Longer visa for thai girlfriend

[rambot]

I met my girlfriend in January through video calling with my pal who was out there, I met my g/f through that call, we have spoken everyday since.

I visited LOS in March and spent 2 months with her, we got on great,

I can home for 5 weeks and travelled again to LOS and spent another month together.

I applied for a visitor visa and this got accepted on the second application, first time i forgot to translate the thai documents into English

So we are now in the UK, my girlfriend will go home mid August for her daughters graduation from university, she will then return to me here in early September and stay through to christmas of which i will then be returning with her to spend at least a month out there, it is easier for me to work here than in Thailand.

My question is will we have any problems her returning in September, this is a concern although she is within her visa times, as long as she departs by the 29th December

My second question is (i am still officially married although seperated for 3 years now and divorce is filed last week) how can i apply for a longer term visa as we really do not want to ever be apart, we are both madly in love and will get married next year, but i need to wait for decree absolute and want to save some money before we get married. We will be getting married in Thailand as all her family are there.

I would like to obtain a one year visa for her so we can be together and enhance our relationship further and i and her do not wish to spend time apart.

Please accept my gratitude for any help you can give me and advice on our next step.

[rambot]

if we cannot apply for a longer visa can i apply again for a visitor visa in January while i am out there for her to come again next year,

[rambot]

I would like to add that i read the forum and with the help of the knowledgeable people on here our application was successful the second time, but only due to my stupidity of not providing transaled documents proving ownership of land, job being left open for her by her boss, and also proof of house ownership, although very small.

I would like to say a big thanks for the help i have got from reading the application details that were required

[theoldgit]

First of all, and I don't want to sound pernickety, but you don't apply for a visa, your girlfriend does, it's her application and it's her that needs to convince the Entry Clearance Officer that she is a genuine visitor and that her proposed trip is affordable and that she will return to her home at the conclusion of her holiday.

Providing her visa is multi entry she can enter the UK as often as she likes within the validity of that visa, though she must leave the UK on or before the date of expiry. She needs to bare in mind that every time she enters the UK she needs to satisfy the Border Force Officer that she's still a genuine visitor and that she will leave at the conclusion of her holiday.

Until she goes for a Settlement Visa, and she doesn't qualify yet, there is no visa that allows an extended stay in the UK. She can apply for a further visit visa at any stage, but she would not normally be allowed to stay in the UK for longer than six months in any twelve, whatever the length of the visa. Whilst this is a convention and not a hard and fast rule, she would need compelling reasons to exceed the six months in any twelve convention.

[bobrussell]

If she has a multi-entry visa and books a return flight within the validity of the visa then it is pretty unlikely to be a problem. The Border Officer will ask questions to confirm her plans in the UK but that should be all. Be on the end of a phone should there be any problems.

Applying for a 12 month visa may not be that good an idea. These are significantly more expensive than a six month visa and anecdotally it seems that an Entry Clearance Officer is going to want to see compelling reasons for needing a longer visa. Applicant convenience is probably not that high on the list! They tend to be issued to people needing frequent travel for business or partners of those settled long-term in Thailand.

My gf (now wife) flew back and forth over a period of years, getting visit visas when required. The only problem she had was once we were married!

Your situation is far from uncommon!

[rambot]

Firstly if i mistakenly said things wrong i apologise, yes it is her application. I was the sponsor, the reason i asked the questions above was so that we could spend as much time together as possible. Yes i can go to Thailand every few months but a long distance relationship will not really suit either of us, we enjoy being together every minute. Whilst i am here i can still work, so it means that i can be together with her and still earn. If i go to Thailand then not only am i spending money but also not earning, so it is like a double whammy.

If her visa runs out on the 30th December can we apply again for her to come back in maybe February and stay for a couple of months, This year she will have stayed here for about 17 weeks i suppose total.

The reason for a longer visa is to give us the opportunity to enhance our relationship whilst i am still able to work and earn an income to provide for us both.

Maybe i will have to just get my divorce through very quickly and then get married,

Please what problems do you talk about having after you was married.

Also what right has an entry clearance officer got that can override our right to a life together or a future together. I know this sound a bit rude but after we know what happens elsewhere it seems crazy that i should be denied a right to spend time with my future partner.

[bobrussell]

The rules are determined by government and implemented by civil servants. They will argue that a visa is a privilege and not a right and if you don't like the rules, tough!

To qualify for a visit visa, the applicant has to demonstrate a number of things including purpose of the visit, affordability and that he or she is going to leave before the visa expires.

A visit to a partner will involve evidence that there is a relationship and that there is no attempt to by pass settlement rules.

