UK Passport Application (Adopted Daughter)

[ChangMaiSausage]

Need advice / assistance.

1. If I've posted in the wrong area apologies please feel free to move.

2. I've searched the forum for advice but most of what I've found is old and I know that some things have changed.

The adoption of my wives daughter has taken in excess of seven years this was due to work and living locations. This month after our last visit to Thailand and the adoption office we were notified that the adoption board had given the rubber stamp approving her adoption. We now only need to arrange a few pieces of paperwork that will be taken to the District Office in Thailand next month (authenticated passport and original marriage certificate) to change her surname.

The advice I'm looking for is from people who adopted children formally in Thailand and then applied for their UK passport. What are the steps that need to be taken when applying for a UK passport for her? I've only just started searching for information and TV was my first stop to find out other people experiences (lessons learned) I do know that Thailand child adoption is now recognized by the UK authorities so hopefully it will not be a long drawn out affair.

Thanking you in advance.

Dave

[grankboy]

I'm sure if you adopt a child in Thailand the child will not get a British passport, the adoption has to happen in the UK.

I looked into the same some years.

[ChangMaiSausage]

Grankboy as mentioned in my email the law has changed last year Thai adoptions are now (previously they were not) recognized by the UK.

After posting I read a little about the process once the adoption in Thailand is finalized you will give provided with a recognized Hague Adoption Certificate (HAC) both the UK and Thailand are part of the group of countries that recognize form.

When applying you present the HAC with my supporting documentation and wait for an interview (this is held only with the applicant)

[petebutt]

Who is the interview with ? I did not know the rules have changed I'm sure a lot of people would be willing to adopt there step children if they can get British citizenship.

[ChangMaiSausage]

The adoption process has taken us years to complete, we have spent many days sat with the adoption office in Bangkok not to mention the amount of paperwork over the years.

Once the adoption is complete you can apply for the UK passport as legally he/she is now your child based on them issuing the HAC (the Thai birth mother has to agree to release all responsibility to him/her, you become the sole responsible party).

Its all documented just google there are loads of results: https://www.gov.uk/get-a-child-passport/adopted-children

Edited July 18, 2016 by ChangMaiSausage

[petebutt]

Great thanks I'll have a look, do you know if there's a age limit ?

[ChangMaiSausage]

I know for Thai child adoption the maximum age is 18.

I imagine that the UK will follow the same rules as they are part of the same Hague agreement.

I will post more at the end of August as that is when we will formally change her name and start the UK adoption/passport application.

[steady]

The link shown in Chiangmaisausage's post (#5) says -

Adopted on or after 1 June 2003

Your child can get a British passport if either parent is British and the British parent was usually living (‘habitually resident’) in the UK when the child was adopted.

Only adoptions conducted under the Hague Convention are recognised. You must send the child’s full Hague Convention adoption certificate showing the parents’ details.

This information was last updated on 15 December 2015 so it still doesn't clearly say that British Citizenship and hence eligibility for a UK passport is automatic if the adoption takes place overseas. I'm not actually convinced of what it says,. The first sentence indicates that it is not possible, the second sentence indicates that it may be possible!

Another discussion point..........

[ChangMaiSausage]

The link shown in Chiangmaisausage's post (#5) says -

Adopted on or after 1 June 2003

Your child can get a British passport if either parent is British and the British parent was usually living (‘habitually resident’) in the UK when the child was adopted.

Only adoptions conducted under the Hague Convention are recognised. You must send the child’s full Hague Convention adoption certificate showing the parents’ details.

This information was last updated on 15 December 2015 so it still doesn't clearly say that British Citizenship and hence eligibility for a UK passport is automatic if the adoption takes place overseas. I'm not actually convinced of what it says,. The first sentence indicates that it is not possible, the second sentence indicates that it may be possible!

Another discussion point..........

I'll soon find out...

As a note I have two friends who have adopted their wives daughter / son one is an Irish passport holder the other a UK. These adoptions were done a few years ago but they both hold the fathers nationality passport as well as their Thai.

Below is a letter from the UK department of education that I received about the adoption earlier (I dont know why its dept of education)

Thank you for your email of 5 October in respect of adopting your wife’s daughter, from Thailand.

I hope you will find the information below helpful, but please note that although the Department is responsible for the legal framework for adoption in England and Wales in respect of intercountry adoption, and provides information on procedures in general, it does not give advice on individual cases and you will need to seek your own independent legal advice.

I should begin by explaining that the adoption legislation governing the bringing of children into the UK, applies to all prospective adopters who are habitually resident in the British Islands, whatever their nationality. This means that bringing a child into the UK where section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 applies without complying with the relevant requirements, including being approved and assessed by a registered adoption agency, is a criminal offence.

