National Park fees to increase

[Soutpeel]

Thai National Parks.....Just dont do anything for me whatsoever. In fact I would be more upset if they charged 500b to get into Walking Street.

They might charge you THB 500 to get out of walking street

[englishoak]

Having seen or visited most NP long ago before the change I gotta say most dont warrant the Thai price let alone 500 bht. Depending on the time of year some shouldnt even be open when theres nothing there to see.

[BEVUP]

Went Kow Yai national pk few mths back 160 bht for wife & son (together) / 400 for me

[chiang mai]

As much as I really enjoy the NP's here and think that some of them are quite spectacular, I think THB 500 is a bit too steep and that they will loose money as a result, quite sad really.

[Soutpeel]

As much as I really enjoy the NP's here and think that some of them are quite spectacular, I think THB 500 is a bit too steep and that they will loose money as a result, quite sad really.

But guess this begs the question are the NP being run as a commercial entity or are the fees charged just used to top up the funds handed over the the government/tax payers

If they are not run as a commercial entity, cant see them being too fussed over "losing " money

[Beng]

The NP are supposed to preserve the nature (habitat of plants and animals).

Some parks parks with lots of package tourists may get enough money out of the entrance fees to cover the costs, but others, in remote locations with mostly Thai visitors, will not.

For the DL issue,I think this mainly because the government is looking for new sources of income. Target the farang is always an easy option, but I wonder how many are willing to pay 500 Baht.

[evadgib]

Fishy collection of entrance fees detected at famous marine park in South

Collection of entrance fees to Nopparat Tara-Phi Phi Island national park in Krabi province rises to over The 500,000 baht a day from earlier 80,000 baht in two weeks after a working investigative panel of the National Reform Council (NRC) looked into the unusual low collection fees by park officials.

http://www.samuitimes.com/fishy-collection-of-entrance-fees-detected-at-famous-marine-park-in-south/

(Methinks someone has been wearing those trousers featured in 'The Great Escape' !)

Edited June 11, 2015 by evadgib

[Beng]

Fishy collection of entrance fees detected at famous marine park in South

Collection of entrance fees to Nopparat Tara-Phi Phi Island national park in Krabi province rises to over The 500,000 baht a day from earlier 80,000 baht in two weeks after a working investigative panel of the National Reform Council (NRC) looked into the unusual low collection fees by park officials.

http://www.samuitimes.com/fishy-collection-of-entrance-fees-detected-at-famous-marine-park-in-south/

(Methinks someone has been wearing those trousers featured in 'The Great Escape' !)

Interesting..... Nopparat Tara-Phi Phi Island national park in Krabi made 71.000 Baht everyday in 2013, or 26 Mio in total.

I guess most visitors were foreigners. Now an extra 100 Baht/person ??

[Tomtomtom69]

Does Work Permit work the same as DL?

Yes, in fact logic dictates it should only be WP holders who get Thai rates as these are the only foreigner's paying income tax in Thailand, and thus contributing to the upkeep of the parks via their tax, a DL means nothing, as a tourist can get one, so this shouldn't be used as a measure of getting the Thai rate or not and its most certainly not a measure of " residency "

Your logic is not verry logical.

I have no work permit, but I pay tax on everything I buy plus tax on the intrest of my bankaccount (that's income tax).

Yermanee

Its very logical, one assumes your talking about VAT everyone even tourist pay on goods and services received,which sometimes they can claim back , so that can't be a measure of really "paying tax" in Thailand thus giving someone the right to local prices

No the true measure of paying Thai prices should be being able to produce a WP thereby proving legitimised residency in Thailand and in most cases paying proper income tax further

we must as also accept not all WP holders actually pay tax or even have an income as they are volunteers, but in the case of volunteers they are contributing to the country so guess they should get Thai prices as well

Of course the really fair way is not to give Thai prices to anyone who is not a Thai citizen or PR

After all its only THB 500 and all resident farangs are rich, so it only means drinking a few less Leo that day

The only thing worse than institutionalized discrimination by a state or it's citizens towards another group of people (in this case Thailand against foreigners) treating them perpetually as second class citizens even if they have been resident in Thailand for years and decades and have mastered the language are other foreigners like you who have stooped down to that same level and actually perpetuate tired old stereotypes like "all farangs are rich". Firstly, most "farangs" are simply from richer countries than Thailand but many of them live frugally and are of modest means. Many of them are retired and living off not so generous pensions. A great many who are working here only earn a pittance compared to what they could be earning in their homelands even if the Thai government requires they earn a "minimum" salary to be allowed to get a work permit and extension of stay.

