Koh Tao: Suspects found guilty of murdering British backpackers

[IslandLover]

Was the finding of the sunglasses and phone near the accused home, ever discussed in court?

And if the DNA evidence was not permitted in the court, would the Burmese have walked?

They are both mentioned in the court judgement. The second defendant was sentenced to 1 year 6 months for theft at night and was ordered to reimburse 16.000 Baht to the descendants of the first victim.

That was for David Miller's phone.

[IslandLover]

Was the finding of the sunglasses and phone near the accused home, ever discussed in court?

And if the DNA evidence was not permitted in the court, would the Burmese have walked?

For the offense of theft at night charged to the second defendant, the prosecutor had a witness, who confirmed that the second defendant brought the exhibited mobile phone to the witness after the incident, claiming that the phone was forgotten by a foreigner at a shop. Moreover there is a witness who testified that the the second defendant confessed in the interrogation stage that he took the mobile phone and sunglasses of the first victim after he caused harm and raped the second victim.

PS I just see that Huh posted this already - albeit missing the first part and also the fist part of the second sentence also mentioning a witness (which incidentally was the cellmate of the B2).

How convenient to leave the part where witnesses are mentioned out.....

Not at all. HUH's post was in direct response to the question about the sunglasses. Nothing more, nothing less. This trial judgment SUMMARY is no secret and is widely available in the public domain for all to read. The full 64-page judgment is still being translated into English.

[aslimversgwm]

Well summarised

[DiscoDan]

I would imagine that this "cell mate" is now a free and wealthier man!

I am sorry but the phone story just sums up this whole case....farsical.

The more I hear about the trial the more convincing the argument that we are witnessing one of the most blatant and shameful set ups in recent living memory.

The cell mate was indeed released early December as he had finished his sentence.

What a surprise, and the other witness the room mate...was this the guy who was arrested at the same time as the 2 accused? The same guy who said the 2 accused were tucked up in bed and looking very normal in the hours after the murders?

They admitted to being on the beach at 2 am and again at 4am of course it is much more likely they were there the whole time. and never went home for a 2 hour power nap.

[berybert]

They moored there boats there because that side would have been shielded from the weather, so easy to drive out 500m and dump the bodies making the 1/2 and a half hour speed boat trip in bad weather wouldn't be so easy.

Any reason you think the Burmese didn't think to take the bodies out to sea and dump them ?

Or would they be worried who ever saw them kill two people might have got upset with them for using a boat ?

Edited December 29, 2015 by seedy
Quote hidden post

[catsanddogs]

Friends of Hannah and David must also be happy with the guilty verdict then. Those friends that would have excitedly discussed and planned their trips many months before September '14. The females came back minus their friend whose head had been smashed in. Not an everyday occurrence. Press reports stated 'friends said Hannah and David left the AC bar between 3 and 4am. No names in the press of who these friends were. For all we know the friends that made that statement may be non existent. Surely one friend would own up to stating that? Not exactly anything to be afraid of is it? There is a reason why we have heard nothing in the press regards any of the 'friends'. Not one of them have come forward to dispel the rumours that there was an altercation at the AC bar. Not one of them have come forward and said who was the last to see Hannah or David alive. Absolutely incredible and unbelievable! No statements requested by prosecution or defence in court from any of them? Why not? Last movements of the deceased etc etc. RTP said they took statements from the friends - were these read in court? And no CCTV from the AC bar only footage showing David entering the bar at the front. Pure speculation on the part of the police that Hannah and David left by the back door. Where are the bloody witnesses!!! Who saw what and why aren't you speaking up? Likely that drugs of some sort played a part in all this. Did all the friends simply stroll home to go to bed with no concern for their missing friends or where they up, wide awake, maybe off some of their faces and witnessed something they dare not speak of? I can only surmise that their attitude is two little Burmese nothings being sentenced to death is something they can easily live and is meaningless in comparison with losing their 'friends'.

Excellent post, catsanddogs.

Is there any prof they left the AC bar at all?

It would appear not. No CCTV. A statement from RTP saying 'friends said blah blah' - no names to that statement. Would like to see the evidence that they entered. Police very selective about what CCTV they wanted to be seen. Bet they regret running man and number 9 footage getting out. Got Maman to thank for that.

