Selling Timeshare In Thailand

[Nawtilus]

Stayin 'cool' lol

I wonder how many customers Lickalot confused '<deleted> off' with also

[bazmlb]

Only job lower than Timeshare sales, Boiler room share trading that i hear is still going on in Thailand, thought they would have got on top of that crap by now.

At least TS sales people sell something that exists.

[likeitalot]

Likeitnot, You can't even read(or spell), Im the 56 year old with interst like woman(my GF), AND STAYING COOL in THAILAND (from the HEAT, ja IDIOT!).

I don't dislike you I feel SORRY for an "eg" like yourself.Getting your rocks of yet?

Oh dear samui getting personal arent we?

Please dont be so sad and embarrass yourself about spelling, which is a tedious comment anyway without reading your own above........

and i note in your autobiography you failed to mention the age of your fair lady....

[SamuiJens]

Answer to likeitnot, she's 44, is that a problem?

[taxin]

Likeitnot, You can't even read(or spell), Im the 56 year old with interst like woman(my GF), AND STAYING COOL in THAILAND (from the HEAT, ja IDIOT!).

I don't dislike you I feel SORRY for an "eg" like yourself.Getting your rocks of yet?

Oh dear samui getting personal arent we?

Please dont be so sad and embarrass yourself about spelling, which is a tedious comment anyway without reading your own above........

and i note in your autobiography you failed to mention the age of your fair lady....

Just like you are embarrassing yourself by accusing posters of being off topic, and then continue it yourself by bringing girlfriends into it ?

What a complete clown you are !!

[Martin]

I was interested to see someone describe top hotels as a system of selling a $20 product for $500.

Actually, I found that the umpteen-star Yak and Yeti Hotel in Kathmandu was selling a $40 dollar product ($20 for the room and $20 for the breakfast) for $500.

To help a shoestring expedition of Lithuanians with their country's first go at Everest, I was in Kathmandu getting things organised before the team's arrival in Nepal. (Later, I was to hold the highest managerial position on Earth, as their Manager Of Advanced Base Camp.)

I didn't pay the $500. I had just as adequate a room, and just as comfortable a bed, in a guesthouse along the street for $20, and used to go to the Y&Y and pay $20 for the buffet breakfast, which filled me up for the day.

It beats me why people pay so much for 'exclusivity'.

The same happens on the Everest Trek. You can go at a very sensible cost from lodge to lodge, with your own guide and porter, or you can be conducted in a self-contained group at an enormous price.

We were having a great evening in a lodge one night, when an American doctor came knocking, because he had been told that the lady whose lodge it was might be able to sell him some batteries for his flashlight.

We invited him to sit till the lady could pause in her cooking to serve him batteries from her cupboard.

An hour later, after asking a few questions of us, he said "I am paying a lot of money to miss out on a lot of fun, by being 'insulated' in that group."

I said "True."

[steveromagnino]

Your point on financial logic is further evidence of the typical mistakes by people with limited financial reasoning abilities.

Let me teach you....

lets say your 300 went up at 15% compounded, hotel price inflation also goes up at 8-10%(do the google) this is the bit that the anti timeshare and maths simpletons miss out.......timeshare is actually an upgrade of lifestyle deal that also hedges hotel inflation, so if you are a family who usually rent 2 rooms at say 150 or 200 usd x2 rooms youre looking at 7x400

=2800 going up at 8-10% per year so thats $3080, $3388, $3726,$4099 and lets just stretch 6th year....you would have spent $ 18801 ANYWAY on poxy hotel rooms....

INTEAD

youve laid out $15000 + $2625(taxin's 15% maintenance) = $17625

[b]CHEAPER[/b]

OK, so now you have me interested.

What you are telling me is with timeshare, I pay $15k upfront, let's say $300 a year in maintenance, and in total this costs me $17625.

Or...I pay year by year, and this will cost me $18801, which over 5 years is more. Fair enough.

EXCEPT, as a time share salesman, I would have thought you would understand TVM. Time Value of Money. This is where you are misleading me, and where you make your money.

In fact, the average investor can make let's say 7% a year on their money. Certainly no bigger assumption that knowing that every year for 5 years, someone will take 2 weeks vacation.

