Thai Commerce Min will press charges against hospital operators overcharging foreigners

[bangkokheat]

foreigners are different, just like electricity is different here, thats why the excessive charges

[sitti]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

Edited May 15, 2015 by sitti

[Jonmarleesco]

I wonder if enforcement will be retrospective?

[rethaier]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

Your comment does not make the pricing any less ridiculous. When costs are lower prices should be lower. People come here for a cheap holiday and don't want to blow their spending money on accommodation and pay the same for a beer here as they do at home. Bottom line, these businesses are not even targeted to the average wage earner in Australia or The USA.

[Beetlejuice]

If I go into a private hospital for treatment and believe I have been over charged, than whom I going to call? Doctor busters?

How can a patient challenge the medical fees and who to? Is it possible to spend a day, visit all the private hospitals in and around our city areas and ask them for a price list? Will they be publishing their fees on-line on their websites? Somehow I doubt it.

Unless the above is imposed, than foreign patiences are left in the dark and completely up against the odds with these private hospitals that have the power to ban those whom they consider troublemakers and complainers from their facilities.

This only confirms what I have suspected for decades, only now it`s official, we are getting ripped off by the private medical practices.

[long klong]

Beware of one of the tricky ways some private hospitals rip off patients. They sell you a "package deal" making you think that everything is covered in the total price. You later find out that it does not include follow up visits after the operation. Nor does it include any medicine charges. In fact they make the last visit for a final check up about 10% of the package price, just to say Good Bye to you with a smile!! That's called a rip off!

[cumgranosalum]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

....or how can these low income Thais and Americans get healthcare, when all the doctors and hospitals are chasing the big money?

[Brer Fox]

The private hospitals screw the local just as must as foreigners. Keep away from the Ramkhamhaeng Hospital and tell your Thai families likewise. Walk in the door and they behave like vultures on a corpse. My Thai gf will confirm and I ended up with an exorbitant bill for doing almost nothing apart from some sweet talk. She says she would sooner die in the gutter outside than enter the Ramkhamhaeng Hospital hospital. Says it all.

[NickJ]

Need a hotline. Also to be able to see what approved rates are for various aspects of care.

[sitti]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

....or how can these low income Thais and Americans get healthcare, when all the doctors and hospitals are chasing the big money?

Low income Thais always can go to public hospitals regardless of their ability to pay. But they have to wait hours, and up to months if patients require surgery. I have never been to some smaller private hospitals in other cities, but the most reputable big name private hospitals in Bangkok do have fair pricing structure. However those hospitals are already expensive to begin with. I spent 4 days at Samitivej Sukhumvit. My total bill was 450,000 baht (thai/farange same price). My room and services I received were first class. I think it was well worth the price and still far cheaper than the US. In the US, if you have no adequate insurance or at all, hostipals will rape you to the extent where average people may have to file bankruptcy.

[sitti]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

Your comment does not make the pricing any less ridiculous. When costs are lower prices should be lower. People come here for a cheap holiday and don't want to blow their spending money on accommodation and pay the same for a beer here as they do at home. Bottom line, these businesses are not even targeted to the average wage earner in Australia or The USA.

Luxurious accommodations/services/items are always expensive no matter in which country you stay. They are business for profit. it is take it or leave it deal. As long as there are demands for it, they will charge the customers as high as they can. Since they are still in business and continuing to expand, they are obviously targeting it right. Holidays in Thailand don't have to be expensive. I've never stayed in any so I don't know how good or bad but they are plenty of cheap hotels. Thai beers are relatively cheaper than import beer.

[Beetlejuice]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

....or how can these low income Thais and Americans get healthcare, when all the doctors and hospitals are chasing the big money?

Low income Thais always can go to public hospitals regardless of their ability to pay. But they have to wait hours, and up to months if patients require surgery. I have never been to some smaller private hospitals in other cities, but the most reputable big name private hospitals in Bangkok do have fair pricing structure. However those hospitals are already expensive to begin with. I spent 4 days at Samitivej Sukhumvit. My total bill was 450,000 baht (thai/farange same price). My room and services I received were first class. I think it was well worth the price and still far cheaper than the US. In the US, if you have no adequate insurance or at all, hostipals will rape you to the extent where average people may have to file bankruptcy.

For emergency treatments and average health issues, meaning not too serious, I always use the government hospitals.

What you describe is exactly the same sort of service that patients obtain on the UK National Health system. In fact the process here at the Government hospitals is still better than most can receive on the British National Health.

[peterb17]

Off to see an excellent world class doctor on Tuesday - maybe will cost 5000- 10 000 baht.

The cost of a private consultation in the UK or especially America would be staggering .

Quite happy to pay that- a minor problem.

The whole point of organising insurance with an internationally recognised company if heaven forbid you develop cancer or something serious - have millions of $ or £ at your disposal .