[DiscoDan]

If you was it walking and found a phone then got home later and found out there had been a murder where you found it would you ?

A) Go and see the police explain why you was near the crime scene and give them the phone.

smash it up and hide it

Also they smashed up the phone before or when Chris ware was a suspect so why would they think that they might be scapegoated.

And if your answer is they might have seen something and are not telling then they deserve what they get.

That phone could have had very important evidence on it.

For the truthers it could have been a a message saying NS is going to kill me. or a voice recordings of the attack., Photos or video from that night in the bar

But no the poor little B2 decided to destroy a phone worth more than they earn in a month

guilty guilty guilty

Edited December 28, 2015 by DiscoDan

[jing jing]

I would imagine that this "cell mate" is now a free and wealthier man!

I am sorry but the phone story just sums up this whole case....farsical.

The more I hear about the trial the more convincing the argument that we are witnessing one of the most blatant and shameful set ups in recent living memory.

The cell mate was indeed released early December as he had finished his sentence.

What a surprise, and the other witness the room mate...was this the guy who was arrested at the same time as the 2 accused? The same guy who said the 2 accused were tucked up in bed and looking very normal in the hours after the murders?

They admitted to being on the beach at 2 am and again at 4am of course it is much more likely they were there the whole time. and never went home for a 2 hour power nap.

If they were there, it is much more likely as an accessory after the fact, hapless pawns caught up in the vile misdeeds of those far more powerful than themselves.

Truly, have you no common sense, or any sense at all for that matter? To believe the RTP narrative in its entirety, as it seems you do, suggests not.

Are you aware that Khun Praween, the senior RTP investigator brought in to "clean up" the loose ends in this case is now a fugitive - err, refugee - in Australia, claiming that dark forces higher up in the RTP and military are trying to kill him?

[berybert]

They moored there boats there because that side would have been shielded from the weather, so easy to drive out 500m and dump the bodies making the 1/2 and a half hour speed boat trip in bad weather wouldn't be so easy.

Any reason you think the Burmese didn't think to take the bodies out to sea and dump them ?

Or would they be worried who ever saw them kill two people might have got upset with them for using a boat ?

Who ever did it was stupid enough to leave the murder weapon at the crime scene

They were stupid enough not to wear a condom

They were stupid enough to leave cig butts lying near the body

They were stupid enough to steal from the victims (sunglasses never found so presume stolen plus phone)

And then we have the B2

Stupid enough that they can't find a guitar where they left it

Stupid enough that they go back 2 hours later and still can't find it in the same place they left it

Stupid enough they can't find there clothes after leaving them next to a massive log they have been sitting on

Stupid enough that he goes back 2 hours later and still can't find his clothes

Stupid enough to smash up a phone and leave it behind his living quarters.

How many court cases do you think use DNA evidence in Burma ?

I bet the B2 never knew what Dna was and how it could connect you to a crime

Where as the other suspects like Sean Chris Ware and Nomsod all would.

I have no idea how many court cases in Burma use DNA evidence. But I look forward to you informing me.

You are aware if you ask a member of the RTP what DNA is, they will tell you it stands for 'do not ask'.

Was the murder weapon at the scene ? I thought one of your hero's had asked someone to move it and wash it. Why do you think he would have done that ? Because he didn't want the Burmese lads DNA to be found on it ? Nice that he was trying to help them out wasn't it.

Oh and if you believe David and Hannah or as you call her Victoria were killed by the same weapon then I'd have to deduce that by your reasoning you are Burmese.

Oh and as an after thought, if the Burmese are so stupid they managed to lose their clothes, what do you think of a police force that manages to lose a pair of sunglasses, a strand of hair that could belong to a killer and also Hannah's clothes ?

Edited December 29, 2015 by seedy
Quote hidden post

[smedly]

So, RTP- fanboys: you suggest, that there is evidence, that we haven't seen or heard about?!

Evidence, only some inner circle members (and the Miller- family) know about?!

Why exactly, would that be so?

Even the judge, who handed down the judgement said, that the case is flawed, but the DNA- evidence was the most compelling part (which means, in my reading: even that was flawed!).

