My body defies the 'calories in-calories out' equation

[tropo]

21 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

After years of thinking about it, mainly because of overweight kith and kin, I'm coming to the conclusion that most people are simply destined to be bigger than they would prefer to be.  Sustained weight loss is very difficult to achieve, perhaps because there is so much availability of food, and not sufficient collective enthusiasm to truly deal with the problem.

 

I am still skinny at 55 years old.  Even if I stuff my face for a couple of months, getting through multiple bars of chocolate and packs of digestive biccies, then I still won't put on more than 3 kilos- from 70-73 kg.  And as soon as I get bored of over eating the weight slides off. Others have the exact opposite effect.

 

It's not laziness, or lack of will power: it's just that most people retain that genetic disposition to carry on eating and there bodies still operate on conserving as much energy as possible, since not long ago in our history food might be scarce.

 

My advice is give up dieting, just enjoy your hearty appetite while you can.

 

Even if you're 70 - 73kg you could still be carrying a fair bit of fat, depending on your height, frame and body type. The body weight on its own doesn't mean much. The only important parameter, that few here talk about, is body fat percentage. If you don't know that you're stumbling around in the dark.

 

Having said that, why would you make an effort to gain fat by eating? If you want to be heavier you should be concentrating on building muscle. If it's not muscle, what's the point in having it?

[mommysboy]

22 minutes ago, tropo said:

Even if you're 70 - 73kg you could still be carrying a fair bit of fat, depending on your height, frame and body type. The body weight on its own doesn't mean much. The only important parameter, that few here talk about, is body fat percentage. If you don't know that you're stumbling around in the dark.

 

Having said that, why would you make an effort to gain fat by eating? If you want to be heavier you should be concentrating on building muscle. If it's not muscle, what's the point in having it?

I'm 6', skinny, waist about 34" and normal weight about 70kg. The muscle I have is in my arms and thighs. I walk and jog.  I love walking.  I am probably over lean in Thailand on account of the heat decreasing my appetite.

 

I also love eating, and sometimes go on massive binges for a month or two. This time I went back to UK and hit the pasties, pies, sausages, bacon, etc, and tons of chocolate and biscuits, and fig rolls and custard.  I did have cause to go to the doctors, but oddly it turned out I was eating too much whole meal bread, about 10 slices. I do eat plenty of veg also, and like cabbagy things.

 

Recently I saw dad pass away in a quite horrid decline, and mum has advanced Alzheimers. It makes you wonder why bother really, as I said perhaps a massive heart attack is a blessing in a peculiar way.  The different sides of my family are by turns skinny or overweight- it doesn't seem to have made much difference to overall longevity.  I'm guessing this is because advances in managing diabetes, and heart disease.

 

It is nice to be able to fly upstairs I admit, and perhaps that joy should be the only motivation for dieting.  But it seems to me people seem to be trying to get back to the cute days, or shoot for immortality, or some imagined parallel life they imagine they would have if they were thinner.

 

I am a miserable git I must admit- a lot of thin people have this disposition.

[dontoearth]

8 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

Shoud nto be a total fast, that indeed may lead to issues with blood sugar. Secret is to sip very watered down unsweetened fruit juice throughout the day, at least every 2-3 hours while awake, to stabilize you blood sugar. If you can get stevia tablets, taking one in the morning also helps a lot.

 

Adding psyllium ot the watered down fruit juice will create fullness in the stomach which helps avert hunger pangs. And you can add say one piece of fruit or steamed vegetables at some point, just kas long as you keep the total intake  to only a couple hundred calories.

 

If you get food cravings, just firmly say to yourself "it's just one day, I can have that tomorrow".

 

Usually need to have at least 2 days a week to see the effects - spaced out with 2-3 eating normally days in between so as to keep your metabolism in normal mode.

 

Being as active as you can on the fast days is also important. Will distract your mind from food and also further stimulate your body to maintain normal metabolic rate.

