US prepared for military solution to ISIL

[Happy Grumpy]

Looks like the US is going to get it's arse handed to them on a plate.

again.

[Publicus]

Every single muslim related issue the Obama administration has touched upon has furthered islamic jihad. This is not indictment or conjecture, this is fact. Among the vast treasures extended to Islamic States and the Muslim Brotherhood under Obama & Company is something for more precious than money or arms, legitimacy. Obama & Company have made great use of "time" as a solvent to break down resistance to undesired policies or make de facto situations they otherwise state they do not support. Time, the passing of time is equivalent to legitimacy in the case of DAESH.

Obama's dolt at the State Department offered what has now been called a "jobs for jihadis" strategy to battle DAESH. Other similarly minded people offer DAESH is a result of climate change. Anything to keep looking at the left hand while the right hand moves the cards on the table. The US military has repeatedly made clear that the US administration thumbs down nearly all tactical and strategic recommendations, including sortie strikes. The US administration has clearly not been battling DAESH and by Obama's own recent admission, there is no strategy. The public perception balloons to measure response such as jobs for jihadis climate change etc., are designed to keep perceptions unbalanced to enable... time to pass, and further legitimacy to be extended. The US could have wiped DAESH from the earth in months. But then of course DAESH is not the problem, just a symptom.

"...US prepared for military solution to..." DAESH is Orwellian Doublespeak. Be careful what the US administration tells you it is aiming toward/for. With a renewed Authorization for the use of military force effectively any place on earth the US is now poised to employ its military in a manner that may not at all be what people expect. Remember, Obama does not see DAESH the way the world does. Its clear he does not approach DAESH the same way. He does not remotely perceive causation the same as others. Thus, his use of military power should be of grave concern and he has been recently handed grave powers regarding this.

It needs reiteration the right is dense, slow, passe' in its attitudes.

That is in addition to its drumbeat presentation of political spam from the fringe.

The hawk SecDef Ashton Carter is in charge. Short of nuking somebody, which Carter would not consider doing, President Obama is not going to say no to him.

President Obama recognises coordinated and integrated action needs to be taken against Daesh. Just no war, period.

It is nonsense to be pushing alarm buttons concerning "Authorization for the use of military force." President Obama will absolutely not allow his departure legacy to be defined by leaving another war behind for the American people and yet another POTUS to have to deal with.

Bash Daesh yes. Bash Daesh out of effective existence, for sure. Another war absolutely not.

Obama & Company have made great use of "time" as a solvent to break down resistance to undesired policies or make de facto situations they otherwise state they do not support. Anything to keep looking at the left hand while the right hand moves the cards on the table.

A child can follow both hands at work in these statements. Always and every repugnant time.

[manarak]

One of the first things to remember is that much of the appeal of ISIS is to young, disenfranchised people in foreign countries. It's roots may lie in the former Iraqi military regime of Saddam Hussein, but the muscle is provided by the young.

Many of these young people are not looking for any sort of religious salvation. They are like the young everywhere, they are after their own version of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll. For them the sex is everything from the jihadi brides, to the Yazidis sex slaves, the drugs are a variety of amphetamine products that give them a high and the rock-n-roll is the sound of guns and bombs.

Until there are efforts to deal with and provide jobs and education for many of the youth (along with reducing the birth rate and increasing the standard of living), this group will be a problem that will nag humanity.

They are not unlike the baby boomers, but we had better drugs and music.

They are a serious twist on the folly of youth.

So, we give them jobs and education and they will stop cutting heads off??? What drugs are you on?? Bomb and kill every last one of them....

I am not on any drugs, but I have dealt with groups of demilitarized soldiers in a number of countries. The vast majority became involved in militant actions when they were young -- some very young -- child soldiers, in fact.

Once the wars end, they have no usable skills. The only thing they can do is fight and kill.

In as much as possible, we need to prevent young people from joining these groups. Once they join, the outcome is not going to be very positive. They will kill or be killed and they will never have a chance at a reasonable life.

It's done in the name of religion, but the vast majority are not very religious.

As you say, once they joined it get difficult.

Well, there is a whole bunch who joined already, they have to be mopped up and the religious leaders eliminated before the region can be pacified.

Edited January 24, 2016 by manarak

[craigt3365]

Biden beats his lips; the Russians beat on ISIS (ISIL, Daesh).

Actually, Russia is bombing anti-Assad rebels. Ones who are also trying to fight ISIL and Daesh. Many civilians have been killed by these air raids. Lots.

