My Interview Fell Through!

[webbew]

I recently responded to an advertisement on the board which was asking for three people with middle American accents to fill positions as Voice Over artists in Bangkok. After researching the company and discovering that they were legit, I sent my video audition to them and was welcomed to Bangkok for an interview. I shared a few E-mails with their Production Manager and was told that applications would be accpeted for a couple of more weeks. After some dickering on potential remuneration packages, I was scheduled to interview with the company on Friday, October 6th. Once plans for the interview were finalized, I purchased my airline tickets and booked my hotel room in Bangkok. In addition, I cancelled a previously planned medical vacation to Costa Rica, which ended up costing me cancellation fees with the airline I was planning on flying with.

Needless to say I was pretty excited about the opportunity. It was a shot at working in the field which I went to school for in a place where I've always wanted to live... and get paid to do it. So you can imagine how disappointed I was to receive an E-mail from the companies Production Manager only hours after making plans to come to Bangkok which said that they had filled the position. After contacting the CEO of the company about the situation, I was made aware of the fact that the company had no plans to pay for work visas and was looking to hire residents of Thailand for the position. So... the ramifications of this unfortunate mess from my end are as follows: Having the rug pulled out from under me at a chance to fulfill a dream, getting left holding the bag on approximately US$ 1,500 in airline costs and the cancellation of a medical related vacation.

Long story even longer, I'm going to be taking a very expensive joy ride across the Pacific Ocean October 4-9 with absolutely no purpose for the trip unless I can schedule an interview with a new company. Galavanting across the Pacific Ocean for no reason at all would be great if US$ 1,500 was pocket change to me. However, it's not. If I'm going to spend that kind of money I need to know that it's going to count for something. So I'm wondering if any of you know of any companies which are looking for westerners to do work in voice over or related fields. I have a B of A degree in Speech Communications and Theatre Arts with a special area of study in vocal music. In addition, I have many years of experience in the entertainment and recording industry.

I would also like to know if I have any legal rights in this matter. I would guess not, but I figure it's worth the asking anyway.

[Gonzo the Face]

I recently responded to an advertisement on the board which was asking for three people with middle American accents to fill positions as Voice Over artists in Bangkok. After researching the company and discovering that they were legit, I sent my video audition to them and was welcomed to Bangkok for an interview. I shared a few E-mails with their Production Manager and was told that applications would be accpeted for a couple of more weeks. After some dickering on potential remuneration packages, I was scheduled to interview with the company on Friday, October 6th. Once plans for the interview were finalized, I purchased my airline tickets and booked my hotel room in Bangkok. In addition, I cancelled a previously planned medical vacation to Costa Rica, which ended up costing me cancellation fees with the airline I was planning on flying with.

Needless to say I was pretty excited about the opportunity. It was a shot at working in the field which I went to school for in a place where I've always wanted to live... and get paid to do it. So you can imagine how disappointed I was to receive an E-mail from the companies Production Manager only hours after making plans to come to Bangkok which said that they had filled the position. After contacting the CEO of the company about the situation, I was made aware of the fact that the company had no plans to pay for work visas and was looking to hire residents of Thailand for the position. So... the ramifications of this unfortunate mess from my end are as follows: Having the rug pulled out from under me at a chance to fulfill a dream, getting left holding the bag on approximately US$ 1,500 in airline costs and the cancellation of a medical related vacation.

Long story even longer, I'm going to be taking a very expensive joy ride across the Pacific Ocean October 4-9 with absolutely no purpose for the trip unless I can schedule an interview with a new company. Galavanting across the Pacific Ocean for no reason at all would be great if US$ 1,500 was pocket change to me. However, it's not. If I'm going to spend that kind of money I need to know that it's going to count for something. So I'm wondering if any of you know of any companies which are looking for westerners to do work in voice over or related fields. I have a B of A degree in Speech Communications and Theatre Arts with a special area of study in vocal music. In addition, I have many years of experience in the entertainment and recording industry.