Section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 applies to anyone habitually resident in the British Islands, who:

(a) brings, or causes another to bring, a child who is habitually resident outside the British Islands into the United Kingdom for the purpose of adoption by the British resident, or at any time brings, or causes another to bring, into the United Kingdom a child adopted by the British resident under an external adoption effected within the period of twelve months ending with that time.

All prospective adopters who are habitually resident in the British Islands and wish to adopt a child habitually resident in another country are required to comply with the requirements of our adoption legislation and be approved and assessed by a registered adoption agency, which may charge a fee. This will be either a local authority or a voluntary adoption agency registered with The Office for Standards in Education, Children's Services and Skills (Ofsted) for the purposes of intercountry adoption.

Habitual residence is a legal concept which is undefined in statute and subject to case law, and it is possible to be habitually resident in more than one country. You may need to take your own independent legal advice as to your habitual residence and your need to comply with the relevant legislation.

Where prospective adopters live and work overseas and are able to adopt under another country’s legislation, the Department would have no role in the adoption and the prospective adopters would not be required to comply with our legislation if they are not habitually resident in the British Islands. If you are not habitually resident in the British Islands and wish to adopt XXXXX, the Department would have no role in the adoption.

We are aware that some countries require a statement of some description from the UK Government confirming that it has no role. In response, the Government has produced a ‘no objection’ letter which can be presented to the authority which requires such a statement.

Before a ‘no objection’ letter can be issued, British citizens will need to provide a sworn statement to the effect that:

· they have sought independent legal advice on the question of their ‘habitual residence’

· this advice has confirmed that they are no longer habitually resident in the British Islands.

· such a statement must be sworn and signed in front of a solicitor who is a Commissioner for Oaths, which may incur a fee.

Once obtained, the sworn statement should be taken along with a photocopy of the individual's passport to the nearest British Embassy or sent to the Department for Education at:

Intercountry Adoption Team

Department for Education

Level 0, Riverside

Bishopsgate House

Feethams

Darlington DL1 5QE

England.

On receipt of this sworn statement a ‘no objection’ letter may be issued.

Finally, you will wish to note that adoptions made in countries named on the Adoption (Recognition of Overseas Adoptions) Order 2013 (the ‘2013 Order’) effected on or after 3 January 2014 are automatically recognised in England and Wales. Thailand is named on the 2013 Order and an adoption effected in Thailand on or after 3 January 2014 is recognised under the law of in England and Wales and there is no need to readopt the child here in order for the adoption to be recognised, but adoptive parents are still required to comply with the requirements of Section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 before bringing the child into the UK.

I hope this is helpful and I wish you well in the adoption of XXXX.

Edited July 19, 2016 by ChangMaiSausage

[steady]

This concept of habitually resident seems to be the key. Once you find out how many days a year staying in one country constitutes habitual residency you've got the matter sewn up. Very simplistic but could be very expensive if the person you are dealing with in the UK government decided against it. That would mean a court case I assume to take the definition from a grey area to something more legally defined. Hopefully everything keeps on going ok.

[Expatrianglo]

I am also trying to do the same thing in Vietnam. Like someone said - it says The adoption will get automatic citizenship if one parent habitually resides in the UK. Habitually residing to be ellgible for benefits after living abroad many years means living there for 3 months again first. Having a permanent address there.

One point which I noticed in that email from the department of education was that it's a crime to adopt abroad while "habitually resident in the UK" unless you get assessed by an independent adoption agency. I am also dubious that the right to apply for citizenship - doesn't mean they just say no anyway.

[Expatrianglo]

On 7/19/2016 at 6:13 PM, steady said:

This concept of habitually resident seems to be the key. Once you find out how many days a year staying in one country constitutes habitual residency you've got the matter sewn up. Very simplistic but could be very expensive if the person you are dealing with in the UK government decided against it. That would mean a court case I assume to take the definition from a grey area to something more legally defined. Hopefully everything keeps on going ok.

I read that habitually resident regarding claiming benefits if you return to England means staying there 3 months before you are considered "habitually resident". Also that if you stay there 30 days every year at your "address" - you are still habitually resident too.Like you say it's a grey area though. But if you are "habitually resident" you have to be approved by an adoption agency. From what I can gather from the 100 page law.

 

Edited August 29, 2019 by Expatrianglo

[RichardColeman]

16 minutes ago, Expatrianglo said:

I read that habitually resident regarding claiming benefits if you return to England means staying there 3 months before you are considered "habitually resident". Also that if you stay there 30 days every year at your "address" - you are still habitually resident too.Like you say it's a grey area though. But if you are "habitually resident" you have to be approved by an adoption agency. From what I can gather from the 100 page law.