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

If you are not well- go.

We don't live for ever- endless X Rays, instruments shoved up every orifice don't help-

My opinion - have friends who seem to spend every waking moment in Bangkok Pattaya hospital- just love the place. End up on a heap of medically dubious medication- big Pharma loves them.

"Off to see an excellent world class doctor on Tuesday" - really? and who says he's "world class"? his clinic or himself....other patients?...or the framed certificates on his wall?

​on a more general note, it amazes me how people confidently extoll the virtues of a practitioner, clinic or hospital........when they are clearly in no position to make such an assessment....... in fact there isn't even a system in Thailand for doing this properly.

Well She spends three months of the year practicing and lecturing in America - yes world class.

[jesimps]

What about foreigner prices for everything else? Entrance to different venues, etc.

Or is that "Thainess"?

No, but complaining about every little thing certainly is farang-ness.

No one forces you to go to "different venues." Hardly on the same level as obtaining medical care. Maybe attending fewer "different venues" would be healthier anyway.

I don't visit any attractions that double price. Most of them are rubbish anyway. Hospital visits are essential so you have no choice but to cough up (no pun intended). Does that make me a goody two shoes just like you?

[beowolf2012]

interesting but where to make complain over hospitals.

Now I'm talking about Surin hospital normal government hospital. If you have to have a surgical operation. In the bed rooms suddenly come a nurse with a paper you have to write under but it's in Thai. Price for the bed - nursing take care and medicine.

There is no price for the surgery operation so there is no option for about you want the surgery operation yes or no.

Edited May 15, 2015 by beowolf2012

[Broeno]

Another stand up comediant. Their always so funny, but in the wrong theater.

[fritzzz25]

What about foreigner prices for everything else? Entrance to different venues, etc.

Or is that "Thainess"?

No, but complaining about every little thing certainly is farang-ness.

No one forces you to go to "different venues." Hardly on the same level as obtaining medical care. Maybe attending fewer "different venues" would be healthier anyway.

It is spot on the same for the OVERCHARGING FOREIGNERS, which this topic headline states. I am not sure where you are from, but it appears that you assume that ONLY a "farang" would fail to pay for something. As a local would NEVER commit ANY crime. So, you are saying when I go to the National Park, it would be better for my health? Or would it be better if the park didn't get my admission fee that is increased due to the fact that I am not a Thai person? I am not sure why you think my health would be better. I await your diagnosis Doctor Suradit69.

[cookee68]

10,000 baht fine, that'll teach them!

Yea they will just throw that on top of the next Farang bill,

[Beng]

10,000 baht fine, that'll teach them!

That is for not displaying their prices.

The fine for overcharging is 140.000.

[cumgranosalum]

The whole pricing scheme in Thailand is crazy, in a city where the minimum wage is 300THB they have 200 to 300 USD a day hotels, 20M TBH condos, 5 USD drinks at night. Even in the country Rai of land can run into the 100's of thousand THB.

Are you crazy? Those businesses aren't targeting the customers with minimum wage. Why would low income thai people who earn only the minimum wage need to stay at $200 to 300 a day hotels. Can low income Americans who live paycheck to paycheck afford to stay in Ritz Carlton or purchase luxurious condos in their own country? We live in the world of free market.

....or how can these low income Thais and Americans get healthcare, when all the doctors and hospitals are chasing the big money?

Low income Thais always can go to public hospitals regardless of their ability to pay. But they have to wait hours, and up to months if patients require surgery. I have never been to some smaller private hospitals in other cities, but the most reputable big name private hospitals in Bangkok do have fair pricing structure. However those hospitals are already expensive to begin with. I spent 4 days at Samitivej Sukhumvit. My total bill was 450,000 baht (thai/farange same price). My room and services I received were first class. I think it was well worth the price and still far cheaper than the US. In the US, if you have no adequate insurance or at all, hostipals will rape you to the extent where average people may have to file bankruptcy.

For emergency treatments and average health issues, meaning not too serious, I always use the government hospitals.

What you describe is exactly the same sort of service that patients obtain on the UK National Health system. In fact the process here at the Government hospitals is still better than most can receive on the British National Health.

You obviously don't understand the NHS and I'd like to know on what basis you make the assertion that "In fact the process here at the Government hospitals is still better than most can receive on the British National Health."

[RabC]

It's not only outrageous pricing.

The practices of these hospitals to up the charges when they know you have health insurance should also be investigated. And they do this to Thais as well as foreigners.

Surely that's between the Insurance Company and the Hospital, if they dont like the Hospitals Charges they can remove them from their approved list. Yes there is some over charging here but its covered by my health insurance which is a darn sight cheaper here than in the western world.

[RabC]

If I go into a private hospital for treatment and believe I have been over charged, than whom I going to call? Doctor busters?

