Penang Halts Issuance Of Double-entry Tourist Visas

[lucky2103]

What other countries can give Tourist Visa's other than Malaysia??

I once got one in Vientiane.

[my friend you]

JonnieB,

as I told already on another thread, I have easily for the last four obtained a 1year multi O (in Munich) with just a bankletter (800k in your thai Bank)and a passport Photo, visa purpose simply "tourist".

I was then 48, 49, 50...now 51

I still go for visaruns every 3 months because I find it's good for my mental health to leave LOS once in while...

To my knowledge, the Non-Imm O visas are issued prusent to various lets call them sub-catagories (as the name implies, they are "other" visas for situations that don't fall neatly into one of the other visa classes (B or T). The situations include being a student, a monk, studying to be a monk, marrying a thai national, being a missionary, etc, however, I don't recall any of the "other" situations qualifying for this visa being someone not-yet 50, financially self-supporting from non-thai sources and wishing to reside in thailand. If I am wrong in this, I would love for someone to corect me. If anyone out there as applied for a non-imm O visa on the basis of basically the cretirea of the "retirement" extension but not yet being 50 years old it would be great news. However, I have never run into any such mention.

[andyc2006]

Apparently, for the under 50 cashed-up single guy, the options are two: (1) Get married. ... (2) The other option I guess as some people have mentioned is to form a legit company ...

Can anyone think of any other options I have missed?

1) as you mentioned, marriage or supporting a dependent, B visa.

2) as you mentioned, invest in a legit company

3) http://thailandelite.com/

4) volunteer through an organization (eg., US Peace Corps) -- not all under-50 cashed-up single guys are opposed to doing something useful and/or selfless with their time.

5) get a job, with work permit and O visa.

6) leave. if none of the above apply to you (a generic you, not the person i'm replying to), you don't belong there, and it's rather obvious thai people don't want you there -- whether they're being fair or logical doesn't really matter.

[Thaiquila]

Also the now 10 million baht investment visa.

Also you could try to get serial one year non immigrant visas from western countries based on visiting friends or study of Thai irony.

Obviously, the latter option has its risks of not getting the visas.

To the person who said leave, I say, if you really want to be in Thailand and you can find a way to get a legal visa, do as you like, and don't bother what the so called imagery collective consciousness of Thai people wants you there or not. Just do so with your eyes open to the insecurity of your situation.

[andyc2006]

To the person who said leave, I say, if you really want to be in Thailand and you can find a way to get a legal visa, do as you like, and don't bother what the so called imagery collective consciousness of Thai people wants you there or not. Just do so with your eyes open to the insecurity of your situation.

well, i listed "leave" as my 6th (last) option, under the assumption that a person could NOT get a legal visa, so we're actually in agreement.

if a person can get a legal visa, i say "a rai gor dai."

[johnnynmonic]

I haven't heard of any problem with a genuine tourist getting a multiple entry tourist visa in their home country. Over the last couple of years, Penang, Vientiane, etc have stopped giving out multiple entry 'B' visa unless you have a work permit. Looks like gradually it is going to harder to get long term visas in 'close' locations.

A genuine tourist can still get a multiple entry tourist visa in their home consulate, and the 41 exempt countries can still come in for up to 90 days without a visa. The perpetual tourists are the ones affected.

Where does one get a multiple entry tourist visa? I was in the States in July, and the consul in Portland specifically told me there was no multiple entry tourist visa offered. The best I could get was triple. All other visas required a stack of paperwork... Seriously, is there that much difference from consul to consul?

[Totster]

Where does one get a multiple entry tourist visa? I was in the States in July, and the consul in Portland specifically told me there was no multiple entry tourist visa offered. The best I could get was triple. All other visas required a stack of paperwork... Seriously, is there that much difference from consul to consul?

I think people sometimes refer to double and triple entry tourists visas as multiple entry tourist visas.

totster

[loveandlaughter]

I have visa from Hull consulate.......

