Thai Boyfriend Problem--what To Do?

[cm-happy]

Iam an American, just turned 62, lived in CM for 6+ years, well off, but by no measns rich, and have house and property here in CM thru my attorney's holding company. My b/f is Thai from Isaan (yasothan) small farming village, 34, not well educated, but attending a non tradition school so as to complete matayon 6. We have been together for 3+ years. I have been to his village several times visiting and have met everyone.

My b/f problem has several aspects. He is totally dependent upon myself which I happily provide, but have been harping at him to find a job so he an earn his own spending money. He does not seem too keen on that idea and always has an excuse for not working. Most job posting require a minimum of matayom 3(I've seen this myself), his age and or lack of experience. As an alternative to working I've asked him to attend school full time and is reluctant to do so, thinking he would not fit in with the other students because of his age.. The non tradition school is only 1 day a week to hasten his studies.

The second aspect of my problem is that he sometimes dissappears for days at a time. I know he is not fooling around, but just goes off with his friends. Thais need Thais. Have talked to him about this and said that as long as he calls periodically to say everything is ok and he is not in any problem or injured. Continues to do so, but without calls. Seems to me I'm pretty low on his pecking order. 1 is family (Thais way), 2 is friends somewhere below am I.

He is very,very jealous. If I flirt or show interest in another Thais boy he is not shy about letting me know this is unacceptable. In all honesty I have to admit I do enjoy the chase, but do not consider myself a butterfly and would never consider replacing him. Yes, I do love him very much

and for reasons I will not go into, our sex life together is far from ideal. But still I'm a man and have certain physical needs that need to be satisfied from time to time.

From my perspective I have treated him and his family quite well and do not understand his cool attitude towards me.

To date have bought him a Honda Phantom motorcycle (which I've kept in my name) for him to be cool. His family house in Yasothan in his name after his Papa died earlier this year. Picked up all of Papa's medical and hospital expenses.

Sometimes he goes ting-tong on me if I look around for physical satisfaction and have jokingly mentioned to him "no honey, no money" and have discussed breaking up a few times. Enough of my agony Uncle rantings.

Am I a sap, being used, just a walking ATM, throw him out on his ear. Any similar experiences amonst other gays. Constructive comments or advice if you please.

[Barney_the_Dinosaur]

Why can't he work ? Has he got no legs or something? Is he disabled?

Yes you are being used, but so long as you can accept that fact, then its not a problem. You're using him, as there's precious few other ways of getting boodoir-access to someone half your age when one is in ones twilight years.

[bieles]

you're old, he's young

you're rich, he's poor

you're cultivated, he's not as you

you're waiting, he's got it

all that differences explains that you'll have to compose in not other way

... or stay alone, or hazards...

[Scott]

Yes, you are being used. I suggest some rules. One tell him to cut the jealous crap because it is a dead give away that he is either fooling around or up to something no good.

If you want some physical contact just have it and tell him to p*ss off. Don't rub it in his face, don't have "boy friends" on the side, just a little action. No phone numbers exchanged etc.

Next, stop persecuting him about work. He's 34 years old. It ain't going to happen. If you don't have a work ethic by then, you won't have one. He also is now too far up the heirarchy to start out as a delivery boy or coolie for some company. He can hang around and take care of you.

Best of luck. Enjoy yourself (and him) as much as possible.

[orchis]

If he wants to finish high school even in the once a week's program,

that's quite easy and quick, I sent two people through it, but they were both 17,

I think you're problem is a little bigger than that; you give him a lot and he doesnt give you anything; I wd choose the short pain : dump him. Plenty of guys around. If you like the situation then stay in it, but I think 'changing' him and 'improving' your relationship would be a tough call.

Edited November 28, 2006 by orchis

[ProThaiExpat]

I am of the view that attempting to change people, once they have reached maturity, is not possible.

Thus, one must change oneself, or dissatisfaction with the other partner will end up in termination.

