering if Prayut and Co. have decided to break ranks with the RTP to avoid committing political suicide domestically and save what's left of Thailand's reputation internationally?

Yes, it is very interesting.

I guess the General will sit down with Khun Somyot once he gets back and explain why the change of heart, whether it will be a "sorry, I caved in but they have a piece of evidence that proves your investigation result wrong" , or a " what the heck are you doing you moron, the Brits have evidence that the botched things....you're fired", I would be intrigued to know.

The General is going to need the police to help him run the country, whether he needs Somyot I have no idea.

Breaking ranks with the RTP at this point is the only logical and politically prudent thing for Prayut and Co. to do. If the UK investigators confirm RTP findings Prayut wins and can say "See? We had nothing to hide". If the UK investigators manage to find enough inconsistencies to bring into question the integrity of the RTP, Prayut still wins as he can say "I also had doubts, hence the foreign oversight. I now declare a war on police corruption. Thailand is safe, the military government credible, everyone can start booking their tickets to the new and improved LOS." HAHA.

[Eirene]

Very good news. Good Luck to the British Police.

Have any of you read this translation regarding the primary witness Maung Maung, friend of the accussed ? I found this on the facebook page. I find his account of the time that he found his room mates asleep very interesting as the CCTV camera that captures the runner shows the time as 5:41.

<snip>

Deplorable.

What is there left to say about the treatment of these lads.

"KMM : Because Win and Zaw are my friends and I drank beer with them near the crime scene that night.I went to my girlfriend after I finished beer .It was around 2AM .They stayed there. When I came back to my room about 5:40 ,they were sleeping."

EXACTLY, you brutally kill someone and then you go to sleep like a baby with no scratches, no bruises, no blood trail like OJ, nothing! Right yes?

Of course all posts on this forum are pure speculation what exactly the British officers can or are allowed to do on Koh Tao. but one thing I am convinced of: some people must be scared sh*tless they are coming. If the RTP obstruct them I am sure we will here ALL about it and that means this will not go away until justice has been served.

Hopefull!

Guys always go to sleep after sex.

What a deplorable comment!!

[docshock13]

Cameron obviously said to Prayuth that the British forensic team has retrieved two sets of Asian DNA from the body of Hannah and have now taken swabs from the parents of the two Burmese lads in custody and there is no match so the game is up..there is no other option for Prayuth now than to let the Brits in and throw the RTP on Kao Tao to the wolves while stating that he was only acting on information given to him by police....looks like Somyot is toast

Sorry I messed up the post. My reply is below.

Edited October 18, 2014 by docshock13

[SPB65]

It will be an eye opener for the Brits if nothing else. As long as they can learn the word "krap" and how to say it every other word with a slight difference of inflection they should be fine. The problem as always will be tiptoeing around the intricacies of Thai etiquette for the uninitiated. Basically, just treat them as spoilt brats with zero grasp of logic or decency.

[Carrerakiss]

There might be hope left still... If the investigators are not hindered in their efforts. A lot of evidence been tampered with already, though.

The 'real deal' boys won't be on the ground here for another two weeks is the advised eta. Why the delay and is this not tantamount to giving the Thai coppers and mafia a head start? Not that they haven't had that already but straight up, expect mass destruction and loss of all evidence now.

Prior Planning Prevents Pisspoor Performance.

I'm sure there will also be plenty of prior negotiation required with the Thai side over what will and won't be allowed, work permits to process etc. the General isn't even back in the country yet and of course he'll need to officially let Somyot know what's happening.

For the Thai police, I'm sure the delay, stall and slowdown tactics start right now. So that two weeks could become four.

[UncleE]

Thumbs Up for the positive comments.

[Sviss Geez]

What about fingerprints? I didn't see any mention of them, did anyone here notice any official report?

Although many post as though they do, or should do, no-one here sees any official reports about anything.

[docshock13]

My thoughts exactly HughJ! Will be interesting to see conclusions ofUK investigators and should a coverup be exposed to watch RTP close ranks and go head to head with the military. The fallout could lead to further instability in the short term.

[Jip66]

Pretty big deal in the scheme of things and doubtless some face lost, especially for the weak UK 'ambassador' to Thailand with his praise for the police's handling of the investigation. They'll get the runaround, no doubt, and it'll be like working with tetchy teenagers, but if the Thais do sandbag this (foregone conclusion) they could be looking at some interesting travel advisories.

Some people have to find something negative in everything!

I'm sure Mark Kent was involved in getting this result and I don't see he has a problem with the size of his gonads. If you don't have anything nice to say it's best to say nothing at all.

daveAustin: It is best just to appear stupid, than to open your mouth to confirm it!!!!