How can a patient challenge the medical fees and who to? Is it possible to spend a day, visit all the private hospitals in and around our city areas and ask them for a price list? Will they be publishing their fees on-line on their websites? Somehow I doubt it.

Unless the above is imposed, than foreign patiences are left in the dark and completely up against the odds with these private hospitals that have the power to ban those whom they consider troublemakers and complainers from their facilities.

This only confirms what I have suspected for decades, only now it`s official, we are getting ripped off by the private medical practices.

Bumrungrad certainly do publish a costs list on their web site for operations, it shows the lowest, average and max prices paid to date for those procedures. No Hospital wil give a guaranteed fixed price for a procedure as there could be complications or things may actually end up cheaper as the treatment wasnt as complex as first thought.

https://www.bumrungrad.com/en/realcost-thailand-surgery

Just to prove I wasnt making it up.

[WaywardWind]

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

I just last week signed up for the check-up at Pattaya International Hospital on Soi 4. Blood work, chest X-ray, EKG, eye, audio, and dental exams, etc.

Total price was 6300 THB, plus another 1,000 THB for a consultation with a cardiologist which I requested to examine and explain an anomaly seen in the EKG. All of the staff were patient and informative about the process and results. Not the slightest pressure to go for more tests, medications, or procedures.

Took about 3 hours in the AM, and another 2 hours in the late afternoon after the blood work testing was completed.

My wife had a similar check-up the same day, and her experience mirrored mine.

They even gave each of us a 100 THB coupon for lunch at a restaurant across the street.

[johnh869]

Someone mentioned that a farang cannot get a 30 Baht gold card. That's not correct. If you are a PR holder like me you should be able to get a 30 Baht gold card. I have one that was issued to me when the program was initiated. If you are under the Thai SS system like me then you can't use the gold card. You have to use one or the other. Just my two cents...

[cumgranosalum]

Off to see an excellent world class doctor on Tuesday - maybe will cost 5000- 10 000 baht.

The cost of a private consultation in the UK or especially America would be staggering .

Quite happy to pay that- a minor problem.

The whole point of organising insurance with an internationally recognised company if heaven forbid you develop cancer or something serious - have millions of $ or £ at your disposal .

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

If you are not well- go.

We don't live for ever- endless X Rays, instruments shoved up every orifice don't help-

My opinion - have friends who seem to spend every waking moment in Bangkok Pattaya hospital- just love the place. End up on a heap of medically dubious medication- big Pharma loves them.

"Off to see an excellent world class doctor on Tuesday" - really? and who says he's "world class"? his clinic or himself....other patients?...or the framed certificates on his wall?

​on a more general note, it amazes me how people confidently extoll the virtues of a practitioner, clinic or hospital........when they are clearly in no position to make such an assessment....... in fact there isn't even a system in Thailand for doing this properly.

Well She spends three months of the year practicing and lecturing in America - yes world class.

Virtually every single word here raises issues of your comprehension of how to assess a doctor or practitioner.

Citing "America" for one is quite ridiculous as it has possibly the worst healthcare system in the western world.

Practice? What as? - what does she ACTUALLY claim? the laws that allow foreigners to practice medicine in the states are very bureaucratic and it usually involves about 6 years training.

Many Thai doctors cite that they have "practiced" in America and often have a certificate on the wall to support this...however when you look into it you'll probably find that the doc in question does not actually have the right to practice as a doctor in the States. many teaching hospitals etc earn extra money by "training" foreign doctors in aspects of medicine...they aren't actually allowed to practice they are observational courses with a certificate at the end.

lecturing - yes you can talk all you want - have you read any reviews of her work?

you may have noticed too that a lot fewer Doctors claim European qualifications as they are much harder to get and they is far less of a "certificate industry" in the EU.

as a guide to give you some idea from "The Atlantic".........

The United States also has strict policies regarding medical licensing—a doctor is only allowed to practice in the U.S. once he has obtained a license in the state in which he intends to work. The person must acquire a visa, pass the first two steps of the United States Medical-Licensing Exam (USMLE), then become certified by the Education Commission for Foreign Medical Graduates (ECFMG), get into an accredited U.S. or Canadian residency program, and finally, go back and pass step three of the USMLE. Each of these steps could take multiple years, repelling doctors who are already able to practice in the country in which they were trained.

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/11/doctors-with-borders-how-the-us-shuts-out-foreign-physicians/382723/

Edited May 16, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[wiesner]

just like the motorcycle taxi's a suppose to put a price board, still not happening in pattaya, as well as yellow license plates. all talk

[cumgranosalum]

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

I just last week signed up for the check-up at Pattaya International Hospital on Soi 4. Blood work, chest X-ray, EKG, eye, audio, and dental exams, etc.

