UK cops 'to only observe'

[Thaddeus]

So UK Media and/or authorities wanted to put to bed the conspiracy theories started by nonsense posts on Facebook without telling everyone they were being ridiculous but the Thai PM could care less about what these people choose to believe as it is now in the hands of the court.

It certainly did seem strange when the UK said they would participate -- being observers is not even common but generally the furthest one country is going to go to another on a criminal case like this.

And I'm sure you feel much safer making contributions now that the status has been reportedly set back to observe only.

Operative word being reportedly.

[wandasloan]

I can't decide if this a face saving article, or a u turning article............. Time will tell I guess.

Well, there's your problem right there, front and centre. You have picked up the dreadful Obama habit of presenting two false alternatives, neither of which is even valid. In this case, the third choice on your two-choice list is the correct one.

This is a "nothing has changed" article. It was the case last week. It was the case while Prayut was answering Dave's 20 Questions. It's the case now. Nothing has changed.

.

[JeremyBowskill]

I can't decide if this a face saving article, or a u turning article............. Time will tell I guess.

Well, there's your problem right there, front and centre. You have picked up the dreadful Obama habit of presenting two false alternatives, neither of which is even valid. In this case, the third choice on your two-choice list is the correct one.

This is a "nothing has changed" article. It was the case last week. It was the case while Prayut was answering Dave's 20 Questions. It's the case now. Nothing has changed.

.

so glad you sorted it out for me, oh wise one. Thanks

[JeremyBowskill]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

Will never happen because the British police are doing a decent job, they are not known for using scapegoats and biased investigations

The Birmingham 6 may argue, but essentially you are correct. Scapegoats are much less commonplace in the UK for sure.

[draftvader]

So UK Media and/or authorities wanted to put to bed the conspiracy theories started by nonsense posts on Facebook without telling everyone they were being ridiculous but the Thai PM could care less about what these people choose to believe as it is now in the hands of the court.

It certainly did seem strange when the UK said they would participate -- being observers is not even common but generally the furthest one country is going to go to another on a criminal case like this.

Here you are back in celebrating again. Funny how we didn't hear from you for a whole day whilst the media reported that you were (sorry) the case was going to be worked over by the UK police. Now that a ego-bruised leader has returned from his little "chat" in Italy he is trying to look good for the Thai media. He must be happy to be back in MCOT-land again. He has to know that this announcement will only survive for as long as the UK government wants it to. The international media know which parts of the UK media are reliable and they also know how little the Thai media can be trusted. Prayuth is suffering the hardest moments of his leadership and it is coming from an area he has proven himself ill equipped to deal with. I admired a fair amount about his actions earlier this year but feel his credentials as a statesman are being challenged and he is coming up short.....very short.

JTJ, it will swing again. I predict you'll go quiet again. There are numerous "suspicions" about your identity, of which nobody but you can be sure, but your behaviour on this certainly puts you very close to the heart of this matter. Were you too busy yesterday frantically calling people to post on ThaiVisa?

[brewsterbudgen]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

Will never happen because the British police are doing a decent job, they are not known for using scapegoats and biased investigations

Sarcasm, right?

[culicine]

I hope someone has informed the Thai police of the standard response to most questions is "no shit, Sherlock". That should go down well with Scotland Yard's finest

[alantheembalmer]

I bet the boys from The Yard only want to come to see what a "perfect" investigation looks like.

[JohnThailandJohn]

So UK Media and/or authorities wanted to put to bed the conspiracy theories started by nonsense posts on Facebook without telling everyone they were being ridiculous but the Thai PM could care less about what these people choose to believe as it is now in the hands of the court.

It certainly did seem strange when the UK said they would participate -- being observers is not even common but generally the furthest one country is going to go to another on a criminal case like this.

Here you are back in celebrating again. Funny how we didn't hear from you for a whole day whilst the media reported that you were (sorry) the case was going to be worked over by the UK police. Now that a ego-bruised leader has returned from his little "chat" in Italy he is trying to look good for the Thai media. He must be happy to be back in MCOT-land again. He has to know that this announcement will only survive for as long as the UK government wants it to. The international media know which parts of the UK media are reliable and they also know how little the Thai media can be trusted. Prayuth is suffering the hardest moments of his leadership and it is coming from an area he has proven himself ill equipped to deal with. I admired a fair amount about his actions earlier this year but feel his credentials as a statesman are being challenged and he is coming up short.....very short.

