Sanders transforms into contender, still pitches revolution

[rooster59]

Sanders transforms into contender, still pitches revolution

KEN THOMAS, Associated Press
CATHERINE LUCEY, Associated Press


MASON CITY, Iowa (AP) — Bernie Sanders' stump speech offers "radical" ideas and a voice rising in outrage as he describes the plight of a disappearing middle class, retirees scraping by on meager Social Security payments and recent college graduates struggling with debt.

But the Vermont senator now also has the sheen of a contender.

He peppers audiences with his favorable poll numbers and describes what a "Sanders administration" might offer. He takes selfies along the rope line as David Bowie's "Starman" blares over the loudspeakers and now weaves quips into his long-winded speeches.

Eight months into a once far-fetched campaign, the democratic socialist has evolved into a more polished, more professional candidate.

His message of political revolution still draws big crowds — more than 14,000 people flocked to a recent event in St. Paul, Minnesota — but his Iowa events are more intimate and personal. He asks for names before people ask their questions and he surveys the crowd to find the person with the largest college debt or health care deductible, likening himself to a "Vermont auctioneer."

Sanders rips into Republican Donald Trump at most stops. But he also copies from the billionaire's playbook by rattling off poll numbers that he says show he'd be a tougher opponent against Trump than Democratic rival Hillary Clinton.

Sanders is also more willing to jab in Clinton's direction, even while professing to be running a positive campaign.

He has all the trappings of a major candidate, too: a flush campaign bank account, a campaign bus, occasional rides on a chartered jet. Outside of events, vendors hawk his image on T-shirts, buttons and hats. Inside, a series of on-theme songs — Tracy Chapman's "Talkin' Bout a Revolution," for instance — play before he takes the stage.

Known for a serious demeanor, Sanders, 74, has started showing more of a playful side. When MSNBC's Andrea Mitchell asked him about releasing a doctor's letter attesting to his "overall very good health," Sanders clenched his fists and broke into a mock shadow boxing session. "Do I get involved in senior boxing — challenge, go for the light-heavyweight championship, or run for president?" he asked.

Sanders told The Associated Press that he's "not always a grumpy old guy. I do have a sense of humor."

Part of his appeal has been cultivated by comedian Larry David's portrayal of Sanders on "Saturday Night Live" as a blunt, cranky politician screaming of revolution.

Actor Justin Long noted the similarities when he introduced Sanders in Des Moines this week.

"Neither Larry or Bernie are known for their flashy dress — sorry sir — or polished, slick appearance. Both men have had similar struggles with hair growth or loss. Both men speak with a similarly unfiltered tone, a cadence that suggests what they're saying 'NEEDS TO BE HEARD AT ALL COSTS EVEN IF IT'S JUST ABOUT A DELICIOUS PASTRAMI SANDWICH!'"

-- (c) Associated Press 2016-01-31

[Rimmer]

A post has been removed, if you wish your post to remain up please use the correct names to describe the various parties, thank you

[hawker9000]

Once a headache to the Clinton campaign, now become a major headache. ...Among other major headaches. Or maybe it's actually more of a 'perfect storm' thing.

Lots of luck, Hillary!

[Ulic]

The US is a lumbering oil tanker with massive momentum and the best a president can

do is deflect its direction a little. Sanders desire for a single payer health care system

is far, far, better than Obama care which yes has got a couple of good points, and has

brought millions into the coverage fold, but it has made billions for insurance companies

and healthcare providers. That is how I know it is a crap program. Bernie's policies and

ideas are great, but it will not be possible for him to implement any of them. That is

the reality of the US system. A vote for Bernie in the primaries is a vote for the GOP

and looking increasingly like Donald Trump in the election. I find the entire US electoral

process fascinating, and this years even more so.

[Johnpound46]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

[scorecard]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

But I hope they don't install an over the top capitalist.

There is more and more evidence that rampant capitalism is making the rich richer and rapidly owning more and more of the overall wealth.

IMHO there needs to be a much better balance of capitalism and socialism (socialism not communism) or the consequences could be pretty nasty, in all countries.

