After 18 years, executed Mongolian man found not guilty

[MW72]

I hope Thailand takes notice of this awful story.

Oh for Heaven's sake,is there no negative news that someone doesn't decide is directly connected to Thailand, and if anyone should take notice, when it comes to unsound convictions, the west has as much to take notice of as anyone else.

The list below is just those scheduled to die in the first few months of 2015 in Texas and they don't require much to sentence someone to death.

I shouldn't joke about something as horrible as state sanctioned execution but I couldn't help notice that there are 4 Black, 4 White and 4 Hispanics scheduled for execution next year. Do you think Texas is operating some kind of equal opportunities system on death row?

[Robert2006]

The death penalty is effective, maybe not for the prisoner but it certainly gives closure for the family of the victim. It’s a lot easier to say and believe you’re against the death penalty when you have never been faced with a crime like the horror of someone raping and killing your daughter.

I don’t know, thankfully I have never been affected by a situation like that but maybe the only peace and closure for families of victims of these types of crimes is to wipe that degenerate filth infecting our planet off the face of this earth.

You kind of contradicted yourself there. You said "It’s a lot easier to say and believe you’re against the death penalty when you have never been faced with a crime like the horror of someone raping and killing your daughter." . So how can you say that the death penalty is effective and gives closure for the families when you admit "I don’t know, thankfully I have never been affected by a situation like that"? If you can be pro death penalty without having been affected then surely others can be anti death penalty without having been affected?

I have no problem with those that are against the death penalty that is their decision, it’s a noble position, I don’t possess that level of compassion. I don’t want to be contradictory, I am for the death penalty for heinous crime; I knew that if my daughter was raped and killed and I was 100% certain of the perpetrator I would want that vile degenerate filth put to death.

Even thinking about that situation sickens me, if someone can go through an event like that and not want retribution then there a better person than I am, if I had my choice I would want that individual’s life extinguished.

[jacko45k]

exonerated, i'm so pleased for him.

i expect he's over the moon!

Whoopee, a headstone at last.

[Somtamnication]

Wow. His bones are jumping with joy!!

[JetsetBkk]

as was said by a smart guy ..better 10 guilty go free than the execution of 1 inoccent man.....

And then the 10 guilty go off and kill another 10...

So you are actually saying it is ok to execute innocent people right ?

I despair there are still people on this earth who agree with the death penalty though its a comfort that the common denominator is you rarely find a supporter of it to have a high IQ !

Where exactly did I say that?

Talk about low IQs!

[Traveler19491]

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as was said by a smart guy ..better 10 guilty go free than the execution of 1 inoccent man.....

And then the 10 guilty go off and kill another 10...

This is precisely why I oppose the death penalty. A simple Google search will confirm that the vast preponderance of research on whether or not the death penalty acts as an effective deterrent shows this not to be the case. While there are a very few isolated studies to the contrary, the evidence is overwhelming that the death penalty does little, if anything, to deter would be criminals. Life in prison, without the possibility of parole, is a much more effective means of dealing with the scum we are forced to live with, and is, in my opinion, a far worse fate. To those who would espouse the position that life in prison is equivalent to a paid vacation, I would simply point to my son's own experience. A very hard headed kid, he spent two years in maximum security for possession with intent (he was sentenced to five, knocked down to three for his voluntary surrender upon learning of the warrant, and reduced another one for his voluntary participation in a "boot camp" program that was extra hard on the participants, and earned them credit for good behavior and completion of the program). My son has related how hardly a day went by that someone wasn't beaten to a pulp by other prisoners, knifed, or gang raped. If that's your idea of a vacation, you might want to change travel agents.

I would also point to Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma City bomber. McVeigh wanted to be executed rather than spend his life in prison. So, we gave the murderer what he wanted. IMHO, the scum bag should have been forced to spend his life in general population, his life one endless progression of terrified days. The death penalty is forever. Since 2000, in the US alone, there have been 24 people released from death row after having their convictions overturned. That's 24 innocent people who would have died.

I am sure the guy who rapes and murders your children will be happy to hear you support him in his bid to avoid the death penalty.

