Do's and don'ts in Thailand - Dating Etiquette

[redandyellow]

In a previous thread you stated that you were a part of an Australian couple just arrived in CM...

Lost the missus already or are you just trolling?

Happiness is the Truth

[redandyellow]

That is correct. We did arrive as a couple but my wife took an instant dislike to living here ( We had holidayed in Thailand since 1991) She decided to return to Qld at the end of Jan. So no, this is not a troll posting. Holidaying and living in an environment is different. The question is relevant to the position that I find myself in.

I would avoid bars, and find a dark horse Thai woman - about 35-40 in your case, educated, a 7 or an 8 out of ten will suffice, but JAI DEE (good hearted) they must be, above all else.

Also, read "Thai Fever" It's dated, but still okay.

Best

[beau thai]

No, I'm not going to "scream" at you beau thai.

I'd admire andryr45's candor in post #45 of of admitting that reasons No. 1 - 10 that caused his wife to return to Australia were him. And his saying he's "a little introverted"

Thai women are, shall we say, a little more willing to overlook flaws in social skills that would cause many "desirable" western woman to run the other way from a guy. Some of the reason could be economic, some could simply be that a Thai woman may not be as good at "reading" a western guy and recognizing early warnings that something isn't quite right with a guy.

The net result can be the horror stories you read about here on Thai Visa. Guys who had problems with relationships in the west end up having problems with relationship here with Thai woman. Guys who feel like they were "done wrong" by a woman in the west are also "done wrong" by a Thai woman, it's just the way the Thai woman does it is different.

Beau Thai -- I think your advice about reading "Thai Fever" is spot on for anyone considering a relationship with a Thai woman. I've read it and agree with what you say about how many Thai woman, especially those over age 40, do enjoy "taking care" of their men.

However, their abilities to "take care" can be very limited. Most are not someone to have by your side asking the doctor questions when you receive a bad medical diagnosis. They may not be able to manage complex medication schedule. You may not trust them to handle your finances if you become incapacitated. They may not be the person you'd like as your Health Care Representative on your Advance Directive. They may not be willing to challenge the doctor for more morphine when you're in pain in the hospital. In my involvement with Lanna Care Net, I've never had to fulfill these rolls with a western-western couple, but I sure have, many times for a man who was married to a Thai woman.

Now, admittedly poor Andy hasn't even had his first date yet, but at age 57 you'd think someone should ask himself, "is this the woman I want taking care of me when I grow old?"

This was the criteria my father used in selecting his second wife at age 75, after my mother passed away. He realized if he didn't get his act together and do some serious courting, he was going to end up living in a basement "granny flat" with either me or my sister-in-law telling him what to do. Instead, he hit the internet dating sites, drove around a five state area on dates and ended up with a real winner. She was fantastic and did treat him like a king. He died a very happy and well-cared for man 8 years later.

Hi nancy-well thanks for not screaming and for a carefully considered post,as ever. Our views are all formed by our experiences and yours is often with elderly folks in poor health in need of help. And good for you for giving your time and skill to support them.

But you know there are many who sail through old age relatively unscathed. My aunt died recently age 103, spent the last 10 days in a home, and the previous 40 years lone in her own home. Drove until 92 when she was downgraded to an electric 3 wheeler scooter. She needed very little medical support. Many in my family were /are similar and I realise that is atypical. As, I suggest, are the folk you support. Oh, and her daughter visited from Canberra recently and she and her husband travelled on to Vientianne the hard way to do a mega zipwire to celebrate his 77th birthday.

The poster is 57 for godsake. A mere boy!!! What kind of life do you want for him, if at a young 57, he is worrying about what happens to him if he ever gets to be old and infirm? He is entering his third age. No job to worry about and no wife it seems . He is free and unfettered to enjoy his life. Maybe he can have the best of both worlds and date a relatively young nurse??!!

And US women may be far more confident than in UK, but I gotta tell you, I dont think the majority of UK women would feel comfortable challenging a doctor as you do. And I do. I have helped a number of female friends who have suffered from the standard uk GP 'your allotted 7 minutes is up-next patient please'. You have to be pushy in my view to get the right diagnosis and the right treatment. You say thai women are not someone to have by your side at the doctor- same same UK women..