 

 

If the OP is not pre-diabetic or suffering from type II diabetes a full fast would be much better than sipping watered juice.   In fact the doctor who treats most type II diabetics with fasting is Dr. Jason Fung and he recommends bone broth if you need to take in some nourishment during the day.

[simon43]

If the OP is not pre-diabetic or suffering from type II diabetes  ..

 

As mentioned by me in previous posts, there is nothing in my background or body functioning, symptoms etc that would suggest that I'm pre-diabetic.  There is absolute zero history of diabetes in my family and I have 2 brothers who eat substantially more than me.

 

About my weight - 72 Kg.  It is not the weight that bothers me, I simply want to get rid of the flab.  If my weight remains at 72 Kg or even increases, then that's no problem to me - I want the flab gone and I'm making progress in that goal.

[GarryP]

17 minutes ago, simon43 said:

 

 

 

As mentioned by me in previous posts, there is nothing in my background or body functioning, symptoms etc that would suggest that I'm pre-diabetic.  There is absolute zero history of diabetes in my family and I have 2 brothers who eat substantially more than me.

 

About my weight - 72 Kg.  It is not the weight that bothers me, I simply want to get rid of the flab.  If my weight remains at 72 Kg or even increases, then that's no problem to me - I want the flab gone and I'm making progress in that goal.

I am exactly the same. I don't mind the weight it is the flab. I am 181cm tall and weigh 80 to 82 kg depending on the time of day. As I exercise more I put on muscle but that bit of flab around the middle and the love handles will just not shift. 

[simon43]

but that bit of flab around the middle and the love handles will just not shift. 

 

Some say that this will be the last fat to shift when you exercise

 

Sheryl advised me to get a tape measure to check my waistline, (since a reduction in the measurement would certainly be an encouragement to continue the exercise and diet).

 

Frustratingly, I cannot find a shop in Naypyidaw that sells tape measures, (there are a million everyday items that I can't seem to buy here!).  I'm using a piece of string with knots in it to at least track the relative decrease.

 

But I don't think I'm kidding myself when I say that there does seem to be a decrease in size of my stomach flab - this could be because I'm strengthening my muscles in that area and getting a flatter stomach.  

 

Any way, I shall continue with my diet, cycling and tortuous jogging - I have all the time in the world to achieve that 6-pack, sexy hunk figure, there's no time limit for me as I'm only working in Myanmar to save up some $$$.  when I feel that I've got enough money in the bank, I'll leave Myanmar and settle in (enter random country here) :)

[Prbkk]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

 

 

 

As mentioned by me in previous posts, there is nothing in my background or body functioning, symptoms etc that would suggest that I'm pre-diabetic.  There is absolute zero history of diabetes in my family and I have 2 brothers who eat substantially more than me.

 

About my weight - 72 Kg.  It is not the weight that bothers me, I simply want to get rid of the flab.  If my weight remains at 72 Kg or even increases, then that's no problem to me - I want the flab gone and I'm making progress in that goal.

You can deal with some of the flab but need to accept that ,at close to 60 , some is going to be there forever. There will be loss of tone and scraggy, saggy, Shar Pei-like folds, nooks, crevices, canyons...forever. It's no big deal. Deal with the possible and accept the rest. I'm signicantly older than you and don't follow a specific exercise regime other than walking: several, at least 6-7 kilometres a day. My weight is very stable at 73kg, 182 cm, consume about 2,000 calories per day ( but no 'dead' calories like alcohol, sugar).

[tropo]

6 hours ago, simon43 said:

As mentioned by me in previous posts, there is nothing in my background or body functioning, symptoms etc that would suggest that I'm pre-diabetic.  There is absolute zero history of diabetes in my family and I have 2 brothers who eat substantially more than me.

 

About my weight - 72 Kg.  It is not the weight that bothers me, I simply want to get rid of the flab.  If my weight remains at 72 Kg or even increases, then that's no problem to me - I want the flab gone and I'm making progress in that goal.

