Nothing left to say ?

[StreetCowboy]

56 minutes ago, bannork said:

Look if  I argue with you I have to take up a contrary position

That doesn't just mean...

[rogeroc]

On 11/23/2016 at 1:16 AM, JAFO said:

 

Point taken rogeroc. But here in lies the problem. Each of has a moral compass. Its those values that we hold dear. Like integrity. People cannot take that from you, you have to give it away. So I have my opinions as do you. They are usually aligned to our personal values or beliefs unless of course they post just to wind people up.

 

I do however disagree with your comment about happy posters are the only ones allowed to post negatively. You read forums threads like I do. Most of the new posts start out with a good intent. Then the long time pissed off, angry, bitter poster (For whatever reason) comes on and starts on their diatribe.  Then the debates start as someone comes on to refute their sentiment and then the thread usually derails as someone takes it far to personal. Of course there are some on here that have straight up issues with others and that manifests itself in virtually every thread. 

 

 

Strange i agree with most of what you say and i always welcome other opinions.  I like the phrase 'moral compass'' but i believe that some of those with what may be described as 'more traditional moral values' are pushing out those with alternative views. There are a number of such Posters who are often harshly condemned. I give a number of examples many of which have already been mentioned.

 

1) Those who have a negative comment on Thailand (quite likely on only a single issue) are told if they don't like it, leave the country.

 

2) Those that have had a badluck story about buying a house or motorbike for a Thai girl and have lost everything will undoubtedly told they are idiots /need their brains examined.

 

3) Those that like a regular drink will be told they have beer guts and are alcoholics

 

4) Those that pay directy for sex will be determined as sexpats, who will of course be undoubtedly scruffy, unkept, overweight and wear a Chang vest as well!

 

My answer to the Op is that this is i think the reason why the forum is in decline, if you meet any of the above 4 (and quite possibly more similar) criteria then you are going to get insulted by those with a more traditional moral compass. Pity is that those with a moral compass seem to lose that morality with their negative insults (either personal or general) to the above categories.

 

Edited November 24, 2016 by rogeroc

[rogeroc]

On 11/23/2016 at 4:45 AM, JAFO said:

VF,

I agree. I think far too many people react to a general comment. Not sure why they would take it that the comment was about them unless their name was mentioned specifically. 

 

 

VF and JAFO, i just do not get this mentality. If you insult all drunks who wear Chang Vests and that describes me you are insulting me and a load of others. If you say sexpats are the scum of the earth and i pay directly for sex then you are insulting me, and again many others. Please give me some logical explanation of your reasoning.

[anotheruser]

On 11/23/2016 at 8:48 AM, faraday said:

Of course we're not allowed to comment on Moderating.

It should be more proactive, & visible.

By visible I mean the offender should have their 'mistake' pointed out to them openly.

 

Some  posts I have made, have been ridiculed, when posting with clear, accurate knowledge of the topic. It seems so childish.

 

It gets so tedious, I don't bother much anymore.

 

 

 

Increasingly the web forum format is becoming irrelevant. You can find as much information in other places such as Facebook with less moderation and more multimedia input. 

 

Tv is becoming dangerously close to the day when people will start to defect to other alternatives where freedom of speech is allowed. Name and shame policies are just a small example of this. A doctor could disfigure you for life and you wouldn't be allowed to say a word about it here,

 

The past few months have showed us the limitations of a site that operates under Thai law. So when free speech is limited is it any wonder people have little to say?

 

The model worked a decade ago when TV was the only game in town but increasingly people are becoming a bit jaded about being dictated to and the avenues to express one's self are becoming more readily accessible. 

 

 

 

 

 

[anotheruser]

On 11/22/2016 at 1:09 PM, sipi said:

Occasionally I would like a forum where I (and others) could just post random shit about steam trains, Eminem and Monty Python without incurring the wrath of others.

It'll never happen.

 

 

Try the forums by joe rogan. It is a sausage feast full of dudes talking about MMA, building cars, Eminem and everything else. You have to register to read it.

[JAFO]

10 hours ago, StreetCowboy said:

Time to start renovating the chicken coop ...

 

I did. Its a big house now. LOL!!!

 

But all kidding aside, I could never ever let myself go like some do and not because my wife would be disgusted with me but more as I would. 