However, in determining if one is willing to change to accomodate a partner, a determination of what is a deal breaker to you is imprtant. For me, denial of sex to a partner in a loving relationship is a deal breaker. Absence overnight is a deal breaker. A 4am return on a disco night with friends is not an overnight. Exception is trips to see the family on occasion. If your partner takes care of you and your house, that is a job and no other should be expected.

If he doesn't do anything to contribute to the relationship, that would be a deal breaker for me.

Loving someone is a gift and well worth changing yourself for as long as your own set of "deal breakers" do not occur. Sharing your monthly allocation of money with another, as long as it doesn't exceed that and causes you to impair capital, in my view.

I am of the opinion that a stong man is a respected entity to Thais and many of falang problems with Thais is our expectation that a Thai will live up to western mores and attitudes in life. You must make the rules for the relationship based on your own "deal breakers" and if their is no compliance, then there is not sufficient love for you from your partner to sustain the relationship, regardless of how you feel toward your Thai.

[PeaceBlondie]

Pardon me if this sounds crass, but what does this guy do for you? If he seldom has sex with you, disappears for days on end without notice, doesn't work, doesn't contribute to the household income, then does he cook and wash and clean? Does he translate Thai to English for you? Probably not.

And then he's jealous. All behavior is learned.

Like the others who have suggested, I say you put your foot down and make the rules a bit clearer. Such as, you are going to have non-romantic but sexual encounters as you wish, and he may if he wishes. And, that he put you higher on the priority level, such as #2 after family, or tied with #1.

If you make your own needs or your demands clear, you may be surprised that he'll accept them. He already accepts your 'fooling around,' though he can't be expected to speak highly about it. Just promise him you won't give your heart to a casual acquaintance. Assuming, that is, that your boyfriend has given you his heart.

But none of us really knows what to suggest, because we're not you and we're not him. Good luck.

[toptuan]

I was in a very similar situation. He went to school on Saturdays and Sundays for his M.B.A., which I funded, but he played video games 100 hours a week Monday-Friday. He never contributed 1 baht to his own education. After he graduated with his Bachelor's degree (which I also underwrote) I asked him to find work for Mon-Fri. He never found anything steady and and complained about two short stints of work (less than 2 months) he tried. I pleaded, coaxed, reasoned, and patiently waited for 1.5 more years. I tried ratcheting-down his allowance over a year, to give him the gentle nudge toward self-sufficiency. Didn't work. Yes, I was definitely being used.

Finally, gave a deadline, and then asked him to move on. The break was traumatic, including some very threatening and aggressive attitudes/moves on his part. He tried to turn it into a fidelity issue, accusing me of having someone on the side, which was simply a ploy to whitewash himself and impute guilt to me.

Three months after moving on, he still doesn't have a job, and is selling all the assets I sent along with him. Makes me feel like I'm still being used, in a way, but the money flow is cut off, despite him coming to me several times for "a loan" of thousands of baht (and not getting it).

However, after making the break, I feel much better about myself, and not contributing to his irresponsibility. I really hope he finds self-sufficiency and the self-respect that comes with it. Although he is really an attractive person in many other ways, this would be icing on the cake, if he can master this major area of life. I would even consider trying another "round" once he proves to himself and others that he can live and work responsibly. I really am still in love with him, since he was my "first" Thai relationship. No one else compares in the romantic field. As to this problem, however, he does have the talent and education--just hasn't taken his head out of the sand to face reality, yet. I was his ATM for way too long....

Edited November 28, 2006 by toptuan

[girlx]

wow haven't read all these posts yet but this is exactly like my last boyfriend, also from isaan, including the disappearing. i wasted 3 years on him before i decided i couldn't be with someone who had no passion for life, not to mention me.

[cm-happy]

Thank you everyone for your replies.

I've finally decided I need to free myself from this situation. No more LTR's for me. If I need it I'll buy it!

Have to wait for the right moment to tell him It's over, so not to be too confrontational, or perhaps just withhold all support, and he'll get the idea and move out on his own free will.