So we have seen all the failures and fumbles, all the mistakes, all the "I don't know" and "it is used up".

We have seen the case been sent back a total of 3 times and we all have heard all the questions and all the doubts!

All that has been made public...but the ONE "evidence", that links the B2 to the crime without any doubt and so clear, that a death -sentence has been spoken...THAT part of evidence, is the only thing, that has been kept a secret?!

On what planet does that make ANY sense?

If the semen found inside Hannah's body was that of the B2 then that trumps EVERYTHING else. Nothing else matters, unless you think that they raped Hannah and then somebody else murdered them, which wouldn't actually make that much sense!!

again your making misleading statements

you are constantly making a statement that there was semen found - there has been no evidence of that produced let alone having such evidence made available for independent retest and I am talking about "ORIGINAL SAMPLES"

Like I have said many times now, would it not be in the best interest of the police and prosecution "if this evidence does indeed exist" to have it retested by the CIFS so as to remove any doubt that people have, and I stress again "THIS CAN ONLY BE ACCOMPLISHED USING ORIGINAL SAMPLES" the police chief says on record that they exist - so why not ?

my own thoughts are that no such evidence exists or ever existed - I would like to be proven wrong - I honestly would

I cannot believe there were 160 posts since this one, anyway, lets get that dna retested ....right ?

then everyone will be convinced, it is so simple - case closed

[cdnvic]

People who stir up trouble are being removed without further warning. Debate all you like but personal attacks and insults will not be tolerated.

[JLCrab]

The Criminal Procedure Code (Thailand) Section 193. An appeal on questions of fact and questions of law shall lie to the Appeal Court against any judgement or order of a Court of First Instance, except where such appeal is prohibited by this Code or other laws.

Every appeal must set forth in order a summary of facts or the points of law relied upon

The Criminal Procedure Code (Thailand) Section 198. The Appeal shall be filed with the Court of First Instance within one month from the date of judgement or order has been read or has been regarded as having been read to the party lodging the Appeal.

[NCFC]

Indeed this is correct. Now we are seeing posts along the line "I seem to remember...XYZ" when in fact what they remember is an unsubstantiated rumour posted on this forum twelve months ago.

Initially I too, thought the bar owners must be implicated but in over one year not a single piece of evidence has come to light linking the bar owners and associates to the crime. That is, evidence that would stand up in court when presented by defence lawyers.

I could easily make up my own rumours. That Mon, the sharkman or any from that gang committed this crime then they would have got rid of the evidence. The bodies would have been taken out on a boat, weighted with stones and dumped overboard.

They would not have left the bodies to be discovered in their own resort. That would have been ruinous for business.

But there is no cctv or witnesses that prove the gang was out at the time of the murders.

The only cctv evidence shows the b2 buying alchohol sometime before the murders and one or two skinny kids running around in a panic after the murders.

Why did the defence team put up such a poor show? Because they knew the two Burmese were guilty.

Spot on!

On the contrary, there is a photograph of Shark man and other members of the football team he was playing for in that weekend's tournament, out and about in the bars that night, still wearing their football strip. In fact I have a feeling David may have even been in the same picture. Anyone got it?, although I don't know if it's worth showing again as they will just move on to something else

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

[NCFC]

That morning I believe but I stand to be corrected.

yes stills showing him walking out of his residence the next morning at 9.15/30 (I forget which). This did not eliminate the possibility of him travelling back to Bangkok earlier that morning though which was logistically possible. Apparently there was also film of the apartment block showing he did not enter it that morning (via the front door anyway) but that was only shown to selected media organisations if I understood it correctly - which seems a bit odd. There was also his girlfriend at the time who apparently said she had been unable to contact him over the weekend.

How do they make a video of someone NOT entering? I guess they also have video then from me not entering that building.


Also strange that if he has been walking around the whole weekend on that very small island, that there is not a single picture or CCTV screen shot of him.

Whereas Cruncher much photography that you are seeking has been either destroyed, lost, hidden, damaged beyond repair or simply used up, there are several good pics of him taken by CCTV at the time of the tragedies. He is running, half naked carrying his left arm awkwardly as he always does ( his own kind of trademark pose) and he is in the vicinity of the incidents. Plenty of postings here show the footage I am referring to.