With Timeshare, we have to pay almost all the money upfront; and money today is worth more than money tomorrow; money paid in 5 years could have been invested in the bank, in shares or something else. So with a discounted cashflow rate of 7%...

Timeshare cost = $17,022, or discounted CF of $16,627 (discount rate 7% per year, I have no idea how you got to your number, I've assumed $300 matinance per year increasing at a rate of 15% p.a.)

Hotel cost = $18,801, or discounted CF of $15,220.

Oh no. Hotel is cheaper, gives you more flexilibility and doesn't have that initial 'hit' upfront with uncertainty.

on the other hand, I have 'invested' in the membership so I can sell it off, and that should impact the decision. However, after 5 years, in order to make the investment stack up, the membership would need to raise $1407 ($16627 - $15220) in today's money; when we use NPV calculation, we can estimate that since in 5 years from now, $1407 will only be worth $1000 in today's money, in fact we will need $1973 ($1407 * (1+0.7)^5).

Since we know that the secondary market for these investments is around that, we can assume that time share is certainly not a wise financial decision, but not necessarily a bad one either; it all depends on the individual case.

Re. strawman 'doctors and lawyers are buying this'. This is the standard technique also used by Amway, cigarette companies and Ponzi schemes - if doctors and lawyers are doing something, they are smart and clever so I should do what they are doing.

If you can prove that the majority of holidaying doctors and lawyers choose to invest in timeshare vs. staying in hotels, then I will listen.

Otherwise.... I will continue to believe that timeshare mostly is based on the non financial appeal of being able to holiday as part of some membership to access certain resorts. It is not a particularly astute financial investment, and smart people recognise it as such. Dumb people are usually sold it on the basis of financial soundness, and hence I stand by the assertion most timeshare sales are scum.

Including the fancy hotel chain sales people. Marriot is the only one I have had the displeasure of listening to, and once their financial analysis fell over on a NPV calculation, there wasn't much point in me listening further. Just as well for both them and me.

[~G~]

hotel price inflation also goes up at 8-10%

No, they don't. Average daily rates (ADR) can rise and decline from one year to another. Sometimes the declines are VERY significant. On the long term, I'd say about only 2% rise a year, which is less than what a safe, conservative investment protfolio can do.

Oh and Ive still got the timeshare for another 20-freehold amount of years to sell, pass to the kids etc

Second hand timeshares are selling for 20%-30% of the price they were bought, if they manage to sell at all. Taking into consideration the TVM, as explained by steve, shows even a bigger loss.

[~G~]

we can assume that time share is certainly not a wise financial decision, but not necessarily a bad one either; it all depends on the individual case.

Two problems with your analysis:

1. The hotel inflation rate DOES NOT rise 8%-10% a year. Let's get the facts right.

2. Secondary market is very problmatic: low liquidity, supply exceeds demand in such a way the make the units fall to 20%-30% of their original value, high costs to sell - advertisments or large comissions (you only have one or few units to sell, you cannot afford the marketing expenses those companies have).

Add those consideration, and it can be easily seen that buying a timeshare unit from the timeshare companies is a BAD FINANCIAL DECISION in all cases.

Edited September 4, 2006 by ~G~

[taxin]

Your point on financial logic is further evidence of the typical mistakes by people with limited financial reasoning abilities.

Let me teach you....

lets say your 300 went up at 15% compounded, hotel price inflation also goes up at 8-10%(do the google) this is the bit that the anti timeshare and maths simpletons miss out.......timeshare is actually an upgrade of lifestyle deal that also hedges hotel inflation, so if you are a family who usually rent 2 rooms at say 150 or 200 usd x2 rooms youre looking at 7x400

=2800 going up at 8-10% per year so thats $3080, $3388, $3726,$4099 and lets just stretch 6th year....you would have spent $ 18801 ANYWAY on poxy hotel rooms....

INTEAD

youve laid out $15000 + $2625(taxin's 15% maintenance) = $17625

[b]CHEAPER[/b]

OK, so now you have me interested.

What you are telling me is with timeshare, I pay $15k upfront, let's say $300 a year in maintenance, and in total this costs me $17625.

Or...I pay year by year, and this will cost me $18801, which over 5 years is more. Fair enough.