Your "pithy" response is so typical of the small minds who fail to grasp what the death penalty is all about. It is not a deterrent, but state sanctioned revenge. Now, were I prone to seek revenge, then the last thing that I would want my child's murderer to have is the escape afforded by execution. No, those of us possessed of an IQ higher than a tomato are not seeking revenge, but justice. Justice is not served by putting the scumbag to death, but by forcing him, or her, to live in hell for as long as possible. Were my child to be murdered, I would experience an exquisite sense of equanimity each time I sat down to enjoy a nice steak, smothered in sauteed onions and mushrooms, coupled with a fine wine, knowing that his, or her, sorry ass can only look forward to more swill tomorrow. Every time I make love to my girlfriend, I will do so with the satisfaction of knowing that he, or she, has most likely had to endure a gang rape at some point in the not too distant past, or perhaps may get to enjoy such tomorrow. Each time that I walk out of my front door and, lock it, on my way to some pleasant endeavor, it will be with the satisfaction of knowing that he, or she, is on the other side of locked bars, and will never, ever enjoy the freedom that I enjoy, but will have their every action monitored and dictated to them. Every time I find serenity in a beautiful landscape, a lovely waterfall, a breathtaking sunset, it will be with a smile on my face, knowing that he. or she, will, once more, gaze on institutional walls, and that will be their landscape forever.

Death would release them, spare them the torment of perpetual isolation, permanently subjected to humiliation, trauma, harassment, physical and mental abuse, and such will be their fate for every single one of their remaining days on this earth. That, my minimally intellectually functional friend, is justice. A six foot deep hole is way, way too good for them. And on the off chance that they are not guilty, then I will have the satisfaction of knowing that my values afforded them the opportunity to regain their just freedom. You, on the other hand, have no problem with denying the innocent true justice, and are happy to condemn the innocent to death in your near sighted quest for revenge. Lame. But then I wouldn't expect much more from a person of such limited intellectual capacity.

[Robert2006]

Traveler19491 - As is usually the case with many polarizing issues both perspectives can be argued effectively as there is validity to each argument. The death penalty issue pro or con is an opinion it cannot be reduced to a singular perspective accepted by every individual.

Personally I could exist in almost any environment and find some happiness so I don’t share your perspective that a life prison sentence is satisfactory retribution for certain murder cases. I believe in an eye for an eye and the act of ending another individual’s life being the ultimate insult to humanity fitting of retribution in kind. A murderer should expect nothing less.

[wilcopops]

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as was said by a smart guy ..better 10 guilty go free than the execution of 1 inoccent man.....

And then the 10 guilty go off and kill another 10...

This is precisely why I oppose the death penalty. A simple Google search will confirm that the vast preponderance of research on whether or not the death penalty acts as an effective deterrent shows this not to be the case. While there are a very few isolated studies to the contrary, the evidence is overwhelming that the death penalty does little, if anything, to deter would be criminals. Life in prison, without the possibility of parole, is a much more effective means of dealing with the scum we are forced to live with, and is, in my opinion, a far worse fate. To those who would espouse the position that life in prison is equivalent to a paid vacation, I would simply point to my son's own experience. A very hard headed kid, he spent two years in maximum security for possession with intent (he was sentenced to five, knocked down to three for his voluntary surrender upon learning of the warrant, and reduced another one for his voluntary participation in a "boot camp" program that was extra hard on the participants, and earned them credit for good behavior and completion of the program). My son has related how hardly a day went by that someone wasn't beaten to a pulp by other prisoners, knifed, or gang raped. If that's your idea of a vacation, you might want to change travel agents.

I would also point to Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma City bomber. McVeigh wanted to be executed rather than spend his life in prison. So, we gave the murderer what he wanted. IMHO, the scum bag should have been forced to spend his life in general population, his life one endless progression of terrified days. The death penalty is forever. Since 2000, in the US alone, there have been 24 people released from death row after having their convictions overturned. That's 24 innocent people who would have died.

I am sure the guy who rapes and murders your children will be happy to hear you support him in his bid to avoid the death penalty.

this has to qualify as the lamest argument for death penalty that there is - the fact that this poster (csabo) has rolled out this cliche reveals how little he understands about JUSTICE systems and the effectiveness of the death penalty, resorting to the neanderthal concept of revenge instead.

Edited December 17, 2014 by wilcopops

[Traveler19491]

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Traveler19491 - As is usually the case with many polarizing issues both perspectives can be argued effectively as there is validity to each argument. The death penalty issue pro or con is an opinion it cannot be reduced to a singular perspective accepted by every individual.

Personally I could exist in almost any environment and find some happiness so I don’t share your perspective that a life prison sentence is satisfactory retribution for certain murder cases. I believe in an eye for an eye and the act of ending another individual’s life being the ultimate insult to humanity fitting of retribution in kind. A murderer should expect nothing less.

