Farming/work Permits

[supersomchai]

First i would like to say what a great idear this forum is.I don`t want to pour cold water on a great idear but iam sure that any farming or forestry activities are not allowed for falangs(i hope not)what is the law regarding this, say your wife owns the land and her family work on it,can the falang husband work as well without being done by immigration????

[solent01]

First i would like to say what a great idear this forum is.I don`t want to pour cold water on a great idear but iam sure that any farming or forestry activities are not allowed for falangs(i hope not)what is the law regarding this, say your wife owns the land and her family work on it,can the falang husband work as well without being done by immigration????

Yes farming is allowed but indirectly, you can own a farm, rather you can be a 49% share holder in a Thai company, the company can own farmland, depending on the size of the farm, the total share size you hold within the company may have to be reduced, but be aware, the Thai government are tightening the law on Farangs being share holders, the law has not changed just at the moment they are making sure the company that is being formed is lagit, Thais are investing etc etc.

So yes Farang can farm as such, however you personally can not work the farm, you have to employ Thais, or your family work the farm, but as a share holder of a trading (working) company you need a work permit full stop.

Sol

Edited August 30, 2006 by solent01

[chownah]

I think that owning part of a company has no work connotation associated with it in and of itself....it just means that you own something...it doesn't mean that you work....so I think that owning a company is a different legal thing than working. Solent01's comments disagree with this and now I'm wondering if I'm wrong....

Working generally speaking includes management. If your wife owns a business and you act as a manager....make decisions etc....then legally you are working...and need a permit...

Foreigners are not allowed to work as farmers. There is some debate on the issue of where hobbies might apply to any activity and the need for a work permit.....there is some credible evidence (from a Thai immigration officer) that the intent of the law is that engaging in hobbies (no personal financial gain) is to be allowed........this is the loophole that I will try to squeeze through if push comes to shove....I doubt I will ever be asked about this since I'm so small time and having only a two wheeled walk behind tractor and being older than anyone else in my neighborhhod that does any farming I clearly can not be serious about what I'm doing................hahahhahahahahahha.

I'm hoping MaizeFarmer and RandomChances come on and address this question....they are certainly not small time..........etc.......my opinion is that as long as you don't seriously challenge some influential Thai farmer's position and you are not taking alot of money out of the country then no one really cares....except to say thank you very much for sharing in the task of providing food for everyone.

[Maizefarmer]

I,m not going to comment on the legal side of it other than say whats written above is in principal a fairly accurate representation of the legal side of it, but I will say this.

I have farmed for nearly 20 years on a commercial scale in Thailand. I drive my tractor on public roads to get from field to field, I even plough other peoples land for them. My farm is used by foreign & Thai students from KK Uni time to time and I have the odd Government livestock inspector turn up.I weld in my workshop, I use the lathe & milling machine, I sell parts - but never has that issue ever been raised with me.

Treat your neighbours with respect pay your hardware store bills (and other suppliers) on time and if anything, and you will earn the respect of the community for your effort to be one of them.

Oh - and make a big effort to learn to learn to speak, read & write the language.

Things work very differently in the rural communities.

Tim

Edited August 30, 2006 by Maizefarmer

[Maizefarmer]

I've just got a PM telling me to add that my situation is a little different because I am a Permanent Resident, have a registered company and a work permitt, pay tax ect ect......

True - but residancy, company and work permitt strictly speaking gives me management & consultancy "rights" - no right to milk the cows or drive the tractor to plough the land myself - that should be done by my employees.

Tim

Edited August 30, 2006 by Maizefarmer

[RamdomChances]

I was wondering how long it would be before this came up.

Well in my instance I have'nt got a farm, my wife has. As far as I know and I'm no expert on it most of what has been writen is correct.

Treat your neighbours with respect pay your hardware store bills (and other suppliers) on time and if anything, and you will earn the respect of the community for your effort to be one of them.

Oh - and make a big effort to learn to learn to speak, read & write the language.

Things work very differently in the rural communities.

This sums it up very well IMO, we have student vets come and stay with us on work experiance out of Pitsanuluk, and had visits of a varaity of officials, to be honest it's never even been mentioned.

[teletiger]

For Info on Farangs farming in Thailand go to

http://www.boi.go.th/english/about/eligible_activities.asp

Regards

Edited September 2, 2006 by RamdomChances

[Maizefarmer]

The hoops & hurdles you have to jump through, the amount of money you have to invest, the ongoing paperwork you have to do to satisfy accounting reg's, the staff you have to employ.