There is no visa designed to allow someone to stay for long periods without settling and being married makes little or no difference to this unless both partners intend to live in the UK. 17 weeks in a year is going to be a bit tricky to get past an ECO as they may consider this more than visiting! The government are really missing out on a trick here! They could charge a lot for a suitable visa, charge something for NHS costs (not all travel insurance covers longer visits), yet prevent any settlement rights being acquired!

You have a perfect right to spend time with your future partner but there is nothing stopping you moving to be with him or her! The system is not designed to be caring nor particularly interested in what most people would consider the right thing to do!

Pretty pointless fighting the system but better to accept it as it is otherwise you will be hitting your head against a very unresponsive brick wall!

My advice is to go for a standard visit visa, shorter visit initially and cover reasons to return very, very thoroughly.

(My wife was initially refused entry at Heathrow largely because she used a marriage visit visa to return to the UK after we had married. The purpose of the visa had therefore changed! Very robust communication to the UKBA by my MP, assisted by my bloody minded refusal to accept a daft decision by an immigration officer allowed a satisfactory compromise to be reached. Her visit went ahead as planned!)

[Tony M]

Firstly if i mistakenly said things wrong i apologise, yes it is her application. I was the sponsor, the reason i asked the questions above was so that we could spend as much time together as possible. Yes i can go to Thailand every few months but a long distance relationship will not really suit either of us, we enjoy being together every minute. Whilst i am here i can still work, so it means that i can be together with her and still earn. If i go to Thailand then not only am i spending money but also not earning, so it is like a double whammy.

If her visa runs out on the 30th December can we apply again for her to come back in maybe February and stay for a couple of months, This year she will have stayed here for about 17 weeks i suppose total.

The reason for a longer visa is to give us the opportunity to enhance our relationship whilst i am still able to work and earn an income to provide for us both.

Maybe i will have to just get my divorce through very quickly and then get married,

Please what problems do you talk about having after you was married.

Also what right has an entry clearance officer got that can override our right to a life together or a future together. I know this sound a bit rude but after we know what happens elsewhere it seems crazy that i should be denied a right to spend time with my future partner.

I'm by no means defending ECO's, but they do have to work to the immigration rules. Their job is to refuse visa applications that are not in accordance with those rules. You have brought up several points :

There is no visa that allows your girlfriend/partner to just spend time in the UK with you, if you are not in a relationship ( either a marriage or you are already living together). That leaves visit visas. Visit visas are for people visiting the UK, and if the ECO believes that this is being abused, for instance the applicant is actually living, or seeking to live, in the UK by using visit visas as a means to do so, then he will refuse the visa. On the one hand, it is reasonable to say that someone who is spending a lot of the time in the UK with their partner is probably not actually a "visitor". On the other hand, they could be. So, the ECO weighs up the evidence, and makes a decision.

The ECO bases his decision on all sorts of factors, the easiest being the amount of time the applicant has spent in the UK prior to any new application. It did indeed used to be based (unofficially) on whether the applicant had spent more that 6 months in the UK in the previous 12 months, but this has changed slightly. Now the ECO must make his decision on whether the applicant ( the ECO must be satisfied that the applicant) :

will leave the UK at the end of their visit; and

( will not live in the UK for extended periods through frequent or successive visits, or make the UK their main home; and

© is genuinely seeking entry for a purpose that is permitted by the visitor routes

From what you say, your girlfriend id likely to fall under ( above.

The ECO still uses an unpublished "yardstick" to decide whether you fall foul of (, and at the moment they are using percentages. So, if your girlfriend has been in the UK, as a visitor, for more than 50% of the previous 12 months, she is likely to be refused another visit visa. I have seen a refusal notice which says " You have spent 53% of the previous 12 months in the UK, which is more time than you have spent in your own country in the previous 12 months".

Don't think about "years". If you are thinking that she spent only 17 weeks in the UK in 2015, then that is not the yardstick that the ECO uses. He uses the previous 12 months ( that is, the 12 months prior to the new application).

A one year visa does not allow the holder to stay in the UK for one year. As previously stated, it is normally for use by people who travel regularly, often for short periods.

What you really need is a settlement visa. I understand that you can't apply for one yet, but you should really be working towards that, I think.

One thing does concern me about your post. You say that the visa was issued on the basis of your girlfriend's job to return to ? Are we to assume that she didn't return to continue her employment ? If so, then that could be a big problem when she applies for a new visa.

[rambot]

My girlfriend is a qualified hairdresser who used to own her own salon. She has many of her own customers. She now works at a salon employed but most of the clients she deals with were her own existing clients. Her boss has allowed her to come to the UK to spend time with me, she has been on her own for a long time and her friends, family and her boss want her to be happy, of which she is really happy now. Her job is held open accordingly because when she returns, whenever that might be she has a job to go to. She will pick up where she left off and deal with her own customers again as she has done now for the last 3-4 years. Obviously she is not earning a salary whilst she is here, she earns a salary and has commission based on her own clients and what they pay, sort of like a commission based bonus system

She does own a small piece of land and she does have family ties, i.e. mum and dad which i am looking after at the moment whilst she is with me of course.