And what a great story about your father re-inventing himself at 75 and dieing happy 8 years later. Way to go!!

And back to the OP, I would advocate thinking short term about enjoying female company at dinner, movies whatever and if it turns into long term, fine. But dont go out on your first date thinking ' Is This the ONE'?

Meet a few ladies first to be certain about who will really make you happy-and have some fun. Just in case you only live once....

[elgordo38]

There are many single women over age 40 in the expats club. I suggest you come to the Breakfast Club social gatherings on the first and third Friday mornings from 9:30 - 11:30 am. The very active Bridge Club would be another good place to meet single women over age 40. They can teach you to play bridge if you don't now: http://www.bridgewebs.com/chiangmai/

Oh did you want to meet Thai women over age 40? I can't give you much advice there, but I do know there are some fantastic western women over age 40 who absolutely love living in Chiang Mai and would be open to socializing with guys. Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male. The single western women I know here tell me you either have to bring your own guy with you or resign yourself to being single. It's a pity because some of these gals are good-looking for their age, are financially independent and have their act together. I think they'd be much better partners and more fun to be around than most of the local women.

I respect Nancy but in this case in her last sentence I must disagree. Trying to find the right Thai lady however can be like picking your way through a mine field but when you get the right one like I did (after 2 misadventures) its worth it. But I found this to be prevalent in North America as well along with swilling coffee and smoking cigarettes and looking for a meal ticket. Just be on your guard and do not lead with your wallet. Meet them for coffee and see where they are coming from. I met a lot of nice girls through Thai Love Links. Most Thai ladies want someone living here permanently not someone who comes here for a 6 month "honeymoon" I did find some of their cultural ideas difficult at first but I have made adjustments to my thinking. Western ladies will not pamper you( and really get upset when you discuss this issue in their presence) but Thai ladies do and its great. She is also right in making the following statement Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male

[redandyellow]

There are many single women over age 40 in the expats club. I suggest you come to the Breakfast Club social gatherings on the first and third Friday mornings from 9:30 - 11:30 am. The very active Bridge Club would be another good place to meet single women over age 40. They can teach you to play bridge if you don't now: http://www.bridgewebs.com/chiangmai/

Oh did you want to meet Thai women over age 40? I can't give you much advice there, but I do know there are some fantastic western women over age 40 who absolutely love living in Chiang Mai and would be open to socializing with guys. Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male. The single western women I know here tell me you either have to bring your own guy with you or resign yourself to being single. It's a pity because some of these gals are good-looking for their age, are financially independent and have their act together. I think they'd be much better partners and more fun to be around than most of the local women.

Hi Nancy. Your points are valid and true, but as you know well, once a farang gets "Thai Fever," nothing in the world will change their minds.

Thai women missed out on western Woman's Liberation for the most part, and it renders them different by default, along with the inherent 180 degree cultural differences.

That is no slight on western women, as culture often dictates personality by default unfortunately, but sometimes that's a good thing.

Like legions of farang before me and in the future, I also married a Thai woman (8 years ago), and am very, very happy. Multiply that by hundreds of thousands of farang, and we see why good quality western women don't get the second look they deserve in the Kingdom.

We farang are cognizant of that, and are not without a degree of empathy for our western "sisters," but once you're bonded, you're bonded. It ain't all roses on the other side of the fence. Thai women are tough as nails too, and most of us fear our women ( if we're honest), to the degree that many of us stop wandering, we still want to keep our peckers, current happiness and peace of mind intact.

Remember though - Thai men love farang women..

[redandyellow]

There are many single women over age 40 in the expats club. I suggest you come to the Breakfast Club social gatherings on the first and third Friday mornings from 9:30 - 11:30 am. The very active Bridge Club would be another good place to meet single women over age 40. They can teach you to play bridge if you don't now: http://www.bridgewebs.com/chiangmai/

Oh did you want to meet Thai women over age 40? I can't give you much advice there, but I do know there are some fantastic western women over age 40 who absolutely love living in Chiang Mai and would be open to socializing with guys. Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male. The single western women I know here tell me you either have to bring your own guy with you or resign yourself to being single. It's a pity because some of these gals are good-looking for their age, are financially independent and have their act together. I think they'd be much better partners and more fun to be around than most of the local women.

