National Park Fees

[Creeper]

do you actually know anything about this country and the way it works?

Not compared with what you know about Thailand, and me.

I hope to one day have as many posts as you do, and be as unhappy about Thailand as you are........

[Nikkijah]

I think the official ruling is that Thais or expat residents with a work permit or other proof of legal residence in Thailand pay the reduced rate.

With all due respect, I believe the by-the-book states merely foreigners one price, Thai citizens another.

Checking for more info, but officially there is no concession made for any document other than a Thai National ID card.

Additionally,

Dr. Adis Israngkura, an economist at Chiang Mai University and a consultant to Thailand's first and foremost "think tank" (Thailand Development Research Institute) conducted a research project for TDRI on this very topic and wrote the best paper, "Determining entrance fees to national parks: the case of Thailand" that I have ever encountered on the subject.

The paper, published in 2001, made the following recommendations:

1. Higher fees, for all, to the more popular parks with many facilities, which can subsidize the smaller parks with very few facilities.

2. Higher fees, for all, on long week-ends/holidays when parks tend to be heavily visited to help ease congestion and lessen environmental degradation, which will result in increased visitor satisfaction.

3. Annual memberships and lifetime memberships should be offered and available to all.

4. Both Thai and foreigners should pay the same entrance fee, but special services should be made available to the foreign visitor for additional higher fees, such as English-speaking tour/travel guides or English-language information booklets/maps. "The current policy unnecessarily jeopardizes the the image of the overall tourism industry."

5. Entrances fees should be exempted for the elderly, the handicapped, and children visiting on school trips.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I FULLY SUPPORT EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THESE RECOMMENDATIONS.

SPOT ON, Dr. Adis Israngkura is a top man! Totally acceptable and reasonable recommendations.

[sriracha john]

As a mater of fact thailand as a country would colapse without thai bar girls to support the ecomony and husbands and family this country would be no more.

Excuse me but I believe there's a rule that only one troll is allowed per thread and since creeper was posting here first, you'll have to find another thread.

Thank you for understanding.

*edit*...

sorry, forgive my manners...I almost forgot....

and have a nice day.

Edited November 11, 2006 by sriracha john

[Creeper]

Excuse me but I believe there's a rule that only one troll is allowed per thread and since creeper was posting here first, you'll have to find another thread.

Thank you for understanding.

Poor ole John......... Still trying to get me to bite.

I have no idea why you keep up your personal attacks on me, a guy that spends his life on this forum, ( judging by the enormous ammount of posts you have )you should give new guys a chance instead of the continuous Troll accusations, just cos they have a life that differs in circumstances to your own life (in front of a monitor), it does not mean that they are trolling.

Maybe you would be happy if everyone was banned and you could rant on and copy and paste to yourself without ever reading a differing point of view or a circumstance that you have no experience of.

If people have circumstances that differ to your own experiences, they must be trolling, right?

Just ignore my posts John, you'll give yourself a stroke.

Good day.

[Donz]

What the hel_l are you guys complain about?

Edited November 11, 2006 by Donz

[sriracha john]

Good day.

A polite troll. That's a new twist, I'll give you that and likewise, have a good day yourself.

[womble]

do you actually know anything about this country and the way it works?

Not compared with what you know about Thailand, and me.

I hope to one day have as many posts as you do, and be as unhappy about Thailand as you are........

[huddy]

But is it, officially, 200 or 400 Baht?

[The Dan Sai Kid]

I don't see why Thai people should pay the same as a Farang tourists. It's their country after all.

I'm a Farang and I get into parks at the same rate as Thais, ( well I have so far ) due to a Thai driving license.

Farang should look at it this way, they are paying the proper rate and the locals get a cheaper rate, not that the Thais pay the proper rate and Farangs are getting ripped off.

That's a sweet outlook but doesn't jive with reality. The signs indicate that the pricing is based on citizenship, but that's a facade for an uglier reality.

If you've got Asian eyes, skin and hair, you get in at the lower rate. I've traveled in Thailand with Japanese, Lao, and Cambodian nationals, and they get the cheap rate while I (light-haired, light- skinned, but working for the Thai government, making Thai wages, and paying my Thai taxes) pay through the nose.

