No More 3mil Investment Visas In Thailand

Firefan · September 21, 2006

Maizefarmer; I agree that having money does increase the flexibility (a flight hoem to apply for 6 month tourist visa/12 month non-o/b or whatever the embassy is willing to issue) but there is currently really not any "stay in country" LEGAL options even for us (under 50/single).

Start company? What if no biz idea/skills/desire? - after a few years of no earnings that would be questioned too, fake marriage? fake student? all either illegal or bordering to it.

Cheers!

Sunbelt Asia · September 21, 2006

Question for Sunbelt or anyone else with direct, personal experience:
First, many thanks to Sunbelt for the info given so far.

My question is: at what stage in the application process do immigration reject your request? Is it immediately on your first visit or is it after the 30 days consideration? I have had three, one year extensions based on a 3M baht, secondhand condo. Soon, I will have to go and apply for another year. If they accept the application and take my 1900 baht, does this mean I will be OK, or could I still be rejected after 30 days?

Any ideas?

You could be rejected after 30 days but as Firefan pointed out, if you get past the gatekeeper accepting the applications, you are in good shape.

If our lawyer is arguing hard on your behalf why you should be grandfather in and they accept it, its 70% chance of being approved after it goes to the committee. If no persuasion is needed its more like 100% success rate.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Maizefarmer · September 21, 2006

Point taken - I didn't have the 30 day stamp in mind - I was viewing this from a Non-Immigrant Visa perspective - which I understood (from this froum) you could just keep renewing/reapplying for - effectively allowing you to stay on endlessly (assuming you got the right one and went about the replacement process correctly).

Again - correct me if I am wrong - I havent had to worry about a visa for nearly 2 decades having been a PR since 1992.

Tim

Question for Sunbelt or anyone else with direct, personal experience:

First, many thanks to Sunbelt for the info given so far.

My question is: at what stage in the application process do immigration reject your request? Is it immediately on your first visit or is it after the 30 days consideration? I have had three, one year extensions based on a 3M baht, secondhand condo. Soon, I will have to go and apply for another year. If they accept the application and take my 1900 baht, does this mean I will be OK, or could I still be rejected after 30 days?

Any ideas?

You could be rejected after 30 days but as Firefan pointed out, if you get past the gatekeeper accepting the applications, you are in good shape.

If our lawyer is arguing hard on your behalf why you should be grandfather in and they accept it, its 70% chance of being approved after it goes to the committee. If no persuasion is needed its more like 100% success rate.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Sunbelt Asia · September 21, 2006

Sorry if their was a misunderstanding, my answer was for logpoacher in reference to his question.

Point taken - I didn't have the 30 day stamp in mind - I was viewing this from a Non-Immigrant Visa perspective - which I understood (from this froum) you could just keep renewing/reapplying for - effectively allowing you to stay on endlessly (assuming you got the right one and went about the replacement process correctly).

As for your point. You are correct as long as the rules ( goal posts) don't change.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Point taken - I didn't have the 30 day stamp in mind - I was viewing this from a Non-Immigrant Visa perspective - which I understood (from this froum) you could just keep renewing/reapplying for - effectively allowing you to stay on endlessly (assuming you got the right one and went about the replacement process correctly).
Again - correct me if I am wrong - I havent had to worry about a visa for nearly 2 decades having been a PR since 1992.

Tim

Question for Sunbelt or anyone else with direct, personal experience:

First, many thanks to Sunbelt for the info given so far.

My question is: at what stage in the application process do immigration reject your request? Is it immediately on your first visit or is it after the 30 days consideration? I have had three, one year extensions based on a 3M baht, secondhand condo. Soon, I will have to go and apply for another year. If they accept the application and take my 1900 baht, does this mean I will be OK, or could I still be rejected after 30 days?

Any ideas?

You could be rejected after 30 days but as Firefan pointed out, if you get past the gatekeeper accepting the applications, you are in good shape.

If our lawyer is arguing hard on your behalf why you should be grandfather in and they accept it, its 70% chance of being approved after it goes to the committee. If no persuasion is needed its more like 100% success rate.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Firefan · September 21, 2006

Maizefarmer/Tim; as mentioned it is unfortunately not that simple.