It seems strange that she can just come and the job is not too important and i understand your concern, she has many friends that own their own salons and can go and work at any of them at anytime. She can always build her clients again easily anyway.

I hope this explains a little more about the situation from her side.

As for me i own and run a small airport taxi company, i can choose my work and at the moment i nip out early or out late and do my work, so we still get practiacally all day together.

Us being together all the time is not an issue. Workwise i earn easy enough money to keep us both. When she goes home she can work at any of maybe 3 or 4 salons. But we do want to be together as much as possible. We are 8 months into our relationship and absolutely love every minute together.

once my divorce comes through which i expect will be about 3 months then i can apply for another type of visa maybe, My income this year has been lowewr because i have spent 3 months in Thailand and she has been here for a month now, so my workload is not what it would have been, but i am still well over the £18600 gross income level, last year i was lazy and grossed £34000, the year before £39000

I hope this explains a bit more, i do not think this is a short term relationship and would like to try all avenues at us being together as much as possible, if she goes home then we will be apart and and if i go out there then my income will be far reduced.

[Tony M]

My girlfriend is a qualified hairdresser who used to own her own salon. She has many of her own customers. She now works at a salon employed but most of the clients she deals with were her own existing clients. Her boss has allowed her to come to the UK to spend time with me, she has been on her own for a long time and her friends, family and her boss want her to be happy, of which she is really happy now. Her job is held open accordingly because when she returns, whenever that might be she has a job to go to. She will pick up where she left off and deal with her own customers again as she has done now for the last 3-4 years. Obviously she is not earning a salary whilst she is here, she earns a salary and has commission based on her own clients and what they pay, sort of like a commission based bonus system

She does own a small piece of land and she does have family ties, i.e. mum and dad which i am looking after at the moment whilst she is with me of course.

It seems strange that she can just come and the job is not too important, she has many friends that own their own salons and can go and work at any of them at anytime. She can always build her clients again easily anyway.

I hope this explains a little more about the situation from her side.

As for me i own and run a small airport taxi company, i can choose my work and at the moment i nip out early or out late and do my work, so we still get practiacally all day together.

Us being together all the time is not an issue.

once my divorce comes through which i expect will be about 3 months then i can apply for another type of visa maybe, My income this year has been lowewr because i have spent 3 months in Thailand and she has been here for a month now, so my workload is not what it would have been, but i am still well over the £18600 gross income level, last year i was lazy and grossed £34000, the year before £39000

I hope this explains a bit more, i do not think this is a short term relationship and would like to try all avenues at us being together as much as possible, if she goes home then we will be apart and and if i go out there then my income will be far reduced.

I understand what you are saying. But, you asked the questions and I, and others, have explained the situation to you. Your avenues are limited. It is, of course, up to you to apply for any visa you want, at any time you want.

I mean no disrespect, but you seem to be able to meet the financial requirement for a settlement visa with ease. You could therefore take a fair bit of time off, certainly a month or so, and it wouldn't harm your settlement visa income threshold. You must make the decision which many others have had to do - more time in Thailand with your girlfriend, or maintain your level of income.

[rambot]

I understand the avenues are limited, i appreciate what you have said, i am understanding more now, i think once my divorce is through i will have more options. This year so far i have only grossed £15600 as i have spent 3 months in Thailand and as she is here now for 5 weeks total this time i am not working fully, but i will pick this up once she goes home.

Although i can take time off its a double whammy.

My plan at the monent is for her to return home for her daughters graduation from university mid august, then for her to return mid september and spend another 7-8 weeks with me, maybe a couple of weeks more. And leave sometime around late November or early December. I will then work again and head over there to spend Christmas with her and the family. Of which i have met of course and spent time with. I was asking whether this could be seen as a problem for later on, her visa expires on the 30th December. When she applied she applied for 5 weeks so she will be adhering to the application timescale but things have changed. She can get another letter if she needs to say her job is open, her boss at the moment is earning far more because she is looking after my girlfriends clienst as well as her own, but since now being here she loves it and would like to come back we were thinking that it would be ok, she will be out of the country before the visa expires and i will almost certainly be going with her or very shortly afterwards.

The employment situation for her is no problem, but whether the ECO will see this way or not is a different matter. I will of course be at the airport to meet her, so if they phone me i will be there.