EXCEPT, as a time share salesman, I would have thought you would understand TVM. Time Value of Money. This is where you are misleading me, and where you make your money.

In fact, the average investor can make let's say 7% a year on their money. Certainly no bigger assumption that knowing that every year for 5 years, someone will take 2 weeks vacation.

With Timeshare, we have to pay almost all the money upfront; and money today is worth more than money tomorrow; money paid in 5 years could have been invested in the bank, in shares or something else. So with a discounted cashflow rate of 7%...

Timeshare cost = $17,022, or discounted CF of $16,627 (discount rate 7% per year, I have no idea how you got to your number, I've assumed $300 matinance per year increasing at a rate of 15% p.a.)

Hotel cost = $18,801, or discounted CF of $15,220.

Oh no. Hotel is cheaper, gives you more flexilibility and doesn't have that initial 'hit' upfront with uncertainty.

on the other hand, I have 'invested' in the membership so I can sell it off, and that should impact the decision. However, after 5 years, in order to make the investment stack up, the membership would need to raise $1407 ($16627 - $15220) in today's money; when we use NPV calculation, we can estimate that since in 5 years from now, $1407 will only be worth $1000 in today's money, in fact we will need $1973 ($1407 * (1+0.7)^5).

Since we know that the secondary market for these investments is around that, we can assume that time share is certainly not a wise financial decision, but not necessarily a bad one either; it all depends on the individual case.

Re. strawman 'doctors and lawyers are buying this'. This is the standard technique also used by Amway, cigarette companies and Ponzi schemes - if doctors and lawyers are doing something, they are smart and clever so I should do what they are doing.

If you can prove that the majority of holidaying doctors and lawyers choose to invest in timeshare vs. staying in hotels, then I will listen.

Otherwise.... I will continue to believe that timeshare mostly is based on the non financial appeal of being able to holiday as part of some membership to access certain resorts. It is not a particularly astute financial investment, and smart people recognise it as such. Dumb people are usually sold it on the basis of financial soundness, and hence I stand by the assertion most timeshare sales are scum.

Including the fancy hotel chain sales people. Marriot is the only one I have had the displeasure of listening to, and once their financial analysis fell over on a NPV calculation, there wasn't much point in me listening further. Just as well for both them and me.

The calculation that scamalot did was based on the room being $150 to $200 and for 2 rooms, my calculation was for 1 week (i.e. 1 room). This means it would have to be a 2 week timeshare which would be double the ammount, the only "$200 a night" standard timeshare around is Marriott and that will set you back at least $20,000 a week x 2 = $40,000. Then theres your maintenance, this would be in the region of $600/800 a year for each week. Thats close to 50K for a timeshare over 5 years. Hardly beating the $18,000 is it ?

Reality is the $150-$200 is just another sales man spiel, yes sure it makes financial sense but only if the timeshare week they are selling is worth $200 a night. When the rep is selling to the unsuspecting punter will be taken to whats called the "show apartment", this is NOT what the new owner will be staying in however, the client will be under the illusion that he will, this is how the sales rep always gets away with his $200 a night spiel.

So we have Scamalot blatantly lying about what they will get, then he comes on to TV saying how stupid they are for not doing the maths ? Its nothing to do with maths, you lied to them !!

In timeshare the weeks they sell are generally worth no more than the maintenance fee they are paying, in some cases the maintenance fee alone can be more than the cost of the week for Joe Public walking off the street.

To call it an investment is a joke !

[likeitalot]

hotel price inflation also goes up at 8-10%

No, they don't. Average daily rates (ADR) can rise and decline from one year to another. Sometimes the declines are VERY significant. On the long term, I'd say about only 2% rise a year, which is less than what a safe, conservative investment protfolio can do.

Sorry 'G' but you are typical in just making assumptions that fit ur case....as with most of the people i am discussing this in this forum if you were my guest i would nt waste the time presenting to you...(but i am at loose end so dont mind sparring with u all)

of course i am talking of a trend over 3-30 years not when sars in in town which is what some people use to say rates go down...but get back to asian boom time and check rate increase

check this its no timeshare site its the economist....brought up by google hotel price inflation average....

check out the graph of common items relating to inflation.....OH HOTEL PRICE INFLATION IS THE HIGHEST!!!!

http://www.economist.com/printedition/disp...Story_ID=457272

i quote

The obvious answer is that everything has risen hugely. The obvious answer would be wrong. Since 1900 average consumer prices in America have indeed risen 20-fold, an average of about 3% a year. But the variations are large. Our colleague’s hotel room in New York cost him $8 a night in 1900; the same hotel would charge $600 today, a 75-fold leap.

