SURVEY: Should the government be involved in rice subsidies?

[robblok]

34 minutes ago, Grubster said:

No you are missing the point, I am saying if you don't want unfair advantages than the government should do nothing for the tourist industry, or any other industry. These industries should provide there own Airports, Shipping yards etc. The fact these industries are making money is because the government has spent vast resources to make it possible. Now is not the time to give up on the farming industry, It is the time to help them get a foot up on the highly subsidized world markets. How to do that is not an easy answer to come up with but turning their back on the farmers is not the answer.

          I don't know how many farmers there are but it sure seams that the current government has gone to great measures to ensure they can't vote on anything haven't they. They/He has already announced that for the next eight years He will decide if anybody elected should take office or not. Do you not believe your vote should count in your country? Cant have it both ways or can they?

Id like you to show me the loss of the airports. The infrastructure is something the farmers benefit from too (unless they transport their rice magically). Also road tax finances infrastructure.. and everyone is paying it. That is not for the tourist industry. No other industries are helped as much as the farmers but they don't change one bit. Without change they will never be able to do without subsidies and will always drain the state coffers in an unfair way. We are talking an enormous amount half the health budget under YL it was the same as the health budget... no others get so much and contribute so little. Only 8.4 % of GDB but take more as those who contribute a lot. 

 

I have no problems with farmers getting money.. if they change just don't see paying them out all the time is a good idea. Vietnamese farmers have double the tons per rai.. how can you compete with that. 

[Goingmad]

20 hours ago, monkey4u said:

If the government subsidise rice farmers, what about every other business venture that fails to make a profit

Does every one get a hand out

This has already happened.

Palm Oil, Rubber trees, Pineapples. The list go on and on.

They do not care that the price of what they are growing goes down in price. They want the government to buy at a higher price. The governments sets a trend by doing this. Remember tractors in Bangkok ?

[CMBob]

2 hours ago, AgMech Cowboy said:

This is actually not a good plan, because there were many cases of rice being smuggled into Thailand from Cambodia.

 

What?  I suppose that's possible on a minimal scale but I've never read about it anywhere.   Plus whatever minimal flow might come that way would hardly affect the market price here or elsewhere.   On the other hand, you've given me the idea to try smuggling ice to the Eskimos....

Edited November 7, 2016 by CMBob

[elgordo38]

The obvious answer is make more babies more mouths to feed. Oppps no immediate payoff. 20 years of nurturing tears diapers backtalk involved with no guarantee of a successful offspring. Great answer for 2030 so lets get to work (or another unmentionable word) folks. 

Edited November 7, 2016 by elgordo38

[lovelomsak]

The government helps palm oil  I feel they are obliged to do the same for rice farmers. Oh and lets not forget rubber,the help they got.What is good for one is good for all do we not think.

Edited November 7, 2016 by lovelomsak

[KenKadz]

Farm Subsidies are a common practice among many world governments.

Subsidies never turn out well, because the farmers become indentured servants of the state.

And food prices for the consumers are kept artificially low, which obligates the consumers to the government.

It is all about a government controlling it's population, i.e. America's multiple welfare systems.

[Grubster]

7 hours ago, robblok said:

Id like you to show me the loss of the airports. The infrastructure is something the farmers benefit from too (unless they transport their rice magically). Also road tax finances infrastructure.. and everyone is paying it. That is not for the tourist industry. No other industries are helped as much as the farmers but they don't change one bit. Without change they will never be able to do without subsidies and will always drain the state coffers in an unfair way. We are talking an enormous amount half the health budget under YL it was the same as the health budget... no others get so much and contribute so little. Only 8.4 % of GDB but take more as those who contribute a lot. 

 

I have no problems with farmers getting money.. if they change just don't see paying them out all the time is a good idea. Vietnamese farmers have double the tons per rai.. how can you compete with that. 

And why do you think Thai automobiles cost so much? Because they pay there workers too much I suppose? could it be because they are far superior autos?  maybe its because the government will not allow foreign manufacturers to compete in this market?  They have a captive audience and can charge as much as they like, they collude with each other to keep the profits very high. The government does this for most goods here that are produced by the Hi-So community. Why shouldn't a farmer be able to buy a truck made in another country with no tariffs added since he has to sell his goods at the world price.

          What is your solution to this matter, let the farmers fail and lose their land to the Hi-So's. I will guarantee that as soon as the Hi-So's own the land there will be huge subsidies for them. I watched it happen in the US and you will here.  They will even get paid for not farming the land.