[dukkha]

Congratulations on your courage, not always an easy step to make...had a friend call yesterday to say that as soon as he stopped giving the lad money he left...oh well, not uncommon, need to put self first on some occaisons, best wishes and good luck Dukkha

[girlx]

that's what i did too, cut off any support, he disappeared.

it's a lot more hurtful when you don't realize you are exchanging money for sex. with the boys it's not upfront like it is with the girls.

[idle44mins]

Thanks cm-happy,

I have no advise, but I just want to thank you. I thought I was the only one with your kind of bf-problem. I recognize every word you wrote.

Please remember Cm-happy, we are not unique. There are plenty of collegue-farangs with exact the same problem and only the cold hearted ones know how to deal with these kind of bf. That's why I always sleep with my aircon on 21

[martine]

IF YOU THINK THAT THAI BOYS LOVE US THINK AGAIN, THEY ARE POOR IT IS AN EASY WAY OUT OF POVERTY,IT IS NOT POSSIBLE FOR A YOUNG THAI TO LOVE AN OLD FARANG, [ IM 60], ITS A FINANCIAL ISSUE ONLY,YOU THREW HIM OUT FOR NOT TRYING TO FIND WORK GOOD ON YOU,WE DONT NEED THE HASSLE,ENJOY YOUR LAST YEARS ,THAIS WILL TAKE FOR A RIDE DONT LET THEM,ENJOY SOCIALISING DONT GET TOO INVOLVED.ENJOY ,ITS LATER THAN YOU THINK...

[chai1240]

Hi,

How easy to change human habits!!! No If there have not good conditions...or may be not happen in whole life...Let him go and walk to your way.

Not all Thai boys to have that habit...u must smart to search them.

Lucky in love, Lucky in game

:-)

[Trouble]

CM-Happy. Glad you got the courage to take action. Many of us have been in the same boat that you describe. Whle I have been used (happily not also abused), I have generally gone into it with both eyes open. I have been pretty lucky in that the last three (all long distance) have all been really decent guys and oddly enough when things ended did not disappear from my life. I never asked much of them and I guess just realized that supporting them with money is just the nature of the beast. I don't know where the situation is going with the current guy. I will be retiring this year and I am concerned that once retired our relationship will change dramatically, but I can handle that because I know that he too will not pass from my life even if we do break it off. Maybe part of that maintaining contact is because of my attitude towards them. I work very hard at a friendship not just the romance or sex part of things. Think they end up seeing me as a good person who was just trying to be nice and help out. There seems to be no bitterness when it ends. As one of the posters said there are plenty of guys out there. I think it is just important to set the rules the minute one starts talking about living together as this definitely changes the dynamics of the relationship. When one of the parties cannot live up to the agreement then it is probably time to part ways. I think it is important to make it perfectly clear what is acceptable behavior and what is not. That is not just because you are footing the bills but both parties MUST know what the other wants out of the relationship. If either does not get their needs met, whether financial, sexual or emotional. It is just time to end it. There are guys out there looking for a decent relationship. They are probably not in the20 to 30 age range but the over 30 guys begin to see their time running out and their perspective changes. I long for the day when I can actually be in Thailand almost full time and try a full time relationship out with one of these guys. The current guy is certainly of my liking but I am not clear on his take on a full time relationship when the time comes.

In the mean time, I have been fortunate to meet a Thai student attending grad school here in America and he is a gem. He honestly wants this older guy (me) as a partner and wants nothing in return. So I am going along for now just to see where it leads. This guy has actually pursued me in a way I had not been exposed to in a long time. It is just a thrill for me. I know he will be returning to Thailand after he finishes school so I do not hold out any long term hopes at the present time but he knows I am retiring and has hopes I will be his partner in Thailand. The whole thing will probably blow up in my face when both these guys are in Thailand and I (unlike many Thais) cannot juggle two guys.