[JAFO]

5 hours ago, anotheruser said:

Increasingly the web forum format is becoming irrelevant. You can find as much information in other places such as Facebook with less moderation and more multimedia input.

 

Absolutely. I use nothing off TV and never really have. I try and contribute to help others in the the VISA, Motoring and Motorcycle sections. The Pub section is just to pass time as its designed to be.

 

Overall Its a descent website and likely offers value to many new folks or potential travelers. To the regular posters I doubt it very much other then its a huge part of their day.

 

 

 

[JAFO]

6 hours ago, rogeroc said:

VF and JAFO, i just do not get this mentality. If you insult all drunks who wear Chang Vests and that describes me you are insulting me and a load of others. If you say sexpats are the scum of the earth and i pay directly for sex then you are insulting me, and again many others. Please give me some logical explanation of your reasoning.

 

Not speaking for VF at all, But your point is fair. I post as I do because it is my opinion on the matter. I guess that's the hardest part of it all is not taking it personal if you happen to fit the stereotype mold.  If people take it that personal or are offended not much one can do about that. Conversely if someone posted that guys that have jobs, dress nice and do not buy hookers are arrogant pompous A holes then I would have to accept that's how some people view it. Would I be insulted..Not likely but again I would have to consider the source.  

[faraday]

Sticks & Stones etc....

[transam]

I think forums are a bit like newspapers, you have quality ones and then the 'rags'. Each attracts perhaps a different kind of reader/poster. I put TVF at the quality end and is staffed to keep it that way.

I was admin on another Thai based forum and one of my stipulations was to not discuss other forums or their staff, I was out voted so I bailed because l knew what would continually happen. TVF has the same thought and rules as l wanted..

[Strange]

On 11/22/2016 at 1:09 PM, sipi said:

Occasionally I would like a forum where I (and others) could just post random shit about steam trains, Eminem and Monty Python without incurring the wrath of others.

It'll never happen.

 

Reddit

 

Edited November 25, 2016 by Strange

[Strange]

On 11/23/2016 at 8:50 PM, White Christmas13 said:

Well think it is the new format you open one page and you see dozens of reply's to just one post

you click on it and you get directed to the last post I never get to go to the OP at the first click

to find out what the story is all about but maybe you guys disagree   

 

On mobile or tablet? The app? I don't know about now but prior to the upgrade there was a setting you could change that would stop that. Another option is not to use the 'mobile' site. I never use the mobile site when visiting any website. 

[JAFO]

7 hours ago, rogeroc said:

1) Those who have a negative comment on Thailand (quite likely on only a single issue) are told if they don't like it, leave the country

 

More often then not more people have a hard time here. They really had no plan then come on and whinge about their lot in life. As we both know the individual owns it and the outcome, so one can fix it or complain about it.  The ones that made a good go at it will likely bash the whinger. As for leaving the country comment, I stand  if you do not like something, why do it? I did not care much for the US anymore so I decided to  exit rather then waste my time complaining about it. So I guess many feel that if you do not like it, you do have options and one would be to leave.

 

7 hours ago, rogeroc said:

2) Those that have had a badluck story about buying a house or motorbike for a Thai girl and have lost everything will undoubtedly told they are idiots /need their brains examined.

 

This is a sad reality here and in many cases I have empathy for those folks. Some really get duped. I do not think they are idiots, I think they made a poor decision and they are having to live with it. HOWEVER they are the same ones that typically post with a sweeping comment  and say all Thai women are con artists. So in many ways they set themselves up.

 

7 hours ago, rogeroc said:

3) Those that like a regular drink will be told they have beer guts and are alcoholics

 

I personally have never said that but generally some will display that look and that behavior. I have a drink or 2 when I want. If someone thinks I am alcoholic then OK, but I do not take their comment personal at all because they just do not know. I think what happens here is there is a stigma that most come here and immediately flock to the bars and sit around and drink their lives away. And many do sadly and as we all know that great majority of men here are over 50 (like me) just don't look like we did in our earlier years LOL! . Of course there are others guys having a beer or 4 or 5. LOL!!.

 

7 hours ago, rogeroc said:

4) Those that pay directy for sex will be determined as sexpats, who will of course be undoubtedly scruffy, unkept, overweight and wear a Chang vest as well!

