Envoys not fussed about the consequences of their remarks

[Lodestone]

I am personally amazed at the high quality of diplomat the USA has sent to Thailand. This guy is a professional, not the debutante political appointee that was here before as a reward for spending money on the reelection of POTUS.

Quoting Wikipedia ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristie_Kenney ):

In July 2010, President Barack Obama nominated Kenney as the United States ambassador to the Kingdom of Thailand. She was confirmed by the United States Senate on September 29, 2010.

Prior to being the U.S. ambassador to Thailand, Kenney served as the U.S. ambassador to Ecuador and the Philippines. Before working for the United States Foreign Service, she worked in United States Senate, a tour guide in the United States capitol, an intern in the House of Representatives, and as a staff member of the Senate Human Resources Committee.

At the State Department, she was appointed overseas as economic counselor at the United States Mission to International Organizations in Geneva, economic officer at the U.S. Embassy in Argentina, and consular officer at the U.S. embassy in Jamaica. Back home, she was appointed as director of the State Department Operations Center, a detail to the White House as a member of the National Security Council staff, and political-military officer in the Office of NATO Affairs.

Kenney served as Executive Secretary of the State Department before becoming senior advisor to the assistant secretary for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement. She worked for both Secretaries of State Madeleine Albright and Colin Powell and led the State Department's transition team from the Clinton to Bush administrations.

[mark131v]

I'm a yank living here and say bravo to both diplomats for their statements. Especially the Brit: well played indeed. I am not worried at all about being "in danger". These two said what many of us have said to each other here on TV, but have said it where can get a bit of attention from the current self installed rulers. Those who wish to can cower in corners. I will not join them however.

Very well said!!

You put into words my own thoughts far more eloquently than I could and it is refreshing to see the replies to this topic

Seems to be a lot of weak scared people on TVF I wonder if they were always like that....

[ddavidovsky]

I'm a yank living here and say bravo to both diplomats for their statements. Especially the Brit: well played indeed. I am not worried at all about being "in danger". These two said what many of us have said to each other here on TV, but have said it where can get a bit of attention from the current self installed rulers. Those who wish to can cower in corners. I will not join them however.

Very well said!!

You put into words my own thoughts far more eloquently than I could and it is refreshing to see the replies to this topic

Seems to be a lot of weak scared people on TVF I wonder if they were always like that....

Fact is that no one in Thailand can say what they really think - and that includes you and me on this forum. Therefore pragmatism is called for. Realpolitik. For an ambassador simply to carp in this context seems to me both gauche and counterproductive. Thailand is going through an extraodinary process and I should think the situation calls for something far more cunning and Machiavellian. The diplomats should be smoothing the path for that, not making waves.

[mark131v]

I'm a yank living here and say bravo to both diplomats for their statements. Especially the Brit: well played indeed. I am not worried at all about being "in danger". These two said what many of us have said to each other here on TV, but have said it where can get a bit of attention from the current self installed rulers. Those who wish to can cower in corners. I will not join them however.

Very well said!!

You put into words my own thoughts far more eloquently than I could and it is refreshing to see the replies to this topic

Seems to be a lot of weak scared people on TVF I wonder if they were always like that....

Fact is that no one in Thailand can say what they really think - and that includes you and me on this forum. Therefore pragmatism is called for. Realpolitik. For an ambassador simply to carp in this context seems to me both gauche and counterproductive. Thailand is going through an extraodinary process and I should think the situation calls for something far more cunning and Machiavellian. The diplomats should be smoothing the path for that, not making waves.

...

For the ambassador not to speak up about the blatant double standards would be wrong, their countries have a set of standards they work to

If this place was somewhere that mattered maybe they would temper their remarks but actually in the grand scheme this place is nothing so niceties aren't required especially when the people in charge keep ignoring (edit too dim is probably more apt) the subtle stuff

Thailand is not going through an extraordinary event the military and ruling elite stamp their authority on a regular basis but the problem they now have is that the great unwashed are getting education from sources the little man and his cronies cannot control

You keep burying your head in the sand mate because that will make things better....

Edited December 12, 2015 by mark131v

[Thai at Heart]

They knew exactly what they were saying, their meanings were crystal clear, and they had fully weighed up the consequences before they made their comments.

Why should there be any consequences? One wasn't lese majeste, and the other was pointing double standards in the Thai govt.

The precious Thais need to stop acting like kids. They are the country with the coups, with the poorly functioning democracy, and the constant political mess.

