Chiang Mai Hospitals

[Ajarn]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

Edited October 10, 2006 by Ajarn

[Gonzo the Face]

Richard, sorry for your misfortune, and wish you a speedy and complete recovery....

Got a mysterious call today from a pretty secretive Thai Private Eye, name Sherlockaporn, Thakholmessin, and he wanted to know if you think this may have been the suspect 4 Door Pick up as the owner was sighted in the area at the time.. Guy by the name of Majo Man.... Late at night he was seen wearing a cape [nothing else, just a cape, and one glove]and clinging to the window sill of a 5th floor window in the Rydges Hotel..... could this have been the vehicle that did you dirty....

Understand that the word is out that he is desperately trying to flog it off.... cheap

Sorry MM , just couldn't resist......

I might sell it yet!! It's sitting at home all cleaned nicely. Actually I was driving my other vehicle that night

Yeah, yeah. That's what they all say. And oddly enough I have heard that one before, albeit some years ago. Any witness MM?

Yeah we know your other vehicle is a Rolls

[Gonzo the Face]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

One of the very few times I have to disagree with you Ajarn..... It would appear to me that the truck driver was attempt to pass another vehicle [albeit a small vehicle] in the process of a left turn in an intersection..... I think that this would have put him at equal fault. ..... and I agree that it is done every day practically at every intersection.... on a single turning lane you should have one lane of traffic not two..... but that is my opinion..... and it is a western opinion not local.....which not doubt may differ.... when in Rome ......

and panic is very probable in a case like this, but still no justification for leaving the scene of an accident. This is an area where an excuse like this in just not acceptable , only for personal gain at the expense of another's , possible life....

OMHO

Gonzo

[Ajarn]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

One of the very few times I have to disagree with you Ajarn..... It would appear to me that the truck driver was attempt to pass another vehicle [albeit a small vehicle] in the process of a left turn in an intersection..... I think that this would have put him at equal fault. ..... and I agree that it is done every day practically at every intersection.... on a single turning lane you should have one lane of traffic not two..... but that is my opinion..... and it is a western opinion not local.....which not doubt may differ.... when in Rome ......

and panic is very probable in a case like this, but still no justification for leaving the scene of an accident. This is an area where an excuse like this in just not acceptable , only for personal gain at the expense of another's , possible life....

OMHO

Gonzo

I don't know what you mean by saying the truck was 'trying to pass'. It seems to me that the truck was tying to turn left from the second lane. Because the left lane is a 'turn only' lane, the lane next to it is then a 'left turn or straight ahead' option, which is what I see at most other such intersections in Thailand...

[Blinky Bill]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

One of the very few times I have to disagree with you Ajarn..... It would appear to me that the truck driver was attempt to pass another vehicle [albeit a small vehicle] in the process of a left turn in an intersection..... I think that this would have put him at equal fault. ..... and I agree that it is done every day practically at every intersection.... on a single turning lane you should have one lane of traffic not two..... but that is my opinion..... and it is a western opinion not local.....which not doubt may differ.... when in Rome ......

and panic is very probable in a case like this, but still no justification for leaving the scene of an accident. This is an area where an excuse like this in just not acceptable , only for personal gain at the expense of another's , possible life....

OMHO

Gonzo

I don't know what you mean by saying the truck was 'trying to pass'. It seems to me that the truck was tying to turn left from the second lane. Because the left lane is a 'turn only' lane, the lane next to it is then a 'left turn or straight ahead' option, which is what I see at most other such intersections in Thailand...

Unless I am mistaken this incident was at the intersection of Ratchwithi and Moonmuang Road. The only options at this intersection is that traffic on Ratchawithi must turn left onto Moonmuang Road and traffic on Moonmuang Road can either turn left into Ratchawithi Road or make a turn right to make a U-turn onto Chaiyaphum Road (Mikes Hamburgers). Any other turn here would be illegal.