[Jingthing]

Some people have made a thing about Bernie being a Jew but only about 10 percent of Americans say they wouldn't vote for someone just based on being a Jew.

But he has too MUCH BIGGER political problems.

A very large percentage of Americans will never vote for an atheist.

Also, a very large percentage of Americans will never vote for socialist.

Bernie recently "came out" as not associating himself with religiosity which is short of saying he's an atheist, but it's close enough.

People, forget this guy.

It's hopeless!

Those two things are simply insurmountable going into the general election, if he's nominated.

[chilli42]

Its an interesting race. Trump is the master of running a modern campaign based on shaping public opinion. Sanders is creating a movement based on ideas. So far the rest of them are just background noise. If for some reason HRC wins the Presidential race it will only be because Sanders gave her the slap in the face she needed to wake up and express a point of view.

[boomerangutang]

Some people have made a thing about Bernie being a Jew but only about 10 percent of Americans say they wouldn't vote for someone just based on being a Jew.

But he has too MUCH BIGGER political problems.

A very large percentage of Americans will never vote for an atheist.

Also, a very large percentage of Americans will never vote for socialist.

Bernie recently "came out" as not associating himself with religiosity which is short of saying he's an atheist, but it's close enough.

People, forget this guy.

It's hopeless!

Those two things are simply insurmountable going into the general election, if he's nominated.

What's this 'very large percentage' thing. What polls are you referring to?

Also, a very large percentage of Americans will never vote for socialist.

Show me one American who does not benefit from several socialist programs. There are none. As soon as the knuckle draggers realize what socialism is, and how the US has been massively socialist for decades, they'll realize 'socialism' is not bad. Indeed it's the theme behind SS, and nearly all of hundreds of other do-good programs administered by States and Feds. Bernie is also good at pointing out how Scandinavian countries (which aren't spooked by the word 'socialist') are doing rather well. Even right-wingers can admit (however reluctantly) that Scandinavian countries are better administered than the US. Unless the right-wingers are rich (see below).

The only people who both understand what socialism is and who are spooked by the word (and the prospect of a Prez Sanders) are rich people who don't want to pay taxes. They want to continue to hide money away and avoid taxes. Since they can spend lots of money getting their ideas publicized (super pacs, full page ads in the WSJ, etc) they're able to sway some of the voters to be afraid of Bernie - and to be afraid of the S word.

[Jingthing]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/06/americans-least-likely-to-vote-for-atheist-muslim-presidential-candidates-poll-finds/

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2016/jan/29/jennifer-granholm/jennifer-granholm-says-americans-would-rather-elec/

Edited January 31, 2016 by Jingthing

[boomerangutang]

Its an interesting race. Trump is the master of running a modern campaign based on shaping public opinion. Sanders is creating a movement based on ideas. So far the rest of them are just background noise. If for some reason HRC wins the Presidential race it will only be because Sanders gave her the slap in the face she needed to wake up and express a point of view.

Trump is good at selling his one and only brand: Trump. He's got the redneck vote and little more. I said it earlier, and will say it again: he'll burn out like a scud missile. Actually, I hope he does get the Rep. nod, because it will make for great theatrics. Though I doubt he will point at the mirror in his gold encrusted bathroom, purse his lips, scowl, and say; "You're a loser" on November 5th.

[boomerangutang]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/06/americans-least-likely-to-vote-for-atheist-muslim-presidential-candidates-poll-finds/

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2016/jan/29/jennifer-granholm/jennifer-granholm-says-americans-would-rather-elec/

I looked at the two links. Thanks. On the one hand, Americans in general are becoming more liberal-minded year by year, as mentioned in the summaries of both polls. Interesting to note that hard-right republicans have the most problem with the 'socialist' tab than any other group. Before Romney came in the national spotlight, what would right-wingers said about voting for a Mormon? Now, they like Mormons, because they've come to like Romney. What would they have said about blacks? Then? Now? It's not a big deal, because right-wingers are a minority (despite Trump calling them the 'silent majority'). Nixon also liked dangling that nebulous term around, "silent majority." ....as if all the people who don't show up and who aren't active in politics are going to vote for the person who says the phrase 'silent majority.'

