US Navy sails near reefs claimed by China

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

It is never a good idea to be heavily indebted to another nation and then pick a fight with them. At present the Chinese can bring the US financially to its knees without firing a shot. So one ship in the vast SCS is what the US can afford to spend on the their Asian pivot and any person with any savvy will know it's just show boating as the US can't afford financially or politically (2016 election and Iraq lies) to get involved in another ill perceived war. I don't trust the Chinese but neither do I trust the US government (not Americans just their government). Well to be honest I don't trust any politician with my future or the future of our world.

[sgtsabai]

Explain how China can economically bring the US to it's knees. If it calls the loans, and the US says screw you do you really think the rest of the world would care? Do you think the US government would care at that point? China will not fight an all out war with the US, it cannot win, but it could easily start WWIII as Russia would more than likely jump in. The nukes would fly. Do not think the mild mannered response, which should have been done years ago, is all the US can afford. The US has a fleet in the AO and more coming. The problem being lack of willpower. Militarily the US even with it's present Naval weakness does not have to invade China, a fools errand. Although the US has shown itself to be nothing more than a fool since Korea. At present the US and Japan would blow China out of the sky and sink their navy, and the US would suffer losses, perhaps major. 20 years from now, not so sure. The US has wasted defense money on boondogal after boondogal, witness the F-35, can't fly, can't fight, can't bomb,a F-16 beat it in a dogfight.

[slipperylobster]

Explain how China can economically bring the US to it's knees. If it calls the loans, and the US says screw you do you really think the rest of the world would care? Do you think the US government would care at that point? China will not fight an all out war with the US, it cannot win, but it could easily start WWIII as Russia would more than likely jump in. The nukes would fly. Do not think the mild mannered response, which should have been done years ago, is all the US can afford. The US has a fleet in the AO and more coming. The problem being lack of willpower. Militarily the US even with it's present Naval weakness does not have to invade China, a fools errand. Although the US has shown itself to be nothing more than a fool since Korea. At present the US and Japan would blow China out of the sky and sink their navy, and the US would suffer losses, perhaps major. 20 years from now, not so sure. The US has wasted defense money on boondogal after boondogal, witness the F-35, can't fly, can't fight, can't bomb,a F-16 beat it in a dogfight.

...as bad as we are, there is nothing else that even comes close

[sgtsabai]

Oh but there is. Both the Russians and the Chinese have new generation fighters that can out fly, out fight the piece of junk F-35.

[squarethecircle]

None of the smaller nations with superseding claims in the China Seas have the ability to fight the Chinese Navy. But, make no doubt, the Japanese will give it a hell of a try. The Japanese have been practicing the taking/retaking of islands with the US Marines for a couple of years. Just finished a joint exercise in Australia recently. That does sound a bit strange considering WWII. The Chinese won a sea battle with VN but paid the price when they entered the country. The US is now helping VN with building up of their Navy, as they are in the Philippines. I say put a couple of those may or may not work out LCS ships backed by destroyers and maybe a guided missile cruiser right next to the shore and at the same time but a few F-18's overhead along with the P8. Good time for a F-18 fly by. Think what you want, I see a couple of posters here that think they know me, they don't, there will be shooting in the China Seas and the US better be damn well prepared. The Chinese will continue to push, while lying about there peaceful purpose and wish for peace. While our government was expending our money, our economy, our military, our good will, and not only our lives but the lives of 100's of thousands of Iraq people and others only to increase radical Islam, China has been laughing it's head off at our government's inability to get anything done, much less win a war or "hearts and minds". They are and have been the enemy and the US better damn well recognize it, to the fullest. They will only respect strength and diplomacy. Strength first and they, unlike the American people recognize our weaknesses.

Well I recognize their weaknesses.

#1 internal corruption, the powers-that-be will do anything they can to stay that way.

#2

Actually was starting with #2 but #1 says it all. For 3500, rather 3300 years, China has been its own greatest enemy, at home. Guess it can spread out into the west parts and north. In Mongolia they say, "Welcome China into your home, but keep a knife upstairs."

[hawker9000]

Way overdue. China badly needs to be reined in. And as usual, the America-hating zombies really have no other nominees able or willing to do the job.

[sgtsabai]

Just more info.

