Overstaying UK visit visa

[darren1971]

If a Thai national obtains a visit visa to the UK are they entitled to stay for any period upto the 6 month expiry regardless of how long they planned to stay.

[The Fat Controller]

Yes

[darren1971]

that's interesting... and wont be frowned on for future applications?

[The Fat Controller]

14 minutes ago, darren1971 said:

that's interesting... and wont be frowned on for future applications?

That's a whole different discussion.

 

It certainly will have to be explained on subsequent applications if there is a large discrepancy in the time requested as against the actual stay.

 

 

[theoldgit]

As well as the spot on advice given above, keep in mind that the visa holder must leave the UK on or before the date printed on the visa vignette, it's not the same as Thailand.

 

I can't alter the title, but what the op has described isn't an overstay.

[darren1971]

58 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

As well as the spot on advice given above, keep in mind that the visa holder must leave the UK on or before the date printed on the visa vignette, it's not the same as Thailand.

 

I can't alter the title, but what the op has described isn't an overstay.

yes, and if I remember correctly that is 6 months from the date of issue?

[theoldgit]

yes, and if I remember correctly that is 6 months from the date of issue?

Yes, you're right, the expiry is also on the visa.



Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[7by7]

2 hours ago, darren1971 said:

yes, and if I remember correctly that is 6 months from the date of issue?

 

1 hour ago, theoldgit said:

Yes, you're right, the expiry is also on the visa.

 Pedant's corner.

 

The visa starts on the date of issue or the requested start date, which is usually the date of intended travel entered on the application form; whichever is later.

[rasg]

4 hours ago, darren1971 said:

that's interesting... and wont be frowned on for future applications?

Yes it can be. If you relied on a job being open for your wife or GF on her return, if she does stay longer than she requested, you need to explain why she stayed longer on the next visa application.

[darren1971]

18 hours ago, rasg said:

Yes it can be. If you relied on a job being open for your wife or GF on her return, if she does stay longer than she requested, you need to explain why she stayed longer on the next visa application.

yes agree... really we're pinning our hopes on our future spouse visa application as being the main reason to return, and from what I gather for the low income Thais this is as good a reason as any.

[rasg]

2 hours ago, darren1971 said:

yes agree... really we're pinning our hopes on our future spouse visa application as being the main reason to return, and from what I gather for the low income Thais this is as good a reason as any.

You will need more than that imho.

 

Almost everybody uses that line in their sponsor letter. Your GF needs ties to Thailand, property, land, a job to return to etc etc. Having kids doesn’t mean much to an ECO either as so many Thai women work away for home.

[darren1971]

3 minutes ago, rasg said:

You will need more than that imho.

 

Almost everybody uses that line in their sponsor letter. Your GF needs ties to Thailand, property, land, a job to return to etc etc. Having kids doesn’t mean much to an ECO either as so many Thai women work away for home.

I understand, but she just does not have any of those things, her family home is rented, has no car, can't have children and unemployed for 4 years.... really it is the only thing we have.

[rasg]

8 minutes ago, darren1971 said:

I understand, but she just does not have any of those things, her family home is rented, has no car, can't have children and unemployed for 4 years.... really it is the only thing we have.

That makes things far more difficult. How long have you been together? How many times have you visited her in Thailand? Have you flown anywhere together and stayed in hotels etc where you have the  booking info?

 

How does she live without a job? ie. Where does her money come from?

Edited April 19, 2017 by rasg

[darren1971]

Just now, rasg said:

That makes things far more difficult. How long have you been together? How many times have you visited her in Thailand? Have you flown anywhere together and stayed in hotels etc where you have the  booking info?

been together 1 years, 4, 1 month visits, 3 flights to chiang mai, phuket and bangkok together...next visit booked for June to take in application

[rasg]

It's a start and fine for proof of relationship. Skype, Whatsapp logs etc are useful too.

 

The three things you need for a visit visa to the UK are sufficient funds to pay for the trip, proof of relationship and reason to return to Thailand. The reason to return is the sticky one.

 

Edited April 19, 2017 by rasg

[theoldgit]

rasg makes very valid points, at the end of the day it's the applicant, your partner, who has to satisfy the ECO that, on the balance of probabilities that she will leave the UK at the conclusion of her stay.
At this stage I wouldn't be worrying about how long she will stay in the UK, she needs to address the basic requirements.

[darren1971]

39 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

rasg makes very valid points, at the end of the day it's the applicant, your partner, who has to satisfy the ECO that, on the balance of probabilities that she will leave the UK at the conclusion of her stay.
At this stage I wouldn't be worrying about how long she will stay in the UK, she needs to address the basic requirements.

