Silent Final Consonants

[Briggsy]

One that has always puzzled me is the word Buriram, บุรีรัมย์ . My wife can't explain it either.

I didn't know it either, but from Googling around a bit:

บุรีรัมย์ means เมืองที่น่ารื่นรมย์: pleasant city

รมย์ comes from Sanskrit รมฺย - ramaya, meaning: pleasant, beautiful

http://dictionary.sanook.com/search/รมย์

Thanks. I still don't understand why the final letter is ย์

The Sanskrit consonants are retained in the Thai spelling.

However the final syllable starting with ย is dropped in pronunciation.

This is shown by use of the karan ์

[Johpa]

How many more decades will they need for a reform of their script to enable Thai/Thai people to read loanwords as they are?

Probably the same number of decades before they reform the English alphabet that uses all of five or so symbols to represent nearly two dozen vowel sound.

As for the pronunciation of final consonants, the phonetic rules are quite simple with only a few allowed consonants such as unvoiced stops, nasals, and of course the elusive glottal stop after any short vowel.

[AyG]

How many more decades will they need for a reform of their script to enable Thai/Thai people to read loanwords as they are?

Probably the same number of decades before they reform the English alphabet that uses all of five or so symbols to represent nearly two dozen vowel sound.

As for the pronunciation of final consonants, the phonetic rules are quite simple with only a few allowed consonants such as unvoiced stops, nasals, and of course the elusive glottal stop after any short vowel.

There was a previous attempt to reform Thai spelling, back in the early '40s if memory serves me right. It was an initiative of military dictator "Plaek" Phibunsongkhram. It failed.

The Lao language's current written form is very much like Thai with all the duplication and irregularities removed. This was the result of spelling reform after the communist Pathet Lao overthrew the government in the 1970s.

So, spelling reform is possible under the right circumstances. Perhaps it's something the current junta will get around to some time in the next few years.

[Richard W]

One that has always puzzled me is the word Buriram, บุรีรัมย์ . My wife can't explain it either.

The Sanskrit consonants are retained in the Thai spelling.

However the final syllable starting with ย is dropped in pronunciation.

This is shown by use of the karan ์

The general rule is that the final short vowel of the Sanskrit stem is usually not pronounced at he end of a Thai word. Thai can only pronounce the first of a run of final consonants. When there are two or more consonants at the end, the final consonant is then marked with the karan to show that it is not pronounced. An exception is groups of two consonants ending in ร. I don't know the reason for not marking them with karan; conceivably it could be connected with special methods for writing ร in clusters, but I don't know enough about how the special methods of writing clusters evolved.

So, starting with Sanskrit stem ramya รมฺย, we silence the vowel, add mai han akat to show that the word is not pronounced [M]rom, and remove the clustering mark to make writing quicker, giving us รัมย์. It's entirely possible that the starting point was actually Pali ramma รมฺม, which would naturally give Thai รัม after the spelling reform (40's?) that eliminated many Thai final geminates. A Sanskritised spelling looks classier.

So, spelling reform is possible under the right circumstances. Perhaps it's something the current junta will get around to some time in the next few years.

I think a fundamental disfigurement of Thai spelling is unlikely. The current spelling serves to keep the peasantry in its place.

Edited December 13, 2015 by Richard W

[cooked]

One that has always puzzled me is the word Buriram, บุรีรัมย์ . My wife can't explain it either.

The Sanskrit consonants are retained in the Thai spelling.

However the final syllable starting with ย is dropped in pronunciation.

This is shown by use of the karan ์

The general rule is that the final short vowel of the Sanskrit stem is usually not pronounced at he end of a Thai word. Thai can only pronounce the first of a run of final consonants. When there are two or more consonants at the end, the final consonant is then marked with the karan to show that it is not pronounced. An exception is groups of two consonants ending in ร. I don't know the reason for not marking them with karan; conceivably it could be connected with special methods for writing ร in clusters, but I don't know enough about how the special methods of writing clusters evolved.

So, starting with Sanskrit stem ramya รมฺย, we silence the vowel, add mai han akat to show that the word is not pronounced [M]rom, and remove the clustering mark to make writing quicker, giving us รัมย์. It's entirely possible that the starting point was actually Pali ramma รมฺม, which would naturally give Thai รัม after the spelling reform (40's?) that eliminated many Thai final geminates. A Sanskritised spelling looks classier.

So, spelling reform is possible under the right circumstances. Perhaps it's something the current junta will get around to some time in the next few years.

I think a fundamental disfigurement of Thai spelling is unlikely. The current spelling serves to keep the peasantry in its place.

Great information, thanks.

I agree with remarks about using language to keep poorly educated people in their place. Even using Facebook is a problem for many people.

A Rabbi, many years ago, once told me that the Hebrew language was invented by priests in order that the peasantry would not have access to their writings and that that still applies today. Same with Latin services in the Catholic church.