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2015/10/22/Yet-Another-Costly-F-35-Glitch-Won-t-Be-Fixed-Any-Time-Soon

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_UNITED_STATES_CHINA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-10-27-05-50-57&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2ASituation%20Report

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/10/26/u-s-dispatches-warship-to-challenge-chinas-fake-islands/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2ASituation%20Report

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/10/27/us-southchinasea-usa-idUSKCN0SK2AC20151027

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/27/us-warship-lassen-defies-beijing-sail-disputed-south-china-sea-islands?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2AMorning%20Brief

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-34647651?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%

[Synoptic 12]

Oh but there is. Both the Russians and the Chinese have new generation fighters that can out fly, out fight the piece of junk F-35.

China has only one aircraft carrier, the U.S. has many including the U.S.S. Ronald Reagan.

[Synoptic 12]

Does China have air superiority?

[sgtsabai]

And their best can't fly off of it, plus it will be some years before they can build even one carrier to match anything we have. Taking that into consideration they have the long range carrier killing missiles and our aircraft no longer have the range to fly 1,000 miles, fight and return. Disregarding of the picture of the German tri wing, I thought funny and frankly rather appropriate, the Chinese and Russians have the capability to negate the "stealth" and their latest generation fighters can and will out fight the junk F-35. Remember Vietnam when the fools in the Pentagon thought the F-4 would be a stand off fighter and not have to dogfight. Ahem, that plan didn't work so well as the US had to go back to school, put a cannon in the F-4 to prevent it from continuing to being blown out of the sky by the Russian MIGs'. Read Information Dissemination for up to date info about ours and their capabilities, or lack

[sgtsabai]

No, not yet. That is why they must be stopped now. They just might within 25 yrs. The F-35 is not the plane to establish air superiority and our aircraft are aging, rapidly. The F-22 would be if production had not stopped.

[Synoptic 12]

Well, well, well what do we have here? > The U.S.S. Pennsylvania; one of the many.

Edited October 27, 2015 by Synoptic 12

[sgtsabai]

Missing the pic of the battleship, or do they now name smaller ships after states? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pennsylvania_(BB-38)Look we are basically arguing the same point, mine is the US will be ill prepared if the government does not truly prepare for war, yesterday. Oh, the USS Pennsylvania I'm guessing you are refering to is running out of its use by date and in fact the entire Ohio class is to be replaced, later and if the money is available. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pennsylvania_(SSBN-735) http://navylive.dodlive.mil/2012/09/24/next-generation-ohio-class/

[NeverSure]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget that the US has treaties to defend most SE Asian countries, and of course Japan. Keeping the shipping lanes open and the SCS as international waters is vital to many of these countries.

The US will keep its promises. If not for the US, China the alligator would be gobbling up much in the area. You said about US actions, "unless assistance sought from troubled countries". You must not follow the news.

I suppose you have another nominee such as your own country to stop China from clogging up the works and being the SE Asia bully?

[eggers]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget that the US has treaties to defend most SE Asian countries, and of course Japan. Keeping the shipping lanes open and the SCS as international waters is vital to many of these countries.

The US will keep its promises. If not for the US, China the alligator would be gobbling up much in the area. You said about US actions, "unless assistance sought from troubled countries". You must not follow the news.

I suppose you have another nominee such as your own country to stop China from clogging up the works and being the SE Asia bully?

I think there is a difference between defending & interfering.

As said, none of the claimant countries have sought assistance in this matter from the almighty US; it is simply flexing it's muscles, as it does elsewhere in it's self appointed role as international sheriff!

As for keeping it's promises, it's record in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Africa, etc, not exactly exemplary & now Russia is showing up US muscle in Syria.

To say " you must not follow the news".......Where do you suggest to get a basis of information from? Perhaps US embassy, State Dept releases, where?? Ludicrous.

As for another nominee, if UN was doing it's job properly that is where the matter should be resolved or through the World Court in the Hague; world doesn't need another sheriff!

[slipperylobster]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget our obligations with the Philippines..

Several times we have been asked for assistance...

You believe the Philippines has more than 2 ships with gas in them?

No haven't forgotten, but bear in mind, the islands are claimed by not only Phillipines, but also Brunei, Malaysia, Taiwan & Vietnam.To my understanding, none of those countries have sought US intervention, so why is US there??? What does Phillipines Naval power have to do with issue? The other claimants have naval power but not sought to confront Chinese militarily, using diplomatic channels; something, in which, US lack credible skills.

Talking really works. we could have talked our way out of many wars... right? Sometimes you got to show the stick.

I do admire your idealistic view that sitting around a dinner table with tea and crumpets...would help solve world problems. However..history proves otherwise.

Edited October 27, 2015 by slipperylobster

[simon43]

In case one thinks that these are 'real' islands, (prior to the Chinese dredging), they are either under water at high tide, or are extremely small bits of rock.