It may only be 500 THB to you, mr. bigshot who earns who knows how much from your oil and gas job, but that's no reason to be taken advantage of either. If it was, then how do you explain rich Thais rolling up in Mercs and BMWs with personal drivers still only have to pay a tiny 40-100 Baht entrance fee for a national park, but Mr. Johnson, their white American guest who drives a 20 year old car back home and earns only a modest salary is charged 500 Baht because it is assumed he is the rich one? When in fact everyone in the car with him maybe 20 times richer than he is?

Or a group of 4 sweaty backpackers who slaved for 12 hours per day for 1 year at minimum wage washing dishes at the dingiest dive in London or Los Angeles to afford their trip to Thailand, but who can only afford a 100-Baht a night dorm once they get here?

Even if Thai passports or citizen ID cards were required to be shown to get the local price, which we know are only ever requested from non-Thai looking individuals, it still wouldn't change the fact that it's not fair to discriminate against a group of people based on tired old stereotypes and assumptions. I mean, if we used Thai logic back home, we would also be charging Thais more to enter our national parks and museums, because after all, if they are in our countries and could afford the airfare to get there, they must be rich too, right?

This whole system must be abolished for it to be fair. I'm not even going to go into the whole this type of ID might work and this other type won't argument. I refuse to step foot in any establishment that has institutionalized discrimination - even if I am eligible to enter at the "local" price based on my ability to speak and read/write fluent Thai, presentation of a Thai D/L or any other document, going through that whole process makes me feel like I'm less than human. I can already feel it before I enter the door, when the staff see me and try to get me to pay the higher rate, while my Thai or other Asian companions never even get spoken to.

Meanwhile a Vietnamese, Malaysian, Singaporean, Chinese or Japanese visitor gets a "free pass" because they look Thai.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Tomtomtom69

[mogandave]

Where are you from?

I know Thais have to pay more to fish in California.

Hey, any U.S. Citizen can get into Thailand free, but Thais have to pay $160 just to apply for a visa.

How is that fair?

[BudRight]

Does Work Permit work the same as DL?

Yes, in fact logic dictates it should only be WP holders who get Thai rates as these are the only foreigner's paying income tax in Thailand, and thus contributing to the upkeep of the parks via their tax, a DL means nothing, as a tourist can get one, so this shouldn't be used as a measure of getting the Thai rate or not and its most certainly not a measure of " residency "

Your logic is not verry logical.

I have no work permit, but I pay tax on everything I buy plus tax on the intrest of my bankaccount (that's income tax).

Yermanee

Its very logical, one assumes your talking about VAT everyone even tourist pay on goods and services received,which sometimes they can claim back , so that can't be a measure of really "paying tax" in Thailand thus giving someone the right to local prices

No the true measure of paying Thai prices should be being able to produce a WP thereby proving legitimised residency in Thailand and in most cases paying proper income tax further

we must as also accept not all WP holders actually pay tax or even have an income as they are volunteers, but in the case of volunteers they are contributing to the country so guess they should get Thai prices as well

Of course the really fair way is not to give Thai prices to anyone who is not a Thai citizen or PR

After all its only THB 500 and all resident farangs are rich, so it only means drinking a few less Leo that day

The only thing worse than institutionalized discrimination by a state or it's citizens towards another group of people (in this case Thailand against foreigners) treating them perpetually as second class citizens even if they have been resident in Thailand for years and decades and have mastered the language are other foreigners like you who have stooped down to that same level and actually perpetuate tired old stereotypes like "all farangs are rich". Firstly, most "farangs" are simply from richer countries than Thailand but many of them live frugally and are of modest means. Many of them are retired and living off not so generous pensions. A great many who are working here only earn a pittance compared to what they could be earning in their homelands even if the Thai government requires they earn a "minimum" salary to be allowed to get a work permit and extension of stay.

It may only be 500 THB to you, mr. bigshot who earns who knows how much from your oil and gas job, but that's no reason to be taken advantage of either. If it was, then how do you explain rich Thais rolling up in Mercs and BMWs with personal drivers still only have to pay a tiny 40-100 Baht entrance fee for a national park, but Mr. Johnson, their white American guest who drives a 20 year old car back home and earns only a modest salary is charged 500 Baht because it is assumed he is the rich one? When in fact everyone in the car with him maybe 20 times richer than he is?

Or a group of 4 sweaty backpackers who slaved for 12 hours per day for 1 year at minimum wage washing dishes at the dingiest dive in London or Los Angeles to afford their trip to Thailand, but who can only afford a 100-Baht a night dorm once they get here?

