It would be interesting to see how many 'UK expats for EU exist', have actually bothered to register to vote in the referendum.

A little honesty on that point might shed some light on the posts in this whole thread.

I intended and registered to vote - can't begin to tell you how much I hate the cost and waste of the EU.

Even so, I eventually decided that Brexit would only lead to more right wing policies - in both the UK and the EU - which left me in a quandary.

In the end, it seemed a better decision not to vote.

It would be interesting to see how many 'UK expats for EU exist', have actually bothered to register to vote in the referendum.

A little honesty on that point might shed some light on the posts in this whole thread.

I voted (to remain in the EU) by postal proxy 2 weeks ago.

I agree with the emboldened part - shame Paxman didn't address the cost of the EU, and only marginally addressed the ridiculous financial waste.

I also deplore EU profligacy, however, contrary to most, I think the UK´s financial contribution to the EU is fairly small considering the "total ROI" (incl. higher taxes et al). But with the campaign currently on hold I should do the same and stop posting about the referendum.

The recent tragic killing of a Labour MP, a Euro supporter , will be used , sadly, as a reason for UK to remain in the EU .

No Brit exit . RIP JO .

Edited June 18, 201610 yr by elliss

The recent tragic killing of a Labour MP, a Euro supporter , will be used , sadly, as a reason for UK to remain in the EU .

No Brit exit . RIP JO .

I agree it would be wrong to use the tragedy for political purposes but I suspect it is inevitable. Needless to say, it would be a fitting testament if the more tolerant, inclusive arguments were to win.

The recent tragic killing of a Labour MP, a Euro supporter , will be used , sadly, as a reason for UK to remain in the EU .

No Brit exit . RIP JO .

I agree it would be wrong to use the tragedy for political purposes but I suspect it is inevitable. Needless to say, it would be a fitting testament if the more tolerant, inclusive arguments were to win.

It is very sad that an MP should be killed for her views about whatever, you have different views we all do, we usually manage to live with each other and our differences, sadly this is not the first time things like this happen, there are plenty of cranks around who want attention.

The event will have a passive impact against the OUT campaign and I see there are already calls for the Referendum to be cancelled as a mark of respect, I suspect its going to be chaotic in the days leading up to the vote. This tragedy is going to cloud the issue, I just hope it does not become bigger than the real issue, this is to important a decision.

I sent my postal vote off on the 8th and I voted OUT.

It amazes me why people dont see the EU for what it is, a protectionist, power mad, un-democratic project run by the powerful and rich to the detriment of the poor. You can be sure that when it collapses the rich and powerful will still have well feathered nests and the poor people will spend the rest of their lives paying for it.

Things are moving on at a pace, main allies in the EU are our Nordic/Scandanavian friends, it seems almost certain that if we go the Swedes will demand a referendum ( according to reports on the BBC ) with Denmark and Finland wavering as they will isolated.

Someone mentioned Norway in an earlier post, the Norwegian Government wanted to Join the EU and I think still do, its the people who rejected it by referendum, I can foresee a small alliance forming here outside the EU, a good one based on shared interests and sovereign countries.

To his credit Cameron has said that the vote of the referendum is the deciding factor, if the majority vote out, then we leave, there will be no vote in Parliament. I can see why some would like the result to be verified in the House of Commons, after all we know that the EU is where old UK politicians go see out their lives and die at 3 times the salary and that I kid you not, there 10,000 employees in Brussels who earn more than 3 times that of our PM and that cannot be right!

Not sure Cameron can state there will be no vote in parliament. The referendum is not binding it is only a consultation. I believe an Act of Parliament is required to repeal the EU acts and that while unlikely from a political point of view, it is still possible that such an Act may not pass a vote.

http://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-we-may-remain-even-if-we-vote-leave-a3272621.html

I sent my postal vote off on the 8th and I voted OUT.

It amazes me why people dont see the EU for what it is, a protectionist, power mad, un-democratic project run by the powerful and rich to the detriment of the poor. You can be sure that when it collapses the rich and powerful will still have well feathered nests and the poor people will spend the rest of their lives paying for it.

Things are moving on at a pace, main allies in the EU are our Nordic/Scandanavian friends, it seems almost certain that if we go the Swedes will demand a referendum ( according to reports on the BBC ) with Denmark and Finland wavering as they will isolated.

Someone mentioned Norway in an earlier post, the Norwegian Government wanted to Join the EU and I think still do, its the people who rejected it by referendum, I can foresee a small alliance forming here outside the EU, a good one based on shared interests and sovereign countries.

To his credit Cameron has said that the vote of the referendum is the deciding factor, if the majority vote out, then we leave, there will be no vote in Parliament. I can see why some would like the result to be verified in the House of Commons, after all we know that the EU is where old UK politicians go see out their lives and die at 3 times the salary and that I kid you not, there 10,000 employees in Brussels who earn more than 3 times that of our PM and that cannot be right!