[craigt3365]

I am not on any drugs, but I have dealt with groups of demilitarized soldiers in a number of countries. The vast majority became involved in militant actions when they were young -- some very young -- child soldiers, in fact.

Once the wars end, they have no usable skills. The only thing they can do is fight and kill.

In as much as possible, we need to prevent young people from joining these groups. Once they join, the outcome is not going to be very positive. They will kill or be killed and they will never have a chance at a reasonable life.

It's done in the name of religion, but the vast majority are not very religious.

Clearly understanding the causes is part of the solution. I didn't take your post as thinking we could hold hands and sing Kumbaya as a solution.

We can't just assume we can kill a bunch of them, not help nurture an environment that leads to violent extremism and then think it will all work out. That said, I think we are pretty limited in what we can do with regards to changing the culture. I believe trying to do so as outsiders would be virtually impossible. I am certainly no expert and could be wrong. In the end, I believe it is up to the people there to understand what their problems are and how to fix them.

As is the case most of the time, the problems were created by the leadership of their country. Peaceful protesters who were shot at and killed. Things escalated from there.

Egypt tried an experiment many years ago. There was an area between Cairo and Luxor where rebels were, ones who were carrying out attacks. They went in and created jobs for them. After this, they became family men, stopped the attacks and moved on. I'll try to find the article about this. As in happening in Tunisia right now, unemployment is a huge problem with the youth.

[slipperylobster]

Nothing has been learned. The politicians still act like they can "win" a war against ISIS. It is a nonsense. ISIS is just strict Islam, they are good muslims as it were. The solution is staggeringly simple, just boot them back to their own countries where they can behave like barbarians until the camels come home, with nobody to care or criticize. Trying to force these muslims to accept freedom, democracy, womens rights is absolutely impossible, so why bother?

I just hope the US doesn't end up in the crazy situation modern Germany is in nowadays, that being that if a women wears perfume, and doesn't cover every inch of skin, that she deserves to be raped.

you make it sound easy... boot them back to their own countries. How is that going to happen?

[slipperylobster]

Biden beats his lips; the Russians beat on ISIS (ISIL, Daesh).

Actually, Russia is bombing anti-Assad rebels. Ones who are also trying to fight ISIL and Daesh. Many civilians have been killed by these air raids. Lots.

connda not reading the news...eh?

It has been the USA bombing the crap out of ISIS for years. Targeting leaders, with some success there.

[craigt3365]

Biden beats his lips; the Russians beat on ISIS (ISIL, Daesh).

Actually, Russia is bombing anti-Assad rebels. Ones who are also trying to fight ISIL and Daesh. Many civilians have been killed by these air raids. Lots.

connda not reading the news...eh?

It has been the USA bombing the crap out of ISIS for years. Targeting leaders, with some success there.

Many don't want to accept the fact Russia is not actually always bombing IS targets. Just there to prop up Assad. Even though they are getting tired of him! LOL

The biggest problem is the money and arms coming in from Iran and other Arab states. It's become a huge religious proxy war. And the citizens are paying the price. Some 4 million are now displaced. One half are children. Most are in neighboring countries.

[simple1]

Biden beats his lips; the Russians beat on ISIS (ISIL, Daesh).

Actually, Russia is bombing anti-Assad rebels. Ones who are also trying to fight ISIL and Daesh. Many civilians have been killed by these air raids. Lots.

connda not reading the news...eh?

It has been the USA bombing the crap out of ISIS for years. Targeting leaders, with some success there.

Many don't want to accept the fact Russia is not actually always bombing IS targets. Just there to prop up Assad. Even though they are getting tired of him! LOL

The biggest problem is the money and arms coming in from Iran and other Arab states. It's become a huge religious proxy war. And the citizens are paying the price. Some 4 million are now displaced. One half are children. Most are in neighboring countries.

The 4 million plus in bordering countries are the tip of the iceberg, with an additional 7.5 million IDPs. Analysts expect these numbers to increase as the fighting intensifies for land grabs prior to any 'political' solutions.

Syria war: The plight of internally displaced people

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34189117

[derator01]

Please stick to the topic.

[Publicus]

SecDef Ashton Carter recently completed the rounds in the ME and Nato to hash these things out.

He's in charge.

VP Biden's statement is of a great importance to the region that needs to know the US is pro-actively committed to the peace process as it's trying to establish itself.