Very popular with visiting radio amateurs - this gives you an idea of the size of the bit of rock:

[slipperylobster]

Way overdue. China badly needs to be reined in. And as usual, the America-hating zombies really have no other nominees able or willing to do the job.

As it becomes clear...my allegorical reference to "penis envy" is the root of the baseless jealousy. What happened to powerful allies....who once could hang it out in public...but now lurk miserably in dark corners and throw insults.

[eggers]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget our obligations with the Philippines..

Several times we have been asked for assistance...

You believe the Philippines has more than 2 ships with gas in them?

No haven't forgotten, but bear in mind, the islands are claimed by not only Phillipines, but also Brunei, Malaysia, Taiwan & Vietnam.To my understanding, none of those countries have sought US intervention, so why is US there??? What does Phillipines Naval power have to do with issue? The other claimants have naval power but not sought to confront Chinese militarily, using diplomatic channels; something, in which, US lack credible skills.

Talking really works. we could have talked our way out of many wars... right? Sometimes you got to show the stick.

I do admire your idealistic view that sitting around a dinner table with tea and crumpets...would help solve world problems. However..history proves otherwise.

What nonsense... UN nor World Court aren't a "tea & crumpet" brigade as you suggest. However, both need to lift their game & exert influence on member countries.

You ought read "History of WW1" & later volume on WWII, perhaps you might come to a more informed view.

The whole issue of the Sprately Islands is to do with untapped resources, much the same as conflicts elsewhere in world & throughout history.

You have a US centric view of the world & only believe what is fed to you as occurs with many Americans.

That's why the world is in turmoil; thanks to violent resolutions.

Bye

[slipperylobster]

Actually...the present size allows for a landing strip...not quite the small rock in the photo.

It is one of the few fishing grounds left....and very important for the Philippines, as a food source. The Philippines was not interested in a military buildup...it was China that initiated all this.

Edited October 28, 2015 by slipperylobster

[slipperylobster]

LOL UN???

omgggggggggggggggggggggggggg

[craigt3365]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget that the US has treaties to defend most SE Asian countries, and of course Japan. Keeping the shipping lanes open and the SCS as international waters is vital to many of these countries.

The US will keep its promises. If not for the US, China the alligator would be gobbling up much in the area. You said about US actions, "unless assistance sought from troubled countries". You must not follow the news.

I suppose you have another nominee such as your own country to stop China from clogging up the works and being the SE Asia bully?

I think there is a difference between defending & interfering.

As said, none of the claimant countries have sought assistance in this matter from the almighty US; it is simply flexing it's muscles, as it does elsewhere in it's self appointed role as international sheriff!

As for keeping it's promises, it's record in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Africa, etc, not exactly exemplary & now Russia is showing up US muscle in Syria.

To say " you must not follow the news".......Where do you suggest to get a basis of information from? Perhaps US embassy, State Dept releases, where?? Ludicrous.

As for another nominee, if UN was doing it's job properly that is where the matter should be resolved or through the World Court in the Hague; world doesn't need another sheriff!

Do some research on this. Almost every country involved, other than China, are supporting U S help.

[Publicus]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget that the US has treaties to defend most SE Asian countries, and of course Japan. Keeping the shipping lanes open and the SCS as international waters is vital to many of these countries.

The US will keep its promises. If not for the US, China the alligator would be gobbling up much in the area. You said about US actions, "unless assistance sought from troubled countries". You must not follow the news.

I suppose you have another nominee such as your own country to stop China from clogging up the works and being the SE Asia bully?

I think there is a difference between defending & interfering.

As said, none of the claimant countries have sought assistance in this matter from the almighty US; it is simply flexing it's muscles, as it does elsewhere in it's self appointed role as international sheriff!

As for keeping it's promises, it's record in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Africa, etc, not exactly exemplary & now Russia is showing up US muscle in Syria.

To say " you must not follow the news".......Where do you suggest to get a basis of information from? Perhaps US embassy, State Dept releases, where?? Ludicrous.

As for another nominee, if UN was doing it's job properly that is where the matter should be resolved or through the World Court in the Hague; world doesn't need another sheriff!

none of the claimant countries have sought assistance in this matter from the almighty US

That will need to be documented in specific terms.

Asean has not taken a vote on US and allied activities in the SCS or in the region, to include Australia, NZ, Philippines, Japan among others. They have in the meantime engaged in naval and military exercises with the United States armed forces. Asean has made no statements of opposition to US and its allies involvement in the SCS, to include Japan and also India.