 

This is a challenging one. Let me say I have 2 daughters mid to late 20's and this has a significant influence on my view about men who pay for sex or sexpats. In my opinion, if you are paying for sex you will always be lumped into the bucket of being a sexpat because it is prevalent in high tourist areas and visible to all.  I have tried to have an open mind about it but It just doesn't work for me and moreover the stigma around the world is that "Dirty old, perverted borderline pedophile men flock to Thailand to exploit young women". Sadly the image that is viewed on You Tube, FB and other forms of media continually shows this and as we know, perception becomes reality so expect people to bash men that openly admit they pay for sex in an open forum. I have had to fight off the people that believe it to be the case for all men here. But again there are so many negative and unfounded stigma's for foreigners coming to this country and it all stems from the  great number that come here and act out and always make the news. Look at TV for example and the garbage news they post. It really shows a negative image. But that's whats sells and look at all the posts and smart a$$ posts follow. WHy I do not read the news on this site.  When I first came here some 10 years ago, my US friends had some pretty pointed comments. Many asked me " So being single what it is like to be surrounded by pretty asian beauties that always want to have sex with you?" I had to hold back my laugh. My response, was 'You need to get a passport and go see the world". "You are so far askew from reality". "Its not like that at all unless you pay for it and not all the prostitutes are pretty". I have seen some downright nasty ones in tow with some foreigners after leaving a bar.  Very seldom does a foreigner living his life with his wife and family get any good press, just not how it works in the media because honestly that's how one is supposed to behave in the public's eye. I know many foreigner colleagues here that work and make a living just like they did in their home countries. They take their kids to school, go to events, do weekend stuff, go to the movies, bowling etc. Its just life.

 

Your subjects along with a few others are charged ones and usually light the crowd up quick. I always enjoy the "Why would you build a house in Thailand when you can never own the land" That's one of my Favs LOL! 

 

Again as I said before, this is forum life. If you put yourself out there with your personal preferences you have to be prepared that someone might make a general sweeping comment that might fit the persons lifestyle and you have to be thick skinned. What I do not do is post specifically at anyone. Just not my make up. I do my best to respect other peoples choices.

 

Apologize for the long post. Its Friday and I had 2 glasses of OJ as its an easy day at the office. LOL!!

Edited November 25, 2016 by JAFO

[rogeroc]

4 hours ago, JAFO said:

Conversely if someone posted that guys that have jobs, dress nice and do not buy hookers are arrogant pompous A holes then I would have to accept that's how some people view it. Would I be insulted..Not likely but again I would have to consider the source.  

 

Something i was hinting / getting at is that it really does not happen much this way round. It is primarily the alternative ways that are targeted for abuse and continuously so.

[rogeroc]

5 hours ago, JAFO said:

 

I did. Its a big house now. LOL!!!

 

But all kidding aside, I could never ever let myself go like some do and not because my wife would be disgusted with me but more as I would. 

 

 

I wouldn't mind betting that the scruff that your wife commented on in the shopping centre felt exactly the same way as you do now, at one stage !

[rogeroc]

3 hours ago, JAFO said:

This is a challenging one. Let me say I have 2 daughters mid to late 20's and this has a significant influence on my view about men who pay for sex or sexpats. In my opinion, if you are paying for sex you will always be lumped into the bucket of being a sexpat because it is prevalent in high tourist areas and visible to all.  I have tried to have an open mind about it but It just doesn't work for me and moreover the stigma around the world is that "Dirty old, perverted borderline pedophile men flock to Thailand to exploit young women". Sadly the image that is viewed on You Tube, FB and other forms of media continually shows this and as we know, perception becomes reality so expect people to bash men that openly admit they pay for sex in an open forum. 

 

 

Exactly but isn't that just shallow and ill informed?  Many on Thai Visa are letting 'conditioned' views rule the way they think and also inspire some of the comments made on this forum which exacerbate the mis information.

 

My expectation would be that intelligent people would challenge the common perception.

[JAFO]

16 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

 

 

I wouldn't mind betting that the scruff that your wife commented on in the shopping centre felt exactly the same way as you do now, at one stage !

 

I'm not following you, Care to elaborate further?

[JAFO]

4 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

 

 

Exactly but isn't that just shallow and ill informed?  Many on Thai Visa are letting 'conditioned' views rule the way they think and also inspire some of the comments made on this forum which exacerbate the mis information.

 

My expectation would be that intelligent people would challenge the common perception.

