Maize and Rotational Crops

[kickstart]

16 hours ago, IsaanAussie said:

Have you guys tried to ferment this stuff rather than make silage? 

I was always taught that  silage, was fermented  grass/ maize  .

[farmerjo]

Back after a few weeks away,sunn hemp still not ready for harvest.

It is submerged in a lot of comunist grass which shouldn't be a problem for the harvester.

My problem will be whether the seeds mature before the pod borers get to them.

There is caterpillars doing damage but also have lots of these beetles and i'm not sure if they are good or bad.

 

[kickstart]

iseases and pests

Sunn hemp is attacked by many diseases and pests, including viruses, fungi, insects and nematodes, but they usually cause little economic damage. In India, anthracnose, caused by Colletotrichum curvatum, wilt caused by Fusarium udam and caterpillar larvae of the moth Utetheisa pulchella can be serious. Pod-boring insects can reduce seed production. However, Dempsey (1975) reported that significant shoot borer resistance has been identified. Beetles of the genus Exora can sometimes cause serious defoliation. Dey et al. (1990) reported that sources of resistance to anthracnose have been identified, indicating the potential to reduce disease losses through the development of resistant varieties. Germplasm possessing resistance to the fungus C. fimbriata has also been reported (Ribeiro et al.1977). Damage from insects is more severe if crops are planted in the same area for more than 3 consecutive years. Fungicide seed treatments and crop rotations are the most recommended and practiced disease control measures.

Hi FJ

          The above come from the FAO  ,you probably know most of it ,it is an old paper but I would say most things are still relevant.  

[Michael Hare]

My company, Ubon Forage Seeds Co. Ltd, is buying this coming season, 300,000 kg of ordinary Thai Sunnhemp and 60,000 kg of Organic Sunn hemp seed. We are based in Ubon Ratchathani. The main seed producers are in Ubon, Sisaket, Roi-et and Mahasarakham. Nearly all plant after the rice is harvested, in November-December. Harvest the seed in April-May. 

 

With dry season plantings there are far less attacks from diseases and insects. In trials I sowed at the end of June, aphids destroyed most of the plants. I resowed at the end of September and the heavy early October rains flooded the fields and rotted the emerging seedlings. I tried for the third time towards the end of October and while establishment has been okay, the plots require constant irrigation which we don't have time for.

 

Sunn hemp is a great plant for green manure but it is difficult to grow in some environments.

[farmerjo]

We talked breifly about Communist grass on here before.

KS mentioned his wife used to sell it for paper many years ago.

Being a wet year,i have an abundance of it and trying work out what best to do with it other than burn it.

I see on the internet it is called pennisetum ornamental grass and sold for around 30 baht for 20 seeds.

Am i barking up the wrong tree here with a different variety or is it possible?

I think i read somewhere it's to toxic to feed cattle so making hay would be out of the equation.

But if rolled and crimped at the right time could do well as a cover crop(if thick enough) for say pumpkins or watermelons in the dry season.

What do other farmers do with it.

 

 

[kickstart]

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [Edit] References

 

 

Grassroots
Classification of science
Kingdom :	Plantae
Not Rated :	Angiosperms
Not Rated :	Monocots
Not Rated :	Commelinids
rating:	Poales
family:	Poaceae
Currency:	Pennisetum
species:	P. pedicellatum
Binomial name
Pennisetum pedicellatum  Trin.

Grassy or grassy communist grass ( Scientific name : Pennisetum pedicellatum ; English : desho grass, desho ) is a single-flowering plant. One species in the genus Pennisetum grass origin. Ethiopia ^[1] This grass is an important source of food for livestock and can be sown in small areas. ^[1]

Yard is a major weed, leading to the damage to agriculture in Thailand can be quickly spread by seeds. Grassroots in Thailand since about 1955 by Professor Kuma FAO animal feed expert from India. ^[2]

 

Content 

 [ซ่อน] 

• 1botanical characteristics
• 2strains of grass or wild communist grass
• 3benefits and disadvantages
• 4.Removal
• 5References

 

Botanical characteristics [ edit ]

Grass is a grass that grows yearly. Can shoot large clumps up to 1-2 meters or more. The trunk is covered with a leaf. The stem of the stem has broken out. Grass is scurry Cactus Leaf cover Leaf slices The leaves are green, the leaves are top and bottom with a soft coat. Flowering is a flowering bouquet from the tip of the stem. Long-haired And soft, like the animal tail, the flowers will flow in October.And the fallen soil will regenerate after rain in May.