[likeitalot]

Your point on financial logic is further evidence of the typical mistakes by people with limited financial reasoning abilities.

Let me teach you....

lets say your 300 went up at 15% compounded, hotel price inflation also goes up at 8-10%(do the google) this is the bit that the anti timeshare and maths simpletons miss out.......timeshare is actually an upgrade of lifestyle deal that also hedges hotel inflation, so if you are a family who usually rent 2 rooms at say 150 or 200 usd x2 rooms youre looking at 7x400

=2800 going up at 8-10% per year so thats $3080, $3388, $3726,$4099 and lets just stretch 6th year....you would have spent $ 18801 ANYWAY on poxy hotel rooms....

INTEAD

youve laid out $15000 + $2625(taxin's 15% maintenance) = $17625

[b]CHEAPER[/b]

OK, so now you have me interested.

What you are telling me is with timeshare, I pay $15k upfront, let's say $300 a year in maintenance, and in total this costs me $17625.

Or...I pay year by year, and this will cost me $18801, which over 5 years is more. Fair enough.

EXCEPT, as a time share salesman, I would have thought you would understand TVM. Time Value of Money. This is where you are misleading me, and where you make your money.

In fact, the average investor can make let's say 7% a year on their money. Certainly no bigger assumption that knowing that every year for 5 years, someone will take 2 weeks vacation.

With Timeshare, we have to pay almost all the money upfront; and money today is worth more than money tomorrow; money paid in 5 years could have been invested in the bank, in shares or something else. So with a discounted cashflow rate of 7%...

Timeshare cost = $17,022, or discounted CF of $16,627 (discount rate 7% per year, I have no idea how you got to your number, I've assumed $300 matinance per year increasing at a rate of 15% p.a.)

Hotel cost = $18,801, or discounted CF of $15,220.

Oh no. Hotel is cheaper, gives you more flexilibility and doesn't have that initial 'hit' upfront with uncertainty.

on the other hand, I have 'invested' in the membership so I can sell it off, and that should impact the decision. However, after 5 years, in order to make the investment stack up, the membership would need to raise $1407 ($16627 - $15220) in today's money; when we use NPV calculation, we can estimate that since in 5 years from now, $1407 will only be worth $1000 in today's money, in fact we will need $1973 ($1407 * (1+0.7)^5).

Since we know that the secondary market for these investments is around that, we can assume that time share is certainly not a wise financial decision, but not necessarily a bad one either; it all depends on the individual case.

Re. strawman 'doctors and lawyers are buying this'. This is the standard technique also used by Amway, cigarette companies and Ponzi schemes - if doctors and lawyers are doing something, they are smart and clever so I should do what they are doing.

If you can prove that the majority of holidaying doctors and lawyers choose to invest in timeshare vs. staying in hotels, then I will listen.

Otherwise.... I will continue to believe that timeshare mostly is based on the non financial appeal of being able to holiday as part of some membership to access certain resorts. It is not a particularly astute financial investment, and smart people recognise it as such. Dumb people are usually sold it on the basis of financial soundness, and hence I stand by the assertion most timeshare sales are scum.

Including the fancy hotel chain sales people. Marriot is the only one I have had the displeasure of listening to, and once their financial analysis fell over on a NPV calculation, there wasn't much point in me listening further. Just as well for both them and me.

The calculation that scamalot did was based on the room being $150 to $200 and for 2 rooms, my calculation was for 1 week (i.e. 1 room). This means it would have to be a 2 week timeshare which would be double the ammount, the only "$200 a night" standard timeshare around is Marriott and that will set you back at least $20,000 a week x 2 = $40,000. Then theres your maintenance, this would be in the region of $600/800 a year for each week. Thats close to 50K for a timeshare over 5 years. Hardly beating the $18,000 is it ?