Total price was 6300 THB, plus another 1,000 THB for a consultation with a cardiologist which I requested to examine and explain an anomaly seen in the EKG. All of the staff were patient and informative about the process and results. Not the slightest pressure to go for more tests, medications, or procedures.

Took about 3 hours in the AM, and another 2 hours in the late afternoon after the blood work testing was completed.

My wife had a similar check-up the same day, and her experience mirrored mine.

They even gave each of us a 100 THB coupon for lunch at a restaurant across the street.

The test packages offered by hospitals are in fact highly questionable. they are in most cases just a way of making quick cash.

The whole concept of persuading a patient that taking an "MoT" type package of tests has any real value is hotly debated and goes against basic principles of treating a patient as an individual.

We humans are NOT machines - every patient is different - even in things like blood temperatue and pressure and applying uniform tests are not considered to be an effective way of treating most patients

Edited May 16, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[xylophone]

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

I just last week signed up for the check-up at Pattaya International Hospital on Soi 4. Blood work, chest X-ray, EKG, eye, audio, and dental exams, etc.

Total price was 6300 THB, plus another 1,000 THB for a consultation with a cardiologist which I requested to examine and explain an anomaly seen in the EKG. All of the staff were patient and informative about the process and results. Not the slightest pressure to go for more tests, medications, or procedures.

Took about 3 hours in the AM, and another 2 hours in the late afternoon after the blood work testing was completed.

My wife had a similar check-up the same day, and her experience mirrored mine.

They even gave each of us a 100 THB coupon for lunch at a restaurant across the street.

The test packages offered by hospitals are in fact highly questionable. they are in most cases just a way of making quick cash.

The whole concept of persuading a patient that taking an "MoT" type package of tests has any real value is hotly debated and goes against basic principles of treating a patient as an individual.

We humans are NOT machines - every patient is different - even in things like blood temperatue and pressure and applying uniform tests are not considered to be an effective way of treating most patients

Whenever I go back to NZ, my doctor insists on doing "blood work" on me and I have no problem with that.

Over here, hospitals advertise the tests and no one is "persuaded" to take them, it's a matter of choice.

Of course we are all individuals, however some things do remain the same as regards to "ranges" of BP, cholesterol, liver and kidney function tests etc, so always nice to know that you are within the ranges, and if you are outside of them, reasons why can be investigated and hopefully rectified.

As for………“applying uniform tests are not considered to be an effective way of treating most patients”, well they are not being treated, their blood work etc is being measured against a set of parameters which generally apply to the population, and if they are outside of these parameters then the treatment, if necessary, can begin.

[louse1953]

and Santa Claus are gonna visit us tonight ... Hospitals are as many other above the law cause who own the privat hospitals ...

Please enlighten us.

[cumgranosalum]

Do they overcharge - probably not. Do they push you into loads of tests and treatments -yes. Never go for all those check ups- they will always find something.

I just last week signed up for the check-up at Pattaya International Hospital on Soi 4. Blood work, chest X-ray, EKG, eye, audio, and dental exams, etc.

Total price was 6300 THB, plus another 1,000 THB for a consultation with a cardiologist which I requested to examine and explain an anomaly seen in the EKG. All of the staff were patient and informative about the process and results. Not the slightest pressure to go for more tests, medications, or procedures.

Took about 3 hours in the AM, and another 2 hours in the late afternoon after the blood work testing was completed.

My wife had a similar check-up the same day, and her experience mirrored mine.

They even gave each of us a 100 THB coupon for lunch at a restaurant across the street.

The test packages offered by hospitals are in fact highly questionable. they are in most cases just a way of making quick cash.

The whole concept of persuading a patient that taking an "MoT" type package of tests has any real value is hotly debated and goes against basic principles of treating a patient as an individual.

We humans are NOT machines - every patient is different - even in things like blood temperatue and pressure and applying uniform tests are not considered to be an effective way of treating most patients

Whenever I go back to NZ, my doctor insists on doing "blood work" on me and I have no problem with that.

Over here, hospitals advertise the tests and no one is "persuaded" to take them, it's a matter of choice.

Of course we are all individuals, however some things do remain the same as regards to "ranges" of BP, cholesterol, liver and kidney function tests etc, so always nice to know that you are within the ranges, and if you are outside of them, reasons why can be investigated and hopefully rectified.

As for………“applying uniform tests are not considered to be an effective way of treating most patients”, well they are not being treated, their blood work etc is being measured against a set of parameters which generally apply to the population, and if they are outside of these parameters then the treatment, if necessary, can begin.

It appears you are unfamiliar with the "powers of persuasion" used by commerce on the general public - which is unfortunate because you are also clearly subject to them...presumably you are unaware of this.

As for your concept of parameters and their interpretation...yet another field you are uninformed about....