Indeed, and rather than trying to make up a reason I think my best option is to state strongly that we have plans to make a spouse visa next year and returning to Thailand is essential for us to do that. 

[rasg]

38 minutes ago, darren1971 said:

Indeed, and rather than trying to make up a reason I think my best option is to state strongly that we have plans to make a spouse visa next year and returning to Thailand is essential for us to do that. 

You can try that but I doubt that it will succeed. Things have tightened up in the last couple of years imho.

 

I had known my GF for four months when she applied for her first visit visa. I had been to Thailand three times in that time. She had little money but she did have a job and the letter from her employer and that was pretty much her total reason to return. Proof of relationship were a few airline boarding cards, hotel bookings and photos with her family.

 

You have my sponsor letters to give you a really good idea of what's required but the reason to return is the most important.
 

Edited April 19, 2017 by rasg

[7by7]

17 hours ago, darren1971 said:

Indeed, and rather than trying to make up a reason I think my best option is to state strongly that we have plans to make a spouse visa next year and returning to Thailand is essential for us to do that. 

You are quite correct; never make anything up!

 

If caught doing so, then not only will this application be refused, she could be banned from vising the UK for up to 10 years!

 

In the absence of a concrete reason to return, all you can do is explain the history of your relationship, the reason for her visiting the UK at this time and your plans for the future together.

 

17 hours ago, rasg said:

You can try that but I doubt that it will succeed. Things have tightened up in the last couple of years imho.

I disagree.

 

IIRC, your opinion is based upon your own experience of a refusal. Others in this position have been successful.

[rasg]

5 hours ago, 7by7 said:

I disagree.

 

IIRC, your opinion is based upon your own experience of a refusal. Others in this position have been successful.

Nope. My wife has had two visit visas, a settlement visa and FLR since June 2015 and all were successful. She hasn’t been refused so far...

 

I am basing my remarks on the number of refusals I have seen in the last year or so from people in very similar situations to ours when my wife applied for her first visit visa.

[7by7]

My apologies, your wording gave the impression that your opinion was based upon a refusal your now wife had received.

 

2 hours ago, rasg said:

I am basing my remarks on the number of refusals I have seen in the last year or so from people in very similar situations to ours when my wife applied for her first visit visa

 Seen where? Remember, people very rarely post on forums such as this about successful applications; only refusals!

 

Darren, you have two choices:

1. apply with what you have and trust it's enough, or
2. don't bother applying at all.

Were I you, I'd go for number 1.

Edited April 20, 2017 by 7by7

[rasg]

5 hours ago, 7by7 said:

My apologies, your wording gave the impression that your opinion was based upon a refusal your now wife had received.

 

 Seen where? Remember, people very rarely post on forums such as this about successful applications; only refusals!

 

Darren, you have two choices:

1. apply with what you have and trust it's enough, or
2. don't bother applying at all.

Were I you, I'd go for number 1.

Seen on here along with another forum and I occasionally help people with sponsor letters etc. One thing I do know where the forums are concerned is that we seem to hear as much about the successes as we do refusals.

 

In my experience, and you have a lot more than I do, visit visas do seem more difficult to obtain and the reason to return seems to get more difficult as time goes on imho.

[darren1971]

really good advice on this forum, have to thank everyone who goes out of there way to help others.

 

I have had 2 successful visit visa applications in 2011 and 1 failed application. The failed one was because the applicant had already stayed 10 months in an 18 month period. I will put this application in with what we have, it's an honest application and they will decide one way or the other. 

[rasg]

2 hours ago, darren1971 said:

really good advice on this forum, have to thank everyone who goes out of there way to help others.

 

I have had 2 successful visit visa applications in 2011 and 1 failed application. The failed one was because the applicant had already stayed 10 months in an 18 month period. I will put this application in with what we have, it's an honest application and they will decide one way or the other. 

I do agree with you. My suggestion would be if your GF's application is unsuccessful, is that she gets a job and gets a letter from her employer after a few months for a holiday. Good luck with the application.

[darren1971]

here's an update of the supporting letters for our UK visit visa:

 

Sponsors letter 2

 

RELATIONSHIP

I have been travelling to Thailand for 7 years and in March 2016 I met xxxxx on badoo.com an online dating website. We went on some dates and really enjoyed each others company so spent much of that first month together at the condo I was renting. 

 

I returned again in July 2016 for a further month and we stayed the whole month together and decided we would like to have a more permanent relationship together. xxxxx did not have any work and lives at home where she is needed to help her Mother and look after her siblings. I decided I should help support her and gave some money to help financially. 