Asean has many times since 2002 voted for the CCP Dictators in Beijing to accept a Code of Conduct concerning the SCS. The CCP Boyz have rejected every Asean attempt since then, in 2012 esepcially and most recently, to negotiate the SCS areas, resources, territorial claims etc etc.

Asean wants to negotiate with the CCP Gang in Beijing as Asean, however, the CCP Boyz want to negotiate with Asean member states country by country.

Reality is Asean does not want to be dominated by either the CCP Dictators in Beijing or the Americans in Washington. Asean has no objection to US military involvement with allies in the SCS while Asean has repeatedly expressed objections to the CCP Dictators and their actions and attitudes in the SCS.

Produce an Asean statement complaining against the United States involvement in the SCS disputes and produce an Asean statement saying they are accepting of the CCP Boyz approach to run over, push over and to boss over the Asean countries one at a time, country by country.

Asean chief says ‘can’t accept’ China’s South China Sea claimsAPRIL 26, 2015

⋅

Association of Southeast Asian Nations Secretary-General Le Luong Minh on Nov. 11, 2014. Mr. Minh said Asean would speed up talks to establish a code of conduct on how to resolve overlapping territorial claims in the region.

Mr. Minh said the group is still drafting an official statement for the summit, but it will include an “expression of concern” about issues affecting peace and stability in the region and will call, as it has in the past, for a swift conclusion to talks on a legally binding code of conduct in the South China Sea, originally made a goal in 2002.

Asked about U.S.’s attempts to boost connections with Asia in recent years, he said the U.S. “has been playing a constructive role in the region,” and that he hoped the relationship “can be enhanced, contributing to the maintenance of peace and stability.”

(Emphasis added.)

http://chinadailymail.com/2015/04/26/asean-chief-says-cant-accept-chinas-south-china-sea-claims/

[sgtsabai]

A few more sources of information. Let me recommend some excellent sources of information for those unaware of them:

Andrew S. Erickson, The Diplomat, Robert Kelly---Asian Security Blog and Information Dissemination. There are also links inside all that lead to more information about ours and theirs military and diplomatic capabilities.

http://amti.csis.org/maritime-disputes/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2ASituation%20Report

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/10/27/china-lambasts-illegal-u-s-operation-in-south-china-sea-subi-mischief-lassen/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2AEditors%20Picks

http://www.navytimes.com/story/military/2015/10/27/china-navy-shaddows-lassen-spratly-islands-patrol/74680390/

http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/AndrewErickson/~3/qXq8Zz9H-Uc/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/AndrewErickson/~3/aAHAh0VV-88/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/AndrewErickson/~3/tlGllV9t59U/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email

[Publicus]

I am sure you believe all the things that you say, Publicus.

We can agree on that.

No one should think any less of any TVF poster.

One takes your posts at their gross face value.

The net aspect of 'em doesn't get much different either.

Try now to focus on the posts rather than on the poster. It's the thing people who can argue do best.

[hawker9000]

Once again, US sticking it's nose into other countries business!!

Why do they need to have a Navy ship in vicinity of these disputed Spratly islands? Seems just wanting to taunt the Chinese & stir up more trouble, than necessary. UnStately Dept claimed to be "exercising freedom of navigation operations; OK if China sends navy ship to US East coast under same code??

Utter stupidity....Serves no purpose!

As said, time & time again, US should fix up own problems unless assistance sought from troubled countries.

However, doubt much will change if either, Donald "Bull in China Shop" Trump or Hillary"Trust me.. I'm with First man, Bill" Clinton are elected next year!!

You seem to forget that the US has treaties to defend most SE Asian countries, and of course Japan. Keeping the shipping lanes open and the SCS as international waters is vital to many of these countries.

The US will keep its promises. If not for the US, China the alligator would be gobbling up much in the area. You said about US actions, "unless assistance sought from troubled countries". You must not follow the news.

I suppose you have another nominee such as your own country to stop China from clogging up the works and being the SE Asia bully?

I think there is a difference between defending & interfering.

As said, none of the claimant countries have sought assistance in this matter from the almighty US; it is simply flexing it's muscles, as it does elsewhere in it's self appointed role as international sheriff!

As for keeping it's promises, it's record in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Africa, etc, not exactly exemplary & now Russia is showing up US muscle in Syria.

To say " you must not follow the news".......Where do you suggest to get a basis of information from? Perhaps US embassy, State Dept releases, where?? Ludicrous.

As for another nominee, if UN was doing it's job properly that is where the matter should be resolved or through the World Court in the Hague; world doesn't need another sheriff!