JTJ, it will swing again. I predict you'll go quiet again. There are numerous "suspicions" about your identity, of which nobody but you can be sure, but your behaviour on this certainly puts you very close to the heart of this matter. Were you too busy yesterday frantically calling people to post on ThaiVisa?

Neither celebrating (why would I) nor was I sorry (why would I be - should you be apologizing now) ... unlike some people, I don't believe every initial report I hear on this case or try to mold bits of information to fit what I want to believe.

Suspicions about my identity ... more conspiracy nutty talk.

Edited October 19, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[NongKhaiKid]

The Thai government needs to be called on their unauthorised comments in no uncertain manner and, for example, a travel advisory which goes beyond the usual notice of martial law etc but actually warns travellers their diplomatic representatives may not be able to help them because of restrictions and so on from the ' host ' government.

I think you'll find every informed traveler and country embassy advices citizens to leave their "we our more special" attitudes at home when visiting another country as they have absolutely no jurisdiction into criminal matters within other countries or much of anything else. Once you leave your own country you are bound by the laws and procedures of that country and highly doubtful your embassy will even provide an attorney without your paying ... they will however hold your hand for comfort from time to time but that is about it.

You are right about some aspects of diplomatic services. I have experience of an American who was arrested in Hong Kong and the consular officer who visited him handed over a list, in alphabetic order and without giving any recommendation, of lawyers he could contact but at his own expense. The only other assistance would be to inform relatives in the US if he wanted.

Unfortunately so many travellers, especially the less experienced, are very naive and don't consider things can be so different to where they come from.

There are also misconceptions as to what their embassy / consulate etc can do for them and usually expect more than they are likely to get.

Finally, how many tourists check the FCO website for info on their intended destination and without thinking rely on their travel agent who may not be too responsible.

Possibly the only effective way to reach people would be through television news broadcasts but still there's the ' won't affect me ' mentality.

[JohnThailandJohn]

So UK Media and/or authorities wanted to put to bed the conspiracy theories started by nonsense posts on Facebook without telling everyone they were being ridiculous but the Thai PM could care less about what these people choose to believe as it is now in the hands of the court.

It certainly did seem strange when the UK said they would participate -- being observers is not even common but generally the furthest one country is going to go to another on a criminal case like this.

And I'm sure you feel much safer making contributions now that the status has been reportedly set back to observe only.

Operative word being reportedly.

Nothing has been set back. UK are observers which I would think would be a step forward for you and what is a rational, logical and though not common, a normal way countries allow others to be involved in a local criminal case.

A glance at the other thread where it sounded like they would be involved, most of you still found reasons to whine and moan and be skeptical and formulate new conspiracies to continue in your minds the frame up of two admitted murdering rapists.

[carmine]

"Call me Dave" could have saved the UK a few bucks by just inserting the Beebs J Head there. That man has a head for trouble.

Jonathon Head also has a head for one sided bias in his reporting. The jumped up twits not worth listening too unless you are a red shirt.

[bongoz]

"Details of the agreement were yet to be worked out, but would involve "close coordination" between Thai authorities and the British Embassy in Bangkok, Col. Weerachon Sukondhapatipak, the deputy spokesman of Thailand's Army, said."

From ABC Australia

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-18/british-police-to-join-thai-investigation-into-tourist-murders/5824552

Edited October 19, 2014 by bongoz

[bertty]

The Thai government needs to be called on their unauthorised comments in no uncertain manner and, for example, a travel advisory which goes beyond the usual notice of martial law etc but actually warns travellers their diplomatic representatives may not be able to help them because of restrictions and so on from the ' host ' government.

I think you'll find every informed traveler and country embassy advices citizens to leave their "we our more special" attitudes at home when visiting another country as they have absolutely no jurisdiction into criminal matters within other countries or much of anything else. Once you leave your own country you are bound by the laws and procedures of that country and highly doubtful your embassy will even provide an attorney without your paying ... they will however hold your hand for comfort from time to time but that is about it.

You are right about some aspects of diplomatic services. I have experience of an American who was arrested in Hong Kong and the consular officer who visited him handed over a list, in alphabetic order and without giving any recommendation, of lawyers he could contact but at his own expense. The only other assistance would be to inform relatives in the US if he wanted.

Unfortunately so many travellers, especially the less experienced, are very naive and don't consider things can be so different to where they come from.

There are also misconceptions as to what their embassy / consulate etc can do for them and usually expect more than they are likely to get.

Finally, how many tourists check the FCO website for info on their intended destination and without thinking rely on their travel agent who may not be too responsible.