If there is a silent majority, it's the regular people who don't get off their butts to vote. However, a lot of them did for Obama, and that made a difference. That was because they were inspired by Obama. Now we've got Sanders to contend with. He's also inspiring, as proof of the many thousands who enthusiastically attend his rallies - a strong % are younger folks / first time voters. If Bernie can continue to inspire the millions who are usually too cynical or lazy - to vote, he'll take the whole enchilada.

[Jingthing]

I don't think Sanders is technically an atheist because he says he believes in God but he clearly does not participate in any organized religion. Also the way he talks about God sounds close to what an atheist would say. My point is if nominated the republicans will run constant ads painting him as atheist socialist with subtext Jew, and BURY him in a landslide. Take that prediction to the bank.

Personally I like him more for his lack of religion, but that won't help him.

On the other hand, it's probably good for the country to have such a secular person have a high profile run at all. Maybe someday an actual out atheist can be president. In a few centuries perhaps.

Edited January 31, 2016 by Jingthing

[boomerangutang]

Perhaps the swearing-in ceremony at the US presidential inauguration can include a few phrases which bolster a person's religious credentials:

I _______________ promise to always believe in Noah's Ark, virgin birth, and the sun rotating around the Earth. I also swear to uphold the belief that fossils of dinosaurs cannot be over four thousand years old and that God created everything, including I-Phones, Zika virus, ISIS, and diaper rash, so help me God.

[willyumiii]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

I do not remember the stats, but socialism is better understood and accepted by many more Americans now than it was just a few years ago.

Most Americans still believe the cold war propaganda about socialism and have no idea of what it is or how much it is a part of their daily lives already.

If nothing else, Bernie Sanders has convinced a lot of Americans to at least look at socialism and learn what it is really all about.

Maybe people who like what Obama has done hearing him being called a socialist has had some influence as well?

P.S. The cold war has been over for a while now and we don't need that propaganda in the 21st century !

Edited February 1, 2016 by willyumiii

[helpisgood]

I think a problem with this debate about socialism is that the question is sometimes wrongly framed. We like to conveniently peg countries and candidates as being socialistic or not. It seems to me that it's more of a spectrum. It's better to say that certain countries or candidates or whatever are more socialistic or less so.

It seems strange to hear some Americans rail against socialism, but defend social security or medicare, etc. In fact, the US Constitution provides Congress with the power to establish a post office (Art. I, Sec. 8). Isn't that a form of socialism, especially in light of the fact that we now have Federal Express, UPS and other private carriers? Thus, it is not strictly one or the other.

I do understand that it is sometimes convenient, or perhaps expedient, in conversation to use the label "socialism" when discussing these issues. Nevertheless, it's important to still keep in mind that we are really just discussing where on the spectrum is best for a country or a people. Doing so will better help us focus on the real issue of deciding if socializing a certain industry or whatever better serves the needs of the people.

Edited February 1, 2016 by helpisgood

[CMNightRider]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

I do not remember the stats, but socialism is better understood and accepted by many more Americans now than it was just a few years ago.

Most Americans still believe the cold war propaganda about socialism and have no idea of what it is or how much it is a part of their daily lives already.

If nothing else, Bernie Sanders has convinced a lot of Americans to at least look at socialism and learn what it is really all about.

Maybe people who like what Obama has done hearing him being called a socialist has had some influence as well?

P.S. The cold war has been over for a while now and we don't need that propaganda in the 21st century !

Socialism promotes laziness and discourages hard work. If you are giving things away, you are just taking from those who work. I suspect a large percentage of the Sander supporters on this forum were less than successful in their careers, and tend to fall into the 47% who pay little to no taxes. There is no logical reason for tax payers to want higher taxes so the slugs of society can continue to receive government handouts.