Are you ready to testify under oath in a court of law that the running man in the CCTV footage is Nomsod?

If not you should remove your post because you and this forum can be sued for defamation.

The penalties for perjury by the way are also pretty high I guess.

It's interesting how we see the same things in a different way. When I see the pictures of Nomsod he looks like a guy who either works out a bit or is doing some manual labour. Absolutely not a bodybuilder but he had a good upper body shape. But the bare chested kids in the cctv looked skinnier than Nomsod and more round shouldered. Just my opion of some extremely grainy footage but you can see why ot is difficult to pinpoint who the runner is.

[smedly]

Indeed this is correct. Now we are seeing posts along the line "I seem to remember...XYZ" when in fact what they remember is an unsubstantiated rumour posted on this forum twelve months ago.

Initially I too, thought the bar owners must be implicated but in over one year not a single piece of evidence has come to light linking the bar owners and associates to the crime. That is, evidence that would stand up in court when presented by defence lawyers.

I could easily make up my own rumours. That Mon, the sharkman or any from that gang committed this crime then they would have got rid of the evidence. The bodies would have been taken out on a boat, weighted with stones and dumped overboard.

They would not have left the bodies to be discovered in their own resort. That would have been ruinous for business.

But there is no cctv or witnesses that prove the gang was out at the time of the murders.

The only cctv evidence shows the b2 buying alchohol sometime before the murders and one or two skinny kids running around in a panic after the murders.

Why did the defence team put up such a poor show? Because they knew the two Burmese were guilty.

Spot on!

On the contrary, there is a photograph of Shark man and other members of the football team he was playing for in that weekend's tournament, out and about in the bars that night, still wearing their football strip. In fact I have a feeling David may have even been in the same picture. Anyone got it?, although I don't know if it's worth showing again as they will just move on to something else

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

I will answer your first question

If I was an investigating police officer I would have been very focused on the injuries to David, not so much the blunt trauma to the back of his head (likely caused by something heavy but not a blade) but the strange puncture wounds to other parts of his body, those injuries are not normal - in fact very unique, not a blade/knife because there would then be deep wounds (stabbing wounds) on other parts of his body, the puncture wounds from what I could see in the photos were caused by a very short blade with a thrust or punch, a good forensic pathologist would have no difficulty working out the sort of weapon that caused these wounds and yet there is no mention of it as far as I know, there would also likely be damage to the bone where these impacts took place, I have my own thoughts as to what caused these injuries as do many others, but no mention of it in anything I have read, looks to me like someones trademark, some chicken coward that managed to get a few punches in along with the wooden clubs his mates were using - a real man - right ?

[jimmybkk]

The British government and Cameron in particular should be ashamed of themselves. What happened to the policy of not getting involved in death penalty cases? UK cops conducting interviews with witnesses in the UK and passing that information to the Thai cops... The FCO releasing statements on behalf of the families endorsing the Thai investigation and declaring confidence in the guilt of the accused... Refusing to allow the defense access to the Met Police report...

And here we are with a guilty verdict and the death sentence handed down... Does it get any more contradictory than this? Well, maybe if you add that, according to The Guardian,: "This financial year, 2015-16, the Foreign Office is spending £600,000 on anti-death penalty projects."

This has blown up as bad as it is possible to blow up and heads should roll.

On top of this the FCO refrains from posting news of British nationals murdered in Thailand in a prominent position on its website for fear of damaging relations with Thailand, and so potentially places British citizens in harm's way.

Could this all be to say thank you to the Thai govt for not shouting and screaming at the UK govt about those bomb detectors a few years back, and instead letting some locals take the rap for them? It struck me that the UK govt got off very lightly considering that the FCO (FO at that time) were happily sending out letters of introduction and recommendation for the company selling these bomb detectors whilst uniformed members of the Royal Engineers were attending arms fairs giving demonstrations of the detectors. Put those two together and you've got yourself quite some sales pitch right there. Quite unbelievable...

The British cops were sent to Thailand at the UK taxpayer's expense, and it seems like that if anything that trip facilitated the guilty verdict and subsequent death penalty, or at least did absolutely nothing to prevent it, nor to finding out the truth as to what happened that night. And all the while government officials are speaking of the need for transparency... Personally I am disgusted that my taxes are being spent in such a fashion.