The basic denominator is that the two-tiered pricing policy for Thai parks is racist.

Pure and simple. It also is amazingly coincidental with the all-too-common outlook of "The farang is the rich guy--milk him!"

I'm not angry or bitter, just pissed off and revengeful. I know, I should see a counselor.

i think its racist as well.

to use edinburgh castle as an example as thats my home city if the guy collecting the money was to post a sign up saying that anyone that wasn't british or didnt look british had to pay 100 quid to get in instead of 10 he would be done for racism instantly.

"I'm sorry sir but your natural colour isnt blue, therefore you cannot be scottish please pay 10 times the price or get lost"

if you wouldn't accept it at home why should you accept what is blatant racism in a different country?

In Scotland we like to have one, rip-off price for everybody - regardless of race, colour or creed.

[KireB]

The dual price system is like telling the world: 'Hey I am poor, I need your money'! It's beggards behaviour! Third or fourth world country alike! Go on Thailand, 400 baht for a poluted waterfall or commercial beach (ko Samet). It will work for a while, till tourism drops and will never come back again! I mean 400 baht, 8 euro for what? Short term thinking! TIT and Thailand is not that special at all!

[lung]

But is it, officially, 200 or 400 Baht?

officially they start 400baht next october

but the erawan-waterfall is allready 400

The dual price system is like telling the world: 'Hey I am poor, I need your money'!Go on Thailand, 400 baht for a poluted waterfall

i was paying 40$ for 3 day ANGKOR WAT ok...

and for 450baht you see the biggest aquarium in SEA.

but for every f.. small waterfall around ?? NO

this is only the nature.i mean no one build this.

this crap-tigertempel in KAN now charge ~300baht.

the "big"-monk just buy a new car. a BENZ

and i think 1(20baht) to 10 or 20 (400baht) is not fair

Edited November 11, 2006 by lung

[Johpa]

Racism or not.... it is a lot of money to go and see a waterfall.

If you were a family of four here on vacation, it would cost you 1600 THB, over 40 USD every time you visited a national park. This alone will probably deter a lot of people.

And this happens quite frequently at the small waterfall at the edge of National Forest land adjacent to my village. This small park is a bit out of the way, about 10km off the highway. It does not get too many visitors, mostly the occasional low budget young folk willing to explore on their rented Dreams & Wave motorcycles. I would guess that over half the foreign vistors balk at having to cough up 200B each for a small park with minimal facilities and either turn around or continue on up the road.

This small park use to be free for all visitors and was popular with local rural Thai familes, and especially with students where young couples could get lost in the forest and make out. It use to be popular enough that the local women would open up som tam and other food stalls on weekends and holidays. But with the imposition of fees that all ended, few Thais, few foreigners, and no more som tam stalls.

[sriracha john]

But is it, officially, 200 or 400 Baht?

it seems to vary from park to park, but several have started the 400 rate, eg. Koh Chang and Koh Samet. The NP website doesn't specify which parks are which fee... so just have to do word of mouth for now.

[womble]

I would say a lot of parks will see a decline in visitors.

400 baht is ###### expensive for a visit to the park. Especially when there are no english guides, no Western toilets and a lack of english signs.

I know there are some members who are happy to pay whatever they are told to pay, that's fine, they're mugs.

I really do think 400 is excessive though double pricing or not the sites simply are not worth that, well 95% of them anyway.

This will come back to bite them, they may well collect less revenue this year, not more, and things like this leave a bad taste in your mouth, it will make people unhappy.

Thailand needs to be careful, they can only over charge tousists so many times whilst they are here before they realise they are being atken advantage of.

There are not many countries where the people are as greedy and money grabbing as they are in Thailand.

It's a very unnattractive part of the culture, and it's getting more and more extreme.

[ovenman]

but for every f.. small waterfall around ?? NO

Agreed. I may represent a minority view here, but in the world-wide national parks scheme of things, I don't think Thailand has many parks to offer that are actually worth a 400 baht look-see, irregardless of how this price relates to what a Thai would pay. 200 baht is probably pushing it, too.