I returned to the UK in November after 3 years in Thailand - only came back for 2 days every 9 months. Resident test done in December, benefits and resident test granted in December same day. So, maybe hit and miss. I think probably as i kept coming back, if you are out a long time without returning maybe is different. 

[Expatrianglo]

On 7/19/2016 at 10:54 AM, ChangMaiSausage said:

I'll soon find out...

As a note I have two friends who have adopted their wives daughter / son one is an Irish passport holder the other a UK. These adoptions were done a few years ago but they both hold the fathers nationality passport as well as their Thai.

Below is a letter from the UK department of education that I received about the adoption earlier (I dont know why its dept of education)

Thank you for your email of 5 October in respect of adopting your wife’s daughter, from Thailand.

I hope you will find the information below helpful, but please note that although the Department is responsible for the legal framework for adoption in England and Wales in respect of intercountry adoption, and provides information on procedures in general, it does not give advice on individual cases and you will need to seek your own independent legal advice.

I should begin by explaining that the adoption legislation governing the bringing of children into the UK, applies to all prospective adopters who are habitually resident in the British Islands, whatever their nationality. This means that bringing a child into the UK where section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 applies without complying with the relevant requirements, including being approved and assessed by a registered adoption agency, is a criminal offence.

Section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 applies to anyone habitually resident in the British Islands, who:

(a) brings, or causes another to bring, a child who is habitually resident outside the British Islands into the United Kingdom for the purpose of adoption by the British resident, or at any time brings, or causes another to bring, into the United Kingdom a child adopted by the British resident under an external adoption effected within the period of twelve months ending with that time.

All prospective adopters who are habitually resident in the British Islands and wish to adopt a child habitually resident in another country are required to comply with the requirements of our adoption legislation and be approved and assessed by a registered adoption agency, which may charge a fee. This will be either a local authority or a voluntary adoption agency registered with The Office for Standards in Education, Children's Services and Skills (Ofsted) for the purposes of intercountry adoption.

Habitual residence is a legal concept which is undefined in statute and subject to case law, and it is possible to be habitually resident in more than one country. You may need to take your own independent legal advice as to your habitual residence and your need to comply with the relevant legislation.

Where prospective adopters live and work overseas and are able to adopt under another country’s legislation, the Department would have no role in the adoption and the prospective adopters would not be required to comply with our legislation if they are not habitually resident in the British Islands. If you are not habitually resident in the British Islands and wish to adopt XXXXX, the Department would have no role in the adoption.

We are aware that some countries require a statement of some description from the UK Government confirming that it has no role. In response, the Government has produced a ‘no objection’ letter which can be presented to the authority which requires such a statement.

Before a ‘no objection’ letter can be issued, British citizens will need to provide a sworn statement to the effect that:

· they have sought independent legal advice on the question of their ‘habitual residence’

· this advice has confirmed that they are no longer habitually resident in the British Islands.

· such a statement must be sworn and signed in front of a solicitor who is a Commissioner for Oaths, which may incur a fee.

Once obtained, the sworn statement should be taken along with a photocopy of the individual's passport to the nearest British Embassy or sent to the Department for Education at:

Intercountry Adoption Team

Department for Education

Level 0, Riverside

Bishopsgate House

Feethams

Darlington DL1 5QE

England.

On receipt of this sworn statement a ‘no objection’ letter may be issued.

Finally, you will wish to note that adoptions made in countries named on the Adoption (Recognition of Overseas Adoptions) Order 2013 (the ‘2013 Order’) effected on or after 3 January 2014 are automatically recognised in England and Wales. Thailand is named on the 2013 Order and an adoption effected in Thailand on or after 3 January 2014 is recognised under the law of in England and Wales and there is no need to readopt the child here in order for the adoption to be recognised, but adoptive parents are still required to comply with the requirements of Section 83 of the Adoption and Children Act 2002 before bringing the child into the UK.

I hope this is helpful and I wish you well in the adoption of XXXX.

changMaiSausag (Dave)

 

I and all the others I'm sure- would be curious to know what happened.

Darryn

 

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by Expatrianglo

[Expatrianglo]

On 8/29/2019 at 1:20 PM, RichardColeman said:

I returned to the UK in November after 3 years in Thailand - only came back for 2 days every 9 months. Resident test done in December, benefits and resident test granted in December same day. So, maybe hit and miss. I think probably as i kept coming back, if you are out a long time without returning maybe is different. 

Hi Richard

That's nice to know in case I'm stuck. Having to last 3 months an be worrying.. 

 

Thanks.