[NCFC]

The British government and Cameron in particular should be ashamed of themselves. What happened to the policy of not getting involved in death penalty cases? UK cops conducting interviews with witnesses in the UK and passing that information to the Thai cops... The FCO releasing statements on behalf of the families endorsing the Thai investigation and declaring confidence in the guilt of the accused... Refusing to allow the defense access to the Met Police report...

And here we are with a guilty verdict and the death sentence handed down... Does it get any more contradictory than this? Well, maybe if you add that, according to The Guardian,: "This financial year, 2015-16, the Foreign Office is spending £600,000 on anti-death penalty projects."

This has blown up as bad as it is possible to blow up and heads should roll.

On top of this the FCO refrains from posting news of British nationals murdered in Thailand in a prominent position on its website for fear of damaging relations with Thailand, and so potentially places British citizens in harm's way.

Could this all be to say thank you to the Thai govt for not shouting and screaming at the UK govt about those bomb detectors a few years back, and instead letting some locals take the rap for them? It struck me that the UK govt got off very lightly considering that the FCO (FO at that time) were happily sending out letters of introduction and recommendation for the company selling these bomb detectors whilst uniformed members of the Royal Engineers were attending arms fairs giving demonstrations of the detectors. Put those two together and you've got yourself quite some sales pitch right there. Quite unbelievable...

The British cops were sent to Thailand at the UK taxpayer's expense, and it seems like that if anything that trip facilitated the guilty verdict and subsequent death penalty, or at least did absolutely nothing to prevent it, nor to finding out the truth as to what happened that night. And all the while government officials are speaking of the need for transparency... Personally I am disgusted that my taxes are being spent in such a fashion.

Is it possible to get info through a freedom of information request? Anybody know?

[smedly]

I know what goes on on these islands and resorts, drink drugs young western girls having a break from uni for a few months become easy prey to these thugs, oh it's all fun until one of them rejects an advance from one of the locals if front of his thug mates, then it becomes a face issue and nasty - how dare she turn me down - falang pig, that is exactly how it is, these young girls are easy prey until they say no - then they get raped or murdered

[IslandLover]

NCFC, on 28 Dec 2015 - 22:56, said:

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

Neither Zaw Lin nor Wei Phyo worked at the AC bar. Zaw Lin worked at the Brother bar in Sairee and Wei Phyo worked at the Safety Stop bar in Mae Haad. Maung, Maung, the 3rd Burmese who was arrested with them, worked at the AC2 bar.

[SiSePuede419]

I would imagine that this "cell mate" is now a free and wealthier man!

I am sorry but the phone story just sums up this whole case....farsical.

The more I hear about the trial the more convincing the argument that we are witnessing one of the most blatant and shameful set ups in recent living memory.

The cell mate was indeed released early December as he had finished his sentence.

What a surprise, and the other witness the room mate...was this the guy who was arrested at the same time as the 2 accused? The same guy who said the 2 accused were tucked up in bed and looking very normal in the hours after the murders?

They admitted to being on the beach at 2 am and again at 4am of course it is much more likely they were there the whole time. and never went home for a 2 hour power nap.

Isn't meth pretty much guaranteed not to allow you to sleep for at least 10 hours or so?

If they were not doing "stimulants" then they probably would just sleep off their hangover.

If they were "speeding", even if they tried--they couldn't sleep a wink.

Maybe they saw something, ran off, tried to sleep and came back and then....?

They were involved, at least tangentially. Almost 100% sure they weren't the murderers.

But...could they have come back looking for their stuff they abandoned when they ran off, when the shit hit the fan, so to speak. They came back, seen the corpses and then had a "go" at the female victim?

No, they weren't the killers. But....

[bunglebag]

Indeed this is correct. Now we are seeing posts along the line "I seem to remember...XYZ" when in fact what they remember is an unsubstantiated rumour posted on this forum twelve months ago.

Initially I too, thought the bar owners must be implicated but in over one year not a single piece of evidence has come to light linking the bar owners and associates to the crime. That is, evidence that would stand up in court when presented by defence lawyers.