Even if Thai passports or citizen ID cards were required to be shown to get the local price, which we know are only ever requested from non-Thai looking individuals, it still wouldn't change the fact that it's not fair to discriminate against a group of people based on tired old stereotypes and assumptions. I mean, if we used Thai logic back home, we would also be charging Thais more to enter our national parks and museums, because after all, if they are in our countries and could afford the airfare to get there, they must be rich too, right?

This whole system must be abolished for it to be fair. I'm not even going to go into the whole this type of ID might work and this other type won't argument. I refuse to step foot in any establishment that has institutionalized discrimination - even if I am eligible to enter at the "local" price based on my ability to speak and read/write fluent Thai, presentation of a Thai D/L or any other document, going through that whole process makes me feel like I'm less than human. I can already feel it before I enter the door, when the staff see me and try to get me to pay the higher rate, while my Thai or other Asian companions never even get spoken to.

Meanwhile a Vietnamese, Malaysian, Singaporean, Chinese or Japanese visitor gets a "free pass" because they look Thai.

Where are you from?

I know Thais have to pay more to fish in California.

Hey, any U.S. Citizen can get into Thailand free, but Thais have to pay $160 just to apply for a visa.

How is that fair?

Holy shit, you shopped around the whole planet to find another case of racism that vindicates Thai racism. Now there's two racist policies in the world. Oh wow must be okay then.

[jdinasia]

We're compulsorily contributing to the local economy & should receive concessions reflecting it.

Nobody is compelling you.

[evadgib]

《Deleted post-I can't be bothered with trolls on a Sunday!》

Edited June 14, 2015 by evadgib

[Soutpeel]

...hence my 'Compulsorily'!

We're compulsorily contributing to the local economy & should receive concessions reflecting it.

such as ? and please don't say VAT

[evadgib]

...hence my 'Compulsorily'!

We're compulsorily contributing to the local economy & should receive concessions reflecting it.

such as ? and please don't say VAT

《Deleted, see previous post》 Edited June 14, 2015 by evadgib

[Soutpeel]

...hence my 'Compulsorily'!

We're compulsorily contributing to the local economy & should receive concessions reflecting it.

such as ? and please don't say VAT

Hmmmm; the consessions to which I refer relate to local rate based on living here but you already knew that and are about to piss all over it so fill yer boots.

which concessions ?... An Isaan MacMansion/ 'tuna or pick up for one "teerak"

No the fair way....Thai citizen or PR local price, everyone else pays the higher rate, the farangs here bleat on how much they contribute to the Thai economy, so think of the THB 500 another contribution to the up liftment of the local economy to preserve the national parks, so also keeping the tree huggers happy as well

I for one, someone who pays local Thai income tax, has a DL and a WP has absolutely no problem paying an increased entrance fee should I wish to visit an national park, so struggling to understand the self entitlement some have and don't even pay income tax/DL or even a WP and are not PR's or citizens of Thailand

[claffey]

most tourist attractions in d uk charge ridiciously high prices.they only sell annual passes.this also discriminates against and rips off tourists as they are hardly in need of an annual pass...why do people here always complain about thailand despite living here? often if they bother to examine their own counties it just as bad.hypocrits

we should have a forum for positive news.like d guy who had his iphone returned.would that have happened in london or paris or new york???

[mogandave]

most tourist attractions in d uk charge ridiciously high prices.they only sell annual passes.this also discriminates against and rips off tourists as they are hardly in need of an annual pass...why do people here always complain about thailand despite living here? often if they bother to examine their own counties it just as bad.hypocrits

we should have a forum for positive news.like d guy who had his iphone returned.would that have happened in london or paris or new york???

"Holy shit, you shopped around the whole planet to find another case of racism that vindicates Thai racism. Now there's two racist policies in the world. Oh wow must be okay then."

Just kidding.....

[Soutpeel]

why do people here always complain about thailand despite living here? often if they bother to examine their own counties it just as bad.hypocrits

The problem I believe with some of them is that they have it in their heads that they are legal residents/citizens of Thailand on the basis they have built a MacMansion and bought a 'tuna" for some Isaan slapper therefore it gives them the right to start making demands on a country/government which is not even their and its a case of:

"the natives cant treat me like this, don't the fools realise I am a lilly white and I demand respect, don't they know their place, they should be kow towing down at my feet"

[evadgib]

Why not regale the board with exact details of your own circumstances, particularly the reasoning behind your hatred of 'Issan slappers and their MacMansions and 'tunas' which somehow seems to have evaded censorship?

As far as i'm concerned PR and annual extentions are exactly the same in the context of this board, and it is 'expectations' rather than 'demands' that are being expressed here. Nothing spouted by you to date has changed that.