[robblok]

38 minutes ago, Grubster said:

And why do you think Thai automobiles cost so much? Because they pay there workers too much I suppose? could it be because they are far superior autos?  maybe its because the government will not allow foreign manufacturers to compete in this market?  They have a captive audience and can charge as much as they like, they collude with each other to keep the profits very high. The government does this for most goods here that are produced by the Hi-So community. Why shouldn't a farmer be able to buy a truck made in another country with no tariffs added since he has to sell his goods at the world price.

          What is your solution to this matter, let the farmers fail and lose their land to the Hi-So's. I will guarantee that as soon as the Hi-So's own the land there will be huge subsidies for them. I watched it happen in the US and you will here.  They will even get paid for not farming the land.

Nice Chrystal bol can I buy one too.. No proof constantly changing your views going to hiso's and others. As far as I know Honda is foreign and so are ford and Toyota.  Dont let the facts hurt you too much.  Do I like it that there is protectionism.. no.. I don't just as I don't like subsidies. But at least you can not buy a car.. you can't control how your taxes are spend on bailing out farmers year after year.

 

Let them change.. it will hurt but that is how it always goes otherwise this is going to last forever.  

[Grubster]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

Nice Chrystal bol can I buy one too.. No proof constantly changing your views going to hiso's and others. As far as I know Honda is foreign and so are ford and Toyota.  Dont let the facts hurt you too much.  Do I like it that there is protectionism.. no.. I don't just as I don't like subsidies. But at least you can not buy a car.. you can't control how your taxes are spend on bailing out farmers year after year.

 

Let them change.. it will hurt but that is how it always goes otherwise this is going to last forever.  

You cannot buy a Ford, Toyota, or Honda that was not made here by a Thai owned business unless you pay the tariff and you know it. Don't let the facts hurt you to much. I take it you always think that the workers that are a level or two below you are always the problem, well good luck to you as many of those who are above you feel the same way.

[xtrnuno41]

On 6-11-2016 at 10:05 AM, bokningar said:

I theory easy no subsidizing at all, but in real life not so easy.

Even US subsidize rice (You wouldn't think ah?) 

Same for EU where farmers in France and son is protesting on the streets as soon as any one mention cutting down on this.

The agricultural sector is suffering from a world wide sickness. This is not an isolated Thai thing.

 

If you are paying tax is US read this and cry , this is a bottomless hole for taxpayers money.

https://www.downsizinggovernment.org/agriculture/subsidies

The U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) spends $25 billion or more a year on subsidies for farm businesses. The particular amount each year depends on the market prices of crops and other factors. Most agricultural subsidies go to farmers of a handful of major crops, including wheat, corn, soybeans, rice, and cotton. Roughly a million farmers and landowners receive federal subsidies, but the payments are heavily tilted toward the largest producers.

SAw a documentary, farmer in USA, growing strawberries. There was an overflow of them, so it was

economicallly better to do nothing about the strawberries and let them rot.

It costed more to grow and sell, then doing nothing.

How sick is this system?

[maewang99]

why not? why should only things like aviation be subsidized?

[xtrnuno41]

Isn't the Thai government already involved in rice?

And then, you can take the worst rice and convert it into alcohol !

In Thailand you have petrol mixed with alcohol E85, so the rice can really tribute to that.

It is even beter for climat, in a recycling loop.

Isnt it Brazil where cars are running also on alcohol, made from sugarcane production?

[bokningar]

3 minutes ago, maewang99 said:

why not? why should only things like aviation be subsidized?

I think that might be the wrong question, why would aviation or agriculture be subsidized?

 

It might be valid reasons for subsidizing, but then state them and let voters/taxpayers make educated choices  

[robblok]

52 minutes ago, Grubster said:

You cannot buy a Ford, Toyota, or Honda that was not made here by a Thai owned business unless you pay the tariff and you know it. Don't let the facts hurt you to much. I take it you always think that the workers that are a level or two below you are always the problem, well good luck to you as many of those who are above you feel the same way.

 

I dont feel workers are two levels below me, they at least pay taxes and if it goes bad.. they don't get support. Farmers on the other hand contribute a little 8.4% gdb.. but get (maybe if the other rice is subsisided too because they were only talking about hom mali rice.. the other still has to be harvested) an amount of money equal to the yearly health budget while others get squat. 

 

I find that totally unfair, that farmers only have to moan or threaten to march to BKK and get their way while workers.. 711 or whatever if they lose their job there is no goverment ready to help them.. but they do pay their taxes.  (some might be under the income tax treshold). But in general those that pay the taxes see little of it back. That was partly why there were so many protests YL was neglecting the workers in BKK. 

 

As for the Ford Toyota or Honda.. they are not Thai owned.. they are foreign.. BOI anyone. They just wanted them made in Thailand so Thai workers make money and companies pay taxes. 

Edited November 7, 2016 by robblok