I respect Nancy but in this case in her last sentence I must disagree. Trying to find the right Thai lady however can be like picking your way through a mine field but when you get the right one like I did (after 2 misadventures) its worth it. But I found this to be prevalent in North America as well along with swilling coffee and smoking cigarettes and looking for a meal ticket. Just be on your guard and do not lead with your wallet. Meet them for coffee and see where they are coming from. I met a lot of nice girls through Thai Love Links. Most Thai ladies want someone living here permanently not someone who comes here for a 6 month "honeymoon" I did find some of their cultural ideas difficult at first but I have made adjustments to my thinking. Western ladies will not pamper you( and really get upset when you discuss this issue in their presence) but Thai ladies do and its great. She is also right in making the following statement Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male

We may have gotten off on the wrong foot elgordo, but I understand you, and therefore respect you.

I also feel for you, as I only have 14.5 years on my wife, so you "won" hands down. We (you and I) both need to stay in good shape physically and mentally. The pluses are enormous, especially when you quit drinking too

Best

[WinnieTheKhwai]

I would just like to point out, that your example above is in no way comparable ...as far as I know/in my opinion ... I have never heard of a real case of a Thai wife being sold by her farang husband into slavery, but many Thais believe in ghosts too and I haven't seen any of those either. I mean really, do any of us even know where/how to sell a human into slavery if by chance you decided to do that???

Sure, by current definitions of slavery. Because governments, NGOs and intergovernmental organizations have all decided that about anything can be called 'human trafficking' or modern day slavery. It's somewhat ludicrous how far this is stretched, including that trafficking doesn't actually need to involve moving a person anywhere.

So under those definitions you can be guilty of trafficking / slavery by hiring a burmese maid, or taking a bargirl on a trip to Hong Kong or wherever.

And then secondly, when a girl goes to work in a massage parlour, karaoke or brothel abroad and she gets caught or gets in trouble at some point, would she then say A: "Yeah I know I'm here on a tourist visa but can't a girl make some real money?" or B: "Boohoo, I thought I was going to be a waitress.". (Hint: second option just means a free ticket home instead of being locked up.) Not to mention that it sounds a lot better to her family too.

But anyway.. erm: Dating. So far it seems it's a lot harder to stay single in this country than to end up in a relationship. Staying single actually takes more work! Being introverted is almost a good thing here, too. The alternative is being a loud-mouthed knob. Although those don't seem to have much trouble either.

Edited April 6, 2015 by WinnieTheKhwai

[redandyellow]

Thanks Nancy.

My first choice would be to meet a Western lady. That sounds wonderful. I will make myself known at the next coffee morning or meeting. I just need to start mingling and meeting people. I do fancy brushing up my bridge skills as I have played previously.

Just as Thai women (largely) missed out on Women's liberation, good old andyr45 looks like he's gonna miss out on Thai Fever 101.

Don't worry andyr45, I think you're onto something pretty good, that will also respond accordingly to your ultimate desires..after due diligence from both sides of course. In that respect, it's same same same andyr45

In a way, I'm ever so slightly envious, as I never follow the crowd, except with Thai Fever 101.

Signed,

Running against the Grain

[northernjohn]

First off, good luck.

And be patient, you dont want to appear desperate.

Numerically, you have a much much wider choice of course, if you seek a thai rather than farang partner. And despite what you may read on here, they can make excellent partners.

Take time to get to know them-really know them, and you will soon know if you are being scammed. Dont be put off if they are giving cash to their families. It's the norm as there is no social security net. it doesnt mean you are being played if you feel you should help a little. Just a little!.

And do buy a book called Thailand Fever. Left hand page in thai for your GF to learn about farang, right hand page in English for you to learn about thai family, culture et al. If my gf and I hadnt got this book we may not have got through the first 3 months-mostly because of our suspicion of each other from what we had read and heard!!