Not sure Cameron can state there will be no vote in parliament. The referendum is not binding it is only a consultation. I believe an Act of Parliament is required to repeal the EU acts and that while unlikely from a political point of view, it is still possible that such an Act may not pass a vote.

http://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-we-may-remain-even-if-we-vote-leave-a3272621.html

Correct. Only parliament can repeal the European legislation. If Brexit wins, I wouldn't be surprised to see "improved terms" offered by the EU (after 2 years of negotiating the UK's exit) and then another referendum held.

Despite what Cameron has said to the contrary, it seems to me if the vote is to "Leave", Cameron then needs to resign as do the likes of the Chancellor and other 'Remain' ministers.

Anyone else agree?

Despite what Cameron has said to the contrary, it seems to me if the vote is to "Leave", Cameron then needs to resign as do the likes of the Chancellor and other 'Remain' ministers.

Anyone else agree?

Cameron has said he will remain whatever the outcome and carry out the wishes of the people, perhaps he is not actually 100% for remain then, He has said that in is in and out is out and has not mentioned it being ratified in Parliament. Can you imagine what would happen if there was an OUT vote and then the MPs overturned the peoples decision? I think before that was even suggested they would have think very carefully, the result could be anarchy and I do mean, real trouble on the streets.

As far as the EU coming up with a new offer after a couple of years, well they might well do that but I still dont see it being enough. To get what we really want which is to end this Political Union and the relinquishment of the people who are controlling the EU although never being elected would probably need treaties to be scrapped and re drawn and I cannot see them wanting to do that, its to high a price for them, if I were in their position I would not offer it and herein lies the crux of things, the direction the EU wants to go and the way the UK wants to go ( I think ) are a gulf apart. Both sides should accept it and see where they go from here, with goodwill an accommodation would be found. We are not anti-European what we are anti in the way EU its being run and the goals its aiming for.

They show no sign of putting their own house in order, 20 years of accounts unable to be signed off, doing what they want with complete disregard for the ordinary people, allowing un elected civil servants to run the show and then asking Member ministers to sign it off along with EU Parliament with redress to amendments, the sheer volume of regulation and directives, 122,000 since we joined is staggering, how did we live before this? Well we were the 5th biggest economy in the world when we joined and we are still the 5th biggest now, we did live then, the EEC, what we joined has changed into a completely different animal as far as we are concerned, I am sure now that the politicians of the time knew exactly what was going on but kept it hidden, that is was always the end game to change into the EU or United States of Europe where countries would just be assimilated into the collective just told the best bits, today with internet and social media its not so easy to hide alternative views and now we have found out, who has the guts to try and put things right?

There but a few days to go before the vote and the result is expected at breakfast time in the UK. I would just like to say and dont spoil it for me now, that the debate here on these pages has been first class! There have been no personal attacks, excellent! You can have your view and rightly so, I dont have to accept it, nor you mine and thats how it should be. We bring issues, we think about them, maybe something we have not heard before, thats good. You or I may be entrenched in our position, we may not change, thats fine, thats life, on other issues we may well agree.

I dont know what we are going to talk about in the late UK summer apart from the cricket, ah yes the cricket, what a wonderful game, if only the unbelievers could understand it!

To understand cricket is to understand the true meaning of life.

I have watched the various videos - including Paxman's. For me it is a case of voting for the least worst option - and that is Remain.

The Brexit'ers never tire of reminding us that the UK is the World's fifth largest economy. After more than 40 years in the EU surely that indicates that membership hasn't been particularly detrimental to economic growth. Maybe we would do better outside, but the current position is good enough for me and I don't want to jeopardise it.

I have watched the various videos - including Paxman's. For me it is a case of voting for the least worst option - and that is Remain.

The Brexit'ers never tire of reminding us that the UK is the World's fifth largest economy. After more than 40 years in the EU surely that indicates that membership hasn't been particularly detrimental to economic growth. Maybe we would do better outside, but the current position is good enough for me and I don't want to jeopardise it.

... but the current position is good enough for me and I don't want to jeopardise it.

Very short sighted but you're welcome to your vote. My wife and I are voting out.

Out of the dozens of UK residents that I've spoken to over the last three months, only two have indicated a remain vote.

Voting to remain for very clear economic reasons .. also see good reasons to leave.. just that the mindset of the leavers is a bit twisted and narrow minded at times.

Voting to remain for very clear economic reasons Quote . { for ex pats }?.

GBP - THB . today at a two week high . No doubt, due to recent events in the UK . Sad but true .

BRITEXIT is now, very unlikely . IMO .

Edited June 20, 201610 yr by elliss

Does anybody know if currant British European Union passports will have to be replaced if Britain leaves the EU? My passport is only about one year old, so I will be a little bit grumpy if I have to purchase a new one so soon.