 

Rather than thinking you haven't got symptoms of pre-diabetes or relying on family history, you aren't in the clear until you've been tested. A fasting test will set you back 100 baht at any clinic. Even better, get an HbA1c test  (about 300 baht) to see what your average blood sugar levels are.

 

When you're in the early stages of diabetes you don't feel or notice a thing. Usually, by the time people notice symptoms, they have very high blood sugar levels. Diabetes is an insidious disease. It creeps up on you unannounced.

 

Insulin resistance (pre-diabetes) and make packing on flab a lot easier.

[tropo]

6 hours ago, simon43 said:

 

 

 

Some say that this will be the last fat to shift when you exercise

 

Sheryl advised me to get a tape measure to check my waistline, (since a reduction in the measurement would certainly be an encouragement to continue the exercise and diet).

 

Frustratingly, I cannot find a shop in Naypyidaw that sells tape measures, (there are a million everyday items that I can't seem to buy here!).  I'm using a piece of string with knots in it to at least track the relative decrease.

 

But I don't think I'm kidding myself when I say that there does seem to be a decrease in size of my stomach flab - this could be because I'm strengthening my muscles in that area and getting a flatter stomach.  

 

Any way, I shall continue with my diet, cycling and tortuous jogging - I have all the time in the world to achieve that 6-pack, sexy hunk figure, there's no time limit for me as I'm only working in Myanmar to save up some $$$.  when I feel that I've got enough money in the bank, I'll leave Myanmar and settle in (enter random country here) :)

 

 

How much of that flab is fat and how much is loose skin? When you get older the skin loses its elasticity. That means it gets loose and doesn't hold the fat in place like it used to when you were younger.

 

You won't lost much fat from doing ab exercises. Ab exercises are amongst the poorest of fat burning exercises. You can test this by strapping on a heart rate monitor and doing various exercises. Although ab work can be painful, it doesn't push the heart rate very high therefore you won't burn many calories.  

 

I shouldn't even have to mention this, but spot reducing is a myth. You lose body fat according to your genetically predetermined pattern of fat distribution. If your belly fat is your last bastion of fat storage, you're going to lose your fat everywhere else first. 

 

 

Edited February 26, 2017 by tropo

[mommysboy]

Actually, within my family, my step daughter who was basically obese, has lost a considerable amount of weight to the point she is now just overweight. Its quite a miraculous turn around.

 

For everyone's benefit I wish I could say why, or come up with a magic bullet answer, but I rather think it is just a happy complex of factors, and a great deal of time.  I also think she just got fed up with being fat, and as with all addictions it reaches a point where there is no fun in it whatsoever.

 

We provided a reasonable example of normal eating. She sees me exercising and just not eating when I have a mind to. Importantly she sees me stuffing my face full of bad food, and then simply not eating for a good few hours to compensate.  The only thing I said to her is that she doesn't have to give up the naughty food. 

 

But aside from that I think she was just able to work things out for herself, in her own space, with a reasonably sane set of parents around.  And I was very much just in the background, doing not much other than being there.  Like the average UK dad I suppose.

 

Ultimately, I really think it is something she really wants to do.  The food composition possibly isn't a factor at all, although of course bad food has other implications.

 

 

 

 

 

[simon43]

My skin is very elastic for my age.  I have no loose visible loose skin. (I put this down to not smoking - I look at smokers of a similar age to me and their skin looks old and sagging).

 

I fully agree about ab exercises.  I don't do any spot exercises.  I follow a full-body home workout.  As I mentioned, I am very aware that tummy flab will maybe be the last fat to go.

 

I can't do these blood sugar tests easily in Naypyidaw.  I'll add them to my list of "to do's" when I'm in Thailand. Viz:

 

- Do HbA1c test

- Do PSA test

- Do testosterone/free testosterone test

- Get teeth cleaned

- Get ears syringed

- Get a whole load of vaccinations that have expired or that I never had (tetanus booster, rabies job, hep A and B, typhoid, cholera

- Visit Annie's Soapy......

