Tiles

[carlyai]

Where in Pattaya is the best place to go to get advice about tile problems?

I need to go to a shop with a 'Thai Tile Guru' and ask some questions about tile sealers etc.

[ThaiBob]

I found Boontavarn helpful and they have a large selection of tile products and sealers.

[carlyai]

I found Boontavarn helpful and they have a large selection of tile products and sealers.

Yes, I have been there and they are helpful, but they don't seem to have a tile guru to help me with my tile problem.

May be I didn't talk to the right person, and I didn't see any tile or grout sealer, just grout and other stuff.

[Rimmer]

What exactly is the problem? If we know maybe we can move your question to the DIY forum where all the experts hang out

[steve187]

we are the Tile Guru guys

[carlyai]

What exactly is the problem? If we know maybe we can move your question to the DIY forum where all the experts hang out

we are the Tile Guru guys

Thanks for the responses.

I have asked for help on the diy ThaiVisa forum, but not the Pattaya forum.

Did not have any responses on the ThaiVisa forum, but didn't include pics either.

We have a house in Pattaya, where we are now, and fixing up to rent out, we are still building in Isaan.

I have enclosed some pictures of the stone glazed tiles we had laid around the balcony of the house.

The tiles get very dirty, are hard to keep clean, and the water gets in the joins where the grout is and leaves stains.

I think we need to seal the tiles or seal the grout, but I don't know, and also if we do need to seal the tiles or grout, what product to buy and where to get it in Pattaya.

Also need to clean the tiles before we seal (if that is the recommended option), and do we use acid, or how is it best to clean the tiles if we have to seal them?

I have a tile here in Pattaya if some expert wants to look at it and can give solutions.

Thanks for the help.

[ThaiBob]

Have you considered re-grouting and then sealing?

[carlyai]

Have you considered re-grouting and then sealing?

No, haven't considered that, yet.

Do you think the contractor who did the grouting used the wrong grout?

I was away when this was done, but have looked at the grout left over and it seems to be the standard water proof grout, crocodile brand, I think, that was used.

I'm pretty sure the tiler stuffed up, but there's about 150 m2 of tiles to be regrouted, but would do it if that is the answer.

If I re-grout, as against cleaning, how do I know the same thing won't happen? What type of grout would I use?

I'm doing all the stuff-up fixes myself as we won't allow another contractor to set foot on the land.

[Rimmer]

If I remember correctly there are at least two grades of crocodile grout maybe the contractor used the cheaper one which could be porous.

The tiles look like expensive quarry tiles, sealing them will lead to even more problems and they will look terrible as the seal wears off.

Is moister coming up from underneath via the grout then going into the tiles? Top or bottom one way or another I would say the discoloration is getting in via the grout.

[carlyai]

If I remember correctly there are at least two grades of crocodile grout maybe the contractor used the cheaper one which could be porous.

The tiles look like expensive quarry tiles, sealing them will lead to even more problems and they will look terrible as the seal wears off.

Is moister coming up from underneath via the grout then going into the tiles? Top or bottom one way or another I would say the discoloration is getting in via the grout.

My Mrs likes to clean and mop the tiles evey day, or lots.

I think the moisture is going in from the top when she cleans the tiles.

Water spills on the tiles give the same sabby effect in the grout areas.

The tiles are grade A, so the seller says, but not thinking much when I bought them, now I look at them and the nice stone or quarry tile is only on the top of the tile, about 2 mm and the rest is like baked clay. Is this normal for tiles, or should the top of the tile be thicker or all the way through?

[carlyai]

If I remember correctly there are at least two grades of crocodile grout maybe the contractor used the cheaper one which could be porous.

The tiles look like expensive quarry tiles, sealing them will lead to even more problems and they will look terrible as the seal wears off.

Is moister coming up from underneath via the grout then going into the tiles? Top or bottom one way or another I would say the discoloration is getting in via the grout.

My Mrs likes to clean and mop the tiles evey day, or lots.

I think the moisture is going in from the top when she cleans the tiles.

Water spills on the tiles give the same sabby effect in the grout areas.

The tiles are grade A, so the seller says, but not thinking much when I bought them, now I look at them and the nice stone or quarry tile is only on the top of the tile, about 2 mm and the rest is like baked clay. Is this normal for tiles, or should the top of the tile be thicker or all the way through?

I made a mistake about the thickness of the stone face of the tile, it's only about half a mill or less.

[Rimmer]

Seems to be quite a bit about this and similr problems on the net, this link any interest?

http://www.wagnermeters.com/flooring/rapid-rh-concrete-moisture/grout-moisture-issues/

[carlyai]

Seems to be quite a bit about this and similr problems on the net, this link any interest?

http://www.wagnermeters.com/flooring/rapid-rh-concrete-moisture/grout-moisture-issues/

Thanks for that Rimmer, but it seems to be about water comming up from the slab or the surface the tiles are mounted on.

I think my problem is water getting in from the grout or tile joins.

I had high hopes of a solution when I got an answer that 'we are the tile experts' in one of the posts.