Below 50 with money from abroad (pension/savings/rental income/ownership share in biz/whatever) really have no LEGAL avenue for just staying in Thailand (not work/study/marry(!)) after the investment visa got stopped without flights/visa runs Etc. (Unless you go for the Elite card or have 40M Baht willing to invest .. ).

Congrats on the PR - something I will look more into in a years time.

Cheers!

logpoacher · September 21, 2006

Sunbelt,

Thanks for that reply. I hope there will be no arguing required! To be honest, it will just be a relief to have it resolved one way or the other. I still think I'll wait until next week to apply, let the dust settle a bit. And I'll learn the Thai for "grandfathered"!

Thanks again.

Sunbelt Asia · September 21, 2006

Sunbelt,
Thanks for that reply. I hope there will be no arguing required! To be honest, it will just be a relief to have it resolved one way or the other. I still think I'll wait until next week to apply, let the dust settle a bit. And I'll learn the Thai for "grandfathered"!

Thanks again.

The window is open now; we just had two clients approved in the last hour.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Maizefarmer · September 21, 2006

Logpoacher

No - not to argue - trying to help you find a solution. Yes, I see your point, you are trying to find a solution based on a particular set of circumstances - and that I think is where/why you feel restricted.

What I was trying to convey, was leave out the issue of 3mill Baht investment, leave out the issue of age, wife ect ect ect...... if you get a Non Imm Visa (and get the right one) and go about replacing it/renewing it correctly, as things stand at the moment, you can effectively stay in Thailand endlesly (other than for having to leave to get it renewed).

That was what I saying when I said if you can't find one or other visa that you can use to stay then you shouldn't really be here all be it, it may not be the correct visa for your cirucmstances, and in that respect yes, I can see what the problem is for you, but none-the-less, it will enable you to stay - and at the end of the day I don't think anyone cares what the visa they're here on - they're here on a visa and thats all that counts to most guys (especicially those that have lived on 30 day stamps).

Overall though - the whole system needs to be revamped and it doe shave "gaps". One thing wrong (amongst others): it assumes you have to be over 50 to be rich enough to retire - ??? - if you can afford to ritre at 30 and can demonstrate that financially, then why not let people get a retirement visa at 30 or 40??

Tim

zz.fugazi · September 21, 2006

Sunbelt- what does "approved" mean? I went down to immigration today, paid my 1900 THB for the 3MB exstension of a non-B visa, got all the stamps and immediate approvals, then was told to return on in late November. My passport was stamped with the late November date. So, does that mean that I got approval?

sting01 · September 21, 2006

There is one little bit of good out of this new development.
It will screw some of the hateful zealots that posted in the border run crack down thread. All those who showed no understanding and called those who could not get visa lowlifes because they didn’t have 3 million baht to invest are getting a well deserved kick in the teeth.

How does it feel?

If anyone wants to repost the comments of those posters who had investment visa and who were telling others to get out of Thailand that would make my day.

Well, I think people who could not raise a decent amount of let 10 millions of baths are simply low lifes visa runners.

Abusive comments removed.

If you were not really serious, why say it at all?

Moderator

Enought for the silly and moronic abuse, I hope noone feel hurt because I was not really serious ... but I hope people will think next time and not systematically describe others as '****' while they do not know the reasons of the visa runs.

Edited September 22, 2006 by astral

Firefan · September 21, 2006

Maizefarmer; hmm...you still don't seem to get it... there is no way to GET OR RENEW the visa whether non-em b/o or whatever as the rules stand today. EVEN if one gets it from a (very) friendly consulate based on blablabla(visiting friends or whatever-NOT an official purpose btw) and no real docs, there is no chance of RENEWING it it Thailand. (under 50/single/no work).

Sting01; I want some of what you are smoking...if it's legal!

Cheers!

Maizefarmer · September 21, 2006

Maizefarmer; hmm...you still don't seem to get it... there is no way to GET OR RENEW the visa whether non-em b/o or whatever as the rules stand today. EVEN if one gets it from a (very) friendly consulate based on blablabla(visiting friends or whatever-NOT an official purpose btw) and no real docs, there is no chance of RENEWING it it Thailand. (under 50/single/no work).
Sting01; I want some of what you are smoking...if it's legal!

