Mother of children leaving

[SidJames]

I'm not married and we have two children under 4.

The mother is talking about leaving & going back to her village & has suggested that I take the children back to the UK.

I don't know what's brought this on & I've asked her to get professional help with her temper but to no avail.

She may just walk so I want to be prepared.

Can I just buy 2 plane tickets to the UK & just bring the children with me or will the mother actually have to sign something to satisfy Thai immigration when leaving? They have UK & Thai passports.

[robertthebruce]

I am no expert, but I do know the mother will have to sign the relevant documents

Hopefully over the coming days you will recieve more positive knowledge on this.

Sorry to hear of your predicament...

[Boo]

Best to get all the paperwork done before she goes. The likely hood is you don't have any parental rights. Can you confirm what process you went through registering the children's birth as that will clarify further. But you probably need to spend some money having custody documents drawn up.

[rabid old goat]

ask her why she feels its important for you and the children to leave the country.

[benalibina]

Go to the amphur and get the form with which the kids mother agrees you take them out of Thailand. They will authorise it. Take it together with the birtcertificates to the airport. Hopefully the familynames of the kids are similar to yours.

By the sounds of it, as you indicate the mental instability of the mother, better get it all done quickly before she heads off to the village and others might influence her to change her mind.

Good luck.

[Mario2008]

As others have said, get parental consent witnessed at the amphur if you want to leave the country with the children. At the airport they can ask you for this.

But another point that has been raised is that you might not be the legal parent of the children. see:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/381917-how-to-gain-parental-rights-as-a-father/

I would advise to sort that out first and maybe even try to get sole parental rights. Otherwise the mother can ask the children back from you at any moment.

[SidJames]

Both of the children have my surname & were both registered with the British embassy.

The oldest has been the the UK with both of us before the youngest was born.

The compromises that I make don't work & it is like negoiating with IS.

My partner's behaviour has become steadily worse towards me & she starting to not hold back in front of the children in comment.

Hopefully my having to leave with the children will never come to pass but it's becoming more likely.

I could understand more if she just wanted me gone.

In all likelyhood she will not 'not' give consent, she just will not help me in any way by agreeing to go to the amphur.

[colinneil]

Sid James please whatever you do put the children first !!

Sometimes adults fall out of love, sometimes think only whats best for themselves, but forget about the children.

Please put them first, they did not ask to be born. Many children suffer because of parents selfishness, dont let that happen.

[Mario2008]

Both of the children have my surname & were both registered with the British embassy.

The oldest has been the the UK with both of us before the youngest was born.

The compromises that I make don't work & it is like negoiating with IS.

My partner's behaviour has become steadily worse towards me & she starting to not hold back in front of the children in comment.

Hopefully my having to leave with the children will never come to pass but it's becoming more likely.

I could understand more if she just wanted me gone.

In all likelyhood she will not 'not' give consent, she just will not help me in any way by agreeing to go to the amphur.

In other words you are currently not the legal parent as far as Thai law is concerned. That the children have your last name and are registered with the embassy has no meaning.

If checked, and at the airport they do check from time to time, you will not be allowed to take the children abroad.

[VBF]

SJ

Very sorry to hear of your plight - I cannot personally help you, having no personal experience, but the very first thing I noticed was that you mention that "They have UK & Thai passports."

Is it possible that as they hold UK passports, then the Thais could not actually stop them getting on a direct flight to UK?

Giving regard to their visa situation, what if they left Thailand with the UK passports?

Regardless of how the Brit Embassy is perceived, I wonder if they would be able to clarify this?

As I say, I do not know, and have no personal experience but merely offering a suggestion or 2 - good luck to you.

[JMWPACIFIC]

Get the paperwork done ASAP. If she's genuinely offering you an out because she can't handle the situation, you may leave with ease. If not, let the blackmailing/extortion begin. Good luck

[shaurene]

If they have your surname I would think it ok but to be sure get your wife to sign a document at a lawyer office best to be sure than sorry. Is your wife on the menapores mid 40s. It would be hard to understand for you.

This is why Jesus Christ never got married, his Dad gave him the Eye Eye he f*#*#d up with the moulds.

[shaurene]

ask her why she feels its important for you and the children to leave the country.

I am sure he would have done this.

[CMBob]

Presuming you want to retain physical custody of the your children, presuming want to know what rights you have (or don't have) to take the children out of Thailand, and given there may be a concern that the mother may or may not take some action to affect either or both of those situations, there is only one intelligent thing you can do: go talk to a Thai lawyer who has at least some experience in family law. Asking for such important advice here, let alone acting on it, is probably rather foolish.