If Sanders were ever elected, he would do more damage to America than Obama has done. As far as Hillary, she will be lucky if she doesn't end up being a recipient of correctional services.

[helpisgood]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

I do not remember the stats, but socialism is better understood and accepted by many more Americans now than it was just a few years ago.

Most Americans still believe the cold war propaganda about socialism and have no idea of what it is or how much it is a part of their daily lives already.

If nothing else, Bernie Sanders has convinced a lot of Americans to at least look at socialism and learn what it is really all about.

Maybe people who like what Obama has done hearing him being called a socialist has had some influence as well?

P.S. The cold war has been over for a while now and we don't need that propaganda in the 21st century !

Socialism promotes laziness and discourages hard work. If you are giving things away, you are just taking from those who work. I suspect a large percentage of the Sander supporters on this forum were less than successful in their careers, and tend to fall into the 47% who pay little to no taxes. There is no logical reason for tax payers to want higher taxes so the slugs of society can continue to receive government handouts.

If Sanders were ever elected, he would do more damage to America than Obama has done. As far as Hillary, she will be lucky if she doesn't end up being a recipient of correctional services.

Really? It promotes laziness? Then, why are countries that have large socialistic programs listed among the most productive countries in the world? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28PPP%29_per_hour_worked I am sure that the success of these countries is not totally due to their chosen economic systems. Still, it strongly suggests that there are things to learn from them and to not solely depend upon an overly simplistic understanding of socialism.

A socialistic govt. does not necessarily "give things away." I believe that what needs to addressed in regards to that issue is not so much the system itself, but how well it is managed. Does not a supposed capitalistic nation like the USA give large sums of money to big businesses and big banks in what are called subsidies and bailouts? Surely, they are not among the so-called 47%. Their received largesse far exceeds that of any "slug."

As I have stated in an above post, it does not have to do with merely supporting or not supporting an abstract concept such as socialism, but it has to do with whether certain industries, businesses, etc. better serve the public good by being socialistic or not and to what degree, if any, they should be regulated.

Edited February 1, 2016 by helpisgood

[up2u2]

I find this report astonishing. 'Radical ideas' , 'far fetched campaign' , 'political revolution' . It just demonstrates how the American electorate is some strange throw back to a perverted Darwinian mindset.

Investing in the education of a Nation's youth, investing in the health and well-being of a Nations citizens, a fair minimum wage for workers to provide adequately for their families, sensible spending on military weaponry, investing in infrastructure building and repair, regulation on sheer greed and a fairer distribution of wealth.

In ALL other Modern Social Democracies this is rather boring politics. Absolutely NOTHING radical or far fetched and not even close to a political revolution. Simply par for the course.

To the greed of Wall Street, health industry and big Pharma and war mongers and the insanely wealthy I say 'Feel the Bern' your days are numbered. The American People are beginning to wake up and may request the money stolen be retuned.

[Jingthing]

Sanders has labelled himself that way, socialist, so that's the deal breaker aside from the other stuff.

Of course all candidates support some socialist style programs, even the republicans.

That's not the point.

The U.S. is still not Europe. Like it or not.

[up2u2]

Sanders has labelled himself that way, socialist, so that's the deal breaker aside from the other stuff.

Of course all candidates support some socialist style programs, even the republicans.

That's not the point.

The U.S. is still not Europe. Like it or not.

That is simply not true. Bernie labels himself as a Democratic Socialist and then sets out how that applies to his political view. The Government is there to represent the People not Wall Street not Big Health and Pharma not war mongers not god botherers not the NRA not oil and coal producers it is there to represent what is in the best interests of the American People.

In fact I have heard it said that Bernie represents the true values of early Republicans. Of course the corrupted neocons will run the big evil 'socialist' drivel. Why, because they cannot argue the social values that Bernie promotes.

Radical ideas, far fetched campaign and political revolution. oh please, spare me the rhetoric.

[TommyUK1960]

Sanders has labelled himself that way, socialist, so that's the deal breaker aside from the other stuff.

Of course all candidates support some socialist style programs, even the republicans.

That's not the point.