I could easily make up my own rumours. That Mon, the sharkman or any from that gang committed this crime then they would have got rid of the evidence. The bodies would have been taken out on a boat, weighted with stones and dumped overboard.

They would not have left the bodies to be discovered in their own resort. That would have been ruinous for business.

But there is no cctv or witnesses that prove the gang was out at the time of the murders.

The only cctv evidence shows the b2 buying alchohol sometime before the murders and one or two skinny kids running around in a panic after the murders.

Why did the defence team put up such a poor show? Because they knew the two Burmese were guilty.

Spot on!

On the contrary, there is a photograph of Shark man and other members of the football team he was playing for in that weekend's tournament, out and about in the bars that night, still wearing their football strip. In fact I have a feeling David may have even been in the same picture. Anyone got it?, although I don't know if it's worth showing again as they will just move on to something else

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

A few thousand people live on the entire island. You think they were all on sairee beach that night?

All I was doing was correcting your assertion that there was no proof that any of the gang were out that night by highlighting a picture showing both sharkman and david within metres of each other

[smedly]

The British government and Cameron in particular should be ashamed of themselves. What happened to the policy of not getting involved in death penalty cases? UK cops conducting interviews with witnesses in the UK and passing that information to the Thai cops... The FCO releasing statements on behalf of the families endorsing the Thai investigation and declaring confidence in the guilt of the accused... Refusing to allow the defense access to the Met Police report...

And here we are with a guilty verdict and the death sentence handed down... Does it get any more contradictory than this? Well, maybe if you add that, according to The Guardian,: "This financial year, 2015-16, the Foreign Office is spending £600,000 on anti-death penalty projects."

This has blown up as bad as it is possible to blow up and heads should roll.

On top of this the FCO refrains from posting news of British nationals murdered in Thailand in a prominent position on its website for fear of damaging relations with Thailand, and so potentially places British citizens in harm's way.

Could this all be to say thank you to the Thai govt for not shouting and screaming at the UK govt about those bomb detectors a few years back, and instead letting some locals take the rap for them? It struck me that the UK govt got off very lightly considering that the FCO (FO at that time) were happily sending out letters of introduction and recommendation for the company selling these bomb detectors whilst uniformed members of the Royal Engineers were attending arms fairs giving demonstrations of the detectors. Put those two together and you've got yourself quite some sales pitch right there. Quite unbelievable...

The British cops were sent to Thailand at the UK taxpayer's expense, and it seems like that if anything that trip facilitated the guilty verdict and subsequent death penalty, or at least did absolutely nothing to prevent it, nor to finding out the truth as to what happened that night. And all the while government officials are speaking of the need for transparency... Personally I am disgusted that my taxes are being spent in such a fashion.

Is it possible to get info through a freedom of information request? Anybody know?

The British police that came to Thailand observed only - that means they were given a brief on the case evidence etc not much more than anyone else knows, they may have asked a few questions and got answers like - yes we have dna match - can you show us - yes here is the paper from the our lab

I know exactly what thoughts they went away with but there is no way they could go public with that, they came - they looked - the Thai police told them what they had - then they went home

It's the same as the PM, he has been under advisement from his police chiefs - he is not a detective - he is not a forensic scientist - he has to accept what he is being told by the people that he trusts to be doing their job, he will still be asking what is going on here - and he will be getting the same answer - the dna results (we say we have) are true .....honest..........no there is no need to have them retested by the CIFS because that would open a can of worms......

[smedly]

NCFC, on 28 Dec 2015 - 22:56, said:

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

Neither Zaw Lin nor Wei Phyo worked at the AC bar. Zaw Lin worked at the Brother bar in Sairee and Wei Phyo worked at the Safety Stop bar in Mae Haad. Maung, Maung, the 3rd Burmese who was arrested with them, worked at the AC2 bar.

didn't they eventually find their missing guitar that night/morning in AC bar - the one they were playing on the beach that went missing, that has always been a mystery to me yet to be explained, doesn't really make a huge difference either way but it did get from the beach to the bar along with some clothes I think

[IslandLover]

smedly, on 29 Dec 2015 - 00:14, said:

IslandLover, on 28 Dec 2015 - 23:55, said:

NCFC, on 28 Dec 2015 - 22:56, said:NCFC, on 28 Dec 2015 - 22:56, said:

A few thousand people were out and about that night. Where is the defining evidence to link Sharkman to the murder?

