'Democracy is more than polls'

[Lite Beer]

'Democracy is more than polls'
The Sunday Nation May 17, 2015 1:00 am

BANGKOK: -- PRIME MINISTER Prayut Chan-o-cha has said he wished Thais could understand the real essence of democracy - not have a superficial grasp of what it means.

Prayut voiced his sentiment in his column "From the heart of the Prime Minister", published in the second issue of the government's newsletter. Over 60,000 copies were released around the country on Friday by the Department of Public Relations.

"Over the past one year, the government and myself often hear likewise questions: When Thailand will be democratic and when the general election will be held? This question is based on the belief that the two things are cause and effect of one another. As if when there is an election, then that is democracy," he said.

True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation. "If a government cannot rule under these four principles, it can't be regarded as ruling with democracy. If there is only an election and lack other three principles, we are still far from democracy.

"I want people to realise that is a core which is just skin deep, and I do not wish people to think that this government does not want elections," he said.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Democracy-is-more-than-polls-30260269.html

-- The Nation 2015-05-17

[canuckamuck]

True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation.

Justice for all regardless of connections. requires rule of law.

Equality, equal rights, part of the first part

Freedom, of the press, freedom to speak the truth.

Representation, Having the right to vote and majority rule.

He's right, it can't happen here and it's less likely now than ever.

Edited May 16, 2015 by canuckamuck

[trogers]

Corruption kills the first 2 ideals - Justice and Equality.

[Praematura]

A military coup that throws out an elected government lectures the masses about "true democracy." He forgot his fifth principle of disenfranchisement. A pentagon of Thainess democracy.

[Plutojames88]

This guy is being sent all over social media every time he utters non sense .

Freedom?

Show me where I can sing the Beatles song at the very end of Abbey Road that refers to the Queen of England .

Can I let white doves free and sing ""Give Peace a chance"" ? Or hand out George Orwell"s 1984 ?

Maybe get a gathering of twenty To voice democracy for Thailand ?

No .

Even here it is a case of "careful please "

Tick that off without mentioning the rights and freedoms of poor Thais .

Equality.......

A serious dark joke coming from elites in Bangkok ....really little needs to be said further.

The system is so insidiously unfair and has for so long , it's incredible to mention that one.

They don't even regard the poor as people , sometimes words like ""human trash "" are brought up.

Representation ?

Men with guns ?

Or who you decide?

Justice ?

Is this just?

The whole statement is just a continuation on the theme that America has no right to judge us or the world.

Though not mentioned the commentary is subtle ( for them ) enough to be observing democratic states like the US and not so much being about Thailand.

They know what's coming ahead ....as the weeks turn to months and sanctions occur , the xenophobic comments will intensify.

I got out based on intelligence I received that things might deteriorate to the point Westerners are attacked.

The propaganda will shift the sanctions and poorer standards of living to blaming us.

Tourism still relatively sheltered will fall with realisations that tensions are growing.

China is helping them run their party lines it seems.

Key words and phrases so frequently associated with ....""I want the people to realise that it is a core which is just skin deep""

People - skin - realise - deep.

Next monks might denounce white demons for harming the poor righteous Thais with sanctions?

Fundamentally , they see what's coming .

The road is rough.

So the ground work is going in early.

The very comment on Elections and democracy not necessarily being linked , shows the intension to hold power.

The comment is purely designed to deflect criticism from the United States.

Edited May 17, 2015 by Plutojames88

[lovetotravel]

A military coup that throws out an elected government lectures the masses about "true democracy." He forgot his fifth principle of disenfranchisement. A pentagon of Thainess democracy.

Was the previous "elected" government truly democratic? No way. Was the coup good? Some say yes, some say no. Only time will tell.

[TomJoad]

"True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation."

Education would be good too and a strong tradition.

[jamesjohnsonthird]

https://youtu.be/NzlG28B-R8Y?t=17s

Edited May 17, 2015 by jamesjohnsonthird

[lostoday]

Democracy: A system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives.