Possibly the only effective way to reach people would be through television news broadcasts but still there's the ' won't affect me ' mentality.

Oh has that <deleted> thing crawled out from under his rock again.

[Franky Bear]

"Call me Dave" could have saved the UK a few bucks by just inserting the Beebs J Head there. That man has a head for trouble.

Jonathon Head also has a head for one sided bias in his reporting. The jumped up twits not worth listening too unless you are a red shirt.

he's a penis. No time for him at all

[Johnsen]

For all those rebuttlers don't suppose you can write and or read Burmese. You should read what's being written in their blogs and it aint pretty for a few local islanders...

Names, dates, times.... Guess those who returned home to Burma aren't afraid to speak up now.... It doesn't just involve this case either.

There will be some people on that island whether they go to jail or not who will be running scared of the masses if and when they come. Guess this might b the straw that breaks the camels back. I wonder what its like to be the richest person in the cemetary.

[connda]

That didn't take long

[technologybytes]

The only way really for the UK Police to know for sure these men are truly scapegoats will be if the BIB slip up somewhere and show contradictory evidence.

In any major investigation there is always contradictory evidence, the legal process usually ensures that the unwanted evidence is inadmissible in a court for one reason or another so by the time it gets to a jury the evidence is less contradictory. With the UK police being involved at an early stage (meaning pre-trial) they will have to decide how much weight to give to each piece of evidence, trouble is that it's never the police job in the UK to do that, that's why we have the CPS and the courts.

If the UK police were permitted to decide who is guilty and who is innocent there would be a lot more innocent people in prison than there are.

[Oscar2]

With the language differences it will be tough for the Britcops to get to the truth....unless of course the Britcops picked to come speak and read Thai!

the British police will have fluent Thai and Burmese detectives or assistants with them. they are world-class police. they would not neglect this,

and for all the people doubting, the British police are already here, just like the police from other countries are here. they are always here observing the criminals from their own countries, looking for fraudsters, pedos, drug dealers and so forth committing International crimes. i wouldn't be surprised if one of them is already sitting at cafes, etc. waiting for Nomsod to leave a cigarette butt, or snag his drinking glass, etc. and collect some DNA. the British, Americans, Aussies, Germans, Dutch, Russians, etc. all have field ops in places in the world (like Thailand) where illegal activities occur. they keep a very low profile. there was an article one time about 2 or 3 years ago on how many American DEA agents, specialists in nabbing pedophiles, etc. are stationed in Chiang Mai alone...

as to the jurisdiction....well as others said, this is Thailand. but the British police can expose a cover up.

[JohnThailandJohn]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

Will never happen because the British police are doing a decent job, they are not known for using scapegoats and biased investigations

More than half of Britons believe there is a culture of cover-ups within the police.

http://news.sky.com/story/1196380/police-cover-up-wrongdoing-most-britons-say

Edited October 19, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[Franky Bear]

With the language differences it will be tough for the Britcops to get to the truth....unless of course the Britcops picked to come speak and read Thai!

the British police will have fluent Thai and Burmese detectives or assistants with them. they are world-class police. they would not neglect this,

and for all the people doubting, the British police are already here, just like the police from other countries are here. they are always here observing the criminals from their own countries, looking for fraudsters, pedos, drug dealers and so forth committing International crimes. i wouldn't be surprised if one of them is already sitting at cafes, etc. waiting for Nomsod to leave a cigarette butt, or snag his drinking glass, etc. and collect some DNA. the British, Americans, Aussies, Germans, Dutch, Russians, etc. all have field ops in places in the world (like Thailand) where illegal activities occur. they keep a very low profile. there was an article one time about 2 or 3 years ago on how many American DEA agents, specialists in nabbing pedophiles, etc. are stationed in Chiang Mai alone...

as to the jurisdiction....well as others said, this is Thailand. but the British police can expose a cover up.

Totally agree. I've no doubt out American friends may well be assisting off the radar with this too

[jpeg]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

Hardly apples and oranges is it? The British police do not come anywhere near having the worldwide reputation for incompetence and bribe taking as the R.TP. Wake up.

As to if a Thai was murdered in the UK, I very much doubt the Thai ship of constantly changing fools, that is all and any of their governments would give a sh1t.

Edited October 19, 2014 by jpeg

[draftvader]

So UK Media and/or authorities wanted to put to bed the conspiracy theories started by nonsense posts on Facebook without telling everyone they were being ridiculous but the Thai PM could care less about what these people choose to believe as it is now in the hands of the court.