Didn't one or both of the B2 work in AC bar? There is evidence that they were on the beach, too. I wonder if they had done some meth that night? Does crazy stuff to people. The b2 also admitted to returning to the beach to collect stuff they left behind. What little evidence there is, and admittedly it is not much, keeps coming back to the B2.

Neither Zaw Lin nor Wei Phyo worked at the AC bar. Zaw Lin worked at the Brother bar in Sairee and Wei Phyo worked at the Safety Stop bar in Mae Haad. Maung, Maung, the 3rd Burmese who was arrested with them, worked at the AC2 bar.

didn't they eventually find their missing guitar that night/morning in AC bar - the one they were playing on the beach that went missing, that has always been a mystery to me yet to be explained, doesn't really make a huge difference either way but it did get from the beach to the bar along with some clothes I think

The guitar was found in the AC2 bar/restaurant where Maung Maung worked. It was found by a relative of Mon's, who was described in court as his "chef". You will have to look at a map of Sairee beach to see its location but it is much closer to the log where they had been sitting than the AC bar is. The B2 testified in court that they went swimming in front of the Maya Beach Club which is next door, or very close to the AC2 bar. In any event all this is 60-70 meters from where the bodies were found at the end of Sairee beach.

[JLCrab]

The British government and Cameron in particular should be ashamed of themselves. What happened to the policy of not getting involved in death penalty cases? UK cops conducting interviews with witnesses in the UK and passing that information to the Thai cops... The FCO releasing statements on behalf of the families endorsing the Thai investigation and declaring confidence in the guilt of the accused... Refusing to allow the defense access to the Met Police report...

And here we are with a guilty verdict and the death sentence handed down... Does it get any more contradictory than this? Well, maybe if you add that, according to The Guardian,: "This financial year, 2015-16, the Foreign Office is spending £600,000 on anti-death penalty projects."

This has blown up as bad as it is possible to blow up and heads should roll.

On top of this the FCO refrains from posting news of British nationals murdered in Thailand in a prominent position on its website for fear of damaging relations with Thailand, and so potentially places British citizens in harm's way.

Could this all be to say thank you to the Thai govt for not shouting and screaming at the UK govt about those bomb detectors a few years back, and instead letting some locals take the rap for them? It struck me that the UK govt got off very lightly considering that the FCO (FO at that time) were happily sending out letters of introduction and recommendation for the company selling these bomb detectors whilst uniformed members of the Royal Engineers were attending arms fairs giving demonstrations of the detectors. Put those two together and you've got yourself quite some sales pitch right there. Quite unbelievable...

The British cops were sent to Thailand at the UK taxpayer's expense, and it seems like that if anything that trip facilitated the guilty verdict and subsequent death penalty, or at least did absolutely nothing to prevent it, nor to finding out the truth as to what happened that night. And all the while government officials are speaking of the need for transparency... Personally I am disgusted that my taxes are being spent in such a fashion.

Is it possible to get info through a freedom of information request? Anybody know?

Exemptions to UK Freedom of Information Act (2000) Part II

32. Court records, etc.

(1)Information held by a public authority is exempt information if it is held only by virtue of being contained in—

(a)any document filed with, or otherwise placed in the custody of, a court for the purposes of proceedings in a particular cause or matter,

(b )any document served upon, or by, a public authority for the purposes of proceedings in a particular cause or matter, or

©any document created by—

(i)a court, or

(ii)a member of the administrative staff of a court,

for the purposes of proceedings in a particular cause or matter.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/36/contents

Edited December 28, 2015 by JLCrab

[CP3]

We are all speculating here. As much as we have doubts on the facts, don't we think the defense team will argue and have to rebuke all those prosecutor's claims?

[smotherb]

So, RTP- fanboys: you suggest, that there is evidence, that we haven't seen or heard about?!

Evidence, only some inner circle members (and the Miller- family) know about?!

Why exactly, would that be so?

Even the judge, who handed down the judgement said, that the case is flawed, but the DNA- evidence was the most compelling part (which means, in my reading: even that was flawed!).