I know the education system in Thailand is sub standard but still one can assume the majority of the people can define democracy.

Edited May 17, 2015 by lostoday

[BigBadGeordie]

This guy is being sent all over social media every time he utters non sense .

Freedom?

Show me where I can sing the Beatles song at the very end of Abbey Road that refers to the Queen of England .

Can I let white doves free and sing ""Give Peace a chance"" ? Or hand out George Orwell"s 1984 ?

Maybe get a gathering of twenty To voice democracy for Thailand ?

No .

Even here it is a case of "careful please "

Tick that off without mentioning the rights and freedoms of poor Thais .

Equality.......

A serious dark joke coming from elites in Bangkok ....really little needs to be said further.

The system is so insidiously unfair and has for so long , it's incredible to mention that one.

They don't even regard the poor as people , sometimes words like ""human trash "" are brought up.

Representation ?

Men with guns ?

Or who you decide?

Justice ?

Is this just?

The whole statement is just a continuation on the theme that America has no right to judge us or the world.

Though not mentioned the commentary is subtle ( for them ) enough to be observing democratic states like the US and not so much being about Thailand.

They know what's coming ahead ....as the weeks turn to months and sanctions occur , the xenophobic comments will intensify.

I got out based on intelligence I received that things might deteriorate to the point Westerners are attacked.

The propaganda will shift the sanctions and poorer standards of living to blaming us.

Tourism still relatively sheltered will fall with realisations that tensions are growing.

China is helping them run their party lines it seems.

Key words and phrases so frequently associated with ....""I want the people to realise that it is a core which is just skin deep""

People - skin - realise - deep.

Next monks might denounce white demons for harming the poor righteous Thais with sanctions?

Fundamentally , they see what's coming .

The road is rough.

So the ground work is going in early.

The very comment on Elections and democracy not necessarily being linked , shows the intension to hold power.

The comment is purely designed to deflect criticism from the United States.

Do you wear a tin foil hat?

[trogers]

Corruption kills the first 2 ideals - Justice and Equality.

From the comments above, the blind sees better than the biased.

Thailand has never had true democracy. It is all about power struggle. The reason for acquiring power is money, gathered through the state of corruption.

By measuring the depth of corruption of each government or coup, we can correlate the degree of divergence from true democracy.

Edited May 17, 2015 by trogers

[lostoday]

Corruption kills the first 2 ideals - Justice and Equality.

From the comments above, the blind sees better than the biased.

Thailand has never had true democracy. It is all about power struggle. The reason for acquiring power is money, gathered through the state of corruption.

By measuring the depth of corruption of each government or coup, we can correlate the degree of divergence from true democracy.

Thailand has had a true democracy many times but not for long. Synonym for Democracy is elected government as opposed to appointed government.

[lostoday]

"True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation."

Education would be good too and a strong tradition.

I don't see the connection between democracy and education beyond a knowledge of the definition. China and Russia both have good education systems but no democracy.

[trogers]

Corruption kills the first 2 ideals - Justice and Equality.

From the comments above, the blind sees better than the biased.

Thailand has never had true democracy. It is all about power struggle. The reason for acquiring power is money, gathered through the state of corruption.

By measuring the depth of corruption of each government or coup, we can correlate the degree of divergence from true democracy.

Thailand has had a true democracy many times but not for long. Synonym for Democracy is elected government as opposed to appointed government.

Democracy was the name, corruption was the game.

[craigt3365]

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[NongKhaiKid]

Doesn't the country have a PM who described himself as a democratic soldier but sees democracy as a trap ?

[craigt3365]

Please stay on topic, respect other members, and NO use of the term "Dear Leader". Please.

[sandbox]

"True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation."

Education would be good too and a strong tradition.

I don't see the connection between democracy and education beyond a knowledge of the definition. China and Russia both have good education systems but no democracy.