It certainly did seem strange when the UK said they would participate -- being observers is not even common but generally the furthest one country is going to go to another on a criminal case like this.

Here you are back in celebrating again. Funny how we didn't hear from you for a whole day whilst the media reported that you were (sorry) the case was going to be worked over by the UK police. Now that a ego-bruised leader has returned from his little "chat" in Italy he is trying to look good for the Thai media. He must be happy to be back in MCOT-land again. He has to know that this announcement will only survive for as long as the UK government wants it to. The international media know which parts of the UK media are reliable and they also know how little the Thai media can be trusted. Prayuth is suffering the hardest moments of his leadership and it is coming from an area he has proven himself ill equipped to deal with. I admired a fair amount about his actions earlier this year but feel his credentials as a statesman are being challenged and he is coming up short.....very short.

JTJ, it will swing again. I predict you'll go quiet again. There are numerous "suspicions" about your identity, of which nobody but you can be sure, but your behaviour on this certainly puts you very close to the heart of this matter. Were you too busy yesterday frantically calling people to post on ThaiVisa?

Neither celebrating (why would I) nor was I sorry (why would I be - should you be apologizing now) ... unlike some people, I don't believe every initial report I hear on this case or try to mold bits of information to fit what I want to believe.

Suspicions about my identity ... more conspiracy nutty talk.

There is a certain "smug" factor to your post. The "sorry" was in parentheses and was referring to my "carefully" crossed out irrational instinct (still, I have a right to express it) as to your identity.

[TheCruncher]

*Edited*

What he should be doing is shirt fronting him in front of the world by upping travel warnings to Thailand and forcing insurance premiums up so people won't travel there until the British people get satisfactory answers and assurances that the investigation is above board and free of interference .

Edited once again

until the TV conspiracy brigade British people get satisfactory the answers they like to hear.

[IamNoone88]

He also told reporters that Cameron expected the British public to "take some more time to understand this matter".

How about "it will take some time before Thai authorities understands that this will not go away and the UK is watching and ............. judging"

[MaxYakov]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

Did someone state that Thailand is "expected to surrender all legal authority" to the UK? I believe you have contrived a "straw man" argument. Is this behavior habitual with you?

Edited October 19, 2014 by MaxYakov

[AGareth2]

this case will not be be "resolved"

Burmese workers will wake up and find they are no longer " slaves"(internet and world interest)

Thailand's rep will be further tarnished

tourists will still come and murders will still occur

[Tchooptip]

The only place that British police have jurisdiction is in Britain. They have no legal authority at all in Thailand.

Imagine the hoo haa if a Thai was murdered in the UK and the Thai government expected expected the UK to surrender all legal authority to a couple of visiting members of the RTP.

I don't believe anyone is asking for Thailand to surrender legal authority to anyone. Perhaps I missed something?

Yes for sure, you probably missed many many posts on this forum! ?

[chrisinth]

It always surprises me the number of people who believe without reservation, statements from the media which come from un-named sources.

Why would the initial report on this subject have to come from an un-named source?

Every time I read or hear this, especially from a government source, I can smell the cow pastures..................

Anyway, a word of warning to the British observers, unless they are fluent in the Thai language bring your own translators. I would imagine their range of involvement would be to observe, clarify and report only. I very much doubt they will be 'hands-on' in any way or form

[JohnThailandJohn]

*Edited*

What he should be doing is shirt fronting him in front of the world by upping travel warnings to Thailand and forcing insurance premiums up so people won't travel there until the British people get satisfactory answers and assurances that the investigation is above board and free of interference .

Edited once again

until the TV conspiracy brigade British people get satisfactory the answers they like to hear.

No matter what is said, they will hear what they want. And what they want is anything they can use or twist to help them handle their feelings of inferiority in Thailand by putting on a false sense of superiority towards in Thailand with more money and power than them actually pretty much anyone in Thailand down to the much more financially challenged Thai who as an example get to pay a couple dollars less to go to places like their own State Parks.

What seems clear in many of these folks posts is that they are not motivated by a desire to see justice for the victims but rather to display and promote an anger towards Thailand and a desire to see Thailand suffer.

It is as a clear cut case they got the right people in this case as it was for the train rapist murderer of the young girl .... initially suspects wrong, over looked the right person, conflicting stories in the press, confession, DNA match, friend's testimony and so on. But didn't see anyone then suggesting sending money to the suspect as I have seen with this case. They don't want to see justice, they want to see Thailand be proved wrong to help themselves feel good.