In the same way that you hear about thai women scamming farang, thai families also hear about farang taking their young women abroad to be sold into slavery. Seriously. But if you are looking at 40 plus, less of a problem!

Any female TV readers (you there nancyL??) will probably scream at me, but whereas western women are brought up to be self-sufficient, independent, and feminist etc- and nothing wrong with that, thai girls seem to be brought up to enjoy taking care of others-their family and their man. In small ways that may seem pathetic, but are caring.

I feel I am on dangerous ground so will say no more other than at least look beyond the few western women you may meet.

Well said

We are in a culture where giving and caring are a large part of life to the Thai women. Unlike back home. If a Thai lady did not help her family as much as she could when they need it I would have nothing to do with her. It is a value that I highly respect. Definitely going to get that book Thailand Fever.

Another thing is many times they want this or that such as a house. For many of them it is more of a security thing. It took my wife several years to feel secure knowing that I was not going to dump her. We have been together now 8 years.

Also as has been said there are ones who want the house and then dump you. It does not happen that often but it does happen. I know one guy who lost two homes that way. But then again there was about a 40 year age difference. He was a lonely old man just looking at any thing to keep him company.

So don't go jumping into a relationship of that depth very fast..

[northernjohn]

I would just like to point out, that your example above is in no way comparable ...as far as I know/in my opinion ... I have never heard of a real case of a Thai wife being sold by her farang husband into slavery, but many Thais believe in ghosts too and I haven't seen any of those either. I mean really, do any of us even know where/how to sell a human into slavery if by chance you decided to do that???

Sure, by current definitions of slavery. Because governments, NGOs and intergovernmental organizations have all decided that about anything can be called 'human trafficking' or modern day slavery. It's somewhat ludicrous how far this is stretched, including that trafficking doesn't actually need to involve moving a person anywhere.

So under those definitions you can be guilty of trafficking / slavery by hiring a burmese maid, or taking a bargirl on a trip to Hong Kong or wherever.

And then secondly, when a girl goes to work in a massage parlour, karaoke or brothel abroad and she gets caught or gets in trouble at some point, would she then say A: "Yeah I know I'm here on a tourist visa but can't a girl make some real money?" or B: "Boohoo, I thought I was going to be a waitress.". (Hint: second option just means a free ticket home instead of being locked up.) Not to mention that it sounds a lot better to her family too.

But anyway.. erm: Dating. So far it seems it's a lot harder to stay single in this country than to end up in a relationship. Staying single actually takes more work! Being introverted is almost a good thing here, too. The alternative is being a loud-mouthed knob. Although those don't seem to have much trouble either.

I attend a talk by a prominent figure in Chiang Mai. A foreign diplomat who was involved with trying to free women from being sold into prostitution. It is not always what people believe it to be. One lady they freed returned to it voluntarily but they still considered here as being in slavery. Many of the ladies and girls prefer it to starvation.

[thrilled]

Many avaliable women in Thailand.I would stay away from the bars.I also believe you will find A more quality woman

That don't drink,don't smoke and don't gamble,also don't do drugs.Probably won't find many that do any of these things.But some don't.And of course they all like money or what it can buy.

[SilentThai1]

Just don't be one of those plonkers that goes for a someone 20 years younger. 10 years younger max in my personal opinion.

I understand you wishing to find a western partner. Personally would never date a Thai woman.

Maybe the expat club is the way!

Good luck to you.

[ScarpoFongness4U]

Sweet Jesus,

In Chasing Mai and he wants to meet only western women, and everyone here is indulging him, without a full understanding of why his loving wife, who planned this with him for years, or was just going along silently, which is doubtful just suddenly decided to abandon it all, including the family dogs to return to what exactly?