 

Since then I have returned on 3 more 1 month trips (November 2016, March 2017, June 2017) and we have travelled to Chiang Mai, Thaton, Chiang Dao, Phuket and Bangkok together. On my last trip in March 2017 I asked xxxxxx if she would marry me and we plan to get married in March 2018 in Thailand. We would then hope to get a spouse visa and settle in the UK.

 

 I am now sending xxxxxx regular payments by international money transfer directly into her bank as I became aware it was important for me to show concrete evidence that our relationship is genuine and subsisting. We have considered going straight for a spouse/settlement visa but we both feel it is wiser for her to come for a short holiday first before making such a big step.

 

I have attached joint flight bookings, copies of money transfers to xxxxxx bank account, photos of us together in Thailand.

 

WORK AND FINANCE

I own my own business in the UK a partnership with Mr xxxxxxx. I have had this business for 8 years and annual turnover is £xxxxxx per annum. I am personally financing all the cost of xxxxxx trip to the UK and I estimate it will be around £1750.00.

I have attached copies of the business lease, the joint business bank accounts and personal bank accounts.

 

ACCOMODATION

My business includes a 3 bedroom apartment above the business that I share with Mr xxxxxxx. One room will be solely for xxxxxx and Me, one is for my business partner xxxxxxx and there is a third spare bedroom. We also have a large private kitchen/diner/living room. We will stay at this accommodation for the duration of xxxxxx visit with a few weekends away planned to London, Bath and Cornwall.

 

I have attached photos of the accommodation.

 

IMPORTANT INFORMATION

Our plan is to marry in Thailand and settle in the UK in 2018 but we both feel that it is wise for xxxxxx to visit the UK first and meet my daughter who lives in London with her mother. We also are fully aware that we need to demonstrate that xxxxxx has a solid reason to return to Thailand at the end of this proposed visit, in absence of a good job, property, children or assets we are concerned that it may be judged the xxxxxx has no reason to return. But, without a successful future application for a spouse visa there is little opportunity for us to progress with our relationship and live together when married. Therefore xxxxxx WILL be returning to Thailand at the end of this visit visa and she will not be carrying out any paid or unpaid work whilst she is in the UK.

 

APPLICANT SUPPORTING LETTER

 

I am unemployed and live in my family home with my Mother, Brother, Sister in law and their two children. I also have a twin brother who sometimes stays at the family home.

The house is rented and my brother and his wife help support the family financially. My boyfriend XXXXXXX has recently started sending me a small amount to help by International money transfer and I have attached evidence of this to this application.

My Father passed away when I was 14 and my Mother is in bad health, there is very little work near my home and as my Brother and Sister in law both travel to work my Mother is left to take care of two young children alone. I have to be at home to help take care of my Mother so I can only leave for short periods. If this visa is granted my older Sister and twin Brother have agreed to help take care of the family whilst I am away.

 

I wish to visit the UK for a holiday as we are going to marry in 2018 in Thailand and are considering settlement in the UK. I understand it is important to comply with all the rules of this visit visa as I do not want to jeopardise any future visa applications. I understand that if I overstay, fail to return or partake it any paid or unpaid work then it is highly unlikely that we will be granted any future visas.

[rasg]

It looks good.

[darren1971]

1 minute ago, rasg said:

It looks good.

 

took a lot of your advice on board and tried to lay it out in a way that was easy to understand and emphasises the important points... thank you for your help, very generous!

[7by7]

Will her letter be written in English or Thai?

 

I ask because there is a chance that the visa office will phone her and ask her about it. If it's written in English they will expect to talk to her in English. Is her English up to it?

 

If it's written in Thai, then they will be happy to speak to her in Thai. So maybe better to have her letter written in Thai? If you do that, you will also need to enclose an English translation which contains:  

• confirmation from the translator that it is an accurate translation of the original document  
• the date of the translation  
• the translator's full name and signature  
• the translator's contact details

You should do this for all documents in Thai; although anecdotal evidence suggest that in visit visa applications they are not too worried about official documents which do not have a translation.

 

It may seem a bit daft writing a letter in English, having it translated into Thai for her to sign and then getting a certified translation of that; but, unless she is confident enough about her English to be interviewed on the phone about her letter's contents in English, it's better to be safe than sorry imho.

[darren1971]

ok, Im pretty sure she could handle the English because we discussed the letter together, but I will get it translated to be sure.... 

 

anyone know of a good translator?  Thai visa express seem pretty good at 500 baht a page

Edited April 27, 2017 by darren1971

[7by7]

18 hours ago, darren1971 said:

ok, Im pretty sure she could handle the English because we discussed the letter together, but I will get it translated to be sure....

It is easy to get confused when using a foreign language in a pressure situation unless one is completely fluent.

 

If she is interviewed they may ask her how you and she communicate, so she should say she can speak English, but isn't fluent.