[Number 3]

Very good news. Good Luck to the British Police.

Have any of you read this translation regarding the primary witness Maung Maung, friend of the accussed ? I found this on the facebook page. I find his account of the time that he found his room mates asleep very interesting as the CCTV camera that captures the runner shows the time as 5:41.

<snip>

Deplorable.

What is there left to say about the treatment of these lads.

"KMM : Because Win and Zaw are my friends and I drank beer with them near the crime scene that night.I went to my girlfriend after I finished beer .It was around 2AM .They stayed there. When I came back to my room about 5:40 ,they were sleeping."

EXACTLY, you brutally kill someone and then you go to sleep like a baby with no scratches, no bruises, no blood trail like OJ, nothing! Right yes?

Of course all posts on this forum are pure speculation what exactly the British officers can or are allowed to do on Koh Tao. but one thing I am convinced of: some people must be scared sh*tless they are coming. If the RTP obstruct them I am sure we will here ALL about it and that means this will not go away until justice has been served.

Hopefull!

Guys always go to sleep after sex.

What a deplorable comment!!

Genuinely speechless over this ridiculous and indecent comment.

[catsanddogs]

Couldn't have woken up to better news.

[Carrerakiss]

If this report is true, it appears there may be some divisions forming between the police and the military government as both the Nation and BP report that Somyot will "bar" investigators (in one report) and that allowing foreign investigators to become involved is "tantamount to a breach of Thailand's sovereignty" (in the other report). Pretty strong words. Wondering if Prayut and Co. have decided to break ranks with the RTP to avoid committing political suicide domestically and save what's left of Thailand's reputation internationally?

Yes, it is very interesting.

I guess the General will sit down with Khun Somyot once he gets back and explain why the change of heart, whether it will be a "sorry, I caved in but they have a piece of evidence that proves your investigation result wrong" , or a " what the heck are you doing you moron, the Brits have evidence that the botched things....you're fired", I would be intrigued to know.

The General is going to need the police to help him run the country, whether he needs Somyot I have no idea.

Breaking ranks with the RTP at this point is the only logical and politically prudent thing for Prayut and Co. to do. If the UK investigators confirm RTP findings Prayut wins and can say "See? We had nothing to hide". If the UK investigators manage to find enough inconsistencies to bring into question the integrity of the RTP, Prayut still wins as he can say "I also had doubts, hence the foreign oversight. I now declare a war on police corruption. Thailand is safe, the military government credible, everyone can start booking their tickets to the new and improved LOS." HAHA.

If Somyot did accuse the General of breaching Thailands sovereignty, he may have overstepped the mark. It's tantamount to accusing him of treason, and I assume that is a pretty serious accusation to make.

Seems Somyot maybe playing every card he's got in a bout of bluster, but if he doesn't have anything more concrete than that, he may have a losing hand. Plus the guy he's playing against has guns n tanks n helicopters n stuff and at least in theory is the totalitarian leader of the country.

[sweatalot]

You can't compare this to the Blue Diamond issue. It's night and day. The only people here that will suffer in reality are a few cops and the killers (hopefully)

If you know about the blue diamond case, well...... you'll know who is allegedly involved, that's why people were bumped off.

Not so sure. Remember the KT influential persons connections go high, at least to the venerable Suthep, allegedly.

Also suggestions Head Man`s grandmother is bff with the Leader`s mum, allegedly

As to higher, that would be the succession question and unthinkable.

And junta Leader and his own appointed top cop already signed off on perfect investigation.

Absolute power, anything possible

Remember the KT influential persons connections go high, at least to the venerable Suthep, allegedly.

Also suggestions Head Man`s grandmother is bff with the Leader`s mum, allegedly

I'm tired reading of this allegedly high connections. Just hearsay - where is the proof?

[retarius]

How does anybody know that Cameron hasn't done a deal to have the British plod endorse the RTP findings? This would explain why Gen P was willing to allow the plod here in the first place. If plod come here and endorse the findings, all the higher ups are happy and Gen P owes Cameron one. Cameron is one slippery sob and a consummate liar.

[bannork]

It will be an eye opener for the Brits if nothing else. As long as they can learn the word "krap" and how to say it every other word with a slight difference of inflection they should be fine. The problem as always will be tiptoeing around the intricacies of Thai etiquette for the uninitiated. Basically, just treat them as spoilt brats with zero grasp of logic or decency.

That's a trifle unfair, there are some decent folks from the UK.