So far the experts don't seem to have addressed the problem I have.

The answers so far: sealing the tiles will cause more problems down the track. Good reply.

redo the grouting. Good reply, but no answer as to why and what product to use.

Where are all the tile expaPERTS!

[Rimmer]

Waterproof grout as used in swimming pools maybe?

[carlyai]

Waterproof grout as used in swimming pools maybe?

Could be the answer, but, I've not seen tiles with stains like these, but there again I may not have looked too hard before.

Now I look everywhere, and I have only seen one lot of tiles that look a bit the same and they were in a spar area.

I would like to know what the problem is, as most people don't put down water proof grout like in swimming pools and use grout from any shop.

If I can't understand what the problem is, then it's going to be hard for me to fix it.

It looks to me like water is getting in through the grout and causing the stain, but I'm not sure if it's the tiles problem or the grout problem.

I was hoping someone may see the pics and relate to the same problem and a solution.

[carlyai]

Her's an answer from the nice chappy at that link you gave me Rimmer.

'Many, not all, cement grouts are inherently porous and when exposed to water will darken slightly. This typically goes away once the water evaporates. If this is the case here I would recommend a good cleaning with a heavy duty grout cleaner, allow to dry (turn of sprinklers for one night) and then sealing with a premium grout sealer (you get what you pay for in regards to sealers).'

Anyone know anything about grout cleaners and grout sealers, and what brand etc to buy here in Thailand?

Edited July 9, 2015 by carlyai

[rocketboybkk]

You can't seal the tiles

The grout seems to need sorting out. The grout can be cleaned with steam

They're never going to stay new for long - it's called maintenance

If anyone tells you to seal them then they know nothing about tiling!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rocketboybkk]

If I remember correctly there are at least two grades of crocodile grout maybe the contractor used the cheaper one which could be porous.

The tiles look like expensive quarry tiles, sealing them will lead to even more problems and they will look terrible as the seal wears off.

Is moister coming up from underneath via the grout then going into the tiles? Top or bottom one way or another I would say the discoloration is getting in via the grout.

Correct Rimmer, correct

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rocketboybkk]

Further, the stains haven't developed from the grout

It's dirty water, rain, dust etc. etc.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[carlyai]

So, it's not the grout problem, but water getting into the grout, am I correct about this?

To fix the problem, I should buy a steam cleaner and clean the grout? (any other options to clean the grout, as to sure of the cleaner cost)

Should I then seal the grout to stop any water getting in?

I have looked a t a couple of shops here in pattaya and can't find a grout sealer.

I have looked on the internet and seems HomePro has Black Diamond Diamond Stone seal and coat, is this what I could use to seal the grout?

[steve187]

The problem with tiling work carried out in Thailand is the lack of a 3mm ( british standerd) joint, so grout can not get into the gaps and seal the joints, (grouting with flip flops is not a good way to go), the joints need to be cleaned out and re-grouted with a water proof grout, as a previous poster said try swimming pool grout, The stains are just water seeping into the side of the tile

The best tile shop i have seen is on the main 36 road at Rayong. called Rayong ceramics, its on the right on the way towards koh Chang,go past the shop and u turn under the flyover at 'global house', Rayong ceramics will have a suitable grout, they stock all the best brands as well as Weber, ask in there ,

It would seem you have plain ceramic tiles with a brownish 'biscuit' and a thin glaze on the top, quarry tiles, natural stone as well as polished porcelain will need sealing, but as yours appear to be ceramic they do not need to be sealed, (sealing a tiles that requires sealing will allow the tiles to soak up the liquid sealer and protect from marks etc. it should not be allowed to dry on the surface, up to three coats of sealer can be required carried out to the requirements of the tiles)

if after applying the waterproof sealer you still have the same problem maybe a coat or 2 of a suitable sealer applied to the grout lines will help.

I am a tiler with 40 years experience, and still tile in the UK.

[carlyai]

The problem with tiling work carried out in Thailand is the lack of a 3mm ( british standerd) joint, so grout can not get into the gaps and seal the joints, (grouting with flip flops is not a good way to go), the joints need to be cleaned out and re-grouted with a water proof grout, as a previous poster said try swimming pool grout, The stains are just water seeping into the side of the tile

The best tile shop i have seen is on the main 36 road at Rayong. called Rayong ceramics, its on the right on the way towards koh Chang,go past the shop and u turn under the flyover at 'global house', Rayong ceramics will have a suitable grout, they stock all the best brands as well as Weber, ask in there ,

It would seem you have plain ceramic tiles with a brownish 'biscuit' and a thin glaze on the top, quarry tiles, natural stone as well as polished porcelain will need sealing, but as yours appear to be ceramic they do not need to be sealed, (sealing a tiles that requires sealing will allow the tiles to soak up the liquid sealer and protect from marks etc. it should not be allowed to dry on the surface, up to three coats of sealer can be required carried out to the requirements of the tiles)

if after applying the waterproof sealer you still have the same problem maybe a coat or 2 of a suitable sealer applied to the grout lines will help.