Cheers!

Obviously I'm mising something. In your case, yes I can see you are struggling to get the visa you want or to get your current visa renewed. What I am getting at is that, that should still not prevent you from getting into Thailand on some or other visa. Somewhere on the visa threads SUNBELT illustrates how, on one of the Non-Imm type visa (O or B - I can;t remember which one) you can effectively stay here for a year plus - all be it you will have to go out to get it re-entered or restamped at some point. The key to it though is starting off on the right type of Non-Imm Visa (which is not depoendant on 3mill, wife or 50 years of age) - and if you don't (which is where I think I might be missing the relivance of what you have conveyed in earlier postings), then the whole procedure falls apart, and you land up back in square one without any visa that can be used/renewed.

Is that where I have come unstuck with what you have said earlier - sorry I havent had to worry about a visa now since the 1990's so I am well rusty on the subject, and there have been many changes since then - and as you well know, another bunch just about to make things even more troublesome.

Tim.

Sunbelt Asia · September 22, 2006

Sunbelt- what does "approved" mean? I went down to immigration today, paid my 1900 THB for the 3MB exstension of a non-B visa, got all the stamps and immediate approvals, then was told to return on in late November. My passport was stamped with the late November date. So, does that mean that I got approval?

Approved is when Immigration stamps your passport with the extension of stay for one year from the date you first entered Thailand.

However, the odds of being approved are very good as you got pass the gatekeeper. (The person who looks over the documents and stamps you with the "under consideration" stamp.)

Somewhere on the visa threads SUNBELT illustrates how, on one of the Non-Imm type visa (O or B - I can;t remember which one) you can effectively stay here for a year plus - all be it you will have to go out to get it re-entered or restamped at some point.

It does not matter what letter visa you have, if its "B", "O", "ED" or any other non immigrant visa, you can do any extension of stay for another type with no need to change it.

Example. You can get a extension of stay based on retirement on a 90 day "B" visa or even a "ED" visa.

As for getting the visa re-stamped and needing to leave Thailand. This would be if you have a one year multi entry visa. This visa was obtained at an Embassy/Consulate outside Thailand and not from Immigration inside Thailand. You can come and go even 300 times in a year with every entry giving you a fresh 90 days. The only requirement is you must travel at least one time every 90 days to get a fresh 90 day stamp. If you are tired of traveling and meet the criteria you can apply for an extension of stay off your last 90 day entry stamp.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Firefan · September 22, 2006

Maizefarmer; I know it can be a bit confusing (and you can remain blissfull with your PR status you lucky man!

Point is that even IF you start on the"right" visa (say sponsor letter from laywer gets you a visa; "looking for investments"(, or "visiting friends"(o)) obtained outside Thailand at friendly(!) consulate, you would STILL need to do 90 day visa runs+ fly to other country yearly for NEW visa as you will NOT get the visa extended in Thailand NO MATTER what visa you came in with because ONE DOES NOT FULLFILL THE REQUIREMENTS FOR OBTAINING EXTENSION (WP/married Thai or Thai kids/50/student or whatever).

Sunbelt mentions above that whatever visa you have you "can do extension for another type", what is missing is: "with the proper docs of course!" (marriage certificate/work permit/50 Etc.).

Maybe Sunbelt wants to hire me! oh, I already "work" for them on the soccer team.... wonder whether that require a WP!?

Cheers!

PS; also I could imagine that the days of getting a 1 year visa (o/b/ed or whatever) with nothing but a sponsor letter at the few consulates that does it could come to an end fairly soon with the stricter regulations.

astral · September 22, 2006

I suppose the B40 million investment in low interest bonds or deposits required for foreigners to buy one rai of land to build a house on will be increased to B100 million. LOL. Never heard of anyone doing that. Has anyone else?

I don't think that is aimed at the ordinary people like us.

It is a sweetener for the large companies who will invest in Thailand.

Somewhere for the farang MD to live.

