Police Complaint filed against new owners of Pattaya Golf Course

[webfact]

Police Complaint filed against new owners of Pattaya Golf Course



PATTAYA: -- A group of 32 shareholder members of a Pattaya Golf Course filed a Police Report against its new owners on Monday regarding a dispute over existing memberships which the new owners are alleged to be refusing to honor from the previous owners of the Course.

The Members, consisting mostly of foreign nationals, filed the report against the Phoenix Golf & Country Club, at Huay Yai Police Station and the report states that when the new owners of the Golf Course took over, they allegedly refused to allow existing members to continue using their memberships to play at the club, without any prior notice given to the members and later informed them they had to apply for new memberships.

Full story: http://www.pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/155656/police-complaint-filed-against-new-owners-of-pattaya-golf-course/


-- Pattaya One 2014-11-18

[RustBucket]

When you buy a business, you also buy its assets and liabilities. These members are both.

You buy a business as a going concern, you accept it has running memberships in place that you MUST honour.

But carry on doing what you are doing i true Thai greedy style. You will see what happens.... This is not the only golf club available.

[falangjim]

First world problems in a 3rd world country.

[JoeBlowFromUSA]

These foreigners came to Thailand to experience Thai culture and they found it.

[inzman]

Any business arrangement in Thailand is meant to have one winner and one loser. No such thing as two mutually satisfied parties. One scammer and one loser is the mantra. Welcome to LOS, land of scams.

[craigt3365]

Hmmm....I recognize a few of these guys. Best of luck. It's a really bad situation.

[RIJoe]

Why are they not pointing at the building?

[Chang_paarp]

Why are they not pointing at the building?

Because the police station is not a party to the dispute.

This is a dispute that has been simmering for quite some time, there may even be a thread in the golf section of TV about it for those who are interested. The folk who are making the complaint have been trying to negotiate with the owners for a number of moths.

[rickirs]

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When you buy a business, you also buy its assets and liabilities. These members are both.

You buy a business as a going concern, you accept it has running memberships in place that you MUST honour.

But carry on doing what you are doing i true Thai greedy style. You will see what happens.... This is not the only golf club available.

Like a buyer of a rented condo, the golf club buyer rights depend on the contract with the members. The golf club member rights can vary from heavily weighted in favor of the member to heavily weighted in favor of the buyer. For example,

1) Members pay for long-term or lifetime membership. Membership must be transferred on sale of the club to the extent of the term.

2) Members pay only annual fees. Beyond the annual anniversary membership doesn't have to be honored.

3) Members pay only monthly fees. Beyond the monthly anniversary membership doesn't have to be honored.

4) Members pay only for tee-off. Beyond the tee-off membership doesn't have to be honored.

5) Combinations of #1 with #2-4. Membership must be transferred on sale of the club to the extent of the term.

6) Other arrangements?

As you pointed out, club membership is an intangible asset. However, its value depends on the current and expected future income it generates. To the extent that a buyer can legally refuse to renew memberships, is there sufficient demand for memberships that no revenues would be lost in replacing current membership? This depends on membership demand. High demand means the buyer has an opportunity to quickly re-establish an income stream when terminating current memberships and raise membership fees to "market" values. If the golf course is the only game (pun) in town, this is a likely scenario. Low demand (ie., few golfers in the area, heavy competition) means a status quo on current and future income and the buyer will want to keep current membership happy. The scenario gets more complicated when the golf course can be rezoned to a different use entirely, ie., commercial or residential use).

[Sviss Geez]

It's a private golf club so the owners can do whatever they want regarding membership.

[scubascuba3]

It's a private golf club so the owners can do whatever they want regarding membership.

If that was the case no one would join a club in Thailand

[IAMHERE]

Their membership was with the old club, there is no obligation by the new owners. This is Thailand, not the west.

[JoeBlowFromUSA]

Their membership was with the old club, there is no obligation by the new owners. This is Thailand, not the west.

Correct. And the lesson here?

Don't do any business in Thailand.

[petercool]

Flame post removed. keep it civil please

[Baerboxer]

When you buy a business, you also buy its assets and liabilities. These members are both.

You buy a business as a going concern, you accept it has running memberships in place that you MUST honour.

But carry on doing what you are doing i true Thai greedy style. You will see what happens.... This is not the only golf club available.

Rubbish.

Would depend on the terms of what they purchased. I suspect they are customers not members i,e, this was not an organization owned by its members. They simply bought a membership package as a commercial transaction, which gave them certain benefits in exchange for money. That contract or membership agreement should confirm what happens in the event the business is sold or wound up. The new owners would have checked all that and it would have been taken into account in the purchase price.

However, Thai law may teat this differently to laws in other countries. Thai organizations can have a different perspective on customers too. Look at the logic at putting up prices to compensate for falling demand.