The UN you say! ROFLMAO

[NeverSure]

It is never a good idea to be heavily indebted to another nation and then pick a fight with them. At present the Chinese can bring the US financially to its knees without firing a shot. So one ship in the vast SCS is what the US can afford to spend on the their Asian pivot and any person with any savvy will know it's just show boating as the US can't afford financially or politically (2016 election and Iraq lies) to get involved in another ill perceived war. I don't trust the Chinese but neither do I trust the US government (not Americans just their government). Well to be honest I don't trust any politician with my future or the future of our world.

You are a laugh a minute. The Chinese have indeed been selling those bonds. They are selling them because they are desperate for money, not as an action against the US.

There are always a lot more bidders for US treasuries than there are treasuries and that's why people are paying a premium above the prime interest rate to get them. All of the treasuries that China has sold have been absorbed nicely by the marketplace where there is high demand.

But then, I don't suppose that the people who make the decision to pay a premium for US bonds in numbers of hundreds of billions of US dollars are as smart as you are. Surely you manage a portfolio much larger than that considering your in depth knowledge of the world economy.

Cheers.

[Publicus]

Next the Chinese navy might send ships to Samoa or Hawaii or Malvinas or UK - other possibly disputed islands.

Remarkable prescience and powers of prognostication

Since 2013 the PLA Navy has been sending warships inside the territorial EEZ of the US possession Guam in the north central Pacific. Indeed, in the PLANavy's more daring moods it has ventured out to Hawaii to enter the state's territorial EEZ. So that is the PLANavy's penetration since 2013 into two EEZ territorial waters of the United States. The PLAN warships do of course penetrate into the EEZs unannounced and by the legit claim under the international law provision of "innocent passage," meaning no belligerent intent or evidence of intent, despite the fact of Naval warships.

Sept 4th the PLANavy (that's what they call it) did for the first time send its warships inside the 12nm coastal waters limit of the Aleutian Islands of Alaska. The United States did however take offense at that maneuver at the time because President Obama was engaged in a visit to Alaska. Again, as in the instances of Guam and Hawaii, the PLAN entry into USA territorial and then USA coastal waters was done without request, notice, permission, none of which is necessarily required (under 'innocent passage')

The CCP Boyz are however hollering and jumping up and down today that the USS Lossen Destroyer traveled 114 km inside the 12 nm claimed jurisdiction without any request to the PLAN, or without notice or without permission or absent any authority granted by the CCP Boyz. The double standard of the CCP Boyz is of little or no concern to them, or so it could seem and pretty conclusively so.

That's not all either as the Boyz aren't quite funished mucking things up to the max. A couple of weeks ago a PLA-AirForce (hey, that's what they call it) Xian JH-7 clunker fighter-bomber nearly collided with a USAF RC-135 over international waters of the Yellow Sea, coming recklessly within 500 feel of the nose of the US craft. These CCP PLA-AF pilots aren't too good as is well known given they get little practice time in the air, especially in contrast to most US and other pilots in Japan and S Korea.

Thus far the CCP Boyz have been silent concerning their previous threats of a year ago to establish an Air Defense Identification Zone over the newly constructed islands on submerged reefs. The US has warned against doing it and Asean has expressed its great concern, as an ADIZ typically requires all aircraft to ID itself and purpose to include civilian commercial craft.

The Boyz haven't fared at all too well since their 2013 surprise announcement of an ADIZ over islands in the East Sea held by Japan, so maybe they'll lay off the idea in respect of the SCS. The existing East Sea ADIZ was immediately flown through by unarmed nuclear capable US B-52 as a direct act of defiance and the negation of the CCP's ADIZ. The CCP zone has since become aerial Swiss cheese as it is flown through unannounced and regularly by fighter jets from USA, Japan, South Korea, sometimes together, sometimes separately, to the silence and inaction of the fearless and pathetic bullies of Beijing.

Edited October 28, 2015 by Publicus

[slipperylobster]

With pretty much a non existant navy....I don't expect China to do much more than flap gums and squirt water.

Edited October 30, 2015 by slipperylobster

[simon43]

Actually...the present size allows for a landing strip...not quite the small rock in the photo.

Yes, that's my point!

Many of these islands are/were either totally submerged at high tide or very small rock islets.

Dredging an underwater reef to create a larger piece of land with airstrip does not change its status to permanent island - it is an artificial island and no 12 mile limit can be claimed, according to international law.

BTW, @Publicus, what's with this 'Boyz' terminology? Are they some sort of hip-hop group?

Edited October 30, 2015 by simon43