Liisten, these visas are so archaic they are still a simple rubber stamp . Just that worried me as most visas anywhere are printed with security measures as stickers and put in passports.....for the UK (my wife and daughter) they have your photo also printed in there.

I should expect those "honourary" consulates to stop being able to issue visa, perhaps even to exsist within a year or two.

It will be real consulate - ie London only - and they will want you to be part of a real company ie listed in the UK companies directory or sponsered by a real company in Thailand.

Go figure they are not so stupid it's like Sesame Street.....one of these visas does not look like the others......

If like me you have any form of B or non O and are young, beg borrow or steal the money and get a WP on it.

I should also think they would issue without WP once but you must get WP within the year.....again makes sense.....another loophole see

[kitty58]

property development industries

the next crisis in tourist areas is already there

i want to sell 3 condos with 20% discount to last weeks price

sure i am not the only one !!!!!

i would even not buy at a 50% discount under current circumstances

Cambodia is wating for you with open arms, cheap beer, nice girls, no hassel with immigratio,n one year visa in one day, here we come.

[kitty58]

Apparently, for the under 50 cashed-up single guy, the options are two: (1) Get married. This is probably the cheapest and least pain in the butt option (as long as your chosen is low-maintenance). As I have lived here 5+ years, the nitelife scene is really deminimus to my reasons for staying here so maybe I will finally have to bite the bullet. Far more important is the generally friendly people (jing-jing), the low cost of living, and fairly good infrustructure and health care. (2) The other option I guess as some people have mentioned is to form a legit company and do some kind of small business or consulting or something and along with that get a WP. However, many report that this is very much a pain in the arse process, expensive, and maybe in the end you may not get a 1-year renewal visa extension anyway. Seems sorta high-risk option.

Question: If one does the marriage thing and it goes tits-up at some point, would your 1-year extension based on that marriage be non-renewable when it expires? I would assume so and one would be unable to obtain another 1-year extension of a non-imm visa based on marriage until and unless one got remarried!!!

Can anyone think of any other options I have missed?

Leave. Go somewhere you would be made to feel wanted and welcome!

I'm sure you wouldn't be the only one!

go to cambodia, one year visa in one day

[craigoaus]

Is a single entry 6 month tourist visa really a problem? I thought re-entry visa (or what ever it is called) is available at airport or immigration here in BKK and this is the same as an extra entry?

[dsfbrit]

Where is the HUGE UPROAR from Thai landlords, owners of hotels,longstay bungalows, visa run companies, etc?!? This is going to mean an INCREDIBLE LOSS of business for them and the Thai economy in general. They just must not be publicizing this to the general Thai public (Bangkok Post is English only) and most landlords I know barely speak it. Farrang out there, please start spreading the word to your Thai friends, especially those in the rental and tourism industries... only through their complaints and uproar is there any chance that the government will realize the MASSIVE MISTAKE they are making with this non-sense.

Does the Thai government actually think they are going to make more in taxes on work permits and marriage visas then the BILLIONS OF BAHT their economy will loose if the farrang population stops spending at least 50% their money here? Also, the reason many foreigner laborers are here is because THAI companies are illegally hiring these people for agriculture, construction, and other undesirable menial tasks that most Thais don't want to do, and certainly not for the extremely low wages they pay. Removing the low cost labor force will only serve to drive up labor costs, and thus retail prices for basic commodities, which will increase core inflation -- something Thailand cannot afford. If they really wanted to address the problem they should crack down on these companies which are hiring illegal workers.

I also whole-heartedly agree with the person who said before that the requirements of the retirement visa (800K Baht) are sufficient to ensure non-working, financially stable, and desirable status WITHOUT THE NEED TO BE OVER 50 YEARS OLD. Why does it matter how old one is? If you have that much money in Thailand, why would you need to work anyway?

No axe to grind here - really - but 800k baht in the bank account proves very little. Last year I was short of about 100k for the 400k married visa amount. The friendly immigration officer suggested I borrow the money until I got my visa - 'thats whats the others do and then they pay it back straight away' she explained. So quite simply 'wealthy' 40 year old has no cash, borrows it for a month and go goes back to working illegally. Its a mess indeed.