I would also like to know if I have any legal rights in this matter. I would guess not, but I figure it's worth the asking anyway.

Unless there is more to the communication between you and the company, I would say you may have jumped the gun. You purchased new tickets and canceled your prior arrangements, and it did not seem that you had even a contingency agreement with the company....

I would say you would have no legal recourse.

You say you like this part of the world, so just consider it a good opportunity to visit Thailand.

Good Luck

[webbew]

Thanks, Gonzo. I definitely wouldn't have made plans to fly to Bangkok had I not been scheculed for an interview on October 6th and assured that applications would be taken for at least two more weeks. I didn't really think I had legal recourse. What they did is unethical but probably not illegal.

Edited September 26, 2006 by webbew

[johnnyk]

Unethical? Yes, not very nice.

But you did move ahead with nothing more concrete than verbal fluff.

Illegal? Not at all and even if it was, what would you do? Sue them in a Thai court? 555

OK, what to do?

You are committed to the trip. Make the most of it and make the rounds in BKK. Then go out and party like you can't party back home.

Remember, someone hands you a lemon then make lemonade.

[astral]

Just the luck of the draw and tough on you.

Nothing illegal as there was no contract.

[lopburi3]

If by medical vacation you are talking normal treatment you might check out Bangkok as it is a good center for reasonable medical costs.

[webbew]

If by medical vacation you are talking normal treatment you might check out Bangkok as it is a good center for reasonable medical costs.

Nothing too big, Lopburi. I was scheduled for a follow up appointment with my dentist following some much needed dental work in May.

[Ulysses]

Next time, have the company book your travel arrangements.

[MarkBKK]

I have many years of experience in the entertainment and recording industry.

If true I'm surprised by your actions ...

[dave111223]

Even if you cant cancel your airline tickets you might be able to reschedual the dates, and just make a week or 2 vacation of it.

"When life gives you lemons...make lemonade"

[Mobi]

What happened to you doesn't surprise me in the slightest; there is little or no integrity and ethics in thai businesses, and the "media" industry is notorious for screwing around with talent - especially farangs. The consolation you have is that if youy did make the trip, they would have probably continued to screw you around, and either reduce you payments, not pay at all, or make you wait a very long timeto get your cash. (It is common here not to pay out if the production is canned for any reason). Highly unlikely they would have ever got you a work permit, so all in all you are better off out of it.

The only surprise is that they would even consider hiring a voice - over person from so far away. Thailand and the neighbouring countries has a wealth of Americans who I am sure could fit the bill, and a local or regional hire would be a lot cheaper. I spent many years in the advertising/recording business in Thailand, and the furthest anyone aver went for a voice over was Hong Kong. On top of that, in these days of Hi tech - the voice overs can be done on the other side of the world and transmitted in seconds via special satellite links.

I'm sorry you have been messed around - it's a pity you didn't post your pontential employment before, so that some of us could give you the benefit of our sage advice.

Edited September 26, 2006 by Mobi D'Ark

[jcgodber]

A verbal contract isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on!

[richard10365]

If you have a BA degree in anything your qualified to teach English here in Thailand (more or less). I would still come over, teach English for a while and see if anything opens up in the future. Last I heard, Thailand is trying to increase the amount of movies being made here. Something is bound to open up sooner or later.

Take a chance and it may pay off.

I came here as soon as I retired from the army. I had never been here before. I love it here. I think you will too.

Thailand is a great country with great people.

[webbew]

A verbal contract isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on!

I still have all the e-mails. Does that count as a written contract? No? LOL!

I think I'm going to drop by Bangkok University when I'm in town and talk to them about grad school. Probably much more affordable in Thailand than in the US. Time to go back to school and get a degree which pulls a little weight. This B of A degree I've got might as well come in a roll and have "squeezably soft" written on the the packaging. The "don't call us, we'll call you" routine on any jobs which actually pay is getting a bit old. I've got a resume loaded with stuff done on spec or which pays very little.