Grassy or grassy grass species [ edit ]

It is proposed that this article or section should include a new article, Pennisetum pedicellatum , Pennisetum polystachyon and Pennisetum setosum ( debate ).

1. Large or large reddish-green grass. • Scientific name Pennisetum pedicellatum. Trin: Feather pennisetum. The trunk is characterized by straight stems with a height of 1-2 meters or more. Stems are articulated. Shell and strong core Stems branched at the base. And sometimes, the trunk is found on the ground. The stem is a new trunk. Leaves are a single leaf. Sort by the height of the trunk. Composed of light green leaves covering the trunk. The next sheet. Width about 5-10 cm in length, about 15-25 cm long, slender, pointed, leafy, covered with hairs covering the top and bottom, the flowers are bouquet. Both out And stuck out at the stem end. Inflorescences are about 10-12 centimeters long, with an inflorescence of 1-1.5 centimeters, which has a large inflorescence. The flowers are covered with hairs. The blooming flowers are purple and the flowers will gradually turn into straw or light brown.

2. Yellow-throated Prairie or Little Prairie, or Little Prairie. • Scientific Name: Pennisetum polystachyon Sehute. The trunk is characterized by its trunk and leaves, which are similar to the large flowering grass. The leaves are slightly longer than 15-35 cm and the inflorescences are shorter than 12-18 cm and the flower size is smaller. Shorter hair

Yellow lily • Scientific name Pennisetum setosum is a species of frog found after the first two species, which are found in the southern area. From Surat Thani down. This breed is different from the first two varieties: the flowers are yellowish. They are older than 1 year but the first two are only one year old. The number of inflorescences of the yellow flowers from 1 aphid is about 18 bouquets. Each bouquet has about 460 blossom flowers, so it can spread violently. And very fast. The yellow flowers will flowering in January and October.

Advantages and disadvantages [ edit ]

benefit

1. But before the promotion of planting as a raw material for paper production. (In Thailand at Bangpa-in Paper Mill)
2. The first imported Thai duckweed was designed to be fed to buffaloes, yielding about 1.8 tonnes / rai. Can be harvested within 40-60 days after planting.
3. Planted for mulching. Defoliation
4. 186.10 calories, protein: 7.56 grams, fat: 0.79 grams, carbohydrates: 37.21 grams, humidity: 8.70 grams, ash: 8.78 grams, waste Calcium: 129.6 milligrams, phosphorus: 174.3 milligrams and iron: 16.2 milligrams.

cons

1. The frog has a fluffy feather. Which helps to support the blades to fly. Spread quickly
2. The trunk of the grass can grow large clumps. The number of trees. And the number of flowers as well. So can spread quickly.
3. The large and very tall grasses are obstacles to the removal of both cutting and digging.
4. Prairie grass is very resistant to pesticides. The use of some chemicals do not work.
5. It is widely spread as a weed by orchard. Cassava, sugar cane and paddy fields will result in lower crop yields.
6. Often found along the river. The water is not covered by local plants.

Removal [ edit ]

1. Use spraying pesticides limited. Which can be effective.
2. Digging the rhizome or the sun.

References [ edit ]

• Charnchai Manee Dulay, 2511. Record of the introduction of animal feed into the country . Veterinary Medicine Volume 1 January 1968.
• Veerapon Chamsawat and Soman Srisawat, 1995. A feasibility study on the use of barnyard grass for coarse feed in dry season .
• Dumrong Leenanuruksa, 2522. Production of hay for cows. Research of Kasetsart University .

1. ↑ ^{กระโดดขึ้นไป:1.0 1.1} Smith, G. (2010). Ethiopia: local solutions to a global problem .
2. กระโดดขึ้น↑ "IAS in Thailand" .

 

A pice from Wiki, looking at your photos , you already have a problem next year , most of those seed heads will have shed they seeds by now.

You could cut a bale it , but do you have a  mower and baler where you are . buffaloes  will eat it 

I would say the stems are too tough for crimping, it would still grow again unless they are young, and soft being a grass I would say roundup when the plants are young.

Around here it is not a problem, mainly a hedge bottom ,roadside plant , any seeds that do germinate in a field, will get ploughed in .

Wife, daughter, S i L are making charcoal,thay are using it  to cover the wood , before putting the soil on top , and to fill in any holes that appear in the  oven  as the  charcoal  is being made ,a very tough grass .

[Michael Hare]

11 hours ago, farmerjo said:

We talked breifly about Communist grass on here before.