Edited February 16, 2015 by CMBob

[SOTIRIOS]

...when it doesn't 'pan out' the way she wanted....nobody else is of any consequence....

[davidmann]

Offer her money to get any paper work done ,that nearly always works with thai ladies , or,you could just try getting on BA flight using there english passport ,get one month return ,don't have to come back ,as they have your name ,when you get to england ,just go through with UK passport holders ,all you got to loose is money ,feel sorry for you ,but it has never been the land of smiles ,don't even know where that saying came from ,more like the land scams iv even seen thai lady trying to sell her children ,price of a iPhone ,she just wonted to start new life

[Suradit69]

Get the paperwork done ASAP. If she's genuinely offering you an out because she can't handle the situation, you may leave with ease. If not, let the blackmailing/extortion begin. Good luck

" If not, let the blackmailing/extortion begin. "

An entirely inappropriate comment since you know nothing about her. It was her suggestion that he take the children so it sounds like she's accepted that they would be better off with the father. That she is apparently suffering from stress for some reason, she may not be rational about everything, but jumping to the conclusion that she's looking to cash in on the situation (just because she's Thai) says more about you than anything we could possibly know about her.

[boughtoncestrian]

I took my daughter to UK. She also had a uk passport and thai passport. It would be in your own interest to have paperwork giving the mothers consent for you to take the children out of Thailand I had that, and had no problem. The children will have to leave Thailand on their Thai passports and board the aircraft on the uk ones. Going through Thai immigration is where they may or may not ask for the consent papers. If no papers they will not let the kids leave. Best of luck.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Copy of her ID card signed and dated, with her permission to take the kids to the UK written on the photocopy along with her phone number.

Birth cert with your name as the father, and their passports.

That's all you need to leave with them for a holiday abroad.

No need to go into any other details with anyone.

Edited February 16, 2015 by AnotherOneAmerican

[Jonmarleesco]

The one time I had my wife sign a letter, immigration didn't ask for anything, and since then, I've not taken any proof of consent when going back just with my son. But we are together, so I wouldn't like to claim for sure that you won't need one.

[davjenstephjess]

Hi,,i have done the same as you uk passport registered her in uk thai passport..my daughter has been to uk 3 times with me no problems at all,,,first time when she was2yr and 3 and 4yr..we go next month again...she leaves on her thai passport and enters uk on her uk one..no probs at all...just hand over my English passport and her thai one they stamp it and we walk thru no probs.....

[Liquorice]

Interesting reading.

A letter confirming the mothers consent to take the children to the UK seems obvious.........however, looking back I had 4 children, single parent, divorced.

I had sole custody but I used to take the kids everywhere, Europe, Jamaica, Cuba with just our passports, all the same surname and I never once got stopped

or queried about custody either when booking or boarding.

The youngest were 5 & 3. Good job they never asked as I never thought to take proof.

[MonkeySeeMonkeyDo]

How about a nice family trip to Sentosa, Singapore.

Ask wife along. Hopefully she'll decline and then get paperwork for exit

If no paperwork try exit for weekend away to Sungapore (suggest a package tour) and arrive into Bkk using their UK passports

You then have thirty days to leave en famille as UK citizens

[chickenrunCM]

As others have said, get parental consent witnessed at the amphur if you want to leave the country with the children. At the airport they can ask you for this.

But another point that has been raised is that you might not be the legal parent of the children. see:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/381917-how-to-gain-parental-rights-as-a-father/

I would advise to sort that out first and maybe even try to get sole parental rights. Otherwise the mother can ask the children back from you at any moment.

He is the leagal father, he doesnt need any paper from anybody, the kids are British citizen and can leave thailand whenever they want,

before writing nonsense here and scarring other people better be quite and dont talk if you dont know the law,

british passport means that one of the parents is british, and that the have he surname means there must be a british birth certificate also,

to get a passport for a kid both parents have to sign the application!

kids are british and can leave the country whenever they want, there is no law or possibility to deny this!

daily travel more than 5000 kids out of thailand with 1 parent only, never ever anybody will be ask for a permission.

if they have a thai passport with different names on it, of course the IMO should check and ask about the status of the adult, but if you can show that you are a parent than there will happend nothing.

Only a court order can stop a perent from traveling with his kids, nothing else!

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Only a court order can stop a perent from traveling with his kids, nothing else!

He isn't married to mom, so under Thai law isn't considered the father.

British law is great but he isn't in Britain, so it doesn't apply.

As for the US, Canada and the UK, you can't take your child out of those countries without the other parents consent.