So we have seen all the failures and fumbles, all the mistakes, all the "I don't know" and "it is used up".

We have seen the case been sent back a total of 3 times and we all have heard all the questions and all the doubts!

All that has been made public...but the ONE "evidence", that links the B2 to the crime without any doubt and so clear, that a death -sentence has been spoken...THAT part of evidence, is the only thing, that has been kept a secret?!

On what planet does that make ANY sense?

If the semen found inside Hannah's body was that of the B2 then that trumps EVERYTHING else. Nothing else matters, unless you think that they raped Hannah and then somebody else murdered them, which wouldn't actually make that much sense!!

again your making misleading statements

you are constantly making a statement that there was semen found - there has been no evidence of that produced let alone having such evidence made available for independent retest and I am talking about "ORIGINAL SAMPLES"

Like I have said many times now, would it not be in the best interest of the police and prosecution "if this evidence does indeed exist" to have it retested by the CIFS so as to remove any doubt that people have, and I stress again "THIS CAN ONLY BE ACCOMPLISHED USING ORIGINAL SAMPLES" the police chief says on record that they exist - so why not ?

my own thoughts are that no such evidence exists or ever existed - I would like to be proven wrong - I honestly would

I cannot believe there were 160 posts since this one, anyway, lets get that dna retested ....right ?

then everyone will be convinced, it is so simple - case closed

What DNA would that be? Isn't it more than possible that DNA was mishandled?

[DM07]

Name one!

Name one civilized country, where this happens and goes unpunished, if it comes to the light!

"All they said"..."punched and that a plastic bag was put over their head"?

ALL?

For the love of God, man...stop talking out of your anus!

You know, what a plastic bag over your head does, right?!

Now imagine, you are in a 'safe house" with some dudes, who want to pin a murder on you!

You are loathsome!

Heard of Guantanamo Bay?

Yes that was all that was said. Have you read otherwise? If so provide me with a link.

Yes a plastic bag over your head if tight enough can suffocate. But was that said by the defendants?

Oh I can very well imagine what it is like to be threatened as I have been in quite a similar situation before during an armed robbery.

Oh boy...you are really are something!

1) we are talking about POLICE, aren't we?

Guantanamo Bay is a military base and what happens there has nothing to do, with "police" in "civilized countries" getting confessions out of suspects, by torture on a daily basis!

And mind you: what ever goes on there, was part of a congressional investigation, which findings were widely condemned by "civilized nations" the world over and even in the US!

So- again- NAME ONE!

2) If I were to believe your little folksy story about the "armed robbery" (which I do not! Not for a second!)- how is that anywhere near being tortured?

The fact, that you put your "knife to the throat"- story on par with "torture", shows, that you are talking out of the lower end of your digestive system!

You might take a look at your (inadequate) Guantanamo- example: waterboarding, sleep deprevation, anal feeding, beatings etc.!

On what planet is that the same as "being threatened"

That is like saying "I know, how it is to get a bullet to your stomache! I once was in a car accident and broke my arm!"

But here is the thing: please prove, that you were in that "threatening" situation.

Within the next 5 days, send me a) a copy of your passport or ID, b ) another picture of yourself (no head- wear, sunglasses...) and c) a newspaper clip, that links you to an "armed robbery"! ( I am sure you or your mommy have such a clip, as you were in that traumatizing situation)!

So...prove it!

No pressure!

You have time!

No one is beating you, no one is trying to suffocate you and if you choose not to prove it, you will not loose your health, life or sanity (...oh...well...)!

You are a comical genius!

[asiamaster]

They moored there boats there because that side would have been shielded from the weather, so easy to drive out 500m and dump the bodies making the 1/2 and a half hour speed boat trip in bad weather wouldn't be so easy.

Any reason you think the Burmese didn't think to take the bodies out to sea and dump them ?

Or would they be worried who ever saw them kill two people might have got upset with them for using a boat ?

Oh they may have thought to do that (although probably not smart enough to do so) but what boat to use? You're not trying to tell me that they owned a boat are you?

Edited December 29, 2015 by asiamaster

[seedy]

One post with a threat hidden

If you want your warning count to increase, post like this again.