No jail time for driver who killed German in road accident

[Jonmarleesco]

I doubt any further proof of Thai courts' link with asses was needed, following recent cases, but they seem determined to push the point home.

[gdgbb]

On 15/10/2016 at 7:28 PM, LivinginKata said:

No real surprise here. The accused paid the necessary 'blood money' and the small fine. That's the way it plays here in Thailand.

 

In addition to a 2 year suspended sentence a 7500 baht fine, as prescribed by law, is what he has to pay in addition to 1.8m baht compensation, hardly "small", and that is the way 'it plays' worldwide.  No blood money had to be paid.

[gdgbb]

14 hours ago, NamKangMan said:

 

 

You totally miss the point.

 

The German family of the deceased will probably not see one baht of the purposed 1.8 million baht "compensation." 

 

That just leaves the German family knowing that the man who killed their son was fined 7500 baht, and NO GAOL TIME.

 

Where is the "justice" for them????

 

Get it?

If he doesn't pay he goes to jail.  Get it?

[LivinginKata]

58 minutes ago, gdgbb said:

If he doesn't pay he goes to jail.  Get it?

 

You really believe that ?  He will make legal appeals and excuses for ever. 

[MikeyIdea]

32 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

You really believe that ?  He will make legal appeals and excuses for ever. 

 

No Kata, this is criminal and not civil law

 

He can easily appeal all the way to the supreme court in a civil law case and nothing will be enforced until the Supreme court is ready but that does not apply to criminal law

 

Criminal law does not wait for appeals = he has a suspended jail sentence already and he can appeal as much as he wants but his jail sentence will be enforced and he will be put in jail for up to 2 years if he does not pay

 

[LivinginKata]

29 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

 

No Kata, this is criminal and not civil law

 

He can easily appeal all the way to the supreme court in a civil law case and nothing will be enforced until the Supreme court is ready but that does not apply to criminal law

 

Criminal law does not wait for appeals = he has a suspended jail sentence already and he can appeal as much as he wants but his jail sentence will be enforced and he will be put in jail for up to 2 years if he does not pay

 

 

Ah yes ... I have not considered the 2 year suspended sentence. I wonder how long  that will stay in force ?

[MikeyIdea]

11 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Ah yes ... I have not considered the 2 year suspended sentence. I wonder how long  that will stay in force ?

 

Not sure, an arrest warrant for a criminal offence is valid 15 years if I remember right (That's why Thaksin is not back yet ), wouldn't surprise me if it is the same

 

[gemini81]

6 hours ago, MikeyIdea said:

 

Not sure, an arrest warrant for a criminal offence is valid 15 years if I remember right (That's why Thaksin is not back yet ), wouldn't surprise me if it is the same

 

Same for red bull heir. All about the money.

[MikeyIdea]

Gemini, I really don't understand your post. I posted;

15 hours ago, MikeyIdea said:

Not sure, an arrest warrant for a criminal offence is valid 15 years if I remember right (That's why Thaksin is not back yet ), wouldn't surprise me if it is the same

And you answered:

9 hours ago, gemini81 said:

Same for red bull heir. All about the money.

 

First of all, you respond to a post where I state that an arrest warrant is valid for 15 years and that not even Thaksin with all his money can come back to Thailand because it is still valid

 

Secondly, you post in a thread where the offender got a 2 year suspended jail sentence which is much higher than what is the norm in Thailand, that is harder than what the offender would have gotten in my home country too

 

Thirdly, the Red Bull heir case is not closed yet, he has fled the country because he doesn't want to face justice but he will, just as Thaksin did, face an arrest warrant if he doesn't come back to Thailand. An arrest warrant will be valid for 15 years for him too, same as for Thaksin

 

So, what do you mean with - All about the money ?

 

Edited October 18, 2016 by MikeyIdea

[NamKangMan]

On 17/10/2016 at 8:36 AM, Rorri said:

Does it says she "demanded " anything, all I can read is compensation  was ordered by the court. She did ask for 800,000 baht for her injuries, seems fair to me. You comment is rather crass, and would be a good case for defamation.

 

 

" About a week later, Ms Patcharin went to police with CCTV footage and eye witness statements in an effort to prove that Mr Jakarin was at fault." - why did she go to the of investigating the case herself, because the police were not interested in doing so????

 

It was for money, not for justice, although, in Thailand, they are often viewed as the same. 

[NamKangMan]

On 17/10/2016 at 0:59 PM, farcanell said:

 

Not like you to miss the salient points,  namkang.... read the link.

 

i quote.... "a final settlement was then reached to compensate mr Walters relatives in Germany with a 1.3 million baht payout"... "mr Walters relatives received the full amount"

 

also ( quoting but jumping back and forth may make me miss words)... "ms petcharin demanded 800,000 baht, but settled for 500,000 baht, because she wanted things to end peacefully" ( which may suggest fear of local reprisal??? You be the judge of that thought)

 

further, everyone was astounded that no jail time was given, but for various personal reasons, there will be no appeal (in an attempt to change that)

 

Anyway.... thats how the blood money was apportioned.... rightly or wrongly.