KS mentioned his wife used to sell it for paper many years ago.

Being a wet year,i have an abundance of it and trying work out what best to do with it other than burn it.

I see on the internet it is called pennisetum ornamental grass and sold for around 30 baht for 20 seeds.

Am i barking up the wrong tree here with a different variety or is it possible?

I think i read somewhere it's to toxic to feed cattle so making hay would be out of the equation.

But if rolled and crimped at the right time could do well as a cover crop(if thick enough) for say pumpkins or watermelons in the dry season.

What do other farmers do with it.

 

 

Communist grass is a very invasive weed. Get rid of it. It is good for nothing. In Vietnam they call it Thailand grass.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennisetum_polystachion

 

https://www.feedipedia.org/node/400

 

 

 

 

[farmerjo]

It's a pity a crop of value wouldn't just pop up like this and make us some money.

Found my 1st crop of sunn hemp maturing out but still not quite ready to harvest.

 

[Michael Hare]

But there are grass seed crops making money. Lots of money for the farmers. And they just have not popped out of no where. I first introduced forage seed production in Thailand in 1974. Still here. Must be crazy. 

 

Take a look at my village farmers 2017 seed crops. Also on seed buying day. Just purchased 60,000 kg of grass seed. Great income for the farmers. The demand for our Northeast Thailand produced forage seeds is far in excess of supply. Northeast Thailand is the only region in all of Asia that has the ability to produce top quality tropical forage grass seeds. Very sorry that we can not produce tropical turf grass seeds. If we could, I wouldn't be writing on Thai Visa. 

[farmerjo]

I was thinking more along the lines of cereal crops that i can use my harvester with. 

[farmerjo]

Started doing some cleaning up and did a water pump on the old Ford.

On the the way to town to get a replacement there was starting to be some action at the sugar weighbridges.

Prices on the way in started at 700 baht/ton and on the way back had risen to 750.Good to see competition.

I haven't kept up with the sugar as there was talk of rule changes(floating the price?) so not sure if implemented yet.  

 

[kickstart]

15 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

Started doing some cleaning up and did a water pump on the old Ford.

On the the way to town to get a replacement there was starting to be some action at the sugar weighbridges.

Prices on the way in started at 700 baht/ton and on the way back had risen to 750.Good to see competition.

I haven't kept up with the sugar as there was talk of rule changes(floating the price?) so not sure if implemented yet. 750 baht/ton,not a lot last year  950 

 

3

HI FJ

Only talking this morning to a sugar cane grower, asked when the mill opens, he said 12 December, then what price per ton ,he said ,did not konw.

Have said before, where else,  a farmer is  day's/ weeks away, from harvesting a crop , and he does not know what price he is going to get , for that crop.  

Noticed a sugar cane harvester parked up ready to go ,I think the price will be 350-400 baht ton , to cut and haule cane to the mill, if the price is  750 baht/ton ,not a lot of  money to be made ,by the time all other expenses are taken away, also they say sugar content this year will be low , good growing year ,bit to much rain for a high  sugar content.

Just starting to lift cassava around here, drove past a big cassava buyer, board say 2  baht/kg , this guy chips and dry's  cassava. 

[wayned]

The mill is open near here and Route 1 was crowed with trucks yesterday on the way to the mill.  The trucks were actually not overloaded and had red signs on the back so I guess that the DLT is enforcing the laws.  All of the loads were hand cut and not burnt, but when I got up this morning there was a distinct smell  of money burning in the air and pieces of burnt leaves on the back patio.  Nothing has been harvested around here but the prevailing wind is from the east so if Kickstart passes gas I get the result.  I don't know what the price is yet but will find out.

 

The sunflowers are dying but the flowers are really small and many fields very sparse.  Some of the seeds look like grape seeds so it will be up to each farmer whether he harvests them or not.  The combines are ready but the cost/rai is the same whether the crop is good or bad.

[kickstart]

Wife was talking to our neighbor last night, his friend grows sugar cane looking like the price around here, like FJ's area will be 700 baht ton , we have no weigh stations, cut load on to trucks , straight to the mill .

The price might go up a bit , but no  one is going to get rich this year , will the government help out ? like thay did  2years ago .

Our local mill has a plant to make alcohol, which in turn goes on to make gasohol ,so it is in they interest to keep the price up , one grower near here use to have the best part of 1000 rie of cane, now  grow a lot of cassava ,cane price been low for the past 2 years .