Sunbelt Asia · September 22, 2006

Sunbelt mentions above that whatever visa you have you "can do extension for another type", what is missing is: "with the proper docs of course!" (marriage certificate/work permit/50 Etc.).

'

We did say

If you are tired of traveling and meet the criteria you can apply for an extension of stay off your last 90 day entry stamp.

with the proper docs = meet the criteria

Maybe Sunbelt wants to hire me! oh, I already "work" for them on the soccer team.... wonder whether that require a WP!?

Sure anytime you want a wp. I hear you are the Ace striker now.

No need for us to sign 147 pages of docs getting you an extension of stay based on business as you already have the extension of stay based on investment!

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Firefan · September 22, 2006

Yeah you are right - you DID mention that which I over looked (dammit - there goes my new job at fancy Sunbelt!). It just sounded as a casual side remark when in fact that is the crucial point I tried to get across to Maizefarmer. Cheers!

Maizefarmer · September 22, 2006

Okay sorry - I got it wrong. I'll keep me mouth shout now and concentrate on farming subjects.

If you're ever down and out - well, so long as you can drive a New Holland 8970 tractor with a front mounted forage harvester, or operate a Alfa Laval semi auto milking machine, there's a job up here in Loei for you (accomodation and rice ration included!!)

Tim

Firefan · September 22, 2006

He,he - Tim, come to the big city and we will do the job interview over a few beers on me! I can drive an armoured M-113 and have the docs to prove it which might come in handy these days! Cheers!

Ps. I had a bunch of jokes about milking my milking machine qualifications but found them way too seedy for this classy board!

DrDweeb · September 22, 2006

Sorry for most people here on visa extention basis, but do you think you can stay in US, Canada, Germany or any other "civilized" contry for more than 90 days? I do not think so. Shame to layers telling everyone "yes you can", knowing that they break the law.

Well, let's compare the marriage based visa. My wife arrived in Germany, and after some pretty serious arguments with the officials there, she was issued a 5 year residency permit which can be extended to unlimited after 5 years. Citizenship takes 10 years. But the point is: She got there, and was basically equal to citizens with regards to work and permission to stay.

There was no proof of income required either. Not for me, not for her.

Granted they did put up a few more obstacles for the same thing in Austria even though the EU laws are supposed to ensure equal treatment throughout the EU. And some countries even ignore EU law (Denmark). But by and large, the law in the EU is very simple and very clear: An EU citizen can live and work anywhere in the EU, and his/her spouse can come along and live and work there, too.

Compare to Thailand... no work permit included, need to renew visa (and pay for it) every year, need to show 400K in bank, subject to change! Why? No reason.

I mean - if the <deleted> police actually did their job in this country, there are laws and stipulations that deal with foreign criminals and money laundering. That should not be mixed up with the immigration laws. It's just that we all know how easy it is to get away with anything provided the right people are paid off... solution: Stop them at the borders. Hmm....

OK. Not that I am that much of a fan of Danmark, but I have lived here for 20+ years, speak faultless Danish and thus allow myself to opine that I know a lot more about this place than you are ever likely to know or imagine.

Given that it is a absolute fact that DK is the country in the EU that has the highest level of integration of EU directives into national law - exactly why do you opine that Danmark "ignore EU law" - since this is false on the face of known facts. FWIW, no country has 100% compliance and none ever will - realpolitik lives.

I just hate dickheads who saw a one sided TV soundclip (or a BBC documentary equally based on monumental falsitudes) making out that Danmark is deserving of special scorn.

Want some fun - try going to Holland and setting up - either as an EU or non-EU citizen. Trust me, after a year I have had enough - the kloggies can sink into the N. Sea asap as far as I am concerned because if there ever was a place that makes life financially punative against foreigners - its kloggieland. Oh, they are sinking into the N. Sea - More Global Warming please ...

I worked in Germany 2 years as well. No problems I am happy to report.

Back to more relevant programming.

Lammas · September 23, 2006

On Investor Fixed deposit B 3 Mil Investor

visa will be unavailable after Oct 1. Who can say if after will be renewed???