We are in a unique situation slightly in that i can afford to take care of us both fairly easy, i looked after a wife and 4 children for 34 years, albeit a struggle sometimes. And i can afford to send a small amount of money to her family whilst she is with me. I would like her to come here permanaently but without getting married first, i would like to spend a year or so living together to see how things are, once my divorce comes through could i apply for a fiancee visa, with a view to getting married in the UK within the 6 months. I understand we do not qualify for settlement visa as we do not live together, but if we cannot live together then we cannot apply, i cannot afford to live in Thailand and have no skills to enable me to do so.

I was just a bit disappointed that a criminal have a right to life in the UK because he has a cat but this does not apply to my situation.

[rambot]

maybe i am not understanding, you say "I mean no disrespect, but you seem to be able to meet the financial requirement for a settlement visa with ease." but when i check this visa type it states we have to have been living together for eligibility, or am i not undertstanding things correctly.

all i see is this

Apply to settle in the UK

Start again

1. 1What's your situation?
   You're the family member or partner of someone who has settled in the UK

   2How did they settle?

2. Some other way

   3What's your relationship to that person?

3. Partner

   4What situation are you and your partner in?

4. You're still with your partner

   You can apply as the partner of a British citizen or person settled in the UK

You may be eligible for settlement (‘indefinite leave to remain’) if your partner is a:

• British citizen
• person settled in the UK

Partners are 2 people in a genuine relationship - you must be able to prove one of the following:

• you’re married
• you’re in a civil partnership
• you’ve been in a relationship for 2 years

You and your partner must intend to continue your relationship after you apply for settlement.

Eligibility

You need to have been living in the UK with a ‘partner of a settled person’ visa for:

• 2 years if you applied for your visa before 9 July 2012
• 5 years or 10 years if you applied for your visa on or after 9 July 2012

So yes i would like to apply for a settlement visa, but do not think we qualify under the terms above, So yes my options are limited, either spend more time in Thailand and not earn enough money maybe, because the figures i gave are gross not net, i have a lot to pay out of the gross. or get married asap which i do not want to do, as i do not want to rush that quick.

so my predicament is which way to go.

[rambot]

i have found this, but no further information on the subject, could i apply for her to get a settlement visa as an unmarried partner, it seems that this could be some of the criteria, i am struggling at the moment to see why i should have to get married to enable us to live together, or to have to wait 2 years and live together when it will not be possible is she cannot live with me here so that i can carry on working,

Financially i can satisfy the requirements of £18600, there are no children involved, obviously after 34 years in one marriage i dont want to rush into the next one but would like the time together to enhance the relationship up to the point of marriage, next year or the year after, we have both been married before and of course do not want to rush.

Is there something i am missing in the settlement visa because as far as i can see we do not qualify, also if we apply for visit visas then at some point this will be rejected as she will have spent too much time here in the UK. I can of course go out there for another month or so, i can go out there again for maybe 3 months over the next year, but i cannot see this helping with the settlement visa living together for 2 years ruling

[Tony M]

She can qualify for a settlement visa if :

you are married ( either in Thailand or in the UK), or

you have been living together for 2 years in a relationship akin to a marriage ( in your case that would mean in Thailand, as she has no right to live in the UK for 2 years as a visitor).

You can marry in Thailand, and she can then apply for a settlement visa. Or she can apply for a fiancee visa, which means she must marry in the UK within 6 months of arrival. She can then apply for further leave to remain, without having to leave the UK to obtain a settlement visa. Or she can apply for a marriage - visit visa, which means she can marry in the UK, but must leave before the end of her 6 month visit. She cannot apply to stay on for settlement.

[bobrussell]

To qualify as an unmarried partner you need to be living in a relationship similar to marriage for at least 2 years. This is unlikely to apply in your situation. Visits to each other are unlikely to ever qualify IMO.

Under no circumstances allow the visa situation to change marriage plans! It is the worst of all reasons to get married!

The Immigration rules are what they are. She cannot live here while you continue to work without getting a settlement visa. Almost by definition it is a visa for people in a stable relationship - marriage or similar. Once both parties are willing (and able) to make this commitment then it is the correct route.

A visit visa seems to be the only option at this stage and there are limitations to what is allowed with such a visa.

Fighting the system is a massive uphill task and one that is very unlikely to be won. It has taken years to produce such a frustrating system that is almost impossible to challenge without resorting to the courts. They have managed to close more and more rights to appeal.

As I said before, you sadly have to accept the limits of the system and work within it.

[rambot]

Thanks to everyone that responded, i really appreciate your help and comments, please dont think for one minute i was arguing with any of you. I appreciate and respect your comments greatly, i cant thank you enough for making things clear as i have read thousands of pages and it really is not clear, without you guys it really is hopeless. I thank everyone one of you for the input and will think carefully for the future where we go. I will just have to work a bit harder.

Is there any great pitfalls if we do get married to getting a spouse visa, next year sometime maybe