[craigoaus]

Where do you apply for a one year Cambodian visa, can it be done here in BKK?

[BlackJack]

6months here

6 months there

keep moving or you will turn into a bed sitting room

[madi]

Well the options are dwindling for those who are under 50, financially viable (no desire or need to work) but who wish to reside legally in LOS. The option of getting the 3x tourist visa out of Penang to tide one over for about a year appears to be over (and will likely be at all other embassies and consulates in short order).

I have no problem with the government taking measures to control it's borders and keep out "undesirables" and lot of the other marginal flotsam that washes ashore here but it seems to me there should be some way to also accommodate those who are under 50 and self-supporting either from businesses based outside of Thailand or have enough of the folding stuff already that they don't have to work (and don't want to get married).

Seems to me the easy answer is just to remove the age restriction on the "retirement extension" to a non-imm O visa and retain the financial viability requirements. The age of the person should not matter to the government...only that they are financial self-supporting (without working in Thailand).

Malaysia's "My Second Home" expatriate residence program allows anyone whatever age to "retire" there as long as they meet various financial requirements. Maybe this will dawn on the Thai authorities that this may meet their goals too.

Like the PG article says...many property developers, house/apt owners, and business operators of all sorts may see a not insignificant effect on their businesses if these changes are not handled carefully.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Your post makes a lot of sense and I agree with it.

They do have options

If you are rich you can stay here several ways.

Start a business.

Put investments in Thailand.

Put money in Thailand.

Please correct me if I am wrong but I think I read that this new rule is only in affect for those who do not FLY into Thailand. Just fly into the airport and there is no problem.

So if you have enough money to fly in and out, you CAN still stay.

You can do that. The cost is very low now with the discount airlines.

I would think--and this is from talking with Thai immigration, that if you are close to 50--in you mid to late 40s, some of this is negotiable.

You can volunteer to do something and get a work permit you know.

Just help Thai people in SOME WAY and you can stay.

For the people who DO work and are not given a work permit--this is another problem very different from yours.

Thailand KNOWS that most of the teachers it needs to teach English, Chinese, and so on--are not able to qualify for the work permit because they do not have REAL University degrees. Thailand needs to give these people the right to work and face up to the fact that Thailand is unwilling to pay for higher level education requirements for its teachers. It is unfair to hurt the people teaching your Thai children just because you are angry at SOME few people who make headlines.

[loveandlaughter]

.........Don't forget SAFE SEX as Cambodia has rising HIV problems.

If you think Thailand Government is unstable and corrupt Cambodia is a long way from stability.

Still it can be fun....there was a book about living in Phenom Penh as a journalist forget the name (Ganja, Guns and Girls????)

BUT IT IS NOT CONDOS AND SHOPPING MALLS, MULTIPLEXES etc.

[phuketrichard]

a couple of things.

First the sunbelt said that they wil be checking into "sham" marriages. so do u want take the chance ? If so

If you try and set up a Thai company they will catch you as they are invesgating ALL thai companies that have an Farang in them. That is what worries the property developers here in Phuket. Since they started this investigating very very few homes have sold cause no longer can u set up a thai companies with nomines to be able to buy a home OR get a Type B visa

My suggestion.

Get a really tight prenup. get married at the Amphur.

get your marriage paper translated into english and certified

Get Divorced

The 2 officies do not comunicate

You will always have your marriage paper to present to the embassy in Singapore where you can EASILY get a 1 year multiple Type "O" visa.

IF you try and get the 1 year extension IN Thailand they will have ask your "wife" to come in.

BUT they will never ask to see her if your applying for a multi type "O" outside thailand.

Leave thailand every 3 months as required and come back. After your one year is up go back to Singapore or wherever and get a new 1 year mutiple entry.

Then your home free until you turn 50 then get your one year extension as a retirement visa

It is not rocket science.