[Baerboxer]

It's a private golf club so the owners can do whatever they want regarding membership.

If that was the case no one would join a club in Thailand

They do though. Thai law is Thai law. They aren't into consumer protectionism or anything like that.

You pays your money, you takes your chances.

What they can and can't do would be covered in the membership agreement signed when joining. Private clubs are businesses not real members clubs in the Western sense. These private clubs often have very one sided terms of membership which many fail to read fully, IME.

[Pattaya28]

Thai business acumen at its best. P*ss your members off to the extreme.

[frollywolly]

These foreigners came to Thailand to experience Thai culture and they found it.

Their journey is far from over

[petercool]

A generic Thai bashing post removed along with a reply quoting it

[Benmart]

Why are they not pointing at the building?

Nothing of value here.

[SOTIRIOS]

....several quality tourists came to Thailand.....

...they plunked down good money for a membership.....

...someone decided to exercise his citizenship over them.....

...can't there just be 1 law....1 justice....for all.......???

[emilymat]

It's a private golf club so the owners can do whatever they want regarding membership.

If that was the case no one would join a club in Thailand

I fear Sviss is correct.

At my course in the UK the members do 'own' the club and the course is leased to them by a lord wh o owns the land. Obviously he is the club 'Honorary President"..

I am a 'member' of the nearby course and have no rights in respect of policy. The term 'member' has a quite different meaning here. It merely means you have a deal for either 'life' or annual -which appears does not have to be honoured by new owners.

I'll give you a current example. The 'life' members at my course Siam CC, have just been advised by letter that, from next December, they will be required to take a cart, whether they want it or not. That will add 750 baht to each round played, a clear income generation for the club. No consultation took place on this decision. Siam CC is generally a friendly place with good relationship between members and staff. The course has a tremendous annual 'membership tournament'. however, when it comes to financial decisions the 'members' have no input or say.

This issue at Phoenix has been going on for a couple of years, and has involved boycotts etc.

It's very sad, as I used to enjoy Phoenix around 15 years ago when a round cost you 600 baht and you received a voucher for a 50% reduction on your next round.

Good luck to this bunch of members, but I fear a lousy outcome for them.

[Loptr]

Good luck to the club attracting new members... They are going to need it once this story circulates...

[Ulic]

Of course the new owners should honour existing memberships. Unfortunately fairness has little to do with anything here.

The new owners will do what they want and the members will have to take legal action. Who knows how Thai law will

regard existing membership agreements but I don't think the courts will give two hoots about a bunch of wealthy ex-pats

who they think can afford to pay again. Like the 30-30-30 lease agreements and the guaranteed 8% real estate returns,

that are both not enforceable there are many scams here. The members may find out they are SOL.

[Robroona]

It's a private golf club so the owners can do whatever they want regarding membership.

Wrong, so wrong

[konying]

When you buy a business, you also buy its assets and liabilities. These members are both.

You buy a business as a going concern, you accept it has running memberships in place that you MUST honour.

But carry on doing what you are doing i true Thai greedy style. You will see what happens.... This is not the only golf club available.

Not always so.

It depends on the membership conditions and conditions of sale.

Ethically, yes new owners should give some notice, but ..............

However, it would appear this unhappy bunch do not have a single clue and will loose even more.

Non honoring membership is not a criminal matter and has nothing to do with police.

All police has done and will do and make a report, charge 20 baht for each copy and file it away.

[konying]

Many people get excited and pay for lifetime membership, but the truth is, it is not YOUR Life time, but CLUBS life time,

Change of owner can be translated into a new "life" therefore your membership is no longer valid.

They could argue its the same club, but all new owners have to do is change one letter in the spelling and its a new different club

Do not have to agree with this or like this, its just how it is and how it works.

[bartpix]

Thailand has laws to protect against wrongdoing and fraud. It just happens that some people choose not to follow up on their legal options. See ThaiVisa forum below:

Shocking Price Rises At Phoenix Golf Club Pattaya

Edited November 19, 2014 by Rimmer
Topic linked

[Loptr]

Many people get excited and pay for lifetime membership, but the truth is, it is not YOUR Life time, but CLUBS life time,

Change of owner can be translated into a new "life" therefore your membership is no longer valid.

They could argue its the same club, but all new owners have to do is change one letter in the spelling and its a new different club

Do not have to agree with this or like this, its just how it is and how it works.

Are you a Thai attorney practicing law in Thailand? If not, then this is your opinion, not Thai law...

As usual, the only people that will profit from this legal matter will be the lawyers...

[axact]

Why are they not pointing at the building?

Because the police station is not a party to the dispute.

This is a dispute that has been simmering for quite some time, there may even be a thread in the golf section of TV about it for those who are interested. The folk who are making the complaint have been trying to negotiate with the owners for a number of moths.

How many moths are the members after ?