If it does not, SecDef Carter will ply his trade.

The juxtaposition of the words pro-actively committed and Obama administration does make me chuckle.

The hardheaded right can't get much that connects to reality.

Ashton Carter is in charge the rest of the way. He'll very likely stay on if the D wins the election and becomes potus the next four years. Carter has directly served or formally advised 11 secretaries of defense.

We needed Ash Carter to succeed Bob Gates. Hawks instead had to overcome Chuck Hagel as secdef which was less challenging than precluding Hegle's appointment had been.

Carter ended 15 years of US strategic ambiguity to ID Russia as enemy Number One. He put new nuclear warheads in Germany and Turkey, put the US Navy in the South China Sea and he's made the rounds in the ME to get everyone on the same page.

Nobody's looking for a war. It's a matter of mustering and integrating available and new resources to get rid of Daesh militarily. Which means when the peace negotiations fail as they must fail due to divisions, the dividers will be excluded from the combined military effort that will occur.

Daesh can't be allowed to go on indefintely and neither can Assad to include Putin. Recall Ash Carter in 2006 publicly advocated precision strikes against North Korean missile test sites which should have been done then and there. Governments in the ME, Daesh, Moscow, Beijing, Iran et all know Carter means business and that he's in charge the rest of the year.

The set in stone right already have iron domes so one can go ahead to advise the rest of us to get the hardhats on and to fasten the chinstrap on each one.

Yes..and with thousands of artillery pieces pointed at Seoul that would have been a very effective thing to do right ? More bluster without any real thought behind it. Dismantle their ballistic missile test sites and get the capital of South Korea destroyed....good tit for tat. What's next after that...bomb Pyongyang ? Ahd what's next after that ? Again...knuckleheaded thinking.

More bluster without any real thought behind it.

It is not simple neither is it empty minded. To think it is so is to make a severe error of judgement and reflects a deficiency of analytical abilities of the self and of responsible others. Even Daesh knows better than to adopt such an attitude.

Here are the present SecDef Carter's own words concerning his position from the time he'd been AsstSecDef for International Security Policy to SecDef William Cohen during the Clinton Adminsration. The analysis of the North Korea nuclear program to the present is considerably thought through, from the posture of brinkmanship in particular.

"Everyone could appreciate the magnitude of the damage that North Korea could do, if it chose to respond to a strike on Yongbyon [by attacking South Korea]. Now, if we did it properly, if it came to this option, one would say to the North Koreans in advance, "Yes, you can lash out at South Korea after we mount this attack. That will be the end of your regime." So after the strike on Yongbyon, the ball's in their court.

"Now what we couldn't do was assure anyone, and I'm sure the secretary of defense couldn't assure the president, that North Korea would not, irrationally lash out and begin that war. They say they would. So we would be calling their bluff. Therefore, there were substantial risks associated with carrying that out that attack, although it would surely set back their nuclear program. That was a risk that I certainly felt at the time, and feel now, was worth running in light of the enormous risks to our security associated with letting North Korea go nuclear."

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/kim/interviews/acarter.html

It needs noting the interview was conducted in 2003.

The Kim regime had been assisting Syria to construct its nuclear plant that Israel precision bombed a year after Carter made his 2006 statements concerning Yongbyon (co-authored with former SecDef William Perry). Think of what Syria, Daesh and other conflicts between Sunni and Shia would be like the past five or six years had the plant been left to its completion. North Korea, Iran, Pakistan are feeding things nuclear in central Asia and in Asia minor and Syria had been a client.

The nuclear deal with Iran is significant and may not have been possible had a nuclear plant been allowed in Syria. There however can be no Iran kind of deal with Pyongyang which leaves only one approach to deal with 'em, i.e., the calculated and forward one. The South Korean government is not objecting or complaining btw.

[arjunadawn]

Create crisis; provide solution!

That the headline on any news piece in 2016 can read "US military prepared..." for anything regarding DAESH is laughable. Under the guise of the intractable problem of DAESH (brought to this day by both creating it and the refusal to do anything about it) the US and its Western lapdogs now have a plausible entry point into Syria directly- the world calling for action (create problem, provide solution). This military entry was never the plan rather Russia's direct presence requires the US and its sycophants to meet Russian presence headlong. The goal remains, however: Create a collective sunni counterweight to shia hegemony in the Persian arc to Beirut. The US will seek to force an outcome that permits Assad an exit, ideally Russian face saving, and a shakeup of the 'appearance' of DAESH.