So do what you need to do. Sometimes we farang just try to be too nice. There is nothing wrong with that but I have discovered that at this point in my life my needs are important also and giving in to someone who does not meet me half way just is not going to work. I don't need the stress at this point in my life. As much as I want a special guy in my life, I will no longer be the whipping boy for some Thai just to have a little romance. There are just too many out there that will treat me better if I look around. Good luck.

[ProThaiExpat]

In the West, I was told that the reason I had so many dysfunctional relationships with young men was “no young gay guy with his act together would choose a much older man as a lover”. The truth of this assertion hit me like a “ton of bricks at the time.

The “myth” about Thailand, that I embraced, because that is what I wanted to hear, was that “Thai boys don't have an age prejudice as young men in the West do” and so I leaped to the idea that a equal partnership relationship was possible in a falang/thai“spring/winter” liaison with a Thai.

Convoluted as the reasoning was, if I avoided “money boys”, a decent Thai farm boy, usually from Issan, would be a great candidate for a LTR based on love and mutual caring.

Sure, I acknowledged that, like in the west, the boy would be “marrying well” so to speak, but that in the long run the relationship would be based on something other than money. Hah!!!

Sure,one could not blame the boy for “feathering his own nest or his families” in the process. Hah!!!

Well after five years with the same Thai and faced with all the same issues discussed at length in this thread and others regarding "sick buffalo" , I have concluded that the age of the Thai is very important as mentioned in the previous post. A thirty something Thai is in a very definite different situation than under 30 is. Many Thai boys think they are "over the hill" when they reach 30 and so are more likely to "work things out" with an older falang that is good to them than "catching" another which may be more difficult, due to the falang penchant for under 30 guys.

While treating my Thai as a "partner" in the western sense hasn't worked, I have learned that my support must be put in a context understandable in Thai society. What I mean is that all Thai boys understand what a "salary" is, but really don't understand the concept of an "allowance". When I spent a year in Australia with my Thai and my daughter augmented my pension so I could rent a pricey apartment next to hers at the beach, the augmentation was given to my Thai as "salary", since he was doing a lot of house cleaning and laundry for her anyway. While he received this "salary" he worked dillegently and was pleased when he received it. He was free to spend it as he chose.

My support of my Thai has increasingly been taken for granted over the five years we have been together and he completely failed to demonstrate an understanding of mutual contribution to the household. He developed an attitude that he had a "rich husband" and that any money he received was something he was entitled to.

Taking a lesson from what happened in Australia, I have produced a "work schedule" directly tied to his household duties and other things he does for me, except sex, and tied his support directly to his work effort. No work, no support.

A little crass, you might think, but I have abandoned my romantic western notions about a Thai understanding mutual contributory effort and so far, by giving my Thai the option of getting a job or working for "salary" at home has done the trick. It was classic, diligent work and contribution during our first year together, to "catch" me, then a gradual dimunition of effort toward the relationship to the point of flaking out generally. It took a major breakup threatening scene to get on the new footing, and while it doesn't sound romantic, I was at wits end until I drew the line in the sand. "Get a job or follow this schedule of work around the house for "salary". The schedule of work around the house. allows sufficent free time for recreation and school work. Not as much time for naps, T.V., etc. but once I assumed the role as "employer" in this regard and I referrerd to the support as "my money" which I "pay you", his attitude changed radically. I was just too soft and romantic. Thais like strong men.

The "collegial" approach just didn't work. Sure, I was kind, but not getting what I wanted and needed out of his contributory efforts. Sex is a different issue and I have never had that problem with him. Likewise, overnights with friends and other "deal breaking behaviour" hasn't been a problem.

Perhaps my "problem" with my Thai is not of the magnitude as those expressed in this thread so far, I offer this "approach" toward "fine tuning" in Thai/falang male relationships for what it is worth. Keep in mind, while my Thai looks cute, has a great body and looks under 30, his 40th birthday is next March. I would never attempt any relationship with an under 30 Thai boy.

