Stop finding fault, Prayut says

[DaffyDuck]

How little you actually understand what is going on. Same same like in the gmo thread.

So tell me, will their little sojourn in power deliver anything of any real value?

Yes.

To continue with the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating because it suits them to have it that way?

Oh, I get it now - that's your problem, then - you apparently fail to realize that there are a great number of differences between the Prayuth government, and those why preceded him. The most notable being, that he is actually getting stuff done, and that he is starting to make a dent (small at first, but consistently growing larger) in the very system that you complain about.

It appears that you are the one advocating maintaining or returning to "the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating" while denying that there are differences here -- the irony is palpable.

[DaffyDuck]

Time for the army to return to the barracks and take the retired generals with them!!

This idea is all very well and I don't much like the country being run by the junta either. However the a General is right when he asks if people want an election tomorrow. There is so much so basically wrong in this country that most people do not really understand nor ever think about. The political parties are all clueless and none are ready to run the country - not even close. You have an country divided by wealth and corruption and just about every institutions a failure from monks to judges and the justice system.

The General is right that Thailand needs the skeleton of a workable system of administration before elections take place. The problem is the enactment of achieving that system is not looking like it is getting anywhere fast and some of the people in the NLA, well one in particular I happen to know of, is absolutely NOT a person fit for that job, with no ethics or professionalism to his character.

It does appear, though, that these individuals are allowed to hang themselves, and are slowly being removed. Pongpat was the most recent example. No sacred cows anymore, it seems.

I agree with your understanding of Prayuth's endeavors and goals, and the complete myopic misunderstanding of those critical of anything that has the word 'junta' or 'military' in association with the Army.

Would it make a difference if the monks had revolted and taken over, to them?

[Fat Haggis]

How little you actually understand what is going on. Same same like in the gmo thread.

So explain it to us all who bielieve this is just a power play seeing as you have clearly intimated that you know exactly what's going on ?

Thanks I look forwards to the truth now seeing as you know it?

[MexicanFarang]

"You shouldn't ask me when the election will be held or when we will leave. What am I?"

Where's the Chopped Liver, Dude?

[tbthailand]

How little you actually understand what is going on. Same same like in the gmo thread.

So tell me, will their little sojourn in power deliver anything of any real value?

Yes.

To continue with the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating because it suits them to have it that way?

Oh, I get it now - that's your problem, then - you apparently fail to realize that there are a great number of differences between the Prayuth government, and those why preceded him. The most notable being, that he is actually getting stuff done, and that he is starting to make a dent (small at first, but consistently growing larger) in the very system that you complain about.

It appears that you are the one advocating maintaining or returning to "the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating" while denying that there are differences here -- the irony is palpable.

the dysfunctional system is not democracy, but the system which has existed for decades through which the powerful partnership of the traditional elites and the military continue to undermine democracy and periodically rob the Thai people of their rights to self-governance.

And if you think that the current 'PM' is different from those who preceded him, well compared to governments chosen by the people, yes, there is a difference. Compared to other 'intervention' leaders, no, there is not a big difference at all.

[Thai at Heart]

How little you actually understand what is going on. Same same like in the gmo thread.

So tell me, will their little sojourn in power deliver anything of any real value?

Yes.

To continue with the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating because it suits them to have it that way?

Oh, I get it now - that's your problem, then - you apparently fail to realize that there are a great number of differences between the Prayuth government, and those why preceded him. The most notable being, that he is actually getting stuff done, and that he is starting to make a dent (small at first, but consistently growing larger) in the very system that you complain about.

It appears that you are the one advocating maintaining or returning to "the same corrupt disfunctional system they have kept on creating" while denying that there are differences here -- the irony is palpable.

Not at all. If they are going to go.through this process, then the changed may as well.be far reaching and genuine, not cosmetic.

I am not holding my breath and genuinely expect that after this latest round of army intervention, someone will commandeer the process again within 5 years and there will have to be another rewrite.

Why? Because history has shown that the constitution needs to be written to.catch ALL wrongdoing not just that of one side. It does need to put the army under civilian control, it does need to reform many institutions in thailand to make them genuinely independent from interference from all parties, pro and anti thaksin.

Will they achieve this? I doubt it.

Why are u so sure this coup will achieve real change when all others before haven't? What are the supposed massive differences between this junta an all others

Edited December 1, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[tbthailand]

Not at all. If they are going to go.through this process, then the changed may as well.be far reaching and genuine, not cosmetic.

I am not holding my breath and genuinely expect that after this latest round of army intervention, someone will commandeer the process again within 5 years and there will have to be another rewrite.

Why? Because history has shown that the constitution needs to be written to.catch ALL wrongdoing not just that of one side. It does need to put the army under civilian control, it does need to reform many institutions in thailand to make them genuinely independent from interference from all parties, pro and anti thaksin.

Will they achieve this? I doubt it.

Why are u so sure this coup will achieve real change when all others before haven't?

I agree with you that there will remain the threat of future 'interventions'. However, not because of the process used to write the constitution, but rather because nothing will fundamentally change in the current power structures which has allowed this political 'meddling' by generals.

The CDC could write a perfect constitution or a crappy one, the generals still remain a political player.

ps; ok, if a constitution is "perfect", then it would succeed in placing the military under civilian control and, if successful, that would remove generals as political players. It's necessary to consider that point, unfortunately, I don't see any reasonable possibility of this happening.