Reality is the $150-$200 is just another sales man spiel, yes sure it makes financial sense but only if the timeshare week they are selling is worth $200 a night. When the rep is selling to the unsuspecting punter will be taken to whats called the "show apartment", this is NOT what the new owner will be staying in however, the client will be under the illusion that he will, this is how the sales rep always gets away with his $200 a night spiel.

So we have Scamalot blatantly lying about what they will get, then he comes on to TV saying how stupid they are for not doing the maths ? Its nothing to do with maths, you lied to them !!

In timeshare the weeks they sell are generally worth no more than the maintenance fee they are paying, in some cases the maintenance fee alone can be more than the cost of the week for Joe Public walking off the street.

To call it an investment is a joke !

Toxin youre the joke......you have to rely on someone else who at least can do sums(G) to help you but then YOU mislead everyone...

I never said every timeshare was good and it isnt... but u r saying they are all bad..

but lets just take any of the top chains as an example as you have done.....their hotel rooms do cost circa $200 worldwide and i did not mislead anyone i used the example of a family with kids needing two rooms...

its horses for courses....in their case it would work out to be a decent investment BUT eveyone is missing the point.....the good ones will significantly enhance your vacation as you are no longer in a 28 sqm room but typically a 2 bed 100 sqm aprtment with kitchen laundry etc.....you only have to go online and do a search of positive timeshare experience to hear people rave about it........

but dont waste ur time coz im sure they are all stooges....

[likeitalot]

OK, so now you have me interested.

What you are telling me is with timeshare, I pay $15k upfront, let's say $300 a year in maintenance, and in total this costs me $17625.

Or...I pay year by year, and this will cost me $18801, which over 5 years is more. Fair enough.

EXCEPT, as a time share salesman, I would have thought you would understand TVM. Time Value of Money. This is where you are misleading me, and where you make your money.

In fact, the average investor can make let's say 7% a year on their money. Certainly no bigger assumption that knowing that every year for 5 years, someone will take 2 weeks vacation.

With Timeshare, we have to pay almost all the money upfront; and money today is worth more than money tomorrow; money paid in 5 years could have been invested in the bank, in shares or something else. So with a discounted cashflow rate of 7%...

Timeshare cost = $17,022, or discounted CF of $16,627 (discount rate 7% per year, I have no idea how you got to your number, I've assumed $300 matinance per year increasing at a rate of 15% p.a.)

Hotel cost = $18,801, or discounted CF of $15,220.

Oh no. Hotel is cheaper, gives you more flexilibility and doesn't have that initial 'hit' upfront with uncertainty.

on the other hand, I have 'invested' in the membership so I can sell it off, and that should impact the decision. However, after 5 years, in order to make the investment stack up, the membership would need to raise $1407 ($16627 - $15220) in today's money; when we use NPV calculation, we can estimate that since in 5 years from now, $1407 will only be worth $1000 in today's money, in fact we will need $1973 ($1407 * (1+0.7)^5).

Since we know that the secondary market for these investments is around that, we can assume that time share is certainly not a wise financial decision, but not necessarily a bad one either; it all depends on the individual case.

Re. strawman 'doctors and lawyers are buying this'. This is the standard technique also used by Amway, cigarette companies and Ponzi schemes - if doctors and lawyers are doing something, they are smart and clever so I should do what they are doing.

If you can prove that the majority of holidaying doctors and lawyers choose to invest in timeshare vs. staying in hotels, then I will listen.

Otherwise.... I will continue to believe that timeshare mostly is based on the non financial appeal of being able to holiday as part of some membership to access certain resorts. It is not a particularly astute financial investment, and smart people recognise it as such. Dumb people are usually sold it on the basis of financial soundness, and hence I stand by the assertion most timeshare sales are scum.

Including the fancy hotel chain sales people. Marriot is the only one I have had the displeasure of listening to, and once their financial analysis fell over on a NPV calculation, there wasn't much point in me listening further. Just as well for both them and me.

Sorry i credited G with the good maths ...mistake it should have been Steve's decent maths..

I have found exactly what you have just shown me even when i have had smart financial people (lots and lots of investment bankers) who all do npv which i had not overlooked

(but this level is beyond most timeshare sales people and poster for that matter so they do not know how to talk it thru...)

They always miss simple points they would normally see in their desire to be clever and negative...