[Thai at Heart]

I'm a yank living here and say bravo to both diplomats for their statements. Especially the Brit: well played indeed. I am not worried at all about being "in danger". These two said what many of us have said to each other here on TV, but have said it where can get a bit of attention from the current self installed rulers. Those who wish to can cower in corners. I will not join them however.

Very well said!!

You put into words my own thoughts far more eloquently than I could and it is refreshing to see the replies to this topic

Seems to be a lot of weak scared people on TVF I wonder if they were always like that....

Fact is that no one in Thailand can say what they really think - and that includes you and me on this forum. Therefore pragmatism is called for. Realpolitik. For an ambassador simply to carp in this context seems to me both gauche and counterproductive. Thailand is going through an extraodinary process and I should think the situation calls for something far more cunning and Machiavellian. The diplomats should be smoothing the path for that, not making waves.

What are the Thais going to do?

Threaten an Ambassador from the USA or the UK?

Oh really? Threaten them with what? Diplomats are not always there to make everything smooth.

Best friends will tell you when you are acting like a dick. The USA and UK ambassadors should be applauded for pointing out these very obvious contradictions.

[Emster23]

I do wish to remind those about a few LM's lesser known parts. Foreign heads of state are included in group you cannot disparage, insult, etc. Being a yank, we think perfectly ok to insult President: look what some have said about Obama, look at "smirking chimp" references to Bush. Right or wrong, true or false perfectly legal in USA. If I were to engage in expressing those same negative opinions and insults about Obama, I could be subject to arrest and imprisonment in Thailand, up to 30 years isn't it?

[kimamey]

The double standards of the UK and US are laughable. "No one should be jailed for peacefully expressing the views". Really? There are many examples in both countries where this has been the case using draconian anti terror laws. One young man and a women served 2 years in jail some years ago in the UK for peacfully demonstrating in front of the Cenotaph in London. There crime was reading out of the names of the war dead. And many examples of peaceful protest in the both countries are ruthlesley stopped by Police. What a joke.

Maya (Anne) Evans is a British peace campaigner who was arrested in October 2005 opposite theCenotaph war memorial in London, for refusing to stop reading aloud the names of British soldiers who had been killed in Iraq following the 2003 Iraq war.Evans, an anti-war activist from Hastings, became the first person in the UK to be convicted under the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act 2005 for taking part in an unauthorised demonstration within 1 km of Parliament Square. She received a conditional discharge and a fine.

A conditional discharge and a fine is NOT serving 2 years in prison.

Get your facts straight before inserting your foot into your mouth.

I believe Milan Rai was imprisoned for a few days but that was for non payment of fines rather than the offence you mentioned. He had several other convictions as well for simlar offences. At the time in question he was reading out the names of civillians killed during the Iraq war using the common tactic of fitting the time scale to the agenda so as not to include the far greater number killed by Saddam Husein prior to the war as that would have detracted from his point.

Evans reportedly said "I think it's a shame that you can't voice your freedom of speech in this country anymore". Either she wasn't bright enough to understand the facts of the case or she thought she could get away without anyone noticing the inaccuracy in very much the same way that bim has tried to do with his post.

The point here of course is the blanket prevention of protest and criticism in Thailand

Edited December 12, 2015 by kimamey

[MiKT]

The double standards of the UK and US are laughable. "No one should be jailed for peacefully expressing the views". Really? There are many examples in both countries where this has been the case using draconian anti terror laws. One young man and a women served 2 years in jail some years ago in the UK for peacfully demonstrating in front of the Cenotaph in London. There crime was reading out of the names of the war dead. And many examples of peaceful protest in the both countries are ruthlesley stopped by Police. What a joke.

It is totally untrue that anybody in the UK was jailed for reading out the names of war dead. In one incident an anti- war activist was rightly fined for insulting war dead. In another incident a drugged up rich thug was fined for defacing the war memorial over a protest about university fees that he could well afford. This is such a typical example of the blatant lies that jaunta huggers post to obfuscate and cover up the shocking missuse of the LM laws that should be used to protect the monarchy not hide military corruption and political misdeeds. The envoys should file defamation cases against the protestors and gov ministers who have deliberately twisted their words to inflame public opinion. Such blatant hypocrisy.