Without hearing from the wife, I don't believe a word the OP states

BTW, the reason so many Thais think they will be sold into slavery is because that's a Thai specialist occupation and they go to the sam e villages every few months waiting for the girls to graduate 6th grade so they can select the new crop before the parents have any other ideas about backing out on their agreements when they took those loans from the loanshark

Thai selling Thai is a known fact, just ask the UN trafficking condemnation that Thailand cannot shake

This OP in Chiang Man is a sob story but has no hint of truth

You cannot be a single man in Chiang Mai and not be nearly assaulted by the throngs of women....even Tim Sharkey is surrounded by hordes of young girls

Sorry OP.

Anyone in Chiang Kai for 24 hours knows better.

Western women are too smart for you

[maxman71]

OP, rather than focus on what you consider to be negatives about yourself, identify areas of your "being" that are positive. And, while you may not be able to do much about your self-described less-than-visual-facial-attractiveness, you can still improve certain aspects your appearance. Get in good physical shape. If you're overweight, lose it. Do some weight training and cardio training. Give the ladies something to look at besides your face. I have found that Thai women like a guy who takes care of themselves that way (most women anywhere do as well). And, if you get in good shape, you'll feel better, be healthier and that gets noticed too in a positive way.

Learn to speak Thai; the Thai people in general like that too.

In essence, work with what you got.

[NancyL]

I must say that Andy got a nice discussion going, didn't he?

Meanwhile, this thread got me thinking and I did a mental count. In the 7 years I've lived here, I can think of at least 10 western women -- over age 40, but under age 60, good looking, fit and fun to be around -- who stayed over here for a year or so, thinking they were going to stay long-term, but moved on when they realized they hadn't had a date in the entire time they'd been in Thailand.

As for "Thai men like western women" -- I sure don't see it. Not unless you count the times that tuk-tuk and song thaew drivers try to do more than "pick us up". These aren't the type of guys we're interested in.

This thread has made me realize the enormous peer pressure that guys are under, too, to date young Thai women ("follow your built-in GPS") and to reject all western women as man-hating feminist shrews.

I hadn't realized how much I'd come to accept the idea that there is no possibility of a love-life for older women until a friend of mine decided to return to the the U.S recently. She became a widow last year and, for a time she thought she'd stay in Thailand. But, as time went on, she decided she wanted another relationship -- she liked having a man in her life, but she realized that would never happen in Thailand. So, this was one reason she decided to return to the U.S. In talking with her, I expressed surprise that she thought she'd be able to find a man in the U.S. "Are men really interested in women our age?", I asked. That's when I realized I'd been in Thailand too long, watching men making fools of themselves with women 40 years younger than themselves. My goodness, I've come to accept this as "normal" behavior.

Edited April 7, 2015 by NancyL

[FolkGuitar]

I'm a bit curious... Andy showed up with his wife and dog. After just a few months his wife left and returned to Australia. Andy stayed in Thailand.

Andy, why didn't you return to Australia and try to work out the difficulties with your wife? You were most likely married for many years before leaving Australia, but instead of trying to solve the marital problems, instead sought a girl friend. Perhaps your wife would have been more comfortable moving to Bali or to Singapore. Did the two of you talk about her needs?

[MaeJoMTB]

This thread has made me realize the enormous peer pressure that guys are under, too, to date young Thai women ("follow your built-in GPS") and to reject all western women as man-hating feminist shrews.

Most of us have more sense than to have relationships with women who have access to the western legal system.

Thai girls don't and can't unless you voluntarily take them there.

[mesquite]

I must say that Andy got a nice discussion going, didn't he?

Meanwhile, this thread got me thinking and I did a mental count. In the 7 years I've lived here, I can think of at least 10 western women -- over age 40, but under age 60, good looking, fit and fun to be around -- who stayed over here for a year or so, thinking they were going to stay long-term, but moved on when they realized they hadn't had a date in the entire time they'd been in Thailand.

As for "Thai men like western women" -- I sure don't see it. Not unless you count the times that tuk-tuk and song thaew drivers try to do more than "pick us up". These aren't the type of guys we're interested in.

This thread has made me realize the enormous peer pressure that guys are under, too, to date young Thai women ("follow your built-in GPS") and to reject all western women as man-hating feminist shrews.