Fundamentally, a functioning democracy requires the population to make a decision - to evaluate choices by asking questions and applying critical analysis to the answers.

When considering the consequences of a democratic process applies to the population as a whole a degree of altruism also is necessary and therefore a scope of knowledge wider than the circumstances or needs of the individual - health care or welfare, for example

Poverty and the lack of self-improvement through education will always be the antithesis of establishing and maintaining a democracy.

Edited May 17, 2015 by sandbox

[rametindallas]

Doesn't the country have a PM who described himself as a democratic soldier but sees democracy as a trap ?

Is what he is saying worse that Thaksin saying, "Democracy is not my goal"?

Thaksin wanted to be like his buddy, the thug, Hun Sen, and did everything possible to become 'President for Life' of Thailand.

General Prayut is doing everything possible to bury the influence of Thaksin and to set up conditions in Thailand where democracy, if not thrive, at least can grow. That is my opinion.

[Plutojames88]

Doesn't the country have a PM who described himself as a democratic soldier but sees democracy as a trap ?

Is what he is saying worse that Thaksin saying, "Democracy is not my goal"?

Thaksin wanted to be like his buddy, the thug, Hun Sen, and did everything possible to become 'President for Life' of Thailand.

General Prayut is doing everything possible to bury the influence of Thaksin and to set up conditions in Thailand where democracy, if not thrive, at least can grow. That is my opinion.

And some asked if I wore a Tin Foil hat?

Edited May 17, 2015 by Plutojames88

[NongKhaiKid]

Doesn't the country have a PM who described himself as a democratic soldier but sees democracy as a trap ?

Is what he is saying worse that Thaksin saying, "Democracy is not my goal"?

Thaksin wanted to be like his buddy, the thug, Hun Sen, and did everything possible to become 'President for Life' of Thailand.

General Prayut is doing everything possible to bury the influence of Thaksin and to set up conditions in Thailand where democracy, if not thrive, at least can grow. That is my opinion.

Yes, but there's no right and wrong in this situation as whoever is in power wants to set things up to suit them and those who support them.

[KarenBravo]

When ordinary Thais can discuss openly a subject that they presently can't, without threat of gaol time, then, I might believe that this country is progressing.

[waitforusalso]

Thanom, Suchinda, Prayuth; all cut from the same cloth, with the same views on democracy. All with the same willingness to deal with to pesky northerners & Isaan people who dare to disagree.

[lostoday]

Corruption kills the first 2 ideals - Justice and Equality.

From the comments above, the blind sees better than the biased.

Thailand has never had true democracy. It is all about power struggle. The reason for acquiring power is money, gathered through the state of corruption.

By measuring the depth of corruption of each government or coup, we can correlate the degree of divergence from true democracy.

Thailand has had a true democracy many times but not for long. Synonym for Democracy is elected government as opposed to appointed government.

Democracy was the name, corruption was the game.

Democracy may be corrupt or not. It has nothing to do with the fact that some governments are democratic. Democracy just means polls nothing else. It is a form of government whereby the people choose the government they want. That choice may be corrupt or not it's up to the people who vote. Do you see the point? Democracy is neither good or bad it is simply a system of government that involves elections.

[sweatalot]

True democracy, he said, was actually based on four principles: justice, equality, freedom and representation.

Justice for all regardless of connections. requires rule of law.

Equality, equal rights, part of the first part

Freedom, of the press, freedom to speak the truth.

Representation, Having the right to vote and majority rule.

He's right, it can't happen here and it's less likely now than ever.

He's right, it can't happen here and it's less likely now than ever.

I think, now it is more likely than it ever was, in particular more likely than during the shin gang governments

[sweatalot]

A military coup that throws out an elected government lectures the masses about "true democracy." He forgot his fifth principle of disenfranchisement. A pentagon of Thainess democracy.

