Condo Management Company in Pattaya

[Bandersnatch]

Can anyone recommend a good condo management company in Pattaya? The contract for our condo management company will shortly expire and we are looking to get quotes from other companies. Is your condo well run and within budget? Has any condo committees tried to run their building themselves, employing a manager and staff directly? We would love to hear from you. I don't want to name our building here, just to say it is not a small building.

[NormanW]

Optima are brilliant. Wouldn't have anyone else. Ran by an English lad.

[craigt3365]

You can try NorthShore. Can't remember the name of the company, but they seem relatively happy with them.

[Jupiterjim]

You can try NorthShore. Can't remember the name of the company, but they seem relatively happy with them.

The North Shore is a prestigius contract for a management company and they put their good people in there.

The same company can have absolute bozos running other projects.

Very hit and miss with these management companies.

[ThaiBob]

QPM manages a lot of condos here.

[KittenKong]

Optima are brilliant. Wouldn't have anyone else. Ran by an English lad.

You said something very similar a few months ago but you didn't give any details. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/819544-condo-management-companies/ Can you now?

Anyone have any comments about Optima's relationship with Wongamart condo, which seems to be in deep trouble? http://www.wongamartcondo.com/

Anyone know of other buildings that Optima manage? I dont.

I wonder why doesn't their website give their office or postal address?

[KittenKong]

QPM manages a lot of condos here.

This is very true. Some people like them, some hate them with a vengeance I have rarely encountered. It's not clear why.

From what I have seen of them they appear to be reasonably efficient.

[KittenKong]

Jones Lang LaSalle do condo management in Pattaya. They seem to be run to farang standards but they are expensive.

[rickthailand]

qpm are good

[KittenKong]

Is your condo well run and within budget? Has any condo committees tried to run their building themselves, employing a manager and staff directly?

What a nightmare condo management is here, especially considering how small the budgets usually are. It's hard to comprehend how so little money can generate so many problems. My building's yearly budget is less than my yearly revenue used to be when I worked for myself. And I had no staff and even found time to do my own accounts. Yet our building needs 3 people to run the office, plus an external management company for the accounts and general legal work, and still they cant get the most basic things right.

I'm often tempted to sack our management company and employ a competent manager. I think that if this was done the important thing would be to have good outside accountants who report weekly to the committee and to never let the manager ever have any access to bank accounts or chequebooks or cash, apart from paying in the daily takings.

There are dozens of cases here of badly controlled managers walking off with millions of Baht, though this often happens even when a management company is employed also as many of them seem to have no idea how to monitor staff.

But another problem I find in our building is the very high level of apathy and general stupidity of the co-owners. Few seem to be interested in the way the building is run, none of them seems to know how to read a spreadsheet or understand a cash-flow report, and in fact hardly any of them ever look at any building documents at all. If they do think about the building it only seems to involve stabbing other people in the back and generally complaining without offering any useful input. We also have more than our fair share of retired people who will happily tell you that they used to do this and that important job, and used to chair this and that committee, and then five minutes later they will tell you exactly the same thing, and again a half hour later. I would be unhappy about having such people on a committee that had to directly oversee a manager and all the finances. In fact I would be unhappy about having such people oversee a family picnic on the beach.

[huawei]

Plus renting out and selling condos where the commission goes directly into their pockets. Co- owners keep quiet because they got the sale. These amounts can be significant. No management company I have talked seems to care about this.

[KittenKong]

Plus renting out and selling condos where the commission goes directly into their pockets. Co- owners keep quiet because they got the sale. These amounts can be significant. No management company I have talked seems to care about this.

I can see that might be a problem in buildings where the office handles rentals or sales. In our building the office (supposedly) never gets involved in anything like this, though I'm certain that there have been such private transactions in the past. I'm also certain that our staff have (and probably still do) provided confidential or advance information to favoured agencies etc.

Dishonest practices are par for the course here but as long as it doesn't actually involve a loss to the building finances it's not the end of the world.

[Jupiterjim]

The problem is the word "manager."

It's a Thais birthright to rob the place if they rise to a management position. They feel they earned it. No?

[fosseway]

I worked with QPM in the past in my role of a Committee member at Jomtien Condotel some 10 years ago, I have since moved on but QPM still manage the building of some 900 units (from memory), all in all they did a good job, as managing a multi nationality, communal living building is not an easy task.

[NormanW]

Send them an email and ask questions.

If satisfied meet up with them in one of their condos and then make a decision.

I've no complaints.

Good luck.

Optima are brilliant. Wouldn't have anyone else. Ran by an English lad.

You said something very similar a few months ago but you didn't give any details. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/819544-condo-management-companies/ Can you now?

Anyone have any comments about Optima's relationship with Wongamart condo, which seems to be in deep trouble? http://www.wongamartcondo.com/

Anyone know of other buildings that Optima manage? I dont.

I wonder why doesn't their website give their office or postal address?

[huawei]

Optima are brilliant. Wouldn't have anyone else. Ran by an English lad.

You said something very similar a few months ago but you didn't give any details. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/819544-condo-management-companies/ Can you now?