It's considered child abduction.

[Boo]

chickenrunCM - I suggest to tone down your aggression & insults. I have removed several unhelpful, wrong & frankly dangerous posts.

Under THAILAND law, he is not recognized as the father. The mother can at any time remove the children & hand them over to whomever she choses & he will have no right to claim them back without a lengthy & expensive court case.

You are uniformed on THAI law, the fact of a British passport does not mean he is recognized as the father under THAI law.

He most likely can get on a plane with the kids & no one will ask him but IF they do, he will be in serious trouble if the mother doesn't confirm he can take them out of the country. That is not "rubbish" that is fact.

He could also come back here for a holiday in a few years & the mother could decide to keep the keep the kids here, he will not be able to do anything as he has no legal rights under THAI law.

[Forethat]

As others have said, get parental consent witnessed at the amphur if you want to leave the country with the children. At the airport they can ask you for this.

But another point that has been raised is that you might not be the legal parent of the children. see:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/381917-how-to-gain-parental-rights-as-a-father/

I would advise to sort that out first and maybe even try to get sole parental rights. Otherwise the mother can ask the children back from you at any moment.

He is the leagal father, he doesnt need any paper from anybody, the kids are British citizen and can leave thailand whenever they want,

before writing nonsense here and scarring other people better be quite and dont talk if you dont know the law,

british passport means that one of the parents is british, and that the have he surname means there must be a british birth certificate also,

to get a passport for a kid both parents have to sign the application!

kids are british and can leave the country whenever they want, there is no law or possibility to deny this!

daily travel more than 5000 kids out of thailand with 1 parent only, never ever anybody will be ask for a permission.

if they have a thai passport with different names on it, of course the IMO should check and ask about the status of the adult, but if you can show that you are a parent than there will happend nothing.

Only a court order can stop a perent from traveling with his kids, nothing else!

Different surnames appears to be the triggering factor for being asked to provide documentation when you attempt to depart a country with young children as a single parent.

After 3,5 years of doing exactly this I believe I've gathered enough statistical evidence to form a qualified opinion, and here it is:

If you travel with young children who doesn't have your surname you WILL be asked to show the correct documentation when you leave Thailand. Furthermore, when you enter UK you WILL be asked to show the correct documentation again. In fact, I have NEVER left Thailand or entered UK without having to do this. Not once. Fact.

If you travel to or from a country who has signed the Hague Abduction Convention, you will need the birth certificate and an affidavit from the other parent confirming that the child may travel with that you, copies of the ID card or passport of the mother, and her contact details. Read more here:

http://www.hcch.net/index_en.php?act=text.display&tid=21

Here's a list of participating countries:

http://www.hcch.net/index_en.php?act=conventions.status&cid=24

However, and this needs to be considered by anyone who for any reason ends up in a situation like OP: even if you manage to get her to sign documents at the amphur and leave Thailand with the child/children you will end up in a legal vacuum since documentation from a Thai amphur is more or less disqualified as evidence of single custody. This will, for instance, create a massive issue when you need to renew their passports as signatures from both parents are required.

Edited February 24, 2015 by Forethat

[Chuckles78]

Offer her money to get any paper work done ,that nearly always works with thai ladies , or,you could just try getting on BA flight using there english passport ,get one month return ,don't have to come back ,as they have your name ,when you get to england ,just go through with UK passport holders ,all you got to loose is money ,feel sorry for you ,but it has never been the land of smiles ,don't even know where that saying came from ,more like the land scams iv even seen thai lady trying to sell her children ,price of a iPhone ,she just wonted to start new life

Perhaps it would be best to get the mothers consent. Without you may be "kidnapping" the children. I'm not sure if Thailand is part of the international treaty, but if they are the UK may well hand your children back should the mother change her mind and you will face other problems.

[paz]

Can the OP explain how the kids have his surname on they Thai documents? They would need to leave with their Thai passports. Is it possible that Thai and UK passports show different names ?

That is more a curiosity than else, I agree with what Mario2008 and Boo have said before.

Edited March 7, 2015 by paz

[wisemonkey]

Sid James please whatever you do put the children first !!

Sometimes adults fall out of love, sometimes think only whats best for themselves, but forget about the children.

Please put them first, they did not ask to be born. Many children suffer because of parents selfishness, dont let that happen.

Because of parents selfishness? You think its better for a child to grow up in a house where their mother and father are not happy and always arguing? Its not a selfish thing to want to be genuinely happy and want your kids to grow up in genuinely positive environment, please open your mind things arent always black and white.