[Gonzo the Face]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

One of the very few times I have to disagree with you Ajarn..... It would appear to me that the truck driver was attempt to pass another vehicle [albeit a small vehicle] in the process of a left turn in an intersection..... I think that this would have put him at equal fault. ..... and I agree that it is done every day practically at every intersection.... on a single turning lane you should have one lane of traffic not two..... but that is my opinion..... and it is a western opinion not local.....which not doubt may differ.... when in Rome ......

and panic is very probable in a case like this, but still no justification for leaving the scene of an accident. This is an area where an excuse like this in just not acceptable , only for personal gain at the expense of another's , possible life....

OMHO

Gonzo

I don't know what you mean by saying the truck was 'trying to pass'. It seems to me that the truck was tying to turn left from the second lane. Because the left lane is a 'turn only' lane, the lane next to it is then a 'left turn or straight ahead' option, which is what I see at most other such intersections in Thailand...

From my memory, which has been known to be wrong .... once long time ago, , Moon Muang is one way , Northbound on the inside of the moat. The intersecting street [Rajwithee Rd.] is one lane Eastbound and one lane Westbound, inside the moat. For Eastbound traffic there is no straight thru option [legal] as I seem to remember barricades directing all eastbound traffic [which is one lane] to turn left onto Moon Muang then to the next crossover near Somphet Mkt. to do a 'U' Turn.

Yes, I do agree that any time you are Northbound on Moon Muang, you will see motorcycles either shooting across to go over the moat, or waiting to do so. This is what I believe Richard was attempting to do.

Thus my comment that the truck driver was attempting to pass on/in an intersection, I was attempting to say that as there is one lane eastbound, the truck should have been following Richard and not been beside him. I think there is enough room [widthwise for a truck and amotorcycle, but not for two car width vehicles. The truck driver should have been following Richard thru the intersection, then passed if it was necessary, not passing in the intersection itself. If Richard would have been using the entire lane from the middle, the truck would not have had enough space in that lane to come along side and try to pass.

To me it seems that we have a situation of two wrongs making a wreck.

Gonzo

[Ajarn]

Yes, I think it is fair to suggest that Richard caused the problem, since he was the only person making an illegal turn. If he had been turning normally, the accident would not have happened. Period. He was the one driving crazily, and no defensive driving on the truck drivers part is going to change that..

You are 'blaming' the driver based on law. You should not blame him for trying to leave, since no problems were caused by his leaving, No problem at all... he left from panic, which I can understand.

One of the very few times I have to disagree with you Ajarn..... It would appear to me that the truck driver was attempt to pass another vehicle [albeit a small vehicle] in the process of a left turn in an intersection..... I think that this would have put him at equal fault. ..... and I agree that it is done every day practically at every intersection.... on a single turning lane you should have one lane of traffic not two..... but that is my opinion..... and it is a western opinion not local.....which not doubt may differ.... when in Rome ......

and panic is very probable in a case like this, but still no justification for leaving the scene of an accident. This is an area where an excuse like this in just not acceptable , only for personal gain at the expense of another's , possible life....

OMHO

Gonzo

I don't know what you mean by saying the truck was 'trying to pass'. It seems to me that the truck was tying to turn left from the second lane. Because the left lane is a 'turn only' lane, the lane next to it is then a 'left turn or straight ahead' option, which is what I see at most other such intersections in Thailand...

From my memory, which has been known to be wrong .... once long time ago, , Moon Muang is one way , Northbound on the inside of the moat. The intersecting street [Rajwithee Rd.] is one lane Eastbound and one lane Westbound, inside the moat. For Eastbound traffic there is no straight thru option [legal] as I seem to remember barricades directing all eastbound traffic [which is one lane] to turn left onto Moon Muang then to the next crossover near Somphet Mkt. to do a 'U' Turn.

Yes, I do agree that any time you are Northbound on Moon Muang, you will see motorcycles either shooting across to go over the moat, or waiting to do so. This is what I believe Richard was attempting to do.

Thus my comment that the truck driver was attempting to pass on/in an intersection, I was attempting to say that as there is one lane eastbound, the truck should have been following Richard and not been beside him. I think there is enough room [widthwise for a truck and amotorcycle, but not for two car width vehicles. The truck driver should have been following Richard thru the intersection, then passed if it was necessary, not passing in the intersection itself. If Richard would have been using the entire lane from the middle, the truck would not have had enough space in that lane to come along side and try to pass.