The U.S. is still not Europe. Like it or not.

America hopefully will never be like the failed states of Europe. See the muppets running the show in the EU. That's why I hope the American people make Donald trump the next president.

[Jingthing]

Sanders has labelled himself that way, socialist, so that's the deal breaker aside from the other stuff.

Of course all candidates support some socialist style programs, even the republicans.

That's not the point.

The U.S. is still not Europe. Like it or not.

That is simply not true. Bernie labels himself as a Democratic Socialist and then sets out how that applies to his political view. The Government is there to represent the People not Wall Street not Big Health and Pharma not war mongers not god botherers not the NRA not oil and coal producers it is there to represent what is in the best interests of the American People.

In fact I have heard it said that Bernie represents the true values of early Republicans. Of course the corrupted neocons will run the big evil 'socialist' drivel. Why, because they cannot argue the social values that Bernie promotes.

Radical ideas, far fetched campaign and political revolution. oh please, spare me the rhetoric.

You overestimate the intelligence of the American people. They hear the word socialist in ANY context, and it's GAME OVER.

Trump on the other hand may become president based on the opposite, assuming the American people are the most STUPID on the planet.

[up2u2]

Sanders has labelled himself that way, socialist, so that's the deal breaker aside from the other stuff.

Of course all candidates support some socialist style programs, even the republicans.

That's not the point.

The U.S. is still not Europe. Like it or not.

That is simply not true. Bernie labels himself as a Democratic Socialist and then sets out how that applies to his political view. The Government is there to represent the People not Wall Street not Big Health and Pharma not war mongers not god botherers not the NRA not oil and coal producers it is there to represent what is in the best interests of the American People.

In fact I have heard it said that Bernie represents the true values of early Republicans. Of course the corrupted neocons will run the big evil 'socialist' drivel. Why, because they cannot argue the social values that Bernie promotes.

Radical ideas, far fetched campaign and political revolution. oh please, spare me the rhetoric.

You overestimate the intelligence of the American people. They hear the word socialist in ANY context, and it's GAME OVER.

Trump on the other hand may become president based on the opposite, assuming the American people are the most STUPID on the planet.

I hate it when you are right!

[sgtsabai]

Well Bernie has my vote and I believe in revolutions. although mine would be much more drastic than his. There are some in DC etc. that deserve a Nuremberg Trial and GitMo needs to be filled with war criminals. Bernie is well aware the Republicans (sure wish I wouldn't get censored for using the correct spelling) will try to do to him what they did the day before Obama took office and swear in mass to block everything. And to think that even with that public information some ignoramuses believe little to nothing got done because of Obama and the Democrats (I've a correct spelling for them too). Bernie's plan for Medicare for all is not polished, yet. I have no doubt it will be when he is elected, that is if the Republicans haven't figured out a plan to steal the election like they did in 2000 and 2004. It is time to put the real "death panels", insurance companies, out of business. For those that believe all the Republican Kool-Aid, i.e lies, but know nothing about nothing, SS is socialism, as is the VA. And no, SS is not going broke although it needs some simple tweaking and the VA needs a upper level overhaul. Not privatization as the Koch (John Birch Society) traitor brothers and their phony "grassroots" Veterans organization want. I receive my hard earned benefits from both the VA and SS. As we all know that other socialist organization to help Americans Medicare doesn't work over here. If you think that paying for our infrastructure, police, fire, libraries, school etc. with taxes, esp. if the rich, corporations, Wall Street criminals and banksters payed, isn't some form of socialism you better study what a government is supposed to do. And just how do you think those rich <deleted> and corporations that pay little to no taxes while the middle/working class is shouldering much of the burden get their products to the customer, and who provides there protection. And I don't pay taxes, about 1,000 USD short of having to. Receiving SS etc. free insurance etc. damn sure didn't make me lazy. Oh, and I received Aid For Dependent Children, i.e. welfare and food stamps at one time in my life and was working. That is called assistance because the wages weren't enough. Lazy my ass! Try being a wildland firefighter and tell me I was lazy. It is my hope that Hillary is derailed and soon. Bernie will beat any of the clowns from the clown bus and with the people's help get the US headed back on the right track, if the Republicans don't steal the election, again.