[tropo]

8 minutes ago, simon43 said:

My skin is very elastic for my age.  I have no loose visible loose skin. (I put this down to not smoking - I look at smokers of a similar age to me and their skin looks old and sagging).

 

I fully agree about ab exercises.  I don't do any spot exercises.  I follow a full-body home workout.  As I mentioned, I am very aware that tummy flab will maybe be the last fat to go.

 

I can't do these blood sugar tests easily in Naypyidaw.  I'll add them to my list of "to do's" when I'm in Thailand. Viz:

 

- Do HbA1c test

- Do PSA test

- Do testosterone/free testosterone test

- Get teeth cleaned

- Get ears syringed

- Get a whole load of vaccinations that have expired or that I never had (tetanus booster, rabies job, hep A and B, typhoid, cholera

- Visit Annie's Soapy......

 

I don't smoke and always take care of myself, yet I have loose skin on the lower abs, noticeable once I lost all the fat. It's pretty obvious on the buttocks and inner thighs too (I'm 57). What about your neck? I'd be very surprised if you cannot detect loosening of the skin at various places around your body in your 50's. If not, congratulations, you've defied one of the major signs of aging.

[mommysboy]

On 26/02/2017 at 5:19 PM, tropo said:

I don't smoke and always take care of myself, yet I have loose skin on the lower abs, noticeable once I lost all the fat. It's pretty obvious on the buttocks and inner thighs too (I'm 57). What about your neck? I'd be very surprised if you cannot detect loosening of the skin at various places around your body in your 50's. If not, congratulations, you've defied one of the major signs of aging.

I am 55 and used to smoke but don't have loose skin, although yes my skin is ageing and doesn't have nearly the same elasticity. These things are likely genetic, in all other respects I look at least my age and possibly older.  I think smoking does make skin a bit more swollen and pitted.

 

I actually got an horrendous bp reading yesterday, and so will have to join the gang as far as healthy etaing is concerned, unless it settles down pretty quickly.  So I have immediately ditched the rubbish food, and the fridge is already stocked with spinach, veg, fruit, etc.

 

It's going to be tough for me but I'll do it.  I guess I do find it difficult to understand why others find it so difficult, but am empathetic.  Perhaps it helps to have a sporty nature.

 

50 up! No fun.

Edited March 1, 2017 by mommysboy

[tropo]

43 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

I am 55 and used to smoke but don't have loose skin, although yes my skin is ageing and doesn't have nearly the same elasticity. These things are likely genetic, in all other respects I look at least my age and possibly older.  I think smoking does make skin a bit more swollen and pitted.

 

I actually got an horrendous bp reading yesterday, and so will have to join the gang as far as healthy etaing is concerned, unless it settles down pretty quickly.  So I have immediately ditched the rubbish food, and the fridge is already stocked with spinach, veg, fruit, etc.

 

It's going to be tough for me but I'll do it.  I guess I do find it difficult to understand why others find it so difficult, but am empathetic.  Perhaps it helps to have a sporty nature.

 

50 up! No fun.

 

I don't think we're on the same page as far as my "loose skin" comment is concerned.

 

By "loose skin", I'm referring to skin that has low elasticity compared to the younger version of me. It doesn't hang and is mostly not visible, but if I pinch it, it's very noticeable in certain areas of my anatomy. In some areas it's still very elastic - which is a mystery to me as the problem isn't consistent over my entire body.

 

It's not very noticeable because in most areas I have plenty of muscle to plump out the skin and keep it somewhat tight. Unfortunately, in the lower abdominal area I don't want it plumped out, so it is more obvious there.

 

I doubt that you won't have the same problem as me and you're just in denial. I think the 50's is a time of resigning to the aging process. Some people accept it, others are still in denial. That doesn't mean I've given in. I do everything in my power to slow it down.

 

(Did anyone notice recently how good George Bush looks at age 70)

[mommysboy]

2 hours ago, tropo said:

I don't think we're on the same page as far as my "loose skin" comment is concerned.