To me it seems that we have a situation of two wrongs making a wreck.

Gonzo

Maybe I'm confused.. What does Moon muang have to do with anything? Yes, if Richard was trying to cut across the road in front of Mikes, rather than turning, He would be making an illegal turn, too, But am I wrong if I say that is not what he was doing?? I wasn't there, but Maejo Man was..

[Blinky Bill]

I don't know what you mean by saying the truck was 'trying to pass'. It seems to me that the truck was tying to turn left from the second lane. Because the left lane is a 'turn only' lane, the lane next to it is then a 'left turn or straight ahead' option, which is what I see at most other such intersections in Thailand...

From my memory, which has been known to be wrong .... once long time ago, , Moon Muang is one way , Northbound on the inside of the moat. The intersecting street [Rajwithee Rd.] is one lane Eastbound and one lane Westbound, inside the moat. For Eastbound traffic there is no straight thru option [legal] as I seem to remember barricades directing all eastbound traffic [which is one lane] to turn left onto Moon Muang then to the next crossover near Somphet Mkt. to do a 'U' Turn.

Yes, I do agree that any time you are Northbound on Moon Muang, you will see motorcycles either shooting across to go over the moat, or waiting to do so. This is what I believe Richard was attempting to do.

Thus my comment that the truck driver was attempting to pass on/in an intersection, I was attempting to say that as there is one lane eastbound, the truck should have been following Richard and not been beside him. I think there is enough room [widthwise for a truck and amotorcycle, but not for two car width vehicles. The truck driver should have been following Richard thru the intersection, then passed if it was necessary, not passing in the intersection itself. If Richard would have been using the entire lane from the middle, the truck would not have had enough space in that lane to come along side and try to pass.

To me it seems that we have a situation of two wrongs making a wreck.

Gonzo

I just heard from an eyewitness to the accident that the vehicle that hit Richard was travelling north on Moonmuang Road, he was travelling straight ahead when the motorcycle ridden by Richard tried to make an illegal crossing of Moonmuang Road from Ratchawithi. Richard was 100% in the wrong.

[Gonzo the Face]

Maybe I am wrong then also Ajarn, I thought the collision spot was on the inside of the moat, in front of Mikes.

In any event get well quickly Richard, then you can go and photograph the site for us all

Gonzo

[Ajarn]

Maybe I am wrong then also Ajarn, I thought the collision spot was on the inside of the moat, in front of Mikes.

In any event get well quickly Richard, then you can go and photograph the site for us all

Gonzo

Who knows.. When he said to me, 'Yes Ajarn, it was the intereection in front of 'Mikes Burgers'' '

I thought he was heading south on Chaiyaphoom, and went straight, instead of turning left onto Chiang moi... ??

[richard10365]

Sorry for all the confusion everyone. You have the intersection at Mike's Burgers, the moat, and the intersection on the other side of the moat. The accident happend on the intersection on the other side of the moat. Not next to Mike's Burgers.

The truck, according to the police, was not a songtaew, but a Mitsubushi 4 door pick up.

I have pulled up to many intersections before and drove through them with no problems. This time I paniced. Something I saw made me jump the gun.

We were hit on our left side. Normally, if going straight, we would have been hit on our right side. All my injuries are to the left side of my body.

I'm not trying to say I wasn't at fault. I am at fault. Why I pulled out when/how I did, I am not sure. Something about the driving of the truck that made me panic.

There were 2 vehicles there. The idea of the truck in the right hand lane making a left turn almost seems like a memory to me. Then again, maybe I am just putting fake memories into my head.

If I was totally at fault, being a farang, this Thai man would be going after me in court with everything he has. The police said the other man was enough at fault and thought it would be in his best interest and mine if we didn't pursue the matter an more.

We both agreed and walked away.

The whole incident is bizarre. The only time I even saw the police was as I was laying in the street and looking up. They never even talked to me.