Apparently, for the under 50 cashed-up single guy, the options are two: (1) Get married. This is probably the cheapest and least pain in the butt option (as long as your chosen is low-maintenance). As I have lived here 5+ years, the nitelife scene is really deminimus to my reasons for staying here so maybe I will finally have to bite the bullet. Far more important is the generally friendly people (jing-jing), the low cost of living, and fairly good infrustructure and health care. (2) The other option I guess as some people have mentioned is to form a legit company and do some kind of small business or consulting or something and along with that get a WP. However, many report that this is very much a pain in the arse process, expensive, and maybe in the end you may not get a 1-year renewal visa extension anyway. Seems sorta high-risk option.

Question: If one does the marriage thing and it goes tits-up at some point, would your 1-year extension based on that marriage be non-renewable when it expires? I would assume so and one would be unable to obtain another 1-year extension of a non-imm visa based on marriage until and unless one got remarried!!!

Can anyone think of any other options I have missed?

Edited September 15, 2006 by phuketrichard

[racefan]

Sorry if this has been covered before somewhere but will people still have to make the border run for their 2 x 30 day VOA's or will they be issued at local level.

It doesn't affect me as I have a retirement Visa, but I was thinking of how it would affect the many Visa run businesses here.

[paulmw]

What are they dreaming of here? I don't see how this new rule will deter anyone. All eliminating double/triple really means is they have to deal with 2x or 3x the workload as people will just show up there every 3 months instead of every 6 or 9. And they are bound to get REALLY busy on top of that as the visarun noose is tightened in the coming months. This rule does not seem to make any sense--why are they making things hard for themselves? If visa runners can tolerate sitting on a bus 1 day a month, they aren't gonna mind switching to a 2 day trip to penang every 3 months. This is not a deterrent!

Here is another scenario: get a tourist visa and extend to 3 months, then do 30 day border run bus for 3 months, then repeat again and again.

The result of this new restriction simply shoots the consulate in the foot. As long as they allow back to back tourist visas, they should issue a double/triple entry and get it over with. There is less overhead and the thai govt gets all the cash up front. They don't stand to gain anything and they are gonna be swamped.

Abit of lateral thinking here, an article in the BKK post 2 weeks ago stating the Thai embassies & consulates could use more money gained from Visa's etc to refurbish their premises.

Nice way to upgrade without cost to the gov't

[atcallan]

Well well.......... it is all getting interesting. isn't it .............

Personally I think it is a good thing......... and it won't affect tourism revenue. Any tourist with money will have a short time off from work when they can come to Thailand.........nothing like 90 days !!!..........

I know people who have been here years............30 day visa again and again.........no tax paid. And most of them are dead beats.......so it will be good for Thailand to get rid of them. They give the rest of us (legal farangs) a bad name............ weirdo english teachers like Mr Karr chasing children............ or derranged one legged german aids patients going around infecting local girls in isaan.

..............Not to mention all of those mafia wannabees in Pattaya !!

Thailand is my adopted home, I have nothing to hide.............. and if people cannot be here legally than they should GO HOME !

.....................A question to all those who are complaining,

Have you tried to get into America, Austrailia, Europe recently (if you are not a national of any of these countries).............. ?? ...........and if you got in, did you try to stay for more than 90 days ??? or try to work ???

[jdinasia]

Well well.......... it is all getting interesting. isn't it .............

Personally I think it is a good thing......... and it won't affect tourism revenue. Any tourist with money will have a short time off from work when they can come to Thailand.........nothing like 90 days !!!..........

I know people who have been here years............30 day visa again and again.........no tax paid. And most of them are dead beats.......so it will be good for Thailand to get rid of them. They give the rest of us (legal farangs) a bad name............ weirdo english teachers like Mr Karr chasing children............ or derranged one legged german aids patients going around infecting local girls in isaan.

..............Not to mention all of those mafia wannabees in Pattaya !!

Thailand is my adopted home, I have nothing to hide.............. and if people cannot be here legally than they should GO HOME !

.....................A question to all those who are complaining,

Have you tried to get into America, Austrailia, Europe recently (if you are not a national of any of these countries).............. ?? ...........and if you got in, did you try to stay for more than 90 days ??? or try to work ???