Here's my How To :

Go to Krung Thai Govt Savings Bank , Bank of Agriculture, Ratansin , Srinakorn, Nakhornluang, or the Housing Bank

and get a FIXED Deposit account of at least 3 million Baht . ( It pays 5% at Govt Sav Bank ) You'll need a Foreign Transaction Form and a Letter of Guarantee from the Branch Manager

It took 8 days for a wire from Bank of America to be processed into Thailand into my personal account at SCB so DO IT NOW

Greg at Sunbelt informed me that one has to already be in on a real visa, not VOA, in order to apply for the Investor's visa. And within 30 days of its expiration. And that means a trip to an outside consulate.

- VERY IMPORTANT get a 30 day TRANSIT visa, NOT a multiple entry as one can only apply in the LAST 30 days of a visa's validity and ther are only 5 business days as of Monday, Sept 25 to do it.

And be sure to take evidence of an airline ticket in and out of Thailand within that 30 days too !

You must apply in the morning before 12 noon .

I forgot to ask how long , anyone know??

Called Singapore (65) 6 737 2644 on Friday afternoon to be sure it is open on Monday, Sept 25th ,2006

A woman, Ms. Pang , she said her name was, got very nasty when- after she asked , I told her I planned on applying for the 30 day transit vis with which to go for an investor's visa. She kept insisting I needed to, "Have a business" for transit . She even asked me what kind of business!! She was downright hostile, her disdain for, " Farang" palpable.

" You can't just come in here get a visa!! We decide if you get one. " she told me.

( These types always get jobs where they can terrorize and control others in petty, mean ways, like trying to deny somebody a visa , over the phone, with absolutely no reason other than to harrass, because she's under stress.)

That " Transit" might mean transition, as in transistion to another visa which is how it written in the English version on the MFA website and not like say , mass transit on a bus or plane- wasn't in her program.

I kept trying to tell her I needed the Transit visa so as to only have 30 days because Non-Immig visa can only be applied for with the LAST 30 day of an existing visa. She hadn't a clue..

Finally I guess her supervisor came on, Ms. Phirinpra, who slightly more amiable and far more knowledgleble.

She assured me I could get the Transit visa as long as I had a plane ticket in and out of Thailand to a 3 rd country- when I asked if I can book BACK to Singapore, but not a 3rd country . She said that would be OK too . Then she told me she didn't want to know my business when I tried to explain the 3 million in a Fixed Account as qualifying for Investor's Visa.

She touted the line that, " Abusers" of the VOA system were whom Immigration was trying to stop.

I told her I was one of the " Abusers" because I thought it was legal until last week at least , and it still is up to Oct 1, 2006 . but of course I wanted to comply with the new law . I was anxious as I had only 7 days to SEE IF I would be living in Thailand as I wished .

She didn't seemed concerned with the official Immigration statement that documentation of foreigners was what the new changes were about..

( btw I see nothing on the MFA website about fixed accounts as criteria for Investor's visas- only at Phuket Immig where the woman gave me the sheet of paper. On 3 separate visits I finally did get her to write her name on it though..K. Supit.

She recommended since she thought I was , " Beautiful, " I should just , " Get married to a Thai man! "

I didn't bother to explain to her that I really don't want to marry a prostitute.

Does anyone know if I can apply at the Singapore consulate for the Investor's Visa??

I'm taking ALL my paperwork with me ....FBI file, free of 3rd stage syphillis test, etc. And the all important Leprosy!! Wheres that lung X- Ray???

Also the import license for my cats I brought from US in December and the receipt for my horses that I have to care for myself-

( Oooops, is scooping up my own horse's excrement without a work permit, illegal??) -because the boarding stable was a pony torture nightmare and my complaints got me evicted- better take that letter too. And the pictures of those suffering horses??

It'll take me months to find a location out of Thailand to move them and what an ungodly headache. I was literally minutes from signing on a 30 year 3.8 mil lease- My Good Luck of Lammas!!!

I need a hero ..Does anyone have land w small home to lease in say, Malaysia?

But, IS Malaysia any better??

I think 2 weeks to change such a law, that no more Investor's Visas will be offered - that has such incredible impact on a person't life who researched the subject a year ago and sold everything to move here- is this more evidence that Thailand does not possess a mature government and apparently is prone to reactionism? Or was it simply election shenanagins?