[sgtsabai]

Almost forgot, the VA paid a lot of my way through college, although it was a constant battle with them as it is now. Let me add, I also receive two pensions, one from the State of New Mexico and one from the State of Texas. I damn well earned them also. Yea, I was one of those "lazy" government workers working 12-18 hours a day. Sorry for the "provides there protection" should have been their.

[willyumiii]

It would be a blessing for America, and indeed the world in general, if Sanders won the presidency. Unfortunately, that is

never going to happen in a country full of people who already call Obama a socialist/communist.

I do not remember the stats, but socialism is better understood and accepted by many more Americans now than it was just a few years ago.

Most Americans still believe the cold war propaganda about socialism and have no idea of what it is or how much it is a part of their daily lives already.

If nothing else, Bernie Sanders has convinced a lot of Americans to at least look at socialism and learn what it is really all about.

Maybe people who like what Obama has done hearing him being called a socialist has had some influence as well?

P.S. The cold war has been over for a while now and we don't need that propaganda in the 21st century !

Socialism promotes laziness and discourages hard work. If you are giving things away, you are just taking from those who work. I suspect a large percentage of the Sander supporters on this forum were less than successful in their careers, and tend to fall into the 47% who pay little to no taxes. There is no logical reason for tax payers to want higher taxes so the slugs of society can continue to receive government handouts.

If Sanders were ever elected, he would do more damage to America than Obama has done. As far as Hillary, she will be lucky if she doesn't end up being a recipient of correctional services.

Really? It promotes laziness? Then, why are countries that have large socialistic programs listed among the most productive countries in the world? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28PPP%29_per_hour_worked I am sure that the success of these countries is not totally due to their chosen economic systems. Still, it strongly suggests that there are things to learn from them and to not solely depend upon an overly simplistic understanding of socialism.

A socialistic govt. does not necessarily "give things away." I believe that what needs to addressed in regards to that issue is not so much the system itself, but how well it is managed. Does not a supposed capitalistic nation like the USA give large sums of money to big businesses and big banks in what are called subsidies and bailouts? Surely, they are not among the so-called 47%. Their received largesse far exceeds that of any "slug."

As I have stated in an above post, it does not have to do with merely supporting or not supporting an abstract concept such as socialism, but it has to do with whether certain industries, businesses, etc. better serve the public good by being socialistic or not and to what degree, if any, they should be regulated.

" I suspect a large percentage of the Sander supporters on this forum were less than successful in their careers, and tend to fall into the 47% who pay little to no taxes. There is no logical reason for tax payers to want higher taxes so the slugs of society can continue to receive government handouts."

You need to pass this on to the NFL ( America's National Football League ) possibly the best example of successful socialism in the U.S.A.

Every year money is shifted from teams who earn huge amounts to teams that make little or lose money. ( that's socialism )

I think the owners, players and staff could be considered successful and big earners,

and yet, the NFL avoids paying taxes.

What I get a kick out of ( pun intended) is that the hard core football fans are usually the ones who hate socialism so much!

Go figure!

[sgtsabai]

Hilary' thugs are coming. The Clintons never had and never will play anything but dirty. Hillary still supports Bill's NAFTA and you can bet the bottom dollar that if she wins the Presidency she will support TPP, even the head of the right wing Chamber of Commerce said so at Davos. Just a little info on the Bernie/Clinton campaign:

http://act.alternet.org/go/67901?t=8&akid=13934.85778.CaD29m

http://www.salon.com/2016/02/01/bad_news_for_the_gop_america_isnt_scared_of_bernies_socialism/

http://www.salon.com/2016/01/30/my_day_with_bernie_sanders_and_hillary_clinton_two_iowa_rallies_explain_why_hillary_may_be_about_to_blow_a_sure_thing/

http://www.salon.com/2016/01/30/we_do_not_need_another_clinton_administration_if_only_sanders_would_say_it/