From what some of you guys have been saying, it sounds like I'd be stuck in a dead end field anyway. I work as an artisan bread baker to pay the bills and the treatment which a couple of you have described is very similar to what is going on in the US with people in my line of work. Not good. If I would have gotten this job it might very well have been like going from the 'ol frying pan into the fire.

I think the teaching english option is very feasable. Thanks, Richard. It might be a good way to help support myself while I'm going through school.

[Ulysses]

teachers pay is the equivalent of part time in Home Depot.

[Maizefarmer]

I recently responded to an advertisement on the board which was asking for three people with middle American accents to fill positions as Voice Over artists in Bangkok. After researching the company and discovering that they were legit, I sent my video audition to them and was welcomed to Bangkok for an interview. I shared a few E-mails with their Production Manager and was told that applications would be accpeted for a couple of more weeks. After some dickering on potential remuneration packages, I was scheduled to interview with the company on Friday, October 6th. Once plans for the interview were finalized, I purchased my airline tickets and booked my hotel room in Bangkok. In addition, I cancelled a previously planned medical vacation to Costa Rica, which ended up costing me cancellation fees with the airline I was planning on flying with.

Needless to say I was pretty excited about the opportunity. It was a shot at working in the field which I went to school for in a place where I've always wanted to live... and get paid to do it. So you can imagine how disappointed I was to receive an E-mail from the companies Production Manager only hours after making plans to come to Bangkok which said that they had filled the position. After contacting the CEO of the company about the situation, I was made aware of the fact that the company had no plans to pay for work visas and was looking to hire residents of Thailand for the position. So... the ramifications of this unfortunate mess from my end are as follows: Having the rug pulled out from under me at a chance to fulfill a dream, getting left holding the bag on approximately US$ 1,500 in airline costs and the cancellation of a medical related vacation.

Long story even longer, I'm going to be taking a very expensive joy ride across the Pacific Ocean October 4-9 with absolutely no purpose for the trip unless I can schedule an interview with a new company. Galavanting across the Pacific Ocean for no reason at all would be great if US$ 1,500 was pocket change to me. However, it's not. If I'm going to spend that kind of money I need to know that it's going to count for something. So I'm wondering if any of you know of any companies which are looking for westerners to do work in voice over or related fields. I have a B of A degree in Speech Communications and Theatre Arts with a special area of study in vocal music. In addition, I have many years of experience in the entertainment and recording industry.

I would also like to know if I have any legal rights in this matter. I would guess not, but I figure it's worth the asking anyway.

Sorry to hear what has happened - but others have said a) I think you jumped the gun (all-be-it I can see how that happened), and secondly, also as others say, I would have thought you'd have little legal re-course to getting the matter addressed.

Buy the way - I am not complelty clear on the timeframe between been told you had an interview to be been told the interview had been cancelled?

Did you make it clear from the start that you would be coming from the USA for that interview and did you get the impression that that had been acknowldged. If that is the case then I think you were done a bad move by the company - and you may like to publish their details for all to see - and otherwise, nope - you were probebrbly just one other applicant amongst many (as they percieved it)

Tim

[richard10365]

teachers pay is the equivalent of part time in Home Depot.

Part time pay from Home Depot in the USA can be a lot of money here in Thailand. Unless you just work 1 hour a week. Just how much money are we talking about?

[girlx]

I work as an artisan bread baker to pay the bills and the treatment

you could always come to an island and set up a bakery! you never know what might happen

[samran]

Next time, have the company book your travel arrangements.

It generally seperates the men from the boys, good jobs vs bad.

[webbew]

you may like to publish their details for all to see

Wouldn't that be unethical on my part? I don't post private e-mails without permission from the sender.

[webbew]

Next time, have the company book your travel arrangements.

It generally seperates the men from the boys, good jobs vs bad.