 

You can challenge common perception all the time, people see what they want to see. No? Many people are ill-informed and in some cases blatantly ignorant. But you cannot fix it all. Its people. Everyone is going to have personal thresholds of acceptance. We all do. Its not in our make up to accept everything everyone does. It just wouldn't work. For example, Back in the US I heard some young kid dropping the F word around his mom and sister. Nothing was said of it. I found it unacceptable. But not my kid, not my life. Should I accept the way the kid spoke because its an alternative view?

[JAFO]

39 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

4 hours ago, JAFO said:

This is a challenging one. Let me say I have 2 daughters mid to late 20's and this has a significant influence on my view about men who pay for sex or sexpats. In my opinion, if you are paying for sex you will always be lumped into the bucket of being a sexpat because it is prevalent in high tourist areas and visible to all.  I have tried to have an open mind about it but It just doesn't work for me and moreover the stigma around the world is that "Dirty old, perverted borderline pedophile men flock to Thailand to exploit young women". Sadly the image that is viewed on You Tube, FB and other forms of media continually shows this and as we know, perception becomes reality so expect people to bash men that openly admit they pay for sex in an open forum. 

 

 

Exactly but isn't that just shallow and ill informed?

 

In some cases I agree with you. It is shallow and likely in a lot of cases ill-informed. But again its those few that do what they do to keep the belief in tact and because its forum life generalizations exist and always will. I see what you are driving at but your expectations are unrealistic. Personally If I was choosing to pay for sex I surely wouldn't go on a forum and post about it like its some accomplishment. One must consider the audience. Its just common sense in many regards not because its right or wrong but because of the responses it will likely receive.

 

 

[jpinx]

Almost every thread gets hijacked by a few argumentative protagonists who go at it like a pack of dogs.  Spelling, grammar, etc -pedants don't help, and people who repost the full post they're replying to -- these things make every thread quickly become tricky to follow unless you have NOTHING else to do, and any comment you might make will be shouted down in an instant.  We're not meant to comment about modding, but when you read some of the "personal postings" by mods, it certainly makes you wonder what the agenda is,,,,,,,

[Ron19]

You only paid for a 5 minute arguement so I'm afraid I'll have to agree with you.

No I don't.

Sent from my iris 755 using Tapatalk

[bannork]

2 hours ago, Ron19 said:

No I don't.

Sent from my iris 755 using Tapatalk
 

Look, he's not arguing with you, the 5 minutes are up.

Edited November 25, 2016 by bannork

[faraday]

10 hours ago, bannork said:

Look, he's not arguing with you, the 5 minutes are up.

 

That wasn't 5 minutes - it was 4.

[bannork]

3 hours ago, faraday said:

 

That wasn't 5 minutes - it was 4.

I've told you before, I'm not allowed to argue with you anymore until you've paid.

[faraday]

1 hour ago, bannork said:

I've told you before, I'm not allowed to argue with you anymore until you've paid.

 

No you didn't.

[bannork]

1 hour ago, faraday said:

 

No you didn't.

I most certainly did.

[faraday]

2 hours ago, bannork said:

I most certainly did.

Didn't.

 

[bannork]

1 hour ago, faraday said:

Didn't.

 

Look, if you think I'm going to argue with you in my spare time you're very much mistaken

[faraday]

49 minutes ago, bannork said:

Look, if you think I'm going to argue with you in my spare time you're very much mistaken

I want to complain.

[bannork]

8 minutes ago, faraday said:

I want to complain.

You want to complain?

I said to my missus ,' What's the point of going abroad  if you're just another tourist carted around in buses surrounded by sweaty mindless oafs from Kettering and Coventry in their cloth caps and their cardigans and their transistor radios and their Sunday Mirrors, complaining about the tea - 'Oh they don't make it properly here, do they, not like at home' - and stopping at Majorcan bodegas selling fish and chips and Watney's Red Barrel and calamares and two veg and sitting in their cotton frocks squirting Timothy White's suncream all over their puffy raw swollen purulent flesh 'cos they 'overdid it on the first day.'

And being herded into endless Hotel Miramars and Bellvueses and Continentales with their modern international luxury roomettes and draught Red Barrel and swimming pools full of fat German businessmen pretending they're acrobats forming pyramids and frightening the children and barging into queues and if you're not at your table spot on seven you miss the bowl of Campbell's Cream of Mushroom soup, the first item on the menu of International Cuisine.'