The Clintons sordid race game: No one will say it, but the Clintons rise was premised on repudiating black voters

http://www.salon.com/2016/01/26/this_is_a_dishonest_campaign_17_hillary_clinton_memes_the_media_just_wont_stop_pushing_or_factcheck/

http://www.nationofchange.org/news/2016/01/30/spin-shift-on-bernie-the-escalating-media-assault/

http://www.nationofchange.org/news/2016/01/30/bernie-sanders-targets-top-10-corporate-tax-dodgers/

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/hillarys_corporate_democrats_taking_down_bernie_sanders_20160130

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/30/ted-cruz-delivers-firebrand-pitch-iowa-caucuses-2016-campaign

[Jingthing]

I have to agree with that. The Clintons are ruthless campaigners. She's still going to be way better than ANY republican.

[arjunadawn]

Some people have made a thing about Bernie being a Jew but only about 10 percent of Americans say they wouldn't vote for someone just based on being a Jew.

But he has too MUCH BIGGER political problems.

A very large percentage of Americans will never vote for an atheist.

Also, a very large percentage of Americans will never vote for socialist.

Bernie recently "came out" as not associating himself with religiosity which is short of saying he's an atheist, but it's close enough.

People, forget this guy.

It's hopeless!

Those two things are simply insurmountable going into the general election, if he's nominated.

What's this 'very large percentage' thing. What polls are you referring to?

Also, a very large percentage of Americans will never vote for socialist.

Show me one American who does not benefit from several socialist programs. There are none. As soon as the knuckle draggers realize what socialism is, and how the US has been massively socialist for decades, they'll realize 'socialism' is not bad. Indeed it's the theme behind SS, and nearly all of hundreds of other do-good programs administered by States and Feds. Bernie is also good at pointing out how Scandinavian countries (which aren't spooked by the word 'socialist') are doing rather well. Even right-wingers can admit (however reluctantly) that Scandinavian countries are better administered than the US. Unless the right-wingers are rich (see below).

The only people who both understand what socialism is and who are spooked by the word (and the prospect of a Prez Sanders) are rich people who don't want to pay taxes. They want to continue to hide money away and avoid taxes. Since they can spend lots of money getting their ideas publicized (super pacs, full page ads in the WSJ, etc) they're able to sway some of the voters to be afraid of Bernie - and to be afraid of the S word.

Its arrogant to indict those who do not like nor desire socialism. I am not rich. I understand it. I am spooked by it. It is true that's its hard to produce an American who has not benefited from socialist programs but since most of them are coercive and mandate compliance and participation the offer to produce one of these people is specious.

As examples. from social security to the seemingly generous marriage exemption in taxes, there is always direct or indirect coercion; both socialist schemes- one directly and the other to offset socialist progressive tax injuries. In the case of SS its coercion is obvious and collected by the IRS. In the case of a simple enough thing as tax exemption, you participate to reduce the amount of money you would otherwise redistribute to those who hardly worked at all claiming the Earned Income Credit (EEIC). Wherever you look, socialism is "progressively" forced upon America. America has consistently stepped 3 steps left, 1 or 0 steps right for many years. But America is not a socialist country and the fruit of this forced socialism (read social engineering) is what people are railing against. America is in its current perdicament because of the "socialism" crap alluded to in the above post.

Socialism is always inimical to individual liberty. Socialism predicates are equality in outcomes ethical relativity. Socialism poisons everything it touches from the classrooms to the boardrooms, from the battlefields to the court system. Socialism is the bane of reason and Liberty.

The fact that bylines today can even carry such words as "revolution" or socialism when regarding a contender to the white house, a full fledged radical socialist, shows how very successful socialists have been in their Fabian-like "progressive" (read incremental) goals. However, as repugnant Bernie's politics are he possesses one thing that is absent in every other candidate in this and most all elections- honesty. Sanders is who he purports to me. Sanders is consistent. He does not appear to lie. Its just the product he is selling will kill us just as surely as the lies the others peddle.