Edited November 11, 2006 by ovenman

[sriracha john]

but for every f.. small waterfall around ?? NO

Agreed. I may represent a minority view here, but in the world-wide national parks scheme of things, I don't think Thailand has many parks to offer that are actually worth a 400 baht look-see, irregardless of how this price relates to what a Thai would pay. 200 baht is probably pushing it, too.

I've conducted quite a bit of serious scientific research on the subject of which parks are worth it and which ones aren't and it's about 50/50 in my personal humble opinon.

[Nikkijah]

There are not many countries where the people are as greedy and money grabbing as they are in Thailand.

It's a very unnattractive part of the culture, and it's getting more and more extreme.

I don't like to be too sweeping but in my time here I have seen quite a lot of greed, my partner says people from all countries are like it(even though she's never left this land!) but I haven't seen it in other Asian countries I've visited quite like I see it here

Saying that, this decision to charge more for us than for them comes from way up top, I would imagine, so doesn't truly reflect on the people at the 'bottom'

it's not just the parks either!! I went to Dusit zoo and had to pay quite a bit more than my partner, my luk krung and the entourage

Edited November 11, 2006 by Nikkijah

[penguin]

By way of comparison entry to the Grand Canyon NP is $12 (450 baht) or $25 (950 baht) for your car and all its passengers. For $50 you can buy a pass that gives you and your passengers entry for one year to ALL the national parks across the USA, and there are a lot of them. That seems much better value than the fees charged in Thailand, and you can see that at least some of the money collected pays for the upkeep of the sites, something that isn't so obvious at times in Thailand.

[lung]

dear farang

welcome to thailand

please spend us much money you have

and please make your visit not to long

you can then only send the money

Edited November 11, 2006 by lung

[sriracha john]

That seems much better value than the fees charged in Thailand, and you can see that at least some of the money collected pays for the upkeep of the sites, something that isn't so obvious at times in Thailand.

On Koh Samet, I once talked to two men who were thinking about almost planning to do something about whether it might be good to consider an idea about improving the road there.... but then the conversation quickly changed to what kind of fish to have for dinner. The following day, they denied thinking about almost planning to do something about whether it might be good to consider an idea about improving the road and then they took a long nap.

Meanwhile, from the Forestry Ministry website:

Number of visitors Ko Samet National Park : 57,119 Jan. 1 - Sep. 4

However you chose to divide it between % foreign and local ... in regards to entrance fees, it adds up to a hefty sum that one might actually think about doing something about considering an idea to improve the road there....

and then actually DOING IT!

Edited November 11, 2006 by sriracha john

[toptuan]

On another note, I wonder what would happen if you just walk straight in after paying the Thai rate in these situations? If they call the police, you should be in the right. This plan would obviously be dependent on you having the correct change for the entrance fee though...!

Great idea, although I'd like to put my other farang friend up to it, first. You know, see if he gets arrested, shot, or anything...

[huddy]

I think the official ruling is that Thais or expat residents with a work permit or other proof of legal residence in Thailand pay the reduced rate.

With all due respect, I believe the by-the-book states merely foreigners one price, Thai citizens another.

Checking for more info, but officially there is no concession made for any document other than a Thai National ID card.

as can be gathered, this is an often discussed topic... yet another post from another thread:

I have never heard of a tax id and work permit in tandem NOT get someone in at local prices.

Just off the top of my head and to be quite specific from personal experiences, the following parks would accept ONLY Thai National ID cards for admission at Thai prices:

Pang Sida National Park

Huay Huat National Park

Khao Sam Roi Yot National Marine Park

It is a highly inconsistent policy extended across the country which lends itself to abuse and charges of racism/favoritism, and creates a great deal of resentment. Certainly not worth the ill will it generates.

It's a shame when those in power to effect change ignore the recommendations of those with brains. The solution is right in front of their noses:

Dr. Adis Israngkura, an economist at Chiang Mai University and a consultant to Thailand's first and foremost "think tank" (Thailand Development Research Institute) conducted a research project for TDRI on this very topic and wrote the best paper, "Determining entrance fees to national parks: the case of Thailand" that I have ever encountered on the subject.

The paper, published in 2001, made the following recommendations:

1. Higher fees, for all, to the more popular parks with many facilities, which can subsidize the smaller parks with very few facilities.