FYI: I had a company and WP for around a decade, taxes an' all.

Edited June 15, 2015 by evadgib

[Soutpeel]

Why not regale the board with exact details of your own circumstances, particularly the reasoning behind your hatred of 'Issan slappers and their MacMansions and 'tunas' which somehow seems to have evaded censorship?

As far as i'm concerned PR and annual extentions are exactly the same in the context of this board, and it is 'expectations' rather than 'demands' that are being expressed here. Nothing spouted by you to date has changed that.

FYI: I had a company and WP for around a decade, taxes an' all.

Have no hatred in the least, everyone to their own I guess, but lets let be honest, there are many on here who believe building a MacMansion and buying "tuna" makes them a "Thai citizen" and as such they demand "their rights"

PR and annual extension are nowhere close to being the same even in the context of this board, and funny you mention it, as its a perfect example of exactly what I am talking about.

PR infers legal right of unhindered abode in a country, and with that unhindered right to abode, certain "rights" are also granted

where as the case of annual extensions does not, one has to seek continued permission to remain in country, this is where a lot of people get themselves very confused and all hot under the collar and think they can start demanding "rights" or should be seen as someone with "citizenship"

[evadgib]

How can national park officials tell a PR from an extn retiree/husband brandishing a DL?

How can non-Thai Asians sneak in so readily purely on appearance, inc those from as far afield as EU/USA?

Dare I mention foreign wives of Thai husbands?

It stinks yet as a fellow Brit you find it perfectly acceptable?

Edited June 15, 2015 by evadgib

[Soutpeel]

How can national park officials tell a PR from an extn retiree/husband brandishing a DL?

How can non-Thai Asians sneak in so readily purely on appearance, inc those from as far afield as EU/USA?

Dare I mention foreign wives of Thai husbands?

It stinks yet as a fellow Brit you find it perfectly acceptable?

1. Easy they ask for the person to produce PR document and not accept a Thai DL, as this is not proof of residency anyway

2. if they try it on and get away with it good luck to them, but this isn't the debate any way

3. foreign wives of Thai husbands in a lot of cases have PR or even citizenship see 1.0 and if they are not, pay the THB 500

4. What being a fellow Brit got to do with it ? your not in Blighty anymore ....has absolutely no relevance

As stated on numerous occasions, I don't have a problem with it in the least

If someone feels that strong about getting accepted as a "thai" then become a PR then, and before your say it, you said it yourself you had a company/ worked 10 years on WP's/paid tax etc., so you could have applied for PR after 3 years here at any point in those 10 years....

[evadgib]

1.Then why is a residence cert required from imm prior to a DL being issued?

2. Perhaps I should have said fellow ferang.

You're trying to make this into something that it isn't. If it were fair i'd gladly go along with it, but as of now i'd rather sit in the car park or pay THB 500 x 4 (wife & kids, all Thais) on principle rather than accept this in it's current guise.

Fortunately I haven't placed myself in this position for many a year and hopefully never will.

[Soutpeel]

1.Then why is a residence cert required from imm prior to a DL being issued?

2. Perhaps I should have said fellow ferang.

You're trying to make this into something that it isn't. If it were fair i'd gladly go along with it, but as of now i'd rather sit in the car park or pay THB 500 x 4 (wife & kids, all Thais) on principle rather than accept this in it's current guise.

Fortunately I haven't placed myself in this position for many a year and hopefully never will.

1. go an research on TV this debate has been had, a Thai DL is not accepted as official proof of "residency" in Thailand, in the same manner that a thai residency certificate is not proof of someone's competency to drive a motor vehicle

if you have a Thai wife and Thai kids why 4 X 500 ?.....it would be Thai price X 3 and 1 X foreigner at THB 500, or are your principles so rigid you would deprive your kids a visit to a national park just because you have to pay THB 500 WOW...?

one suspects your taking exception to my remarks, simply because I will not jump on the "farang bandwagon" and start howling "racism" "xenophobia" "its just not fair" and stamping my little feet about rights, like the rest of the minion's

Have you not heard the saying "don't sweat the small things" ? this rate increase is one of those small things...

[evadgib]

Post 1782 in the 'Brigades' thread explains.

+

Edited June 15, 2015 by evadgib

[mogandave]

My wife buys the tickets and the almost never ask for my ID.

[evadgib]

My wife buys the tickets and the almost never ask for my ID.

I forgot to mention that generally a compromise used by my wife when the dreaded dual pricing occurs is to tell me how much she paid for all of us rather than admit to the actual breakdown

Edited June 15, 2015 by evadgib