I hadn't realized how much I'd come to accept the idea that there is no possibility of a love-life for older women until a friend of mine decided to return to the the U.S recently. She became a widow last year and, for a time she thought she'd stay in Thailand. But, as time went on, she decided she wanted another relationship -- she liked having a man in her life, but she realized that would never happen in Thailand. So, this was one reason she decided to return to the U.S. In talking with her, I expressed surprise that she thought she'd be able to find a man in the U.S. "Are men really interested in women our age?", I asked. That's when I realized I'd been in Thailand too long, watching men making fools of themselves with women 40 years younger than themselves. My goodness, I've come to accept this as "normal" behavior.

Absolutely not true in my case. I'm making a fool of myself with a woman only 35 years younger.

[andyr45]

Thank you for all the advice posted. I guess that it is really a question of once morals, values and standards. As individuals we choose our own. I have some reading to do in order to feel more comfortable with my new status.

From Folk Guitar

I'm a bit curious... Andy showed up with his wife and dog. After just a few months his wife left and returned to Australia. Andy stayed in Thailand.

Andy, why didn't you return to Australia and try to work out the difficulties with your wife? You were most likely married for many years before leaving Australia, but instead of trying to solve the marital problems, instead sought a girl friend. Perhaps your wife would have been more comfortable moving to Bali or to Singapore. Did the two of you talk about her needs?

Hindsight is an exact science. Our relationship had passed it's sell by date prior to departing from the Antipodes. In my case an opportunity to live in an environment with greater personal freedom (perhaps with out the individual rights one has in the west), and a richness of life that I feel is absent in Australia. This combined with a sense that time was starting to move ever so much faster led me to be the catalyst in the move.

In her case she dipped her toes in the water and decided that she was more comfortable back home. Change of this magnitude is not for all.

The return was simple in that she could move back into her home and resume her comfortable, secure life. In short she is adamant that she could not find her self living a comfortable existence in Asia. After all those years together the separation is amicable and as I still own a business in QLD I return for a week a month (sometimes a little longer) where we catch up. There is no girl friend to date but with a legal separation I feel that it would be appropriate to start meeting people of the opposite sex. I appreciate the question - thanks again

[northernjohn]

Plenty of women in their 30s available for you.

The older ones want just as much, and generally have less to offer.

ThaiCupid, you can fix up a different date for every night of the week in CM.

Can you be more specific on what they have less to offer? I find them to be more loyal.

I will concede your point if it is sex you are talking about. But I think the OP is looking for more than that.

[evenstevens]

in my breaking in days, learn.t the following

treat them mean, and keep them keen policy

it works u know

a top of the morning to all

[FolkGuitar]

Thank you for all the advice posted. I guess that it is really a question of once morals, values and standards. As individuals we choose our own. I have some reading to do in order to feel more comfortable with my new status.

From Folk Guitar

I'm a bit curious... Andy showed up with his wife and dog. After just a few months his wife left and returned to Australia. Andy stayed in Thailand.

Andy, why didn't you return to Australia and try to work out the difficulties with your wife? You were most likely married for many years before leaving Australia, but instead of trying to solve the marital problems, instead sought a girl friend. Perhaps your wife would have been more comfortable moving to Bali or to Singapore. Did the two of you talk about her needs?

Hindsight is an exact science. Our relationship had passed it's sell by date prior to departing from the Antipodes. In my case an opportunity to live in an environment with greater personal freedom (perhaps with out the individual rights one has in the west), and a richness of life that I feel is absent in Australia. This combined with a sense that time was starting to move ever so much faster led me to be the catalyst in the move.

In her case she dipped her toes in the water and decided that she was more comfortable back home. Change of this magnitude is not for all.

The return was simple in that she could move back into her home and resume her comfortable, secure life. In short she is adamant that she could not find her self living a comfortable existence in Asia. After all those years together the separation is amicable and as I still own a business in QLD I return for a week a month (sometimes a little longer) where we catch up. There is no girl friend to date but with a legal separation I feel that it would be appropriate to start meeting people of the opposite sex. I appreciate the question - thanks again

Thanks for the answer. I appreciate your honesty, and recognize your efforts at introspection. After two marriages to Western women, I eventually settled down with an Asian (not Thai) woman close to my own age, and it's been a delightful 20+ years relationship. However...