Anyone have any comments about Optima's relationship with Wongamart condo, which seems to be in deep trouble? http://www.wongamartcondo.com/

Anyone know of other buildings that Optima manage? I dont.

I wonder why doesn't their website give their office or postal address?

Just been to their website...very strange that they don't have a location address. A bit like financial advisors if they only come to visit you be careful..

[Bandersnatch]

Thank you for all your replies. I will contact QPM, a friend of mine is in one of their buildings and seems quite happy. I am arranging to meet with the building's committee chair to get a more detailed feedback. I have emailed optima "Where are your offices located, because I would like to come in and discuss condo management with you". I will feedback here on what I find out.

We are really trying to get our costs down as we have a C.A.M. fee of ฿30/m and we really need ฿40 to run the building. We cannot get enough people to come to an AGM to agree to the increase.

[NormanW]

Sounds like they haven't kept the website up to date.

Paul Rogers is the lad behind it. A really nice guy.

Knows more about condos and the running of them than the majority.

Sorry haven't got his number.

[KittenKong]

I wonder why doesn't their website give their office or postal address?

Just been to their website...very strange that they don't have a location address. A bit like financial advisors if they only come to visit you be careful..

Yes, that puts me right off.

Also I would be concerned about employing a very small company. When it's good, it's good because you always deal with the top man. But if something goes wrong then suddenly you have no one at all to complain to or talk to. I have had personal experience of this and it's no fun at all.

Dealing with a corporate entity like QPM does at least mean that you can have any personnel removed and replaced at short notice if you dont get on with them, without putting the running of the condo in jeopardy. You just cant do this with a one-man-band.

[NormanW]

Sorry my mistake.

He has several staff working at various condos in Pattaya.

Good luck with the search.

[KittenKong]

Thank you for all your replies. I will contact QPM, a friend of mine is in one of their buildings and seems quite happy.

We are really trying to get our costs down as we have a C.A.M. fee of ฿30/m and we really need ฿40 to run the building. We cannot get enough people to come to an AGM to agree to the increase.

My experience of QPM is that they are reasonably priced and reasonably competent. So you shouldn't have too much trouble with them.

Whether they will be able to help reduce your costs rather depends on what you are spending your money on now. Is your current management company expensive? Do you have too many staff? Are you paying full attention to little details like ensuring that fees are charged (and paid) for extra services like renovation cleaning, parking fines etc? All these add up. Is your security expensive? Do you pay too much for pool maintenance etc? Do you properly control petty cash expenditure and obtain multiple quotes for all purchases/expenses of more than a few thousand Baht?

As for your common fee, you will probably never get a big enough turn-out to vote an increase (you need at least 50% of the total vote by ratio for it to pass), and I suspect that many would vote against it even if they did bother to turn up.

What you can do is introduce a special fee at the second AGM that you call after the first one fails due to not having a full quorum. Votes for special fees taken at a second meeting require only a simple majority of those present to pass (unless perhaps your condo has some specific rule about this). The neatest procedure is to only give voters a choice between two or three amounts, without giving them the choice of not having a special fee at all. You can set this fee for more than one year though I would be wary of setting it for longer than the remaining term of the committee.

My building and others I know of have had special fees every year for ages. We could not survive without ours.

Edited July 26, 2015 by KittenKong

[huawei]

Thank you for all your replies. I will contact QPM, a friend of mine is in one of their buildings and seems quite happy. I am arranging to meet with the building's committee chair to get a more detailed feedback. I have emailed optima "Where are your offices located, because I would like to come in and discuss condo management with you". I will feedback here on what I find out.

We are really trying to get our costs down as we have a C.A.M. fee of ฿30/m and we really need ฿40 to run the building. We cannot get enough people to come to an AGM to agree to the increase.

I have read on here that the best approach is to go with a " special assessment fund" ...maybe someone else who has used this can help you. Where you specify exactly what these funds will be needed for. Majority at agm or egm is sufficient.

Your problem in not uncommon.

Ok. As excellently described above.

Edited July 26, 2015 by huawei

[kdrayong]

We had a really good experience with QPM - in the beginning! A period from 3 to 2 years ago.

After that, their first diligence was gone or maybe they just managed too many condominiums without having appropriate staff at that time.

The staff, we were provided with changed to be a joke. From the housing manager to the 'technician', who wasn't able to do anything, but changing light bulbs. The district manager N. didn't show up anymore, daily business including accounting broke down.

Hope, they were able to improve again.

Howsoever, the management company before of them was even worse. Now we are quite happy with a single manager and our other staff, employed by the JP itself.

[KittenKong]

We had a really good experience with QPM - in the beginning! A period from 3 to 2 years ago.

After that, their first diligence was gone or maybe they just managed too many condominiums without having appropriate staff at that time.

The staff, we were provided with changed to be a joke. From the housing manager to the 'technician', who wasn't able to do anything, but changing light bulbs. The district manager N. didn't show up anymore, daily business including accounting broke down.

Hope, they were able to improve again.

Howsoever, the management company before of them was even worse. Now we are quite happy with a single manager and our other staff, employed by the JP itself.

Interesting comments. I suppose yours is a relatively small building?