You don stop going on holiday in 5 years that was just a responsed to an example....

just extrapolate to 8,9,10, 12 lets say max 15 years your hotel expenditure...

taking 11 years as a reasonable period of use you would have spent $30,000+ many people have and use them much longer.......plus residual value or what responsible salepeople would prefer to say, dont worry about selling it, pass it to your kids...if they dont want then sell

And then you do the second error is use 7%...for your investment and ignore tax....im sure a few will be interested if you can give 7% after tax with very little capital risk..(not stock market gamble)

But at least you got beyond the morons who just say its all shit and dont ask themselves why so many top people buy TS, which i know they do....

and i note now your are saying most timeshare salesmen are scum...well maybe 51% are but that still leaves maybe 49% who are not, (same goes for the product) which is my point.......

so that's progress, i was feeling so low about myself

[~G~]

if you were my guest i would nt waste the time presenting to you...

And that would have been a very clever step, since there is not a slight chance I'd buy anything from you

check this its no timeshare site its the economist....brought up by google hotel price inflation average....

check out the graph of common items relating to inflation.....OH HOTEL PRICE INFLATION IS THE HIGHEST!!!!

http://www.economist.com/printedition/disp...Story_ID=457272

LOL. Lecturing people about financial logic and cannot even add 1 + 1...

According to YOUR own data, hotel rooms prices rose only 5.8% between 1900 and 2000. That is not even close to your claimed 8% to 10%. And that is in New York, hardly an average vacation site, nor a representative measure, and over a century, which is not a time to measure ROI. Nobody goes for vacations for 100 years. 15-20 years is the acceptable period for long term investment.

So Let's have a look at the second chart, that shows prices change during 1990 to 2000, which is more relevant. Even in New York, the rise was 70% over the last decade. That is less than 5.5% a year, again, not even close. And that does not include the slowdown in 2001-2003.

And even that pathetic 5.5% or 5.8% (the S&P did over 10% a year on average in the last 40 years) is completely irrelevant. If Phuket gets too expensive and crowded, people go to vacation in Samui, they don't just pay higher and higher prices. When Samui gets too expensive people switch to Ko Phangan or Ko Chang,. There is NO GAIN in timeshare, JUST LOSS, except for the companies who sell them, and for the agents who manage to con people into buying them.

[fxm88]

Don't forget that the latest is the "resale scam": cold-calling suckers who already own timeshares, knowing that they're probably desperate to unload it, and offering to sell the timeshare -- for a fee, of course, payable in advance.

Why bother trying to find new suckers when it's so much easier just to keep conning those who have proven to be easy prey in the past?

[backflip]

"i am not inexperienced and for 3 years I sold to doctors, bankers, CEO's, schoolteachers, accountants...some very clever financial people who did thir own spreadsheets etc."

Clever, perhaps. Bright, informed? I'm not sure.

Not a week goes by that a US newspaper as a story of how a famous rich person gets scammed by buying inappropriate investments. IMHO, that includes a timeshare.

When I got the timeshare presentation, the sales price was $15,000 per week, with several "per week" mandatory fees:

- reservation fee (yup, I'd get charged if I simply reserved "my" condo): $200

- network fee (yup, if I wanted to "trade" weeks and used their network, I'd get charged: $200

- use fee (yup, if I showed up and used my condo, I'd get charged): $200

- maintenance fee (yup, if I used the condo or not, I'd get charged): $200

The development was brand new, and I asked if I could pay fair market value for a unit. The salesperson laughed, and turned me down. He knew that selling a condo by the week was a grade A method to print money. If you take the price per week, and multiply by the number of weeks, the sales price was five times that of a similar non-timeshare condo.

[pschef]

Just wise up guys, old lady or man wanting to find a eutopia ins Spain or some place like that. oh let buy one of those?? they al got the scam or scum. wishing they could live a life inthe sun, sorry back to the bills and whatever. less 15 000 bor pen yang

[Martin]

Timeshare is clearly a crazy "investment".

What guarantee is there that hotel development is not just a bubble waiting to burst, as the price of oil goes up and up and up?

Also there is an unassailable case for a whopping carbon tax to be slapped on air travel, on top of fuel-price surcharges.

Touch nothing now that doesn't have a sound prospect of payback of capital in three years, and a healthy income stream thereafter.

