OliverKlozerof Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 [Originally I posted this in 'DIY Housing' forum, which was not really appropriate....] --------- Apologize for asking newbee / beginner question, but... Say I wanted to build or buy a small, 1 or 2 br house not far from the beach south of Hua Hin somewhere. I'm not in a relationship (let alone married), to a Thai. Is there something like a trustworthy lawyer/law firm who would (for a fee), be the"legal" 51% Thai owner? (Seems like I heard the requirement is something like that; but again, I'm totally green on the subject.) Or, is there some other way to proceed??[something like this may have been asked before. If so, links...?] Thx, DP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post cooked Posted March 16, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted March 16, 2015 My wife owns our house since before I appeared on the scene. If I was living alone I would never go in for one of these doubtful '51% Thai ownership schemes. Rent. Move when you get unpleasant neighbours. You can buy a house boat as a Farang, that's the only way I would think about buying a place to live here. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert24 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Most law firms will be familiar with this. You can purchase property/land through a company and you own 49% of shares in this company. Recommend you speak to a lawyer to go through the details. Basically despite owning less than 50% you can control the company by having preferred shares. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forkinhades Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 ^Yes indeed, any lawyer can do this for you. Better to get a recommendation though. I have purchased property this way before, 15 years ago. Things have changed a little, mainly from 7 shareholders down to 4, from memory. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langsuan Man Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 You don't need to have "preferred" shares, just dilute the number of shareholders so that you have a "voting" majority, then you will be elected "Director" and thus control the company You must understand though that there is a lot of controversy over this system since you have two different laws competing with each other On one side you have the Department of Business Development, under the Ministry of Commerce who "license" these companies and allows them to own property in the business name On the other you have the Land Office which may or may not restrict what type of property can be owned by these companies and each one can set their own requirements The best option for the OP is to try and obtain property via a long term lease (30 year legal limit) or even better, via a usufruct, which allows the control and use of the property for your lifetime Unfortunately in many cases Thai landowners and developers will not "sell". / lease their property since most want to get in and get out, something they cannot do with a lease or usufruct. This is because the long term lease or usufruct becomes part of the chanote (title deed) and legally they and their heirs must honor the terms. So the most clearly legal way to "control" property in Thailand, is not always available to foreigners 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dotpoom Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I bought my house in this manner.........am as happy as Larry.....I don't focus on future possible changes that could be problematic, If I did I would never have ventured as far as I have .....I simply deal with life as it happens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louse1953 Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 My wife owns our house since before I appeared on the scene. If I was living alone I would never go in for one of these doubtful '51% Thai ownership schemes. Rent. Move when you get unpleasant neighbours. You can buy a house boat as a Farang, that's the only way I would think about buying a place to live here. You can certainly buy or build a house,but not own the land it sits on.Rent is the way to go. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark T Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 You don't need to have "preferred" shares, just dilute the number of shareholders so that you have a "voting" majority, then you will be elected "Director" and thus control the company You must understand though that there is a lot of controversy over this system since you have two different laws competing with each other On one side you have the Department of Business Development, under the Ministry of Commerce who "license" these companies and allows them to own property in the business name On the other you have the Land Office which may or may not restrict what type of property can be owned by these companies and each one can set their own requirements The best option for the OP is to try and obtain property via a long term lease (30 year legal limit) or even better, via a usufruct, which allows the control and use of the property for your lifetime Unfortunately in many cases Thai landowners and developers will not "sell". / lease their property since most want to get in and get out, something they cannot do with a lease or usufruct. This is because the long term lease or usufruct becomes part of the chanote (title deed) and legally they and their heirs must honor the terms. So the most clearly legal way to "control" property in Thailand, is not always available to foreigners This is enlightening. Many thanks. I understood previously that companies under foreigners are not allowed to do so! duhh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langsuan Man Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 This is enlightening. Many thanks. I understood previously that companies under foreigners are not allowed to do so! duhh. Covered by post in Ask the Lawyer here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/723747-land-ownership-by-thai-company/?p=7778088&hl=land+ownership 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stgrhe Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 OP, yes you can! As you probably are aware off, you cannot get the title for the land in your name as foreigner, with a couple of very rare exceptions, are not allowed to own land in Thailand. However, you can get a possesory right for the land. If you want to have the building in your name then the best possesory right is a SUPERFICIES right as this right is the only right that clearly state that you may build on someone elses land. The superficies can be had for life or for 30 years. However, there are no specifit title deeds for houseings and you need to carry out a correct procedure. Get a good solicitor. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Pinot Posted March 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted March 17, 2015 Let me put in my 2 baht: The answer to your question is...NO. Never buy property in Thailand. It's a buyers market to rent. It's cheap and when you have to leave, you leave. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forkinhades Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 A lawyer has just said yes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken George Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Renting in your case is the best option. Age is a factor too. If you rent to can move around easily without being as I have seen with other people being a prisoner of their own home. When they want to sell and move they can't get a buyer. When they need some capital they find its stuck in the house. Ofcourse if you love Hua Hin and have lived there for years or vidited often and you have Big money then buy via a scheme that others have outlined here already. Good luck either way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangmaiRob Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I bought a house with the land in my gf's name, she is also the mother of my 2 kids, and the house in my name. She has a 30 year "loan" from me to buy the land and I have a 30 year lease on the land from her, all done legally through a reputable lawyer. After 30 years I won't be caring too much by then so it will all be hers and the kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langsuan Man Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I bought a house with the land in my gf's name, she is also the mother of my 