You will be running a corporation in the true sense of the word... like Monsanto in Thailand and to justfy it and be succefull (profitable) - which you will have to be - thats the sort of company you will be competing with.

BOI ... the hoops and hurdles you have to overcome - in other words: the theory and practise of BOI investments make it impractical for all except the largest of capital investments such as those that multi national organisations committ themselves to - which is exactly what the BOI is looking for within the context of those policies.

Tim

[chang35baht]

SO, at the moment I have a 20 rai rubber farm that I mainly cut the grass on and help to keep the trees in shape, along with my wife and some locals who we employ from time to time when we need some extra help.

Am I right in assuming then, from what I have read above, that I shouldn`t be doing this and that I will not be able to involved at all when we start the tapping process in around another 5 years.

Albeit I only want to be involved in the first instance of tapping. I.e, to learn how to tap( which I`ve already been invited to do) and to realise just how much latex we get from the trees before I let some employees carry on on their own(just in case some of the latex goes out the side door).

We`re well known in the village where my farm is located. I speak a fair bit of Thai so can communicate with everyone ok.

We`ve had visits from the top guys who are heading the initiative to boost the rubber economy in the north and they never once mention anything about me not being able to be involved in the running of the farm. I know that it isn`t there job anyway to regulate who works on the farm.

If I carry on as I am and don`t rock the boat will I have any problems

Edited September 2, 2006 by chang35baht

[chownah]

Sounds like you've been working all along and having no problems....I can't see any reason why this should change in the future...do you?

[chang35baht]

Sounds like you've been working all along and having no problems....I can't see any reason why this should change in the future...do you?

Nope. And I don`t intend to stop either.

I was once told by a Cpt. Jarong in Maesai immig. that for farming land they generally wouldn`t give anybody a pull.

That`ll do for me.

[supersomchai]

Your feedback is much appreciated.I too feel that doing a bit of low key work on my wifes land upcountry should hardly attract much attention.However a cautionary tale,i know of one falang who partly owned a resort in ko chang(the other partner had the work permit not him) who was painting a bugalow when immigration came visiting,they noticed he looked like he had just been painting,so to entrap him they suggested a better way to paint....try it this way he said..as soon as the falang picked up the brush they had him(B30,000 fine...no receipt).Anyway this sort of thing usually happens in tourist areas.The important distinction is WHEN DOES GARDENING BECOME FARMING....AND IS ONE COW A PET AND TWO COWS A BUSINESS????

[solent01]

SO, at the moment I have a 20 rai rubber farm that I mainly cut the grass on and help to keep the trees in shape, along with my wife and some locals who we employ from time to time when we need some extra help.

Am I right in assuming then, from what I have read above, that I shouldn`t be doing this and that I will not be able to involved at all when we start the tapping process in around another 5 years.

Albeit I only want to be involved in the first instance of tapping. I.e, to learn how to tap( which I`ve already been invited to do) and to realise just how much latex we get from the trees before I let some employees carry on on their own(just in case some of the latex goes out the side door).

We`re well known in the village where my farm is located. I speak a fair bit of Thai so can communicate with everyone ok.

We`ve had visits from the top guys who are heading the initiative to boost the rubber economy in the north and they never once mention anything about me not being able to be involved in the running of the farm. I know that it isn`t there job anyway to regulate who works on the farm.

If I carry on as I am and don`t rock the boat will I have any problems

Strictly speaking, no you should not work the land yourself (but as already mentioned, if its a hobby yes you can), but to be honest, most of us do to one dagree or another, its not really a problem out in the sticks, besides some of us provide regular work for some of the locals, this goes a long way. To be honest my envolvement on my Orchard is pretty small when it comes to manual labour, don't get me wrong, I love hard work, I can sit and watch it all day.......

Sol

[bannork]

According to the Thai definition of work a foreigner is doomed as soon as he even thinks of lifting a hoe, here it is-

'Work means to engage in work by exerting energy or using knowledge, whether or not in consideration of wages or other benefit.'

Just remember to be foolish, ie plant russi in soil liable to be waterlogged,(no knowledge used there), and let the hoe fall using gravity.

I think the authorities think a farang attempting farming is sanuk, if not downright foolish, it's no threat to Thais so let them be; so long as John Karr doesn't emerge in the rice fields offering to take the kids swimming there should be no problem.