Wow !

Another inflammatory first post from someone that hasn't thought it out!

[Thaiquila]

I don't believe Mr. Karr was visa runner or working illegally.

Quite a RANT there, atcallan!

[thaihome]

JonnieB, think you have hit the nail on the head there, could not agree more. Enforcing existing laws is the way to go. I don't think Thailand can afford to loose its income from tourism, and tightening up regulations in a country whose main income is tourism (unofficial figures) is not a smart move. Those working illigally will mostly be English teachers, and the income and reliability of work in this trade is hardly going to make anyone rich? PS: I am not an English teacher.

Let's get one thing straight here. Tourism, though an important industry is no where near the kingdom's main income. Thailand’s exports amount to over 4,500 BILLION baht a year, 75% or so of that manufactured goods. Tourism is at best something over 600 billion baht a year. Also, the people making monthly entry stamp runs provide minuscule amounts to the Thai economy in general, though I am sure it is important to the people they directly support.

To think that this whole entry stamp thing is going to have any major (or even minor) impact to the overall Thai economy is ludicrous.

TH

Edited September 15, 2006 by thaihome

[atcallan]

.........Don't forget SAFE SEX as Cambodia has rising HIV problems.

If you think Thailand Government is unstable and corrupt Cambodia is a long way from stability.

Still it can be fun....there was a book about living in Phenom Penh as a journalist forget the name (Ganja, Guns and Girls????)

BUT IT IS NOT CONDOS AND SHOPPING MALLS, MULTIPLEXES etc.

FYI.............. book called "off the rails in Phnom pehn".......girls, guns, ganga.

and it was written by an english teacher not a journo. (written about 8 years ago)

AND.......having spoken to people who knew him, he was not the mere "observer" as he claimed to be in the book............ he got stuck in too !

[Thaiquila]

I think the official figure for tourism is 14 percent of the economy.

However, that is the TIP of the iceberg.

Imagine Isaan without the flows of farang money.

Lets get real here, the amount of HARD CURRENCY brought into Thailand via the sex and love trade is indeed very substantial.

[tracer0]

As many (including SB) have speculated, I'm sure the next step will be to refuse multiple back-to-back tourists visas (at least from the local SE Asian embassies and consulates). Like I said before, I have no beef with the government wanting to keep control of their borders and I have no problem with them wanting everyone to be here legally (as it should be). But, if as stated, they want to crack-down on illegal and/or tax-evading farang business owners/workers (as stated in the PG article), why not just walk-in and inspect the businesses paperwork on a regular basis and see if everything is in order? Contrary to some, I really don't thing there is some Great Anti-Farang Conspiracy at work. It seems to me that Thailand (like most countries) makes a profit out of people who come here to reside and either work legally and pay taxes etc or have sufficient means that they don't have to work but just reside and consume local goods and services, i.e., retires and rich folks. That is why most countries (even Thailand) encourages such people to chose to live in their respective countries. I just think they do want to get rid of undesirables as would any country but it seems like changing visa rules and requirements is not the way to go about it. Illegal behavior or being underfunded are already deportable offenses so why not just better enforcement of existing laws and regulations? TIT

I have been here more or less 20 years and the first 15 years I happely went to Penang every 3 month as it was a nice vacation and shopping trip... I normally stayed a few days even if I had a tripple non O.

I started working and got tripple non B

Until I found that I needed an easier way for the renewal (caused by a motorbike accident making traveling a real pain...

Going every month is mostly done by those not qualifying for the normal visums and as far as I can see there are so many illegal guys working here a cleanup is way overdue and if it hurts the Thais, well they will no doubt rearange the rules.

AS suggested elsewhere, spend half the time in Laos or Vietnam (nice change anyway) and you shouldnt have a problem. Or as a friend told me Vietnam is Like Thailand 20 years ago and you are welcome. Same in Cambodia and you can BUY your house!