"elected government"

again that rubbish "elected government"

forgetting how, why and by whom and with what understanding they were elected

forgetting the corrupt and incapable way they governed

[boomerangutang]

Was the previous "elected" government truly democratic? No way. Was the coup good? Some say yes, some say no. Only time will tell.

Considering the awful Yingluck administration, I think the coup was good. Lesser of two problematic controlling groups. How quick Thais forget what Yingluck was all about. As a reminder, here are the mainstays of her years at the helm:

>>> Cushion her brother's fall from grace and power.

>>> Get the 'fine' money back (money is God, after all).

>>> Get him back to Thailand - with a hero's welcome.

>>> Get his crimes excused, even if it meant altering the Constitution

>>> Get him a diplomatic passport. Done!

>>> Rebate on some types of cars - thereby doubling gridlock in every Thai city

>>> Rice program - which further enriched some of her Chinese-Thai rice millers, and didn't help the little guys.

>>> Computer for every student. There was corruption in that also - who would have thought...?!?

>>> Nada, zero, zip to aid the environment. The Shinawatres are to environmental husbandry what crows are to bicycle repair.

Democracy: A system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives.

I know the education system in Thailand is sub standard but still one can assume the majority of the people can define democracy.

From the Animal Farm book: 'All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.'

'one can assume... the Thai people can define democracy.' I wouldn't assume that. For one reason: they assume democracy is voting for whomever pays best.

[lostoday]

Was the previous "elected" government truly democratic? No way. Was the coup good? Some say yes, some say no. Only time will tell.

Considering the awful Yingluck administration, I think the coup was good. Lesser of two problematic controlling groups. How quick Thais forget what Yingluck was all about. As a reminder, here are the mainstays of her years at the helm:

>>> Cushion her brother's fall from grace and power.

>>> Get the 'fine' money back (money is God, after all).

>>> Get him back to Thailand - with a hero's welcome.

>>> Get his crimes excused, even if it meant altering the Constitution

>>> Get him a diplomatic passport. Done!

>>> Rebate on some types of cars - thereby doubling gridlock in every Thai city

>>> Rice program - which further enriched some of her Chinese-Thai rice millers, and didn't help the little guys.

>>> Computer for every student. There was corruption in that also - who would have thought...?!?

>>> Nada, zero, zip to aid the environment. The Shinawatres are to environmental husbandry what crows are to bicycle repair.

Democracy: A system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives.

I know the education system in Thailand is sub standard but still one can assume the majority of the people can define democracy.

From the Animal Farm book: 'All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.'

'one can assume... the Thai people can define democracy.' I wouldn't assume that. For one reason: they assume democracy is voting for whomever pays best.

It makes no difference. Democracy is just a system of government that involves polls. As much as you might want to change the definition it does not change the definition. If a majority of the people are corrupt then we would be correct in assuming that the government might be corrupt.

Take a look at Singapore. It is not corrupt nor has it always been a democracy. You can have a just dictatorship and a corrupt democracy - nothing in the definition of democracy precludes that.

Edited May 17, 2015 by lostoday

[KarenBravo]

A military coup that throws out an elected government lectures the masses about "true democracy." He forgot his fifth principle of disenfranchisement. A pentagon of Thainess democracy.

"elected government"

again that rubbish "elected government"

forgetting how, why and by whom and with what understanding they were elected

forgetting the corrupt and incapable way they governed

Hard to tell whether you are talking about Peau Thai, or the Democrats as your post is true for both of them......

[chainarong]

This coming from a former Commander In Chief of a Military that wouldn't have the first idea about Democracy or with respect very little only what they've heard about , perhaps through the military grape vine , there is a lot to learn about Democracy and you learn that over centuries not in 5 minuets , however it is better to keep the ball rolling , learn and ask questions , it certainly is not helpful having Coups every 6 years, the majority of Thai's like other people in Democratic countries like to vote as that is the only democratic obligation most have to support their choice of candidate to represent them to ensure Democracy continues , No P.M. Prayut -O polls do count.