Voting to remain for very clear economic reasons .. also see good reasons to leave.. just that the mindset of the leavers is a bit twisted and narrow minded at times.

Their is no economic case to remain in the EU.

Britain exports with the EU are diminishing every year and our exports to the rest of the world is increasing your on year.

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/6337/the_economic_case_for_brexit_is_overwhelming

PLUS do you know that you cannot trust the EU import figures for Britain as the EU employs accounting trickery by counting our products that are in transit through an EU port as an import when in fact our products are being shipped to other countries around the world...it is called the "Rotterdam effect".

EU sleight of hand yet again.!

Voting to remain for very clear economic reasons Quote . { for ex pats }?.

GBP - THB . today at a two week high . No doubt, due to recent events in the UK . Sad but true .

BRITEXIT is now, very unlikely . IMO .

Don't be so defeatist!

... but the current position is good enough for me and I don't want to jeopardise it.

Very short sighted but you're welcome to your vote. My wife and I are voting out.

Out of the dozens of UK residents that I've spoken to over the last three months, only two have indicated a remain vote.

June the 24th will either be a celebration of the revitalising of Great Britain or a commiseration on the death of a once great country.

Voting to remain for very clear economic reasons .. also see good reasons to leave.. just that the mindset of the leavers is a bit twisted and narrow minded at times.

Try another reason for leaving as the economic case fans flat on its face?

Does anybody know if currant British European Union passports will have to be replaced if Britain leaves the EU? My passport is only about one year old, so I will be a little bit grumpy if I have to purchase a new one so soon.

I think it would change when it needs to changed, my old UK passport was not changed to an EU until it expired. I think if you look at your passport front it has the UK coat of Arms on it, so I would not worry about it I am not and I got a new passport last year.

I have watched the various videos - including Paxman's. For me it is a case of voting for the least worst option - and that is Remain.

The Brexit'ers never tire of reminding us that the UK is the World's fifth largest economy. After more than 40 years in the EU surely that indicates that membership hasn't been particularly detrimental to economic growth. Maybe we would do better outside, but the current position is good enough for me and I don't want to jeopardise it.

Membership has been detrimental to economic growth and we would have been far better off without being hamstrung with EU petty interfering regulation burdening British business..remember curved Bananas?

This is no economic case for staying in the EU, FACT!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/6198708/EU-costs-Britain-118bn-a-year.html

http://www.economist.com/news/briefing/21567914-how-britain-could-fall-out-european-union-and-what-it-would-mean-making-break

http://www.voteleavetakecontrol.org/briefing_cost

I shall be travelling to Edinburgh tomorrow in order, amongst other things, to cast my vote - I shall be voting to remain.

I've lived, worked and studied in the EU, experienced first hand the benefits membership of Europe brings and yes I absolutely accept there are negatives to membership and people who loose out on the EU project, but my sincere view is that it the British mainstream political parties (specifically the Labour party) that have let these people down, not the EU.

The Brexit campaign makes much of Britain's borders being open to uncontrolled immigration from Europe, while on the next hand they tell us a Britain free of the EU could go out into the world and trade, unfettered by EU bureaucracy.

And yet Brexit dismisses the very solid fact that British industry, commerce, people have unfettered access to the EU, can trade, travel, live without restriction throughout the EU.

What on earth prevents Britain, its industry, commerce or people making the best of EU membership while also going out into the rest of the world?

I challenge Brexit supporters to give me a coherent answer to that question, you have until Thursday to get me to change my mind.

Edited June 20, 201610 yr by GuestHouse

Despite what Cameron has said to the contrary, it seems to me if the vote is to "Leave", Cameron then needs to resign as do the likes of the Chancellor and other 'Remain' ministers.

Anyone else agree?

Cameron has said he will remain whatever the outcome and carry out the wishes of the people, perhaps he is not actually 100% for remain then, He has said that in is in and out is out and has not mentioned it being ratified in Parliament. Can you imagine what would happen if there was an OUT vote and then the MPs overturned the peoples decision? I think before that was even suggested they would have think very carefully, the result could be anarchy and I do mean, real trouble on the streets.

As far as the EU coming up with a new offer after a couple of years, well they might well do that but I still dont see it being enough. To get what we really want which is to end this Political Union and the relinquishment of the people who are controlling the EU although never being elected would probably need treaties to be scrapped and re drawn and I cannot see them wanting to do that, its to high a price for them, if I were in their position I would not offer it and herein lies the crux of things, the direction the EU wants to go and the way the UK wants to go ( I think ) are a gulf apart. Both sides should accept it and see where they go from here, with goodwill an accommodation would be found. We are not anti-European what we are anti in the way EU its being run and the goals its aiming for.