Thais in relationships with falang who do not work outside the home may well have a "self worth" issue, although I doubt it, so making work around the house a "job" with "pay" sure cures that notion. Anyway, it worked for me and all is tranquil these days as my Thai knows "no work" no "salary" and by the way I sprinkled a few "bonuses" into the mix, money I would have given him anyway, from experience, but identifying it as a "bonus", only added to his self worth and compensation for work well done.

For those new to the "scene" in Thailand may well find this approach "hard", "crass" and certainly not something acceptable in the "west", it has worked for me. Sure,I am "buying" his cooperation and contribution to the relationship and the household. So what!! Separating "love" and "caring" from daily work realities is important, in my view.

Edited December 23, 2006 by ProThaiExpat

[PeaceBlondie]

Excellent contribution, ProThaiExpat: just what some of us needed to hear.

My bf calls his monthly income a salary, too, and he works for it. While I was gone last weekend, he did the heavy cleaning (windows, screens, etc.). Having been a hotel housekeeping manager, he knows how to do this. When we first started the LTR with salary, one day he asked what he wasn't cleaning. I told him, and he did it. He cooks, sends out the laundry, pays the bills, runs the errands, buys the daily groceries, etc. He'd wash my bike if I asked him; he washes the car without being asked.

And, he was 34 when I met him, with a resume. He'd worked for a living since he was a teenager.

Just giving an allowance to a young man, without any expectations as to even sharing the household chores, wouldn't work well in most cases.

[ProThaiExpat]

Thanks PeaceBlondie for the kind words. Your last sentence regarding expectations is a major hangup for many, especialy me.

I have expectations for my partner to contribute to the relationship and when he doesn't, I get angry. Classic failure of expectations-anger scenario. Duh, when I didn't tell hiim of my expectations and he failed to meet the unexplained expectations, anger expressed unfairly.

The schedule I prepared and the tying of that to "salary" has really done the trick. Also I sprinkled a couple of bonuses in there for extra efforts. Now he knows what the expectations are and a simple check off list, for when he gets lazy, or to keep him from forgetting something has really made things a lot better.

A professor once told me when I complained about a grade by saying I knew the answer, just didn't put it down, he said "Well then, turn in your head and I will grade that". Our Thais need to hear what is in our heads and the schedule does that without my nagging. He refers to the schedule at the start of the days work and feels a sense of accomplishment when the tasks have been completed. Especially when there is a reward for successful completion.

Sounds a bit like child psychology, but aren't all men just grown up little boys?

By "dignifying" his "job" as House Manager and Thailand Business Manager with a handsome salary, my Thai has status whenever he feels the need for it and an easy explanation for his Thai friends and acquaintances when he doesn't care to share information regarding our intimate relationship.

[popshirt]

By "dignifying" his "job" as House Manager and Thailand Business Manager with a handsome salary, my Thai has status whenever he feels the need for it and an easy explanation for his Thai friends and acquaintances when he doesn't care to share information regarding our intimate relationship.

Can you give me a "ball park figure" for what a "handsome" or even just adequate salary might be?

[ProThaiExpat]

Of course, compensation, whether legitimate salary or an "allowance" termed a "salary", varies considerably between falang and their mates or g/fs. To me, anything in excess of 6K Baht in Chiang Mai for what is essentially "housework" is generous.

After years of responding to "water buffalo" requests, I drew a line in the sand and essentiall made a "deal" to the effect that I would split what we had left over from my pension, after paying expenses for the month. It is hard for a Thai to ask for more than an even split of disposable income. (He does ask for loans to be paid out of future savings, but that has been stopped)

The key word is "expenses", all food bought in the supermarket is a pre-split expense, however, thai food bought at stalls on the way home from sport, sport expenses and clothing purchases are all out of his split. Likewise, cosmetics and the myriad other expenses that are discretionary are out of his split. Cell phone is out of his split or that portion of his cell phone expense that is in excess of mine is out of his half.

With the devaluation of the dollar, there are not as many "savings" at the end of the month as there were and we definitely are in a "poor" mode, however, we are talking about his half of the split being double the generous level mentioned above. When there are dental expenses or hospital expenses, they are an expense, so this last month the split was quite small due to a heavy dental month.