[taony]

I do wish to remind those about a few LM's lesser known parts. Foreign heads of state are included in group you cannot disparage, insult, etc. Being a yank, we think perfectly ok to insult President: look what some have said about Obama, look at "smirking chimp" references to Bush. Right or wrong, true or false perfectly legal in USA. If I were to engage in expressing those same negative opinions and insults about Obama, I could be subject to arrest and imprisonment in Thailand, up to 30 years isn't it?

I've heard this before too, but don't know for certain.

[MiKT]

I do wish to remind those about a few LM's lesser known parts. Foreign heads of state are included in group you cannot disparage, insult, etc. Being a yank, we think perfectly ok to insult President: look what some have said about Obama, look at "smirking chimp" references to Bush. Right or wrong, true or false perfectly legal in USA. If I were to engage in expressing those same negative opinions and insults about Obama, I could be subject to arrest and imprisonment in Thailand, up to 30 years isn't it?

I've heard this before too, but don't know for certain.

Damn right too, Chimps have a nice smile/grin.

[metisdead]

26) The Bangkok Post and Phuketwan do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post or Phuketwan publications will be deleted from the forum.

A post containing content from Bangkok Post has been removed as well as a reply.

[tigermoth]

Well, the BBC shits all over CNN for its journalism and unbiased reporting and that joke called Fox news is not even in the race.

[MiKT]

Well, the BBC shits all over CNN for its journalism and unbiased reporting and that joke called Fox news is not even in the race.

Aunty has done reasonably well vis-à-vis LM in LOS recently (but not good before when they were, contrary to recent posts very pro yellow, but with no real idea of what was actually happening behind the Suthep led insurrection).

Currently I only object to them featuring the Russian spy and traitor Edward Snowdon as part of their program promotions.

But Fox News is scary, I tend to imagine a farm somewhere way out in the boonies 1/2 way up a blue mountain where banjo strumming Appalachian Hillbilly intelligentsia breed the Fox News female presenters by crossing certified loonies from New York with hungry cross Rottweiler's/Pit Bulls. It saves on the mental cringing when they open their mouths.

I don't think they have managed to find one spare minute between promoting gun ownership and spreading ridiculous panic about Muslims to find time to mention their splendid Thai Ambassador - good man interestingly educated for an American and for sure a Fox News cringer as well.

.

[BudRight]

Thais investigating either of these men for any crime is completely pointless. They both have diplomatic immunity; which exists for situations just like this. All that could be done is pressure the State Department and Foreign Office to replace them. As others have said, that seems unlikely.

Edited December 13, 2015 by BudRight

[MiKT]

Thais investigating either of these men for any crime is completely pointless. They both have diplomatic immunity; which exists for situations just like this. All that could be done is pressure the State Department and Foreign Office to replace them. As others have said, that seems unlikely.

Cleary the British and American Ambassadors should join hands and sing Kumbaya outside the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to protest against the protestors.

[LomSak27]

bim, on 12 Dec 2015 - 08:19, said:

The double standards of the UK and US are laughable. "No one should be jailed for peacefully expressing the views". Really? There are many examples in both countries where this has been the case using draconian anti terror laws. One young man and a women served 2 years in jail some years ago in the UK for peacfully demonstrating in front of the Cenotaph in London. There crime was reading out of the names of the war dead. And many examples of peaceful protest in the both countries are ruthlesley stopped by Police. What a joke

Still waiting for Information, news article or link on those two who were jailed Bim. I would like to believe you are not making all this up to deflect, please link.

[MiKT]

Thais investigating either of these men for any crime is completely pointless. They both have diplomatic immunity; which exists for situations just like this. All that could be done is pressure the State Department and Foreign Office to replace them. As others have said, that seems unlikely.

Cleary the British and American Ambassadors should join hands and sing Kumbaya outside the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to protest against the protestors.

Actually the two ambasdors, joined by the Ambasadors of many other nations should all be working together to present a severe censure of the Thai government for helping Chinese agents to pose as UN staff to trick the asylum granted prisoners into signing forged documents that porported to be papers allowing them to go to a UN country and then assisting in them being abducting to China.

[LomSak27]

Still waiting for Information, news article or link on those two who were jailed, Bim. I would like to believe you are not making all this up to deflect, please link.

[JAG]

Still waiting for Information, news article or link on those two who were jailed, Bim. I would like to believe you are not making all this up to deflect, please link.

I think you should be resigned to waiting for a very long time. Of course he made it up!

[LomSak27]

I think you should be resigned to waiting for a very long time. Of course he made it up!

Noooooooooo