A very expensive lesson now learned, my friend

[webbew]

I work as an artisan bread baker to pay the bills and the treatment

you could always come to an island and set up a bakery! you never know what might happen

That would be cool, but right now I'm just scraping by on paying the bills. Saving money to start a business in Thailand is virtually impossible at this point. I have to work a full time and a part time job just so I can save up to take a nice vacation every year. Which in the long run leaves me much better off than the truely poverty stricken, but certainly not where I envisioned being upon college graduation 18 years ago.

[Maizefarmer]

you may like to publish their details for all to see

Wouldn't that be unethical on my part? I don't post private e-mails without permission from the sender.

Fair comment - but let me throw the ball back into your court, and also remind you that I made the suggestion against a background of a set of questions, which were intended to establish wether it came down to back communication on either side, or wether you felt you had been shafted through no fault of your own.

So, let me ask the question - do you feel you were shafted and that as a result of that you have lost a fair whack of money?

If the answer to that is yes, then it would do no harm to mark everyones card in case someone else gets lead up the garden path by the same people.

If however, on reflection you can see how it happened i.e. they had no idea that you were coming from overseas specificaly for that interview, that you were making a big committement ect ect.. then however bad you feel about htis (and I would feel the same), it coul dbe argued that as they had no insight into what your particular cirucmstances were and how it would/could affect you, they responded to you in much the same way as they would respond to any applicant - in that been the case, then no - I dont beleive there was any bad move on their part and there is no reason to mark anyones card.

Have you told them what has happened and how did they respond?

Thats my take on it from both sides of the fence.

Tim

[johnnyk]

teachers pay is the equivalent of part time in Home Depot.

Part time pay from Home Depot in the USA can be a lot of money here in Thailand. Unless you just work 1 hour a week. Just how much money are we talking about?

I think he means about $7-8/hour.

If you teach 20 hours a week that's tops $160 = 6000 baht/week = 24K baht/month.

Teach more than 20 hours a week and you will be a zombie very quickly.

Teaching in Thailand pays anywhere from 20K baht a month to 130K in top international schools.

Most likely in the 30-40K range which is pathetic to live on in BKK but not bad upcountry.

[steveromagnino]

I work as an artisan bread baker to pay the bills and the treatment

you could always come to an island and set up a bakery! you never know what might happen

If you do that (and I do think there is money to be made) can I be there when people ask you what you do for a crust?

OP - don't sweat it. They were discussing details with you, it was AFAIK an invitation to treat, not an offer, so there isn't any legal recourse.

PM me with your work experience, and I might be able to offer some guidance and options. Lots of headhunters etc in town; worth getting in with them.

Teaching english is ok if you are a teacher and if you enjoy it. I did it as a volunteer for a while and even without pay and without much responsiblity it was the most frigging stressful job I've had (and I've had to lay off 100 very angry tradesmen with threats of physical violence; teaching kids pushes my buttons a fair bit more than that!). If you DO pursue that, then make sure you have the qualifications and desire to do it and do it legally in the current environment. However if you aren't a teacher, then look for something else.

Countless opportunities here if you are prepared to look; and most are not able or willing to look that hard.

[Scott]

If you are interested in teaching, PM me. We always need someone to entertain the children!

[webbew]

I work as an artisan bread baker to pay the bills and the treatment

you could always come to an island and set up a bakery! you never know what might happen

If you do that (and I do think there is money to be made) can I be there when people ask you what you do for a crust?

OP - don't sweat it. They were discussing details with you, it was AFAIK an invitation to treat, not an offer, so there isn't any legal recourse.

PM me with your work experience, and I might be able to offer some guidance and options. Lots of headhunters etc in town; worth getting in with them.

Teaching english is ok if you are a teacher and if you enjoy it. I did it as a volunteer for a while and even without pay and without much responsiblity it was the most frigging stressful job I've had (and I've had to lay off 100 very angry tradesmen with threats of physical violence; teaching kids pushes my buttons a fair bit more than that!). If you DO pursue that, then make sure you have the qualifications and desire to do it and do it legally in the current environment. However if you aren't a teacher, then look for something else.