I do permit a "draw" weekly from his split as an advance so he has spending money and doesn't have to ask me for money. Thus at the end of the month, I ascertain his portion of the "split", then deduct his draw for the month and deduct any outstanding debt and tranfer to his personal account the balance.

He made a substantial loan a few months ago, so it will be a while until he actually gets any "Salary" at the end of the month, unless the sister who made the loan from him, pays him back and he returns the money to me. In months where there is a shortfall, his draw for weekly expenses is levied against his loan accout. (I can always forgive debt if it doesn't look like he will expect it)

The foregoing arrangement has removed, mostly, requests for cash, loans, "water buffalo" stories, and as previously posted, much of my anger for his failure to contribute, through work efforts, the running of the household.

I am sure there are as many "arrangements" between committed couples, gay or straight, as there are couples, so there is noting magical or unique about my arrangement with my Thai. It has taken five years to get to this point, however, mostly due to my own inability to draw the line, say no and otherwise stop being so co-dependent. Despite all of the above, we are a very loving couple in a monogamous relationship.

I have noticed that spending between couples is always an issue and ones lifestyle and expense mode depends on you. If 100 Baht is not a lot of money to you and you act accordingly, you can't expect your partner to act otherwise. Likewise, if receipts are asked for all expenses paid by your partner for which reinbursement is expected, attention is payed to ten bahts. I expect and recieve change and a receipt for all money advanced for purchases to be paid on my behalf by my Thai, and he is always delighted, upon presentation of change and receipt, if I "tip" him with the change.

The old saying, "Pay attention to the pennies and the dollars will take care of themselves" works with the baht as well.

Edited December 24, 2006 by ProThaiExpat

[PeaceBlondie]

By "dignifying" his "job" as House Manager and Thailand Business Manager with a handsome salary, my Thai has status whenever he feels the need for it and an easy explanation for his Thai friends and acquaintances when he doesn't care to share information regarding our intimate relationship.

Can you give me a "ball park figure" for what a "handsome" or even just adequate salary might be?

There's been a lot of threads in other forums of ThaiVisa about how, and how much, farang share their income with their 'domestic partners.' Much of their wisdom applies with gay partnerships.

If your income is 180,000 baht a month, and you pay all household expenses out of that (including vehicle and furnitue purchases, etc.), how would you share the remainder if it's 82,500 baht? How much is it worth it to a farang to have a Thai partner cleaning house, cooking, remembering appointments, guarding the property, giving you advice, running errands, translating between the languages, etc.?

[Rosemarry]

My boyfriend is Swedish, 62 years old and I'm Thai, 29 years old. I've known my boyfriend for 5 years before we agreed that he should move to Thailand after retirement because Thailand is very nice country to live and I have a good job in Bangkok. Now we have been together in Bangkok for 2 years and everything goes very well for us. My boyfriend is not a rich guy but we share everything, he puts his money and my money together for our expense each month so we don't have problem with our financial.

I always think that I hope it's not too late to meet my boyfriend and live with him when he's 62 years old. Sometimes I looked at him when he was sleeping next to me and I thought how I can live without him because I love him very much. Of course, he's not my first boyfriend but time passed and I could learn by my experience how to live with someone and share my life with, but it was very hard to find the right one.

I believe that many foreigners came to Thailand and had bad experiences with Thai boys. Many look for a young boy, some of them is student or money boy but if you could support him and you are willing to do that, maybe money will come before love.

In the other hand, many of Thai boy or guy is looking for the real love but it's hard for them to find the right one because of the different of language, culture, distance, etc and finally they were hurt. Some foreigners come to Thailand just to have fun and they don't know or care what they leaves behind after they goes back to their country and that many boys is hurt alot.

Anyway, you have made decision already and I hope you will open your heart again and I wish you to meet the right guy soon.