I think all these current changes likely are caused by that damned American whom they send back to the USA, first class and who then basically hadnt done what he told them. Must have caused some red faces and thats stupid here SAme with overstay penalties, only need one bus with a grinning Australian on the frontpage of the papers and fees went up. Understandable as I think that guy was likely working....

I have a business, pay my tax, social security, have a girlfriend and some kids and like others not really want to get married. Sofar no problems, am going in a few weeks for my nonb year extension.. In 20 years one could say, I really never had a problem except that one time I wanted a year visum (girlfriend wanted that) but I liked Penang and asked Immigration to send it away for a few months and then say no as I really enjoyed my trips to Penang... They had a good laugh but could understand it ..

Finally I would like to say that if they use their immigration computer properly it really shouldnt be a difficult job to sort the many entries per year and not paying tax and other combo's out to find maybe 95% of all illegal stayers in a few weeks. I am sure I could do it (ok, I work in computers) but that means the Thais can do it as well and likely catch the ones with double passports etc etc.

Whatever if they insist I retire or maybe move, Kids are in the last few years of the school...

Whatever you do do realise that change to an option compatable with what you had before or with what you may do in future

[kojak]

Well it don’t seem a good time to be an ex-pat doz it?

For what ever reason they take these measures it don’t seem that important to me,

more of how to deal with the problems up ahead is the real concern.

I live in chiang mai, 44y, single, not rich but have enough saved from hard graft back

in the UK. I used to do my 30 day visa-run my either bus or motorbike to Measai, on the Burma border. It was ok, I even look’t forward to it, as it was a good excuse to

go on a good bike run.

I don’t work here, don’t need to, don’t want to. I work’t my butt off for employers

in good old London town, this is my treat to myself.

My problem is up here in Chiang Mai it’s a bit far to go to any of the places mentioned for 3 months visa.

I might as well just shoot off to Cambodia for 90 days, then back

here for 90 days.

I don’t really want to live in Cambodia, I’ve been there many times for trips, but I

love Thailand, that’s why I pack’t up and moved here.

I did go to the immigration office near the Chiang Mai airport, I tried to find out

what’s the story with the visa situ, “we don’t know anything about that”

was my answer. All they did know was from other farang!

This was followed up by, “we wait for letter from Bangkok, but don’t worry now”

So if this really doz come into full effect, and is not just Thai government sabre rattling, then that means I’ve got 4 weeks to make a plan, (last visa run 27th sept)

Has anybody got any great suggestions out there for me.

But not ‘get a job’, or ‘go home’.

Is marrage the only real loophole worth going for? I did meet a nice girl yesterday, ermmmmmmm?

What ever, at least there not knocking or our doors armed with M16’s rounding us up, chucking us in the back of cattle trucks and dumping at border control.

lateeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrsssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

ssss

[Scott]

It's probably about time for Thailand to begin cracking down on some of the less desirable people. It is sad for those who really aren't deadbeats, but get caught on the wrong side of the line drawn in the sand.

There was a post about Thailand not paying English teachers enough. This may be true, however, most schools can afford to hire Filipino teachers, whom they can secure within the budget constraints of most schools.

For those who want qualified, native English Speakers, they may have to raise the pay, or lower the level of what they mean by qualified.

Actually, I look forward to being in the country when it is more compliant with it's own laws. I just never quite know where I am with the mai pen rai thing and the never mind, just overstay your visa attitude! Go to another country and that will land you squarely in jail!

Best of luck to everyone with their visa concerns.

[atcallan]

Wow !

Another inflammatory first post from someone that hasn't thought it out!

errrrrrrrrrr......... which part exactly has not been thought out ?

I work in the media, and have interviewed several thai officials about this matter this week.......

let me guess, you must be one of those english teachers i was talking about.

[drummer]

Where does one get a multiple entry tourist visa? I was in the States in July, and the consul in Portland specifically told me there was no multiple entry tourist visa offered. The best I could get was triple. All other visas required a stack of paperwork... Seriously, is there that much difference from consul to consul?

I got one from the Consul in Portland about 2 years ago....