 

for me, what the offender did was absolutely heinous and repulsive, in attempting to flee, the scene, he turned a hit and run incident, that was probably survivable, into a callous murder (but perhaps his engine was revving to loudly, in an attempt to mount the obstacle, that was a screaming man, such that the screams were drowned out)

 

as to justice.... seriously lacking... a man died horribly, and unnecessarily, but the bloodmoney,  has been apportioned and paid (well... to the Germans anyway... no mention of ms petcharin having received her percentage, that I saw).... but I suppose that this is justice thai style, and the best that we will see.

 

if I still don't get it.... rephrase your post, and, being ever persistent, I will try again

 

 

I think the fact that police couldn't even be bothered to investigate this accident is a disgrace.  Perhaps they knew there would be no "commission" in it for them.

 

Do you really think the family in Germany will receive any money, and if they did, do you know how little Euro that is?  I am sure they would rather he receive a prison sentence.

 

In the west, not wearing a helmet, seat beat etc draws a fine as punishment, but to cause the death of another, in general, results in the loss of liberty for the offending person.

 

In Thailand, for a similar crime, the loss of money is seen to be enough punishment for the offender.  This is obviously a system that punishes the poor, rather than the wealthy, who often escape justice completely. 

 

Let's say the offender in this case does pay, and then turns to crime, say, drug dealing, to recoup the money.  What has the Thai justice system achieved???? 

 

What if this guy is reasonably wealthy, and had killed someone in similar circumstances last year, so he has a history of this.  How does this modify his behaviour????

 

3rd world justice system for a 3rd world country.

[NamKangMan]

20 hours ago, gdgbb said:

If he doesn't pay he goes to jail.  Get it?

 

 

So, he has the option of "buying" his freedom, rather than losing it. 

 

I doubt the German family would find this acceptable. 

[farcanell]

On 10/17/2016 at 4:36 AM, Rorri said:

Does it says she "demanded " anything, all I can read is compensation  was ordered by the court. She did ask for 800,000 baht for her injuries, seems fair to me. You comment is rather crass, and would be a good case for defamation.

 

Paragraph 13 of the linked story...

 

"ms patcherin demanded 800 000 baht...." 

 

could be a reporters scew on thai words, but that's what it says.

[NamKangMan]

On 17/10/2016 at 0:58 PM, MikeyIdea said:

OK, NamKangMan, let's be fair and give you an opportunity to explain what you mean with that.

There was another Thai Thai criminal case where the offender killed a Thai driver and injured his family that I referenced. My post is here;

Then you answered;

And to that I answered;

To which you answered;

 

NamKangMan: I'll be as fair as I possibly can - Please intelligently explain your statement

 

I think that most ThaiVisa members posting in this thread know that the case this thread covers never would have gone to sentencing in criminal court had not a farang been killed. The same goes for the 1.8 million baht penalties awarded, it's enormous by Thai standards

 

I would expect that you again post without knowing anything about Thailand so I'll explain what you should have known before you posted. Thai police have the right to issue a light penalty according to criminal law without taking a case to court if they see suitable. The penalty is limited to money and the standard is 1,000 baht (max 2,000 baht), the offender has the right to refuse and demand the case to be tried in court if he wants. The case that I referenced was exactly that, it was not a sentencing in court but a fee paid at the police station

 

2 year suspended jail, 1.8 million baht compensation and 7,500 baht penalty.

So NamKangMan, considering that you state that it is rubbish that Thai's get a harder sentencing if a farang is killed, what in your experience do Thai Thai cases get?

 

 

"Penalty: Criminal offence 1,000 baht" - "Thai's get a much harder penalty when westerners are involved, that does not sound fair at all"

 

The Thai women had to do the investigation herself.

 

The police here didn't care a farang died, and therefore couldn't even be bothered to investigate the matter.  They didn't even care to check the CCTV of a nearby camera.

 

And you think they care about a harsher penalty for THIS Thai on farang death?  Yeah, right.  

 

In fairness, Thai's have received harsher penalties for murdering tourists, but only because it makes international news, and "tarnishes" the tourism industry.  That said, with all the pardons, sentence reductions etc, who knows how much time these people actually serve.

 

"2 year suspended jail, 1.8 million baht compensation and 7,500 baht penalty." - as mentioned in a previous post, IF this guy is a wealthy Thai, and IF he pays the money, with NO loss of liberty, how can this be viewed as a harsher penalty than a Thai on Thai accident????  

 

This is where your argument breaks down.  Prison "equals" everyone (corrupt payments to prison officers in Thai prisons aside)  Everyone enters prison with the same possessions - zero.  The loss of only money, whether it be called "a fine" or "compensation" is selective justice, effecting the less wealthy, more than the wealthy.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 18, 2016 by NamKangMan

[kingalfred]

No justice for Foreigners EVER in LoS


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[farcanell]

10 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

 

"mr wallers family have received the 1.3 million baht... " - yes, I read this.