I am a tiler with 40 years experience, and still tile in the UK.

Great, thanks heaps for this. Sorry to borrow your brain some more.

So I clean out the old grout and redo with new water proof swimming pool grout. Got that thanks.

I bought a grout cleaning tool, like a stanly knife with a blade on it, but I think the blade is to thick to fit into all the tile joints to clean out the grout.

How would you clean out the grout, I've got about 150 m2 of tiles I need to do.

How do you estimate how much grout I need to purchase, as I will try and buy it from that shop you suggested (thanks again), but the house we are building is about 700 km away, so need to buy all the grout here in Patts.

When I re-grout, should I do a small section at a time, ie 2 m2 clean out then re-grout, or a larger area. If I do a larger area there is a chance water will get in again as is wet season.

When I clean out the old grout, how long should I wait to put in the new grout?

Another question I hope you can answer.

My Mrs 'she who must be obeyed' complains that the tiles are too hard to mop, as they have that rough, no slip surface, and she's correct, they are hard to mop.

She wants new tiles that are non-slip and easy to mop.

She wants to put the new tiles on top of the tiles we have.

So my question is, how can she easily clean the tiles, or should I not redo all the grouts and just install new non-slip, easy to clean (if there is such a think), tiles over the tiles I already have?

At the end of the day, I don't want to replace the tiles, I want to regrout, like you suggest, but I want her to be happy in her tile mopping, or I get grief.

Edited July 11, 2015 by carlyai

[Rimmer]

The grout and tile question has got beyond my pay grade now but I maybe can help on the mopping thing.

The foam rubber squeegee mops don't clean rough tiles very well but the new type press down and swirl around ones seem to get in all the tile depressions and hollows much better, they are about baht 750 from Hardware house.

[carlyai]

The grout and tile question has got beyond my pay grade now but I maybe can help on the mopping thing.

The foam rubber squeegee mops don't clean rough tiles very well but the new type press down and swirl around ones seem to get in all the tile depressions and hollows much better, they are about baht 750 from Hardware house.

Thanks Rimmer, but 'she who must be obeyed' does use those style type mops.

'She who must be obeyed' used to be the boss of a canteen feeding 200 to 300 people 2 meals a day, so she knows her cleaning and cooking.

When the health inspectors visited, her canteeen was aways the cleanest, same with the contractor quarters she cleaned, always the best.

So if I can't get this grout sorted and a way to clean the tiles easily, for the sake of 27 years marriage, the tiles will have to go. That's what I don't want.

[steve187]

I liked rimmer's idea for the spinning mops, we use them all the time in Thailand. If you do tile over then use a good adhesive for outside use and use tile spacers. ok to tile over is all exsising tiles are sound no hollows when tapped .

re grout removing , a long boring job, made harder in Thailand by the small joints, they do a special blade for the '' multi tools'' - https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=multi+tool+grout+removing&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&meta=cr%3DcountryUK|countryGB&gws_rd=ssl , not sure if available in Thailand, but i think the lack of a good size joint could cause you the same problems once re-grouted, while grouting use a proper grout float - https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=multi+tool+grout+removing&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&meta=cr%3DcountryUK|countryGB&gws_rd=ssl#cr=countryUK|countryGB&tbs=ctr:countryUK|countryGB&q=grout+float, available in Hardware house, on the 36 road Ban chang.and maybe in Rayong ceramics.

ask in the shop re quantities

Good luck

[carlyai]

I liked rimmer's idea for the spinning mops, we use them all the time in Thailand. If you do tile over then use a good adhesive for outside use and use tile spacers. ok to tile over is all exsising tiles are sound no hollows when tapped .

re grout removing , a long boring job, made harder in Thailand by the small joints, they do a special blade for the '' multi tools'' - https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=multi+tool+grout+removing&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&meta=cr%3DcountryUK|countryGB&gws_rd=ssl , not sure if available in Thailand, but i think the lack of a good size joint could cause you the same problems once re-grouted, while grouting use a proper grout float - https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=multi+tool+grout+removing&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&meta=cr%3DcountryUK|countryGB&gws_rd=ssl#cr=countryUK|countryGB&tbs=ctr:countryUK|countryGB&q=grout+float, available in Hardware house, on the 36 road Ban chang.and maybe in Rayong ceramics.

ask in the shop re quantities

Good luck

Thanks Rimmer and Steve187.

Looks like the Mrs is right again, can't be nope!

If I re-grout then I could have the same problem, and still hard to mop.

If I re-tile then might be able to throw the leg over again? Maybe not.

If I re-tile i'll probably get the same expert tilers applying for the job who can't do it, what a flop!

Better have a Leo and think about something else or not.

Thanks heaps for the good replies

Edited July 12, 2015 by carlyai

[Pdavies99]

Generally the problem is poorly laid tiles in the 1st place, ie onto earth covered with gravel, regardless I never see anyone use grout sealer AFTER the grout has been applied! You can buy this at Homepro, Homemart.

Then no problems!