2. Higher fees, for all, on long week-ends/holidays when parks tend to be heavily visited to help ease congestion and lessen environmental degradation, which will result in increased visitor satisfaction.

3. Annual memberships and lifetime memberships should be offered and available to all.

4. Both Thai and foreigners should pay the same entrance fee, but special services should be made available to the foreign visitor for additional higher fees, such as English-speaking tour/travel guides or English-language information booklets/maps. "The current policy unnecessarily jeopardizes the the image of the overall tourism industry."

5. Entrances fees should be exempted for the elderly, the handicapped, and children visiting on school trips.

I think when experts, and Thai himself, recognizes it as a problem, it's VERY telling....

[huddy]

But is it, officially, 200 or 400 Baht?

it seems to vary from park to park, but several have started the 400 rate, eg. Koh Chang and Koh Samet. The NP website doesn't specify which parks are which fee... so just have to do word of mouth for now.

Cheers John, good information. I look forward to trying, and failing, to get them to go back to 200B.

[simon43]

On another note, I wonder what would happen if you just walk straight in after paying the Thai rate in these situations? If they call the police, you should be in the right. This plan would obviously be dependent on you having the correct change for the entrance fee though...!

I live right by the National Marine Park, just next door to Phuket Airport. In reality, all that exists is a nice beach, some unfinished buildings and a small road that enters the park, winds along by the sea for about 2km, and then exits the park.

The entry fee is 400 baht for 'foreigners'. The 40 baht fee is for Thais.

In practice, I have never seen any Thai person pay the entrance fee. They simply ride their motorbikes past the ticket collector and she ignores them.

I therefore apply the same rule. I drive my car into the park, (as a route to get to NaiYang Beach), and I totally ignore the ticket collector who signals for me to stop. No-one has arrested me yet for this major infringement of the law Perhaps I might be more inclined to pay some money when the 2-two pricing rule is at-least applied in some fashion to Thai people.

I also advise customers who stay at my hotel and who wish to visit the nearby beach to also refuse to pay the entrance fee and to ignore the ticket collector. So far, there have been no problems....

Simon

[martinhuahin]

I decided to take some visitors I have from the UK to the National Park near Hua Hin and to visit Pala - U waterfalls. They are quite un-spectacular and I have not been there since the introduction of the 200 baht fee several years ago. However, as these guests staying had not been, and as it is and interesting walk up the stages of the waterfall in to rain-forest and jungle, I thought what the heck we'll pay the 600 Baht for three of us.

I was horrified to then be asked to pay 1,200. (3 X 400)For this series of puddles???!!!!

I told the man on the guest it was a rip of, and did a "u" turn right in front of them, with all the day trippers peering on from their mini -buses, unaware of the rip off going on...

I think that this doubling of the fee to 400 Baht is outrageous.

I urge all ex-pats who have visitors to boycott all National Parks. Why should we as foreigners pay this, when the mercedes/porsche driving Thais from BKK who visit for the weekend get in for 80 (?) Baht?!!

If you have a Thai license, you will also pay 80 Baht, but what about your guests?

This is a blatent rip off, and where is the money being spent? I certainly see no evidence in Pala-U or in Sam Roi Yot parks......

After my U-turn, we did some off-roading around the lakes near the Park, and it was really beautiful. We saw lots of wild-life and even saw some villagers making charcoal in Clay ovens to sell. It turned out to be far more intersting than the waterfalls, and was FREE! tongue.gif

[englishoak]

I also agree that it's blatant racism, i was talking about this to my Thai language teacher and she was shocked that i considerd it to be racist, she told me that was 'to strong'

Typical quote from a shocked Thai that just mabe someone could be aggrieved that what happens in LOS could be considered racist. It happens all the time in many forms it is at the least xenophobic.

In practice, I have never seen any Thai person pay the entrance fee. They simply ride their motorbikes past the ticket collector and she ignores them.

I therefore apply the same rule. I drive my car into the park, (as a route to get to NaiYang Beach), and I totally ignore the ticket collector who signals for me to stop. No-one has arrested me yet for this major infringement of the law Perhaps I might be more inclined to pay some money when the 2-two pricing rule is at-least applied in some fashion to Thai people.