[thoongfoned]

cane prices at local weigh stations around us are from 800 to 900 baht. wife was talking with the family that rent her land and they said they expect 1000 baht plus if they meet their quota.i always seem to get vague answers to my many questions..... wife pinched some money first but has to wait for the bulk of the rent due, they get paid for their cane in febuary, so thats when she will see her bit.

[wayned]

I got a mumbled 700 baht today at the Coop, but they haven't put the extenders on the trucks yet to haul cane so it will most likely be after the first of the year.  We only load and haul it, hand cut, and the cutting is left to a migrant crew.  Once it gets into full swing the availability of trucks, due to the wait for unloading at the mill, becomes a problem; cut, stack and haul when trucks are available 24/7.  This also creates a big problem for the few combines in use as they have to load as they cut and the trucks don't get any priority at the mill.

[farmerjo]

Most weigh stations around here have come back to 700 baht/ton.

The time of year to keep an arms length from the missus when the neighbours start harvest.

The electric blower has got me some brownie points for cleaning the ash out of the yard.

 

[thoongfoned]

14 hours ago, farmerjo said:

Most weigh stations around here have come back to 700 baht/ton.

The time of year to keep an arms length from the missus when the neighbours start harvest.

The electric blower has got me some brownie points for cleaning the ash out of the yard.

 

those local weigh station, how far do they then have to transport the cane to the processors plant? 

around us the cane is being cut/move ect but it dont look as busy on the roads as normal,  have the fires but dont seem as many as before.... maybe they are starting later this year here, i know from what i have seen and also the wife has told me that many people are finding labor harder to come by this year because alot of poeple are now in south korea. the knock on affect is people are now waiting for work in korea as to many thais are over there...

[farmerjo]

It's about 40 km's to the Mitr phol factory from here.Mitr Phol have their own local depot but it's 8 km's from here.

Looking across the road,there's a 10 man/women team cutting the burnt cane.

A sugar grab on standby and a 10 ton truck just departed for the factory direct.

They are a local business that buys the whole crop,in the old days the price was sorted by eye.

Don't know if still the same or by the ton.

The weighbridge's suit the 1-15 rai small farmers who want to cut an iron buffalo trailer full at a time themselves and do all the harvest to maximise profits. 

[farmerjo]

Harvested some sunn hemp today,will let it dry a couple of days then go cut some more.(festive season takes priority)

Seed looks a decent size,will have to pay more attention when cleaning machine from rice.

Got a great sample only to have old rice in there.

 

 

[thoongfoned]

29 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

It's about 40 km's to the Mitr phol factory from here.Mitr Phol have their own local depot but it's 8 km's from here.

Looking across the road,there's a 10 man/women team cutting the burnt cane.

A sugar grab on standby and a 10 ton truck just departed for the factory direct.

They are a local business that buys the whole crop,in the old days the price was sorted by eye.

Don't know if still the same or by the ton.

The weighbridge's suit the 1-15 rai small farmers who want to cut an iron buffalo trailer full at a time themselves and do all the harvest to maximise profits. 

thats about the same distance that the weigh bridge "middle men" have to take the cane into being re weighed paid ect... 40km. everyone around here just cuts themselves then go and weigh and then spend.555

the family that rent the wifes lands have some part in the main weigh station around us, they unload and load the trucks/tractors with 20 ton macros then straight into the lorry and drag units, from what i was told they expect 1000 baht plus per ton if all good/qouta filled ect..  

same family have all the lorries, tractors, tractor with grab and 4 macros, machines always working year in year out,  the grab tractors work per grap then loaded not sure how much, but cheaper and quick more than people. drivers get paided per grap also. guy that runs the show is good at judging how much work needs to be done/paid for. they farm in many 1000's of rai, mostly cane.

have a guy coming in to get some pig poo later will ask the"boss" to see how much he is getting for his cane, he owns loads of land,cane and rubber, but he is from a different province.

[thoongfoned]

guy says he sells his cane local, no quota, expects 850/900 baht per ton, he has not started cutting yet....

[farmerjo]

My guru from Mitr Phol used to tell me February was when the CSS is best in your cane for sugar content for max price(quota system).

However that takes planning and a decent water supply in most parts to make the cane Hold on that long for harvest.

Our area if they cut now before the cane dries out to much,it will start to regrow on the morning dews without irrigation.

I estimate the crop across the road went 13-14 tonnes/rai without irrigation and minimal fertilizer,next year it will be 3rd year sugar and will go south quickly. 