 

By "loose skin", I'm referring to skin that has low elasticity compared to the younger version of me. It doesn't hang and is mostly not visible, but if I pinch it, it's very noticeable in certain areas of my anatomy. In some areas it's still very elastic - which is a mystery to me as the problem isn't consistent over my entire body.

 

It's not very noticeable because in most areas I have plenty of muscle to plump out the skin and keep it somewhat tight. Unfortunately, in the lower abdominal area I don't want it plumped out, so it is more obvious there.

 

I doubt that you won't have the same problem as me and you're just in denial. I think the 50's is a time of resigning to the aging process. Some people accept it, others are still in denial. That doesn't mean I've given in. I do everything in my power to slow it down.

 

(Did anyone notice recently how good George Bush looks at age 70)

 

Oh sure, we're talking about the same thing.  I thought you meant spare skin like batwings. I have lost elasticity of course.

 

Dernial! No just a miscommunication about what we're talking about.

 

Your fault I believe!

 

 

[tominbkk]

Manage your macros but try strict keto for a month.  See if that works for you.  Everyone I know who is strict on it (and even though it is a very specific group of macros you need to eat it is by no means not delicious!) has lost.

 

Reddit keto form is a great place to start.  their summary of the diet is here.

Edited March 9, 2017 by tominbkk

[morrobay]

1 hour ago, morrobay said:

Its all about limiting sugar intake : You have to realize what happens when there is excess sugar intake: Suppose you take in in excess of energy requirement 100 grams sugar. (387 calories) 

This will be shown with glucose about 180 g/mole.  So  .55 mole glucose  x  2  moles triglyceride/1 mole glucose = 1.1 moles triglyceride x 885 g / mole =  973 grams ester (fat) @ 9 calories/gram

So you started with excess 100 g sugar that converted to 973 g fat

The above is skipping some steps for simplicity. Essentially the 6 carbon sugar is converted to two 3 carbon alcohols ( glycerol ) that are bonded with 6 fatty acids to form 2 triglycerides.

Above is corrected

Edited April 12, 2017 by morrobay

[simoh1490]

Food intake and exercise are two of the factors, climate vs metabolism are two others. I've been back in the UK for six weeks where it was very cold at times and despite a calorie rich diet I lost weight (in the three weeks I've been back the weight has returned).

 

The latest I've read on this is that hot climates mean we sweat but that's just water - cold climate means we shiver and that means we burn fat to stay warm, I cannot disagree, climate change now being regarded as a significant factor associated with the increase in diabetes in the West.

[FruitPudding]

It isn't as simple as calories in, calories out. A calorie isn't just a calorie.

 

There is a reason for this: our metabolism.

 

Our body metabolises different types of foods differently (even if they contain the same amount of calories).

 

Try eating 1500 calories of veggies, fruit, meat and eggs every day.

 

Compare that with 1500 calories of bread, rice, sugar, chips and chocolate everyday.

 

Do the latter for a month, then do the former for a month .

 

See what happens.

Edited April 26, 2017 by FruitPudding

[simon43]

This thread is 2 months old.

 

I'm happy to report that after a slow start, I got my diet worked out to ensure that I was calorie-deficient.

 

I also started cycling to/from work, jogging every day, and gym work (to tone up my puny muscles) every second day.

 

My initial weight was about 73Kg with some 'generous' love handles and ab-flab.

 

I'm now at 65Kg, feeling very good.  My fat % is still about 19%, according to a fat calibre measurement and an Inbody measurement in BKK. My flab has much reduced, but I've still got some way to go.

 

As yet, I do not look like a very thin rake.  For my body size/shape, I look OK.

 

I had a full health check-up in Thailand a few weeks ago. Every check absolutely normal (BP, good/bad chloresterol, DHEA, sugar levels etc etc).

 

My diet is basically raw veg, fresh fruit, nuts, beans, probiotic yogurt, home-made kefir milk, red wine, lean chicken, oily fish.  I cut out a lot (alcohol except moderate red wine, sugars, white rice, bread, processed foods etc etc).