... I spent 15 years enjoying my bachelorhood after divorcing my second wife, sampling what was available on three continents, before discovering a woman that was the right fit for me, and that 'fit' has been a 20-year pleasure. Do NOT rush into a committed relationship just because you are free to do so. Nothing wrong with being a 57yr old playboy if you can handle the scheduling.

Edited April 7, 2015 by FolkGuitar

[LannaGuy]

Just enjoy yourself and be respectful and kind.. understand it's an 'exchange' and most of them need 'looking after'.

Don't delude yourself that the young, gorgeous thing on your arm really wants to be with a guy old enough to be her Dad (or in some cases her Grand Dad) yes she may like you but stop the 'looking after' and see her find another 'love'.

If you want true devotion and love get a dog.

[beau thai]

Just enjoy yourself and be respectful and kind.. understand it's an 'exchange' and most of them need 'looking after'.

Don't delude yourself that the young, gorgeous thing on your arm really wants to be with a guy old enough to be her Dad (or in some cases her Grand Dad) yes she may like you but stop the 'looking after' and see her find another 'love'.

If you want true devotion and love get a dog.

"If you want true devotion and love get a dog" You remind me of the old joke:

. If you want to know who loves you more, your wife or your dog, shut them both in the boot/trunk for 10 miles and see who is pleased to see you when you let them out!!.

But I wouldnt swap my girl for a dog that's for sure 555

[beau thai]

in my breaking in days, learn.t the following

treat them mean, and keep them keen policy

it works u know

a top of the morning to all

Evens, you are a very bad man!!! But I know you';re only joshin'...

[beau thai]

I must say that Andy got a nice discussion going, didn't he?

Meanwhile, this thread got me thinking and I did a mental count. In the 7 years I've lived here, I can think of at least 10 western women -- over age 40, but under age 60, good looking, fit and fun to be around -- who stayed over here for a year or so, thinking they were going to stay long-term, but moved on when they realized they hadn't had a date in the entire time they'd been in Thailand.

As for "Thai men like western women" -- I sure don't see it. Not unless you count the times that tuk-tuk and song thaew drivers try to do more than "pick us up". These aren't the type of guys we're interested in.

This thread has made me realize the enormous peer pressure that guys are under, too, to date young Thai women ("follow your built-in GPS") and to reject all western women as man-hating feminist shrews.

I hadn't realized how much I'd come to accept the idea that there is no possibility of a love-life for older women until a friend of mine decided to return to the the U.S recently. She became a widow last year and, for a time she thought she'd stay in Thailand. But, as time went on, she decided she wanted another relationship -- she liked having a man in her life, but she realized that would never happen in Thailand. So, this was one reason she decided to return to the U.S. In talking with her, I expressed surprise that she thought she'd be able to find a man in the U.S. "Are men really interested in women our age?", I asked. That's when I realized I'd been in Thailand too long, watching men making fools of themselves with women 40 years younger than themselves. My goodness, I've come to accept this as "normal" behavior.

Absolutely not true in my case. I'm making a fool of myself with a woman only 35 years younger.

So, Mesquite, this 'fooling around' ( sounds perjorative, no?)- does it make you happy??

Because I come under the same definition and it certainly makes me happy.

If you are not happy and having fun in this life, then when is it gonna happen for you?

Fooling around? The fools are those that accept their life as it is and make no effort to improve it, but just moan about it to anyone who will listen.

[LannaGuy]

I must say that Andy got a nice discussion going, didn't he?

Meanwhile, this thread got me thinking and I did a mental count. In the 7 years I've lived here, I can think of at least 10 western women -- over age 40, but under age 60, good looking, fit and fun to be around -- who stayed over here for a year or so, thinking they were going to stay long-term, but moved on when they realized they hadn't had a date in the entire time they'd been in Thailand.

As for "Thai men like western women" -- I sure don't see it. Not unless you count the times that tuk-tuk and song thaew drivers try to do more than "pick us up". These aren't the type of guys we're interested in.