They show no sign of putting their own house in order, 20 years of accounts unable to be signed off, doing what they want with complete disregard for the ordinary people, allowing un elected civil servants to run the show and then asking Member ministers to sign it off along with EU Parliament with redress to amendments, the sheer volume of regulation and directives, 122,000 since we joined is staggering, how did we live before this? Well we were the 5th biggest economy in the world when we joined and we are still the 5th biggest now, we did live then, the EEC, what we joined has changed into a completely different animal as far as we are concerned, I am sure now that the politicians of the time knew exactly what was going on but kept it hidden, that is was always the end game to change into the EU or United States of Europe where countries would just be assimilated into the collective just told the best bits, today with internet and social media its not so easy to hide alternative views and now we have found out, who has the guts to try and put things right?

A good post...vote leave is the only way to put things right, having an unelected foreign power rule the UK with EU interests and not the UK's interest at the top of the agenda will only make things worse for the UK.

The UK already has an Orwellian EU designation - "EU region 7", so vote remain if you wish the UK to be subsumed into an undemocratic, sovereignty stealing, poverty spreading expansionist superstate.

I shall be travelling to Edinburgh tomorrow in order, amongst other things, to cast my vote - I shall be voting to remain.

I've lived, worked and studied in the EU, experienced first hand the benefits membership of Europe brings and yes I absolutely accept there are negatives to membership and people who loose out on the EU project, but my sincere view is that it the British mainstream political parties (specifically the Labour party) that have let these people down, not the EU.

The Brexit campaign makes much of Britain's borders being open to uncontrolled immigration from Europe, while on the next hand they tell us a Britain free of the EU could go out into the world and trade, unfettered by EU bureaucracy.

And yet Brexit dismisses the very solid fact that British industry, commerce, people have unfettered access to the EU, can trade, travel, live without restriction throughout the EU.

What on earth prevents Britain, its industry, commerce or people making the best of EU membership while also going out into the rest of the world?

I challenge Brexit supporters to give me an coherent answer to that question, you have until Thursday to get me to change my mind.

I will not try to change your mind, I could not change your mind - your conclusions are as entrenched as mine are.

To directly answer your question I would say that the European Commission is preventing the UK making the best of EU membership. I see federal Europe getting worse with even more central control. I prefer to see the UK having control and working with European partners to find practical solutions to the perceived issues.

Edited June 20, 201610 yr by Jip99

If the British finally remain Frenchies will vote a Franxit ...

Edited June 20, 201610 yr by happy Joe

I shall be travelling to Edinburgh tomorrow in order, amongst other things, to cast my vote - I shall be voting to remain.

I've lived, worked and studied in the EU, experienced first hand the benefits membership of Europe brings and yes I absolutely accept there are negatives to membership and people who loose out on the EU project, but my sincere view is that it the British mainstream political parties (specifically the Labour party) that have let these people down, not the EU.

The Brexit campaign makes much of Britain's borders being open to uncontrolled immigration from Europe, while on the next hand they tell us a Britain free of the EU could go out into the world and trade, unfettered by EU bureaucracy.

And yet Brexit dismisses the very solid fact that British industry, commerce, people have unfettered access to the EU, can trade, travel, live without restriction throughout the EU.

What on earth prevents Britain, its industry, commerce or people making the best of EU membership while also going out into the rest of the world?

I challenge Brexit supporters to give me a coherent answer to that question, you have until Thursday to get me to change my mind.

Hi Guesthouse,

I doubt anybody can change your mind form the way you are posting, however there really is no economic case for staying in the EU and i have previously posted comments on this issue if you'd like to go through them.

Britain's trade is dwindling with the EU year on year and increasing year on year with the rest of the world so the EU is becoming less and less important every year.

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/6337/the_economic_case_for_brexit_is_overwhelming

http://www.economist.com/news/briefing/21567914-how-britain-could-fall-out-european-union-and-what-it-would-mean-making-break

What is more important is the right to control our own destiny not just be the EU Cash machine with no voice.

If the British finally remain Frenchies will vote a Franxit ...

Great lets hope the French exit and my wish is fulfilled to see the demise of the EU before i die.

The EU will fall like a pack of cards.

To all those who are voting or support to remain in the EU.

Please view the attached meme and put yourself in the position of asking the unelected EU commissioners who are the de facto EU government those questions?

If they were truthful an EU Commissioners answers to the 5 questions would be as follows ?

Question 1.

What power do you have?

Answer.

I have unlimited power.

Question 2.

Where did you get that power from?

Answer.

I was not democratically elected, I was given this power by being appointed by the EU.

Question 3.

In whose interest do you exercise this power?

Answer.

The EU interests are above any other individual nation state.

Question 4.

To whom are you accountable?

Answer.

I am not accountable to anyone.

Question 5.

How can we get rid of you?

Answer.

You cannot get rid of me.

How can you support this eh...its a step back wards.