The only exceptions to that that I can see would be those little blocks of gold that you can buy in Thailand and put in a safety deposit facility, or those rice fields that some landless family will farm for you in return for half the crop.

Think fundamentals now. Times they are a'changing.

[Nawtilus]

Hey Lickitalot, can you sell timeshare to my wife.

I will keep the 2 weeks around the start of the year, as that is when she is at her youngest each year, you can sell the rest and keep a little for yourself if you like.

[likeitalot]

Hey Lickitalot, can you sell timeshare to my wife.

I will keep the 2 weeks around the start of the year, as that is when she is at her youngest each year, you can sell the rest and keep a little for yourself if you like.

no problem send her along and i can lickheralot no problem......

but wots the maintenance fee????

[tracer0]

Selling timeshares is legal. It's hard to find customers, specially without experience and without other incomes to survive. Of course if you can find real customers regularly (1-2 times/week) you can obtain a work permit too.

I think it could be a good secondary job (and income) if you meet daily a lot of people with your primal job.

The primal job is the hardest thing to find, specially without big savings..

1. Its illegal unless done from an office. Ie pestering locals in the street is NOT legal. Besides pissing local farangs off as you likely have to hang around in front of their legal shops...

2. The organisers make a lot of money most of it illegal by not delivering what they sell and then running away..

I suggest you check www.crimeshare.com under other parts of the world...

3. They get away with it as likely some pocket money gets spread around but essentially unless its a proper established company, and yes they DO exist, you can easily end up in jail, get kicked out or whatever.

In addition you will normall be financially dependent on the organisers and have no workpermit and under current visa circumstances the last thing is another mess of changed rules....

In Phuket in Patong is a group of obnoxious English guys looking more like football hooligans then people selling something and its just a matter of time before they get booted out...

[tracer0]

my commission only about 200k on this sale but I dont mind as i made a very busy guy take a holiday with his family and gave him some quality time....

-----------

And do you have a workpermit and pay tax???

Timeshare is on the list they will be checking on I heard and as far as I am concerned they can boot the lot out of Thailand except for a few exceptions.

All these scams make things more difficult for those of us doing some honest work and do follow the rules...

[tracer0]

ok it's simple..... TS works if you are a family who can plan a holiday at least 6 months in advance and your home resort is not a s*#thole that has been built on the cheap.... if you own at marriot, disney, sheraton etc you have the power to trade to any resort you want, when you want, worldwide, and you can stay in very exclusive accomodation on the cheap.... 12,000 Baht a week for a 3 bed villa (sleeps 6) at the laguna phuket for a week, is that value or not???....but that is only about 10% of members world wide.... 90% never really get value for money.

if you buy any product on emotion you usually regret it later TS or otherwise..... common sense really.

I live close by the Laguna and thats one of the very few places in Phuket which has what they sell. Obviously living close by I have my own place. By the way normall crooked services donot like to sell if you live in Thailand, they want to sell to tourists... However to book in these places one can also do it by normal booking, they sure arent going to refuse someone who pays for a week vacation....

[Thaibel]

my commission only about 200k on this sale but I dont mind as i made a very busy guy take a holiday with his family and gave him some quality time....

-----------

And do you have a workpermit and pay tax???

Timeshare is on the list they will be checking on I heard and as far as I am concerned they can boot the lot out of Thailand except for a few exceptions.

All these scams make things more difficult for those of us doing some honest work and do follow the rules...

I just checked the list from the ministery of labour in BKK and the activity that comes near time-sharing i think is nr. 35 (Street vending) of the prohibited list.

The question is, is contact on the street with a potential customer also selling TS or not ? I think the contract will be signed in an office and not on the street.........Don't know..........but i guess the law is not very clear on it ? Maybe someone can call the labour departement to know for sure.

[likeitalot]

Thanks tracerO, as you say some do deliver and have the product to back up their claims. My whole point is, some are complete rip offs and a few are credible going concerns.

I worked for the latter. Yes I did have work permit and any company i have worked for do not solicit on the street.

Last but not least, I paid over 1 million baht in tax last year so i know i contributed far more in tax at 37% than most posters for the Thai government(sorry military) to use wisely as usual. Not sure i got value for money for my tax.