 

[kickstart]

8 hours ago, thoongfoned said:

those local weigh station, how far do they then have to transport the cane to the processors plant? 

around us the cane is being cut/move ect but it dont look as busy on the roads as normal,  have the fires but dont seem as many as before.... maybe they are starting later this year here, i know from what i have seen and also the wife has told me that many people are finding labor harder to come by this year because alot of poeple are now in south korea. the knock on affect is people are now waiting for work in korea as to many thais are over there...

Our mill has been only open for 2 weeks, I drove past it today  like you ,very quiet,a lot of cane is cut by machine ,the cutters around here are Cambodian, and a lot come down from Issan, most Issan cutters  are rice  farmers  they harvest their rice first ,  then  come down  here to cut cane ,I think  a lot of growers are waiting for cutters the arrive ,with the labour shortage some growers will be surprised how few are going to come 

This year sugar content is low,  hence  700 baht/ton , yields are good ,I am no expert on cane ,if left a while , will the sugar content rise? hence the slow start.

[farmerjo]

Hi KS and other TV readers,merry xmas to all.

 

http://www.sugarcanecrops.com/agronomic_practices/harvesting_management/

 

Edited December 24, 2017 by farmerjo

[wayned]

The mill here is about 40 kilometers away and for the past 10 years all loads are hauled directly to the mill.  There were local weigh stations but they all closed then.  Most of the cane near me has not been cut.  There were a couple of fields cut with small crews taking 2-3 days doing what used to be done in 1 day.  I'm being told that the price here is 700 baht/kilo.  I've gone in the direction of the mill 2 times in the past week and there are many trucks with hand cut cane, all nicely not overloaded with the proper red flags dangling.  I've not seen any mechanical harvesters yet this year but expect that they will appear after the New Year Holiday along with the nightly black snow storm!

 

No stockings hung by the chimney here as I would have to build one first and the cheer will most likely be a bottle, or two or maybe even three, of Chang or Leo to go with my Christmas dinner of escargot in garlic butter and home made french bread!

 

Have a Merry Christmas, today here, and a Happy New year! 

[kickstart]

What are the red flags for ,I always thought thay said  "long vehicle" or  "slow moving vehicle"., must be a legal requirement, most .trucks /tractors ,have them . and use them all the time .

Happy Christmas.

[thoongfoned]

On 24/12/2560 at 6:22 PM, farmerjo said:

My guru from Mitr Phol used to tell me February was when the CSS is best in your cane for sugar content for max price(quota system).

However that takes planning and a decent water supply in most parts to make the cane Hold on that long for harvest.

Our area if they cut now before the cane dries out to much,it will start to regrow on the morning dews without irrigation.

I estimate the crop across the road went 13-14 tonnes/rai without irrigation and minimal fertilizer,next year it will be 3rd year sugar and will go south quickly. 

 

sounds like you have grown-sold cane before? if the land near to you can produce 13/14 ton with little vits, why dont you grow cane, gotta be ok return per rai? just being nosyyyy.... i have looked at cane for years now and IF we were to grow a crop, cane or some sort of grass would be my choice...

[farmerjo]

Hi thoongfoned,

Last grew cane about 8 years ago.

I liked growing it except for the logistics of harvesting and transporting it on a quota.

Back then there were no contractors or weighbridges in the area so you had to organise everything.

I was on a 15 ton/day delivery quota to local depot as they only ran about 4 truck/trailers a day from there to factory.

I'm not a fan of having lots of labour on my place.

I thought then buying a harvester instead that could be modified to do several crops a better option so went down that path.I'm basically now setting up to grow sunn hemp to cater for the farmers around growing cane who wish to plant a break crop in between cycles.I did it years ago with soya beans to some success until the mrs got carried away with demand and sold all my seed as well.Still intend to grow some rice.And some maize when the price is right,i consider the hybrid seed to expensive at the moment.

Some of the cane i used to grow.

 

 

   

[thoongfoned]

i hear what you are saying about labor, or just having to have people around/deal with in general..... that is the main reason that we do not farm the wifes lands "ourselves". the hassle that we have had with tappers or cutting and hauling and sellling this and that over the years.... that was one of the main plus points of what we do now (contract farm for a large company) many years ago i was lucky to have a sit down chat (in english) with the ceo of the company that the wife now farms for and he said to me if you canot do the work yourselves only employ close family that can be trusted.  at the time i thought it a bit strange,but over time i have come to understand what he was saying.