Countless opportunities here if you are prepared to look; and most are not able or willing to look that hard.

That's definitely more uplifting news than I've received in quite some time. Thanks! I'll definitely PM both of my resumes to you; one for my "pay the bills" work and one for my "for the love of it" work.

I'd rather not do the teaching thing but I will for awhile if need be. I was actually going to be a teacher, and then I did my student teaching. It took me about one semester to realize that there was no way I could do it for one year let alone until I was 65.

It's good to hear that there are indeed work opportunities for falang out there though. I've actually been looking for employment in SE Asia for some time now. The problem I'm running into (especially when it comes to bread bakers) is that most companies would rather hire a local and try to train them than pay for work visas. The higher salaries western workers tend to demand hurts as well. Companies don't even bother responding to foreign applicants.

It seems as though in SE Asia it's now all about the immediate bottom line just like it has become here in the good 'ol US of A. There's no long term vision in corporations anymore. Especially among the service industry. There's no desire to stand apart as a provider of impeccable service. Companies don't care if the final product is mediocre so long as they can hire an inexperienced and untrained laborer to do the work for dirt cheap. Here in the US it tends to be illegal immigrants who come for a year or two, work like dogs and then go back to their country and trade their newly acquired US dollars in for their own currency. Voila! Instant wealth!! Can't say I blame them. We go to their contries and do the same thing.

OK... off my soap box. I need to log off for now, but I'll PM you with my resumes by the afternoon (Bangkok time), Steve. Thanks again!

[webbew]

you may like to publish their details for all to see

Wouldn't that be unethical on my part? I don't post private e-mails without permission from the sender.

let me throw the ball back into your court, and also remind you that I made the suggestion against a background of a set of questions, which were intended to establish wether it came down to back communication on either side, or wether you felt you had been shafted through no fault of your own.

It's hard to know, Tim. Let me give you the time line of events:

1) At approximately midnight (Denver time), I came home from work and opened an e-mail from the companies production manager which stated that remuneration could not be discussed further outside of the interview. I immediately e-mailed back and said that while I was disappointed the company could not give me some idea of potential remuneration as flights to Bangkok are very expensive, I would take a life chance and come to Bangkok to meet with them anyway. I told her to set me up for an interview on Friday, October 6th.

2) Shortly there after I received a return e-mail from their production manager whch stated that I was scheduled to meet with them at 2:00 pm on October 6th. I was also requested to send a copy of my resume to accompany my video audtion, which they already had on file.

3) I sent a return e-mail to confirm the appointment and told the production manager that I would be sending my resume through as soon as possible as it was only on paper. My original plan was to fax it, but I winded up downloading it on to my computer so I eventually ended up e-mailing it.

4) At about 2:00 am (Denver time) the company's production manager received my resume and sent back acknowledgement of recipt.

3) Once the appointment was set and all requested documents furnished to the company, I proceeded to cancel my previously planned trip to Costa Rica and book my flights and set my hotel reservations for the trip to Bangkok.

4) At approximately 6:00 am, right before I went to bed, I received the e-mail from the production manager stating that the position had been filled.

5) I immediately e-mailed back and informed her that I had already finalized plans to come to Bangkok. I stated that I was very disappointed to now know that my trip was going to amount to nothing more than a very expensive joy ride back and forth across the Pacific ocean.

6) A couple of days later I e-mailed the CEO of the company and informed him of the situation. In his reply, he said that the information was very disconserting and that discuplinary action was being taken. I returned his e-mail and asked as a personal favor that no one lose their employment with the company as a result of the discuplinary action he had elected to take.

7) I have heard nothing from anyone in the company since.

So... there you have the time line. As you can see, probably nothing illegal on their part, but certainly unethical.

[webbew]

OK... now I'm late for work!