2 kids, and the house in my name. She has a 30 year "loan" from me to buy the land and I have a 30 year lease on the land from her, all done legally through a reputable lawyer. After 30 years I won't be caring too much by then so it will all be hers and the kids. Just make sure you have a simple Will drawn up and registered at your Amphur, leaving everything you have in Thailand to her, naming the kids as beneficiaries, in the case she predeceases you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post 12DrinkMore Posted March 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted March 17, 2015 Renting in your case is the best option. Age is a factor too. If you rent to can move around easily without being as I have seen with other people being a prisoner of their own home. When they want to sell and move they can't get a buyer. When they need some capital they find its stuck in the house. Ofcourse if you love Hua Hin and have lived there for years or vidited often and you have Big money then buy via a scheme that others have outlined here already. Good luck either way. There is always a buyer at the right price. Loads come here with the Farang "got to buy property" mindset, often prompted and blinded by the little long haired girl, "why waste money on rent, we (sic) can buy a house". They spend way too much, then chuck another wad in home improvements, and finally expect to make a large profit on selling. There is way more property that is for sale than you see advertised. Owners have become discouraged and resigned to being unable to sell. Rent, rent and rent again. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maderaroja Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Check out the "Usufruct" agreement that is legal in Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Thunderbirds20 Posted March 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted March 17, 2015 Give up on the house idea and buy a nice condo, ...you can have it in your own name! ...and forget about building a house, .... it will take longer than projected and cost a lot more, ..ie - I built a house and store that was supposed to cost 1.5 to 2 million baht and take 6 months to complete! It ran over 7 million baht and was still not complete after 2 years! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xylophone Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 You don't need to have "preferred" shares, just dilute the number of shareholders so that you have a "voting" majority, then you will be elected "Director" and thus control the company You must understand though that there is a lot of controversy over this system since you have two different laws competing with each other On one side you have the Department of Business Development, under the Ministry of Commerce who "license" these companies and allows them to own property in the business name On the other you have the Land Office which may or may not restrict what type of property can be owned by these companies and each one can set their own requirements The best option for the OP is to try and obtain property via a long term lease (30 year legal limit) or even better, via a usufruct, which allows the control and use of the property for your lifetime Unfortunately in many cases Thai landowners and developers will not "sell". / lease their property since most want to get in and get out, something they cannot do with a lease or usufruct. This is because the long term lease or usufruct becomes part of the chanote (title deed) and legally they and their heirs must honor the terms. So the most clearly legal way to "control" property in Thailand, is not always available to foreigners "You don't need to have "preferred" shares, just dilute the number of shareholders so that you have a "voting" majority, then you will be elected "Director" and thus control the company". It is my understanding that it is not quite that simple and anyway you may well "control the company" but you don't own the land! In a "link to the lawyer" they also state that the 51% Thai ownership and 49% foreign ownership of the company is allowed, however what they don't mention is that the 51% Thai ownership/directors have to prove that they have actually invested 51% of the value of the company in that vehicle, and that is what has put off many so-called "Thai shareholders" in setups such as these, because the authorities have been checking in some cases and want proof of the "Thai shareholders" investment. I also believe that setting up a company purely for the purposes of owning property is not legal. Always willing to hear other viewpoints, but that is my understanding and it has also been, IMO, backed up in other threads. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csabo Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I bought a house with the land in my gf's name, she is also the mother of my 2 kids, and the house in my name. She has a 30 year "loan" from me to buy the land and I have a 30 year lease on the land from her, all done legally through a reputable lawyer. After 30 years I won't be caring too much by then so it will all be hers and the kids. Just make sure you have a simple Will drawn up and registered at your Amphur, leaving everything you have in Thailand to her, naming the kids as beneficiaries, in the case she predeceases you Quick way to getting your brake lines severed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csabo Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Renting in your case is the best option. Age is a factor too. If you rent to can move around easily without being as I have seen with other people being a prisoner of their own home. When they want to sell and move they can't get a buyer. When they need some capital they find its stuck in the house. Ofcourse if you love Hua Hin and have lived there for years or vidited often and you have Big money then buy via a scheme that others have outlined here already. Good luck either way. There is always a buyer at the right price. Loads come here with the Farang "got to buy property" mindset, often prompted and blinded by the little long haired girl, "why waste money on rent, we (sic) can buy a house". They spend way too much, then chuck another wad in home improvements, and finally expect to make a large profit on selling. There is way more property that is for sale than you see advertised. Owners have become discouraged and resigned to being unable to sell. Rent, rent and rent again. Good advise. In Phuket there are new construction projects and sales billboards everywhere. You would think the market was exploding. Had a friend in real estate here, was down from Chiang Mai to try to get some of the "action". He said the phone never rang once for MONTHS. Imagine you buy preconstruction and you are the only one. Money gone. Imagine you buy post construction and you are the only one. Management gone. Yes, I am not talking about a private home but the trappings of that have been made clear here also. The neighbors being the most likely issue. Then, with a depressed sales market you are stuck. Rent, rent, rent. If you buy you can't fly. If you are one of those really level headed guys who can withstand anything then use that to your advantage and negotiate a multi year lease for a deep discount but still don't buy. I was offered 2 homes on one plot with sea views for a very affordable rent but the owner demanded a 10 year lease two years cash up front. That's too long to commit to for me but maybe you can find a deal like that. Good luck. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smotherb Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Most law firms will be familiar with this. You can purchase property/land through a company and you own 49% of shares in this company. Recommend you speak to a lawyer to go through the details. Basically despite owning less than 50% you can control the company by having preferred shares. Yes, Thai lawyers will help you circumvent the laws, but if the deal goes South for any reason, you lose; unless you're prepared to pay even more money to another lawyer. Plain and simple, quasi-legal ways to circumvent a law are illegal under the law. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forkinhades Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 OP has been answered. //TOPIC CLOSED// If anybody wants it reopened PM me with a valid reason 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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