This thread has made me realize the enormous peer pressure that guys are under, too, to date young Thai women ("follow your built-in GPS") and to reject all western women as man-hating feminist shrews.

I hadn't realized how much I'd come to accept the idea that there is no possibility of a love-life for older women until a friend of mine decided to return to the the U.S recently. She became a widow last year and, for a time she thought she'd stay in Thailand. But, as time went on, she decided she wanted another relationship -- she liked having a man in her life, but she realized that would never happen in Thailand. So, this was one reason she decided to return to the U.S. In talking with her, I expressed surprise that she thought she'd be able to find a man in the U.S. "Are men really interested in women our age?", I asked. That's when I realized I'd been in Thailand too long, watching men making fools of themselves with women 40 years younger than themselves. My goodness, I've come to accept this as "normal" behavior.

Absolutely not true in my case. I'm making a fool of myself with a woman only 35 years younger.

So, Mesquite, this 'fooling around' ( sounds perjorative, no?)- does it make you happy??

Because I come under the same definition and it certainly makes me happy.

If you are not happy and having fun in this life, then when is it gonna happen for you?

Fooling around? The fools are those that accept their life as it is and make no effort to improve it, but just moan about it to anyone who will listen.

I think 'fooling around' with a woman 35 years younger is great and I do it myself all the time but I also think 'fooling around' and not being a 'fool' is different

have fun, be happy but 'understand' why a 35 years younger beauty is with you = happiness

have fun, be happy but not 'understand' = potentially lose the house and one's dignity

good luck to all and enjoy

[ScarpoFongness4U]

Can't understand how a man in Chiang Mai is alone for any length of time with all the hungry women up there

For god sakes man, shut off the computer and go get a 2 hour massage

You went there to live, you said.

Get to it already

[Papayabokbok]

First off, good luck.

And be patient, you dont want to appear desperate.

Numerically, you have a much much wider choice of course, if you seek a thai rather than farang partner. And despite what you may read on here, they can make excellent partners.

Take time to get to know them-really know them, and you will soon know if you are being scammed. Dont be put off if they are giving cash to their families. It's the norm as there is no social security net. it doesnt mean you are being played if you feel you should help a little. Just a little!.

And do buy a book called Thailand Fever. Left hand page in thai for your GF to learn about farang, right hand page in English for you to learn about thai family, culture et al. If my gf and I hadnt got this book we may not have got through the first 3 months-mostly because of our suspicion of each other from what we had read and heard!!

In the same way that you hear about thai women scamming farang, thai families also hear about farang taking their young women abroad to be sold into slavery. Seriously. But if you are looking at 40 plus, less of a problem!

Any female TV readers (you there nancyL??) will probably scream at me, but whereas western women are brought up to be self-sufficient, independent, and feminist etc- and nothing wrong with that, thai girls seem to be brought up to enjoy taking care of others-their family and their man. In small ways that may seem pathetic, but are caring.

I feel I am on dangerous ground so will say no more other than at least look beyond the few western women you may meet.

Dangerous ground----haha--funny--but indeed! 1000 eyes on you in LOS and the forum too!

[Papayabokbok]

There are many single women over age 40 in the expats club. I suggest you come to the Breakfast Club social gatherings on the first and third Friday mornings from 9:30 - 11:30 am. The very active Bridge Club would be another good place to meet single women over age 40. They can teach you to play bridge if you don't now: http://www.bridgewebs.com/chiangmai/

Oh did you want to meet Thai women over age 40? I can't give you much advice there, but I do know there are some fantastic western women over age 40 who absolutely love living in Chiang Mai and would be open to socializing with guys. Seems most western guys, however, are interested in socializing "with the locals", either female or male. The single western women I know here tell me you either have to bring your own guy with you or resign yourself to being single. It's a pity because some of these gals are good-looking for their age, are financially independent and have their act together. I think they'd be much better partners and more fun to be around than most of the local women.

Wow..might be time for me to start learning bridge....or pinochle,

will the Mckenzies be coming?.. Dont use the good hand towels!!!