Chemical vs. mental dependancy

[swissie]

Upon my return to my home country and being retired, I started to work as a volunteer in a so called "soup kitchen".  Lots of people with problems, lots of alcoholics.
Old hands at the soup kitchen told me that half of the alcoholics are "chemically dependent", the other half is "mentally dependent".  Was told: "They don't really like alcohol per se,  but they are just people that can not face the world as it is, with all it's challenges, most of them drink to make the world "bearable"". Further comments were: They have a history of "in and out" of psychiatric clinics, but eventually they end up at the soup kitchen again, not having been able to change their life.
Being a "Newbie" there, I wonder if they are serving me a "cock & bull" story.
= Scientifically: Has there ever been established a difference between "chemical dependency" and "mental dependency" as far as alcohol is concerned?
Cheers.

 

[Johnniey]

Good question. I think the answer is no.

[wtaumme]

Every action that you do is controlled majorly by your brain, so it is the brain that is responsible for everything that you do.

[Dagnabbit]

Let's say your child died and you drank to forget. That would eventually lead to physical addiction. It is well known which parts of the brain are stimulated by alcohol and how dependency occcurs. I think its more a matter of how you got there than different types of addiction.


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[ding]

Tagged with both, myself.

 

Mental obsession with alcohol + Physical allergy of the body.

 

 

That's me anyway. Others may not necessarily be me!

 

Edited October 15, 2016 by ding

[starfish]

On 18.9.2016 at 5:52 PM, Dagnabbit said:

Let's say your child died and you drank to forget. That would eventually lead to physical addiction. It is well known which parts of the brain are stimulated by alcohol and how dependency occcurs. I think its more a matter of how you got there than different types of addiction.


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Those are special circumstances, which are not the case for most drinkers. But yes, it starts (and ends) mentally, we just don´t want to confront reality in general. For some it may be "only" social contacts, or whatever, but for some, the death of a friend in life.

Whatever it is, it starts mentally. Then it becomes physical dependancy in addition, but that is an, only additional, small problem, compared . . .

The physical dependancy, you can clear in a few days, or a week (if inclined to do so)

I find the OP-question funny (sorry), because the mental aspect is clearly about 98 percent, versus the physical aspect 2 percent, or so . . .

 

@ ding. I don´t know, what you mean by: " Physical allergy of the body ", well, i do, but trust me, that´s the least of your (our) problem.

Master the real problem first, then give your body a week, or two, for the physical, and you´re out of here.

Easier said, than done, i know !

However, it´s a mental dependancy, first and foremost, to answer the OP.

It´s in the OP already.

 

 

Edited October 16, 2016 by starfish

[impulse]

If someone can be a gambling addict, that would have to indicate a mental dependency.  

 

Unless those diabolical casinos and dog tracks are pumping some chemicals into the air.

[Johnniey]

On 20/10/2016 at 0:54 PM, impulse said:

If someone can be a gambling addict, that would have to indicate a mental dependency.  

 

Unless those diabolical casinos and dog tracks are pumping some chemicals into the air.

They used to pump oxygen into the air!

 

Anyone can become chemically dependent on booze or any addictive drug without being mentally dependent.

 

I was chemically addicted to fags(nicotine) but quit and never had any urge to return. 

 

Alcoholics are both. When they detox, they still have this insanity to drink again. They are still alcoholic even if the are abstinent for 50 years. 

[rhythmworx]

On 28/10/2016 at 1:46 PM, Johnniey said:

They used to pump oxygen into the air!

 

Anyone can become chemically dependent on booze or any addictive drug without being mentally dependent.

 

I was chemically addicted to fags(nicotine) but quit and never had any urge to return. 

 

Alcoholics are both. When they detox, they still have this insanity to drink again. They are still alcoholic even if the are abstinent for 50 years. 

 

That comment doesn't give me much incentive to quit. Maybe I should just carry on with the insanity that drink causes.

 

I was at a crossing point a few hours ago, hoped after quitting the insanity would stop.

 

Maybe I read your post in the wrong way.

[impulse]

Do what I did.  Try sobriety on for a while, one day at a time.  You can always go back to drinking if it doesn't improve the quality of your life.

 

28 years later, I'm still trying it on.  One day at a time.  I can always get drunk tomorrow.

 

Don't get caught up in the semantics.  That's a killer of millions every year.

[Dagnabbit]

 
That comment doesn't give me much incentive to quit. Maybe I should just carry on with the insanity that drink causes.
 
I was at a crossing point a few hours ago, hoped after quitting the insanity would stop.
 
Maybe I read your post in the wrong way.

Don't worry, what he wrote is just unproven theory.

The urge will dissipate completely, some people just get addicted to going to meetings instead.


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[Dagnabbit]

Do what I did.  Try sobriety on for a while, one day at a time.  You can always go back to drinking if it doesn't improve the quality of your life.
 
28 years later, I'm still trying it on.  One day at a time.  I can always get drunk tomorrow.
 
Don't get caught up in the semantics.  That's a killer of millions every year.

Quite true.

One step at a time. No need to let what seems to be an impossible goal stop you from moving forward.


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[gerryBScot]

On 1/5/2017 at 6:58 AM, rhythmworx said:

 

I was at a crossing point a few hours ago, hoped after quitting the insanity would stop.

 

 

 

The insanity never stops. You just learn to accept it and indeed to laugh at it. In fact the longer I stay stopped the more I realise just how utterly insane my drinking was. Today taking a drink has no appeal to me. I'll worry about tomorrow tomorrow. 

[blorg]

On 27/08/2016 at 2:40 AM, swissie said:

= Scientifically: Has there ever been established a difference between "chemical dependency" and "mental dependency" as far as alcohol is concerned?

There is, for sure, yes- physical alcohol dependence is a thing and that is why alcohol withdrawal can kill you if you are REALLY physically dependent and in these cases stopping drinking may need medical supervision or even hospitalisation in the worst cases. That's not in your head, dying from alcohol withdrawal is not in your head and neither is the shaking, sweating and all the other physical symptoms.

 

If you are physically dependent your body needs alcohol and you will start to get actual physical withdrawal symptoms if you don't drink.

 

But it takes years if not decades of alcohol abuse to get to this point.

 

It's also worth noting though that physical dependency in terms of the withdrawal symptoms only lasts a week to a few weeks, if you are physically dependent and stop drinking you will feel incredibly shit for the first week and off for some time after but the PHYSICAL craving for alcohol will pass at some point after that, you won't be sweating and shaking any more for lack of alcohol.

 

What gets you back on it after a few weeks or months or years is obviously mental, as you don't have the physical need for it any more. Although if you have got to the point where you are physically addicted once I believe it is quicker to get back to it if you ever start again and you will have worse and worse physical addiction and worse and worse withdrawal symptoms if you try to quit then a second or third time. This is called kindling and it is due to actual physical changes in your brain.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kindling_(sedative–hypnotic_withdrawal)

 

So yes you can absolutely be physically dependent, but not all alcoholics are at that stage, and I would say the root cause is mental in just about all cases, yes. You can absolutely have a problem with alcohol and be addicted to it mentally before you actually get to the physical addict stage.