[SamuiJens]

God, you still trying to peddle your wares, likeitnot, or are you pushed into it from the "closers"( the REAL nasty one that won't let you leave , if you don't do as he askes) Or maybe you think people are soo stupid here on tv forum that you'll get a bit?

PS neveranswered my post?

[taxin]

Thanks tracerO, as you say some do deliver and have the product to back up their claims. My whole point is, some are complete rip offs and a few are credible going concerns.

I worked for the latter. Yes I did have work permit and any company i have worked for do not solicit on the street.

Last but not least, I paid over 1 million baht in tax last year so i know i contributed far more in tax at 37% than most posters for the Thai government(sorry military) to use wisely as usual. Not sure i got value for money for my tax.

I cant believe this clown is still rambling on with this utter crap ! 1 million baht in tax, likeitalot you are not kidding anybody so give it up !

Let me reiterate, all (I repeat) "ALL" Timeshare is a rip off, its nothing more than an expensive hobby !

The happy owners are the ones who have yet to know that they have been ripped off, simply because the likeitalots are always at hand to wrap them in cotton wool everytime they use there week, reminding them how lucky they are to be "in the club" and not to listen anyone else, etc, etc, then at the end of the week they convince them that they should buy another week or upgrade !

Exchange for anywhere in the world, rubbish, not a chance !!!! And if you do find someone who will exchange with you its a far lesser standard than yours, always ! And then it costs you another $200 fee to swap, add this to your maintenance of $500 plus the yearly fee of $100 to the exchange company just to be a member (this is the biggest rip off of them all) then you have a poxy hotel room which as has cost you $800, a room you could probably pick up for $300 !

Maintenance, what the <deleted> This is NOT maintenance, this is your rental fee for using the timeshare, yes the one that lkeitalot said you OWNED !! The fee you will be stuck with forever, the fee that will sure rise once likitalot has already upgraded the sh#t out of you over the 1st few years !

Yes tracer0, this is the Laguna timeshare you have heard of, and they are starting to target Thais so watch this space. Foreign ran timeshare company scamming the Thais, not a clever idea !!!

The timeshare concept does not work, its hugely expensive and is sold on lies ! Likitalot, you know it is so stop making yourself sound like a complete moron !!

[Martin]

"The timeshare concept does not work, its hugely expensive and is sold on lies."

As is so much, in this day and age, unfortunately.

[JimsKnight]

Thanks for all the comments. I don't want to do this myself, but I am very curious when I hear about farangs with little or no experience making hundreds of thousands of Baht a month.

Thats because its just that, Hearsay and rumour!

I've been in the dive business and a similar scam operated by some companies is the 'pay us $$$$$ to become an OWSI instructor and earn 80 - 160k baht a month'

Few earn even clost to those figures.

Its pie in the sky mate. A small handful find the pot of gold falang to sell to but for the most part its tall tales, and attempts to get high numbers in the door to send out on the front lines. And the cops are the machine gunners just waiting for the eager falang to pass in front of their sights.

Don't be fooled by the dangled carrot. Make your money in the west and use thailand as a base rather than that kind of work-place.

Edited September 24, 2006 by JimsKnight

[Martin]

"Don't be fooled by the dangled carrot. Make your money in the west and use thailand as a base rather than that kind of work-place."

I would go even further than 'JimsKnight' and say that what he says above should be applied to all 'faranger' activity here.

Thailand is a country where food prices and prices of basic accommodation can be (are) low. Therefore wages can be (are) low.

The West (which includes Singapore, as its nearest example) comprises countries where wages have to be high because food and accommodation are expensive.

So, for part of the year, go where the wages are high (but make sure that your living expenses there will be well less than your wages) , and then spend the rest of the year here. There are all sorts of ways of doing it.

The ideal, of course, is to be hired in the West at Western wages and be sent to work out here; but that good fortune doesn't come the way of many.

Focussing on the topic:

Timeshare is a total con job---and the most "respectable" hotel chains are the biggest con merchants of all. They not only con the punters, they con people into pulling in the punters, too.

Bars in Nana are the more respectable establishments, compared to the hotel chains.

The posters on here who have tried to defend timeshare-selling should be ignored, as should all who are living in denial and in a bubble that is waiting for the pin that will prick it.