Thank you, for an intelligently stated opinion. While we don't share perspectives on this issue, me feeling that a truly evolved civilization does not need to resort to an "eye for an eye", I can certainly understand, and respect, where you're coming from. Might be nice to share a couple of beers and debate this some time. At least, at the end of it, we could part on friendly terms.

[hawker9000]

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as was said by a smart guy ..better 10 guilty go free than the execution of 1 inoccent man.....

And then the 10 guilty go off and kill another 10...

This is precisely why I oppose the death penalty. A simple Google search will confirm that the vast preponderance of research on whether or not the death penalty acts as an effective deterrent shows this not to be the case. While there are a very few isolated studies to the contrary, the evidence is overwhelming that the death penalty does little, if anything, to deter would be criminals. Life in prison, without the possibility of parole, is a much more effective means of dealing with the scum we are forced to live with, and is, in my opinion, a far worse fate. To those who would espouse the position that life in prison is equivalent to a paid vacation, I would simply point to my son's own experience. A very hard headed kid, he spent two years in maximum security for possession with intent (he was sentenced to five, knocked down to three for his voluntary surrender upon learning of the warrant, and reduced another one for his voluntary participation in a "boot camp" program that was extra hard on the participants, and earned them credit for good behavior and completion of the program). My son has related how hardly a day went by that someone wasn't beaten to a pulp by other prisoners, knifed, or gang raped. If that's your idea of a vacation, you might want to change travel agents.

I would also point to Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma City bomber. McVeigh wanted to be executed rather than spend his life in prison. So, we gave the murderer what he wanted. IMHO, the scum bag should have been forced to spend his life in general population, his life one endless progression of terrified days. The death penalty is forever. Since 2000, in the US alone, there have been 24 people released from death row after having their convictions overturned. That's 24 innocent people who would h ave died.

"A simple Google search will confirm that the vast preponderance of research on whether or not the death penalty acts as an effective deterrent shows this not to be the case." The reason why is clear to me. In most states they never apply the death penalty, they just sit on death row or it takes 10 or more years to execute the sentence. What kind of a deterrent is that... There should be an automatic appeal, if the appeal fails then complete the sentence...

The death sentence should not be considered a deterrent. It is simply a way of removing the offender from society.

Which means he won't be able to kill again. 'Works for me.

But the whole it's-not-a-deterrent thing is just activist palaver. If someone is deterred, that obviously means he DIDN'T murder! How do you count those? No. The whole non-deterrent argument is based on overall murder rates, which are the net result of many other factors besides "deterrence". A steady or even increasing murder rate can hide what might have been an even higher rate without the deterrence of capital punishment. Clearly some are not deterred by it, but that doesn't mean nobody is.

Furthermore, once CP is ruled out, advocates immediately proceed with their arguments against denial of parole. "Incarceration doesn't rehabilitate". "Prisoners who show remorse deserve another chance." "The prisoner was a victim of ethnic prejudice and a deprived background." "Prisoner X in Timbuktu was guilty of the same crime but only got 20yr." So the choice isn't actually between CP & Life: it's between CP and <who knows-to be determined>.

Finally, is it really better that 10 guilty go free rather than 1 gets wrongly executed? Really. 'Sounds simple, doesn't it? Let's see. How many do the 10 guilty go on to kill? If not 10, how about 100 guilty? How many more do THEY go on to kill? How about 1000. 10,000. 100,000. A million. Imagine, a million guilty going free, and killing however many... How many are actually sentenced to death as 1st time offenders anyway? Is it better that XX totally innocent persons die at the hands of all those released killers than the single one that would have been wrongly executed otherwise? People just love to repeat these catchy talking points without bothering to think out what they really mean. Edited December 22, 2014 by Scott

[sean in udon]

An interesting debate concerning the pros and cons of the death penalty.

This is where democracy truly kicks in.

If the majority believe a death sentence is appropriate for murderers, then it should be so.

If the majority consider a death sentence inappropriate, then so be it.

Personally, I'm all for killing scum. I know of burglars that have caused ridiculous amounts of stress/grief and I would happily see them die.

This thread contains aspects of many sides of the death sentence debate. We have to agree to disagree, we're all different.

And I've said before, we live in an imperfect world, mistakes are made.

Some of us can live with it, some of us can't.

As for those suggesting IQ has anything to do with ones understanding of this debate (roll my eyes).

[45slap]

Too little; too late.