DAESH, in its current incarnation, may not survive but the notion of the caliphate will (the fact is, DAESH could have been wiped out in months). Turkey, with its current leadership supports DAESH less than it supports the notion of the caliphate. The Muslim Brotherhood supports DAESH less than the notion of the caliphate. Sunni islamic actors support DAESH less than the notion of the caliphate. Turkey supports the Muslim Brotherhood. The US supports the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood has been pushing for a caliphate all along. Expect the US to appear to strike DAESH hard and other actors to step into the vacuum. DAESH will appear to morph but the fools overlook the fact that DAESH is not global. No change in the structure of DAESH locally will impact bay'ah oaths internationally. It will be the equivalent of beating a hornets' nest with a stick, the hornets are still deadly, but then everywhere.

The world should be as equally concerned about the legitimacy/authorization of military force further extended to Obama as Commander in Chief by the congress. This executive now has a green light to wage war... anywhere on earth! I have a candidate for best American actor in a leading role and choreographer- President Obama in "Nobel Peace Prize: They Gave me What?"

(My above comment is related to the Wag the Dog movie and the current Oscar controversy. This is what Obama is doing with respect to DAESH, "wagging the dog." Choreography. However, his goal is not an Oscar and the actors are in a very different union).

[Publicus]

Create crisis; provide solution!

That the headline on any news piece in 2016 can read "US military prepared..." for anything regarding DAESH is laughable. Under the guise of the intractable problem of DAESH (brought to this day by both creating it and the refusal to do anything about it) the US and its Western lapdogs now have a plausible entry point into Syria directly- the world calling for action (create problem, provide solution). This military entry was never the plan rather Russia's direct presence requires the US and its sycophants to meet Russian presence headlong. The goal remains, however: Create a collective sunni counterweight to shia hegemony in the Persian arc to Beirut. The US will seek to force an outcome that permits Assad an exit, ideally Russian face saving, and a shakeup of the 'appearance' of DAESH.

DAESH, in its current incarnation, may not survive but the notion of the caliphate will (the fact is, DAESH could have been wiped out in months). Turkey, with its current leadership supports DAESH less than it supports the notion of the caliphate. The Muslim Brotherhood supports DAESH less than the notion of the caliphate. Sunni islamic actors support DAESH less than the notion of the caliphate. Turkey supports the Muslim Brotherhood. The US supports the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood has been pushing for a caliphate all along. Expect the US to appear to strike DAESH hard and other actors to step into the vacuum. DAESH will appear to morph but the fools overlook the fact that DAESH is not global. No change in the structure of DAESH locally will impact bay'ah oaths internationally. It will be the equivalent of beating a hornets' nest with a stick, the hornets are still deadly, but then everywhere.

The world should be as equally concerned about the legitimacy/authorization of military force further extended to Obama as Commander in Chief by the congress. This executive now has a green light to wage war... anywhere on earth! I have a candidate for best American actor in a leading role and choreographer- President Obama in "Nobel Peace Prize: They Gave me What?"

(My above comment is related to the Wag the Dog movie and the current Oscar controversy. This is what Obama is doing with respect to DAESH, "wagging the dog." Choreography. However, his goal is not an Oscar and the actors are in a very different union).

Got it the first time btw.

This military entry was never the plan

This is certainly a different and in fact opposite tack to the chronic assertion of White House designs that are perpetually supposed to be duplicitous and nefarious. It is at the least an interesting twist to the predictable charges of a subterfuge directed by the usual suspects at 1600 against the interests and national security of the United States. The insane charges.

The goal remains, however: Create a collective sunni counterweight to shia hegemony in the Persian arc to Beirut.

This is a good box to check and implement. Green light on this one indeed. Whether or not however this might be exactly that seems an open question. If it is the real thing, then it would be for the right reasons and means. Which leads to the next point...

The world should be as equally concerned about the legitimacy/authorization of military force further extended to Obama as Commander in Chief by the congress.

No cause of concern here cause that's exactly how the system works under the Constitution.

Kindly recognise that beyond the fact potus is CinC, the Pentagon veteran SecDef Ashton Carter is running the military show globally to include in the ME especially, and that the present vote of the Congress to authorize new powers in the application of military force is the direct result of this new reality. Carter has set out to arrest the trends of recent years and he is going to accomplish this purpose and goal, short term and long term.

So be advised It is not only cinema that the force awakens.