But will the new govt be friendly to foreigners?

Should I Stay or Should I Go.. Now?

lopburi3 · September 23, 2006

The investors extension of stay in only offered by immigration and that is inside of Thailand. Has nothing to do with MFA and Consulates.

Sunbelt Asia · September 23, 2006

Called Singapore (65) 6 737 2644 on Friday afternoon to be sure it is open on Monday, Sept 25th ,2006

I would recommend just stop by our office Monday with your paperwork, if you haven’t booked your flight yet. Let us try to persuade the Immigration officer the logic of having you apply now rather than in the last month of the visa( as it won’t be available) We are finding under the martial law, the lines are shorter the last couple days and some officers are being more liberal under decentralization. The stance of decentralization with some officers is to help foreigners get legal and not be nit picking with a criteria you are don’t have at your fingertips at this time.

If you already booked your flight, then its still a good option as you are playing it safe. But if you are in the area of BKk, stop by the office first before flying out.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Lammas · September 23, 2006

On Investor Fixed deposit B 3 Mil Investor

visa will be unavailable after Oct 1. Who can say if after will be renewed???

Here's my How To :

Go to Krung Thai Govt Savings Bank , Bank of Agriculture, Ratansin , Srinakorn, Nakhornluang, or the Housing Bank

and get a FIXED Deposit account of at least 3 million Baht . ( It pays 5% at Govt Sav Bank ) You'll need a Foreign Transaction Form and a Letter of Guarantee from the Branch Manager

It took 8 days for a wire from Bank of America to be processed into Thailand into my personal account at SCB so DO IT NOW

Greg at Sunbelt informed me that one has to already be in on a real visa, not VOA, in order to apply for the Investor's visa. And within 30 days of its expiration. And that means a trip to an outside consulate.

- VERY IMPORTANT get a 30 day TRANSIT visa, NOT a multiple entry as one can only apply in the LAST 30 days of a visa's validity and ther are only 5 business days as of Monday, sept 25 to do it.

And be sure to take evidence of an airline ticket in and out of Thailand within that 30 days too !

You must apply in the morning before 12 noon .

I forgot to ask how long , anyone know??

Called Singapore (65) 6 737 2644 on Friday afternoon to be sure it is open on Monday, Sept 25th ,2006

A woman, Ms. Pang , got very nasty when- after she asked , I told her I planned on applying for the 30 day transit vis with which to go for an investor's visa. She kept insisting I needed to, "Have a business" for transit . She even asked me what kind of business!! She was downright hostile, her disdain for, " Farang" palpable. " You can't just come in here get a visa!! We decide if you get one. " she told me.

( These types always get jobs where they can terrorize and control others in petty, mean ways, like trying to deny somebody a visa , over the phone,with absolutely no reason other than to harrass, because she's under stress.)

That " Transit" might mean transition, as in transistion to another visa which is how it written in the English version on the MFA website and not like say , mass transit on a bus or plane- wasn't in her program.

I kept trying to tell her I needed the Transit visa so as to only have 30 days because Non-Immig visa can only be applied for with the LAST 30 day of an existing visa. She hadn't a clue..

Finally I guess her supervisor came on, Ms. Phirinpra, who slightly more amiable and far more knowledgleble.

She assured me I could get the Transit visa as long as I had a plane ticket in and out of Thailand to a 3 rd country- when I asked if I can book BACK to Singapore, but not a 3rd country . She said that would be OK too . Then she told me she didn't want to know my business when I tried to explain the 3 million in a Fixed Account as qualifying for Investor's Visa.

She touted the line that, " Abusers" of the VOA system were whom Immigration was trying to stop.

I told her I was one of the " Abusers" because it is legal up to Oct 1, 2006 but of course I wanted to comply with the new law . I was anxious as I had only 7 days to SEE IF I would be living in Thailand as I wished .

She didn't seemed concerned with the official Immigration statement that documentation of foreigners was what the new changes were about..

btw I see nothing on the MFA website about fixed accounts as criteria for Investor's visas- only at Phuket Immig where the woman gave me the sheet of paper. On 3 separate visits I finally did get her to write her name on it though..K. Supit.