I used to do that all the time with thai friends

As far as the Thai licence is concerned pop into the KSR and get one made up for acouple 100 bht if you live there. Only use it for national parks and it works like a dream. Did it for 5 years never a problem. By the way i do NOT recommend you use it as a real licence. If were to get into an accident and the police checked it they would lock you up for sure.

I also have to say that the majority of national parks are a complete waste of money even at 40 bht, I know a lot of thai friends who wil baulk at paying the increase to 80bht per person. If you are going to a park with a waterfall DO NOT bother if it's well into the dry season there will be simply nothing to see.

[meemiathai]

White people, victim of racism.

Is this the Jokes forum?

When was the last time you saw sheeps bullying tigers?

[meemiathai]

In a hierarchical society, all are not equal--especially if you look different. Darker-colored students in my classroom suffer ridiculously merciless insults from other students because of their appearance. In a western classroom, I would have ejected the vocal student for racist attitudes. Not here. The darker one just grins and bears it, much like the black person had to do in pre-civil rights USA southern states. I enjoy making positive comments about the beautiful brown skin of my darker students, and watch the perplexed looks on the faces of my "fairer" more arrogant pupils. It may be the prevailing culture, but I'm trying to change their attitudes, one classroom at a time. I warn them if they want to visit MY country (and most of them do, because they are anglophiles), they better put on more tanning cream, because the darker, the better! (I know, now I sound like a racist myself!).

The darker the better? I heard of someone being hit on the street for the only reason of being dark and is now a vegetable in England. Are you from England?

I grew up in HK, I am half white half chinese. I have never experienced racism in my life. Is HK SEA? The only racism I experienced in life are from white people.

BTW,

The darker one just grins and bears it

, you mean there is only one dark skin person in a thai classroom? Or if not, is the majority the darker ones or the whiter ones?

Give me a break, white people. Pay more attention at your own behaviours. Look at history when talking about racism. You are best at doing it.

(No offense meant to anyone, I am colour-blind. Just pointing out what I see.)

[bmanly]

The subject of 2 tiered pricing is very close to my heart and one that makes me take a stand in Thailand. Almost nothing else bothers me enough to actually do something about it. It is an embarrassment to my wife and her family that this pricing continues. They consider me a part of their family, I mean we have been married for 17 years.

The biggest and last embarrassment came 4 years ago. They took me to an "elephant show/Crocodile farm" I think it was called Suan Samphan in Nakon Pathom. There were 4 kids, my wife, 3 other adults and me. I hung back and let them do all the ticket buying, but the ticket sellers made a point of leaning out of the booth to notice me as a farang. My wife walked backed to me and said something like kids 40 baht, adults 80 baht and farangs 400 baht. There was no excuse that the family could have used to get me to pay the local price, they were upset about it.

I did not want to embarrass the family or upset the kids day out so I paid up and went in and they all had a good time. I made a conscious decision 4 years ago on that day that I would never enter a National Park or Venue again that charges farangs double, triple or in National Park cases 1,000% more! It is nothing more than a blatant money grabbing rip off. Most Thai people that I know are embarrassed about such pricing and think it is unfair.

In future rather than change the families plan for the day, they can go anywhere they like, I will even pay for them but for this farang I won't be entering. I would rather sit outside with the Somtum lady and drink a 6 pack of beer and wait for them.

I always use this example to Thai people when I try to explain why I won't go to a National Park. "How would you like it if you came to Australia and you went to National Park and the sign said Adults $10 entry - Asians $100 entry............. would you think that was fair?" I can tell you that every Thai person I have asked this question to will always answer with a resounding NO.

Edited November 15, 2006 by bmanly

[Rinrada]

National Park Entry Fees

Adult: Baht200.-/person

Children(0 - < 14 years old): Baht100.-/person

Bicycle: Baht10.-/bicycle:

Motorcycle: Baht20.-/motorcycle:

4 - wheel car: Baht30.-/car

6 - wheel car: Baht100.-/car

< 10 - wheel car: Baht200.-/car

http://www.thaiforestbooking.com/np_home.asp?npid=3&lg=2