My boyfirend and I are going to CM next week, if you need somefriends to talk to, just make a contact and we can meet and share experience and I hope you will feel better.

Cheers!

[popshirt]

By "dignifying" his "job" as House Manager and Thailand Business Manager with a handsome salary, my Thai has status whenever he feels the need for it and an easy explanation for his Thai friends and acquaintances when he doesn't care to share information regarding our intimate relationship.

Can you give me a "ball park figure" for what a "handsome" or even just adequate salary might be?

There's been a lot of threads in other forums of ThaiVisa about how, and how much, farang share their income with their 'domestic partners.' Much of their wisdom applies with gay partnerships.

If your income is 180,000 baht a month, and you pay all household expenses out of that (including vehicle and furnitue purchases, etc.), how would you share the remainder if it's 82,500 baht? How much is it worth it to a farang to have a Thai partner cleaning house, cooking, remembering appointments, guarding the property, giving you advice, running errands, translating between the languages, etc.?

My question was really directed to the OP (ProThaiExpat) not the Mod

[ProThaiExpat]

Popshirt: Answer to your question was as follows: "Of course, compensation, whether legitimate salary or an "allowance" termed a "salary", varies considerably between falang and their mates or g/fs. To me, anything in excess of 6K Baht in Chiang Mai for what is essentially "housework" is generous."

"we are talking about his half of the split being double the generous level mentioned above."

There have been months that his "split" is three times the level mentioned above and other months where it is equal to his "draw" but rarely.

[RAMPAGE]

IF YOU THINK THAT THAI BOYS LOVE US THINK AGAIN, THEY ARE POOR IT IS AN EASY WAY OUT OF POVERTY,IT IS NOT POSSIBLE FOR A YOUNG THAI TO LOVE AN OLD FARANG, [ IM 60], ITS A FINANCIAL ISSUE ONLY,YOU THREW HIM OUT FOR NOT TRYING TO FIND WORK GOOD ON YOU,WE DONT NEED THE HASSLE,ENJOY YOUR LAST YEARS ,THAIS WILL TAKE FOR A RIDE DONT LET THEM,ENJOY SOCIALISING DONT GET TOO INVOLVED.ENJOY ,ITS LATER THAN YOU THINK...

Actually you're wrong.It IS possible for a young Thai to love an older man. It all stems from the fact that Thai men in general make such lousy fathers. As a result they produce children (both girls and boys) who spend their lives looking for a father figure. After nearly 20 years in Thailand I am convinced that this is the fundamental reason why you see May-December relationshps everywhere. Yes, its popular to simply write it off to poverty but thats not always true. I am 59, my partner is 23. He works full time and knows full well that unemployment is not an option. We have a loving relationship. I am happy to provide the accommodation but he must (and always has) take care of his own personal expenses.

No one should enter a relationship in this country without first looking in the mirror and deciding exactly what it is that you are seeking. You should never compromise your self-respect. If you don't respect yourself, don't expect your Thai partner to respect you. On those rare occasions when my partner has shown disrespect, he is informed, immediately, that this behaviour is unnacceptable and has learned from the experience that respect is a two-way street.

Of course, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. It all starts with the raw material. If you choose someone with no education, it quite likely follows that you have also chosen someone with no ambition. And your friend has wisely chosen a walking ATM machine.

[popshirt]

I agree with you Rampage. But it is very difficult for Thais to find a job in this country even if they have a good university education. The jobs simply aren't there.

[steveromagnino]

Actually you're wrong.It IS possible for a young Thai to love an older man. It all stems from the fact that Thai men in general make such lousy fathers.

thanks for the assessment ;-0

The idea that Thai people are less concerned about age compared to the west is a joke. Thailand is more preoccupied with youthful appearances, being cute and not aging; superficial appearance are far more important here than in the western countries i have lived in.