 

Last week we had a "driving instructor" involved in a road incident, and a couple of hours later he was a "diving instructor." 

 

Maybe this guy was wealthy, and paid.  Maybe he borrowed against the family's house and paid and is working to pay back the bank, or, is now resorting to crime to pay the bank.  Maybe a criminal group paid on his behalf and now he works for them.  Maybe he didn't pay at all.  Who knows. 

 

Simply put, the option shouldn't exist to "buy" your freedom when you have committed a crime, particularly when that crime involves the death of another, but is a country where money is the closest thing to Buddha, what do you expect?

 

I agree 100%..... the option to buy your freedom should not exist, following the commission of a crime.

 

in some countries, that's called bribing an official, and a further crime.

 

in some countries it's commonplace

 

That said, I'm far from suggesting Thailand should "westernize", as it has a beautiful culture of its own.... but until the government ( of the day ?) can implement and execute fair and just laws for nationals and visitors to these shores, Thailand will languish in the lists of regressive countries, blinded by its own ineffectiveness to succeed as a modern society.... unfortunately.

[NamKangMan]

6 minutes ago, farcanell said:

 

I agree 100%..... the option to buy your freedom should not exist, following the commission of a crime.

 

in some countries, that's called bribing an official, and a further crime.

 

in some countries it's commonplace

 

That said, I'm far from suggesting Thailand should "westernize", as it has a beautiful culture of its own.... but until the government ( of the day ?) can implement and execute fair and just laws for nationals and visitors to these shores, Thailand will languish in the lists of regressive countries, blinded by its own ineffectiveness to succeed as a modern society.... unfortunately.

 

 

"That said, I'm far from suggesting Thailand should "westernize", as it has a beautiful culture of its own." - I agree, however, corruption is viewed as being a part of "Thai culture." 

 

This will take generations to change, because the "one law for the rich, and another law for the poor" is so ingrained in Thai society.  

[MikeyIdea]

35 minutes ago, farcanell said:

everyone involved, apparently, expected jail time to be included in sentencing... and were shoched when it was not

 

now... more interesting... no mention was made as to wether or not ms patcherin has received her 500 000 baht.... I suspect that she may not, and would be to scared of reprisals to bring the matter back into the light ( hopefully I'm wrong, as her ordeal was horrible, watching her partner being repeated run over, reliving those screaming last moments....)

 

Sadly enough, no Thai's expected anything more than suspended jail sentence when the compensation was so high. That was just words for show

 

The Thai victim will get her money or the offender will go to jail, there is no doubt about that. Or she could already have gotten it, we don't know. The court order will clearly specify when and how compensation is to be paid

 

Thailand has a fully implemented system to enforce court compensation. The company I work for normally has one or more in the sales force that they by court order must deduct salary for every month, I asked about it and compensation is always enforced and the process to enforce is pretty simple and quick

 

The problem with it is that it only works when a person has a legal income, or in this case where there is a suspended sentence

 

Ms. Patcharin can calmly sit there and hope that the offender doesn't pay if she wants western style justice

 

[nottocus]

On ‎10‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 9:09 PM, MikeyIdea said:

 

And you would have known that the penalty there was much much lighter. Thai's were upset that the offender there only got a 1,000 bath penalty

 

 

Wow. He must have been smelling clean after that.

[MikeyIdea]

4 minutes ago, nottocus said:

 

Wow. He must have been smelling clean after that.

 

Offender yes, other Thai's were very upset

 

[6thST]

On 10/15/2016 at 7:28 PM, LivinginKata said:

No rea   here. The accused paid the necessary 'blood money' and the small fine. That's the way it plays here in Thailand.

What a disgrace...Don't these people feel any remorse or shame? He just killed another human being while drunk.and he's allowed to just walk away? I hope he gets his payback.My condolences go out to the decease's family...R.I.P.

  

[6thST]

On 10/18/2016 at 0:54 PM, MikeyIdea said:

 

Offender yes, other Thai's were very upset

 

It could have been just as easy if it was a Thai.killed...Money stinks here...

[NamKangMan]

17 hours ago, 6thST said:

What a disgrace...Don't these people feel any remorse or shame? He just killed another human being while drunk.and he's allowed to just walk away? I hope he gets his payback.My condolences go out to the decease's family...R.I.P.

  

 

 

"He just killed another human being" - no, he killed an "Alien" - they are different.  

[realenglish1]

If it was the son or daughter of an prominent figure then jail time is a given

[MikeyIdea]

31 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"He just killed another human being" - no, he killed an "Alien" - they are different.  

 

Yes, and the offender sits there now and thinks about his bad luck killing a farang

 

If only I could have killed a Thai instead, then at least the this would never have gone to court and I would have had to pay much less compensation

 

[Lee4Life]

On ‎10‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 8:42 AM, NamKangMan said:

 

Makes you wonder how much she would have demanded from a farang tourist or expat????

doesn't make me wonder at all, and it shouldn't make you either