Edited December 1, 2014 by tbthailand

[DaffyDuck]

Why are u so sure this coup will achieve real change when all others before haven't? What are the supposed massive differences between this junta an all others

You know, I actually genuinely believe that you are absolutely not seeing the differences, because your preconceptions don't allow you to. This seems to be common.

It really won't make much of a difference over the next 2 years. PM me if you are interested to genuinely discuss this. Such a discussion does not belong here.

[Thai at Heart]

Why are u so sure this coup will achieve real change when all others before haven't? What are the supposed massive differences between this junta an all others

You know, I actually genuinely believe that you are absolutely not seeing the differences, because your preconceptions don't allow you to. This seems to be common.

It really won't make much of a difference over the next 2 years. PM me if you are interested to genuinely discuss this. Such a discussion does not belong here.

I am not asking for a War and Peace, a simple short answer would be OK.

Irrespective of other issues the reform still has to happen one way or another. U keep professing to be the only person with any insight on any matter on this board. Maybe u would prefer just to talk to yourself.

[DaffyDuck]

I'm far from the only person to grasp what's going on. Other have chimed in along the same lines. It's just pointless attempting a discussion with those like you, as you refuse to accept anything outside your narrative. The GMO thread indicates this clearly. So, why waste my time?

[tbthailand]

Why are u so sure this coup will achieve real change when all others before haven't? What are the supposed massive differences between this junta an all others

You know, I actually genuinely believe that you are absolutely not seeing the differences, because your preconceptions don't allow you to. This seems to be common.

It really won't make much of a difference over the next 2 years. PM me if you are interested to genuinely discuss this. Such a discussion does not belong here.

if current Thai laws allow it, why don't you indicate why this 'junta' is different?

In the details which surround Thai current event, yes there are some differences. Fundamentally, no, I don't see a difference between this junta and any since the 60s. In fact, the parallels to the late 70s leading to a decade of General Prem are rather striking.

In any case, it should hardly need to be pointed out that the window dressing from the 'NCPO' on "Why the 'intervention'" is just that, window dressing with no relationship to the real reason(s)

[Muirton]

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Google "criminal history of the shinawatras", there are 319,000 results for that search, should keep you busy for a while.

You will be shocked by quotes like -

"The current regime ruling over Thailand, led indisputably by unelected dictator, convicted criminal, fugitive, mass murderer, billionaire Thaksin Shinawatra, has for well over a decade been willing collaborators with Western interests. From before becoming prime minister in 2001, and throughout his 2001-2006 rule in office, up to and including today, Thaksin Shinawatra and his political machine have demonstrably served foreign interests, as well as their own, at great and continuous expense of the Thai people. "

You mean people would be shocked that Tony Cartalucci wrote that on a blog? And you try to present it as something legitimate and meaningful? oh, dear..

I mistakenly googled "criminal history of the Thai military", guess what?

About 2,780,000 results (0.57 seconds)

I Googled the same and got 2,790,000 results. My Google must be better !

The first listing was "Thailand in World War 2 - Wikipedia

Second listing was - Thaksin Shinawatra - Wikipedia

Third listing - Crime in Thailand - Wikipedia, and the first section is about the 2003 War on Drugs !

Fourth listing - Political Prisoners in Thailand (absolute red garbage)

Fifth and sixth listings - Robert Amsterdam - (absolute red garbage)

Seventh and eighth listing - Thai-Burma Railway

Ninth listing - Thailand's War with Vichy France

Tenth listing - BBC News- Thailand Profile - with mention of Thaksin and the Redshirts !

By the way Laz, considering you have only made 16 comments you are posting like a real pro ! Had any previous experience ??? alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20>

"By the way Laz, considering you have only made 16 comments .." Perhaps Laz has a life. Give it a try.

[Thai at Heart]

I'm far from the only person to grasp what's going on. Other have chimed in along the same lines. It's just pointless attempting a discussion with those like you, as you refuse to accept anything outside your narrative. The GMO thread indicates this clearly. So, why waste my time?

I asked you why you think this Junta is better than previous, and that it is apparently obviously so.

I await your proof, because so far, it's all quite underwhelming......I have a view, that is absolutely as valid as yours, but you choose to believe that you are the only person in the discussion with a valid view. Its a chat room, its for chatting. If you don't wish to chat, don't get annoyed when people ask you for an explanation of your view, and you choose not to provide one.

I think they haven't achieved much so far, and history would suggest that they won't. Please feel free to provide proof of any substantive changes they have made so far...

Edited December 1, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[DaffyDuck]

... and round and round he goes. I have explained why any further discussion with you is pointless.

I have had engaging discussions about this with several other members in PM. I won't with you.

[dieter1]

was there one coup, where it actualy did help a country? I know enough about the situation before. and I dont like

Thaksin, but we all know, that the unrest before the coup was just a successful try to justify the coup. the leaders of this unrest did say this oppenly!

To solve the problems, there is allways a time needed without military command. A coup just could be an interreign episode. But never solve the problems. Most times, it is just the brutal dictatorship of one group. Many times ,even the former supporters , after a while, look at it as a failure. Within military rule, in the best case, the development is just stopped. In many cases, the development goes in the wrong direction. I know, that most coups in Thailand arnt that much bloody. This is not "my" first one... But I am not that much optimistic, that it will help the country.

Edited December 2, 2014 by dieter1