[Basil B]

You do not need a management company.

You require a juristic person, basically a good manager who knows the law, you will need other employees depending on the size of the building to run the office(s), maintenance, cleaning, security and gardening, and probably a good lawyer and accountant.

If you bring in a management company you they will bring in there own staff and contractors and be racking of a big fees for what could be done by one employee.

I used to have a condo in Jomtien Beach Condominium, 3600 apartments very well managed by one JP and no management company, when we had problems with security, that company was out faster than you could say "Jack Robinson" (or was it Red Robo?)and a new contract signed with another security company, you will not get that with a management company that is in bed with all its contracting companies.

You would do better if your committees were to meet with other independent committees socially and your JP was to meet with other independent JP's say encourage then to set up a breakfast club or something, you are not really in competition with other Condominiums and meeting with them could be mutually beneficial to all.

Edited July 27, 2015 by Basil B

[KittenKong]

You do not need a management company.

You require a juristic person, basically a good manager who knows the law, you will need other employees depending on the size of the building to run the office(s), maintenance, cleaning, security and gardening, and probably a good lawyer and accountant.

If you bring in a management company you they will bring in there own staff and contractors and be racking of a big fees for what could be done by one employee.

I used to have a condo in Jomtien Beach Condominium, 3600 apartments very well managed by one JP and no management company, when we had problems with security, that company was out faster than you could say "Jack Robinson" (or was it Red Robo?)and a new contract signed with another security company, you will not get that with a management company that is in bed with all its contracting companies.

You would do better if your committees were to meet with other independent committees socially and your JP was to meet with other independent JP's say encourage then to set up a breakfast club or something, you are not really in competition with other Condominiums and meeting with them could be mutually beneficial to all.

The Juristic Person is the building. You seem to be talking about the Juristic Person Manager, which you must have by law even if you also have a management company. You may also have a building manager, who may be provided by the management company or not.

Not all management companies use their own staff and own contractors, nor do they necessarily charge fees for those staff and services. Some companies just charge a management fee for management services, and everything else is paid directly by the building. Some provide all services (office staff, manager, cleaning, security, etc) either from their own personnel or, commonly, from outsourcing. Management companies may also act as JPM, but this is always a separate arrangement and many wont do it at all.

We have changed our security company more than once and have never had the slightest trouble dispensing with one and using another. The management company prepares a list of quotes and the committee decides which to use, just as they do with other services like pool maintenance and elevator maintenance. The committee can also add names to the list, if it wants.

Not employing a management company can be a problem in that all responsibility is then held by the JPM who may also be the building manager (these are not the same job at all). Whilst this is fine if it goes well it can be a nightmare if the JPM/manager is a crook (and there are many of these around), or if the committee isnt competent to really check what the JPM/manager is doing. This is especially so in large buildings where everyone doesn't know each other or communicate a lot.

Meeting and talking with committees in other buildings is something that I support, but I've noticed that many other committee members seem to be strongly against this. Some management companies and managers and JPMs are also against people talking with other buildings as they are worried that their own shortcomings will be revealed, as of course they could well be.

So much deception and lies in condo management here, and incompetence and ass-covering too.

Edited July 28, 2015 by KittenKong

[Bandersnatch]

There seem to be some interest in condo committees meeting to share their experiences. I would certainly like to be involved.

Anybody else?

[kdrayong]

There seem to be some interest in condo committees meeting to share their experiences. I would certainly like to be involved.

Anybody else?

Always a good thing, to exchange useful information in a foreign country.

[Wallander4]

On ‎7‎/‎25‎/‎2015 at 8:40 AM, KittenKong said:

This is very true. Some people like them, some hate them with a vengeance I have rarely encountered. It's not clear why.

From what I have seen of them they appear to be reasonably efficient.

QPM manage Executive Residence 4 and here´s a few reasons why QPM is not popular here :

 

Juristic Person manager is not in his office half the time he should be there

 

Common Area Fee is not being paid in time so maintenance is horrible - eg. AC in fitness havent worked for months

 

No security in day time - anyone have free access to parking lot and since JP is not in his office no one is looking at security cameras

 

and lots lots more is at fault at Executive Residence 4 like Electric rates is way over government rate

Edited October 25, 2016 by Wallander4

[KittenKong]

3 hours ago, Wallander4 said:

Juristic Person manager is not in his office half the time he should be there

 

Common Area Fee is not being paid in time so maintenance is horrible - eg. AC in fitness havent worked for months

 

No security in day time - anyone have free access to parking lot and since JP is not in his office no one is looking at security cameras

 

and lots lots more is at fault at Executive Residence 4 like Electric rates is way over government rate

 

The first three items are things that the committee should be forcing the management company and the JPM to pay attention to. My experience of building staff here is that if no one pushes them they certainly wont walk around looking for things to do.

 

The last item is presumably because you dont have individual official meters with individual bills for each from the electric company, so everyone pays the business rate to the building. This is not within the remit of the management company or the JPM to change. You need to have a GM and discuss the issue and vote for changing the billing, which may also involve significant rewiring but should, in the end, lead to much lower bills. There was a thread about this recently.