For some gay/non gay western men to believe otherwise must involve some quite major mental gymnastics. What we see with a older man/younger man/woman is almost invariably some sort of other factor at play; namely, one person has relatively more money/assets and is sharing them with the poorer one, so the age/lack of looks/having to put up with people thinking they are a prostitute factor is compensated for. Yes, there are a few cases where the relationship is based on something else, but odds are well less than 50% and drop that another few points in cases where the younger partner is poorly educated with no money and no job.

My encounters with girlfriends/partners/boyfriends of very rich older men in the west has been almost the same; the money makes for some mighty nice trappings and that compensates for some other 'factors' in the relationship.

The idea that someone would want to date a person their dad's age....well go through the hoops you need to for believing that; the advantage of someone their dad's age is usually financial security; a more even keeled individual (without youthful temper) and perhaps also a bit more of a blind eye to indiscretions. But don't fool yourself this is what Thai people in general 'want'; they don't want it anymore (or any less) than most of the rest of the world. it is just that many are pragmatic (especially in Isaan) and given the choice of working hard or kicking back with a rich partner, well the rich partner is easier for everyone.

Incidentally, there are a TON of decent jobs available in Bangkok. Upcountry, perhaps not, but for anyone with a half decent degree (which rules out a fair few) in BKK telling you otherwise they are probably talking rubbish. Sometimes the starting pay isn't great, but NEVER believe the 'they won't hire me, they won't hire gays, they won't hire someone from upcountry, etc, etc' rubbish that many people will spout, it simply is not true in Bangkok.

[RAMPAGE]

Actually you're wrong.It IS possible for a young Thai to love an older man. It all stems from the fact that Thai men in general make such lousy fathers.

thanks for the assessment ;-0

The idea that Thai people are less concerned about age compared to the west is a joke. Thailand is more preoccupied with youthful appearances, being cute and not aging; superficial appearance are far more important here than in the western countries i have lived in.

For some gay/non gay western men to believe otherwise must involve some quite major mental gymnastics. What we see with a older man/younger man/woman is almost invariably some sort of other factor at play; namely, one person has relatively more money/assets and is sharing them with the poorer one, so the age/lack of looks/having to put up with people thinking they are a prostitute factor is compensated for. Yes, there are a few cases where the relationship is based on something else, but odds are well less than 50% and drop that another few points in cases where the younger partner is poorly educated with no money and no job.

My encounters with girlfriends/partners/boyfriends of very rich older men in the west has been almost the same; the money makes for some mighty nice trappings and that compensates for some other 'factors' in the relationship.

The idea that someone would want to date a person their dad's age....well go through the hoops you need to for believing that; the advantage of someone their dad's age is usually financial security; a more even keeled individual (without youthful temper) and perhaps also a bit more of a blind eye to indiscretions. But don't fool yourself this is what Thai people in general 'want'; they don't want it anymore (or any less) than most of the rest of the world. it is just that many are pragmatic (especially in Isaan) and given the choice of working hard or kicking back with a rich partner, well the rich partner is easier for everyone.

Incidentally, there are a TON of decent jobs available in Bangkok. Upcountry, perhaps not, but for anyone with a half decent degree (which rules out a fair few) in BKK telling you otherwise they are probably talking rubbish. Sometimes the starting pay isn't great, but NEVER believe the 'they won't hire me, they won't hire gays, they won't hire someone from upcountry, etc, etc' rubbish that many people will spout, it simply is not true in Bangkok.

Yes, I agree with the comment on "pragmatism". I forgot to mention it in my first missive. I have found Thais much more pragmatic in affairs of the heart that westerners. That said, I still stand by my thesis that there is such a thing as a younger person (male or female attrracted to an older person). The fact that the attraction may be the desire for a "even-keeled temperament and maturity" as you point out, does not invalidate the thesis.

I also agree with your comment about jobs. Anyone accepting a story that jobs are hard to find is being naive.

[Fun2Fun]

The idea that someone would want to date a person their dad's age....well go through the hoops you need to for believing that;

That belief can be compared with how big a chance you have to win million in the next lottery draw.

It can happen to you, but HEY how many times have you won Millions in the lottery?