ATM fees on the rise

[Farang hunter]

1 minute ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Time to shop for a different U.S. bank or CU whose debit card you can use outside the U.S. without getting ripped off.

 

$5 plus 2.5% is a rip-off, plain and simple. There are lots of better banking choices out there.

 

 

lucky I'm not American

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, Farang hunter said:

lucky I'm not American

I would hope and think you probably could do better, even with the banking industry in your home country.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Many US banks limit ATM withdrawals to $500, so for these banks the 20K limit isn't a factor.

Yes, some even down to $300 or $350.

 

But then there's good ole' Charles Schwab with its $1000 daily limit, and a few others similar out there as well.

 

I've also run across a few banks where their limit is low/lower, but they're willing to lift the cap for a 24 hour period if you call and make a special request. Not all, or probably most, but some will do that. Just depends on the bank.

 

[Farang hunter]

Just now, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

I would hope and think you probably could do better, even with the banking industry in your home country.

 

I wish I could but frankly most people around the world must take what is offered otherwise no services and we shall keep dreaming if life is fair. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, Farang hunter said:

I wish I could but frankly most people around the world must take what is offered otherwise no services and we shall keep dreaming if life is fair. 

Are you really certain that EVERY bank in your home country has the exact same $5 plus 2.5% fee on foreign withdrawals??? Nothing different, nothing lower?

 

Edited April 26, 2017 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Farang hunter]

1 minute ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Are you really certain that EVERY bank in your home country has the exact same $5 plus 2.5% fee on foreign withdrawals???

 

I cannot be sure they all charge the same but I am confident they all do charge fees and percentages except for wealthy costumers.

[SunsetT]

On 22/04/2017 at 5:29 PM, naboo said:

Use online transfer instead via a third party. I use Transferwise which gives an excellent rate (much better than the banks or visa) and charges very little. Its peer-to-peer, they take advantage of people moving money in different directions.  (my last transfer of GBP330 cost about 3 quid).

 

And if you click this link, your first transfer up to GBP500 will be with no charge.

Thanks Jake!

[SunsetT]

6 hours ago, thailand49 said:

I will only speak for myself and my direct research in Pattaya, where I've live for 10 plus years. Years ago I did a personal research as to what Thai Banks were charging in general out of their ATM, compare it with the exchange rate of the day.  Why?

Because on a personal note and the way these banks do things I think their system is like 50 years behind times aside from the model ATM machine. It is like pulling teeth whenever you need something simple.  Thailand speaking whoever came up with you needing to go to the branch to do business outside of taking out a few baht. On a serious note I'm scare to death the bank collapse whether I will ever get my money back. In the U.S. we have FDIC, protects you to 250,000 USD per account. Here the way they discriminate against foreigner would I ever get a baht back before a Thai?

With that being said,  I pay the charges for years that is the price of my decision, and I take money in different forms and have a Charles Schwab account too. I've done research on all the Thai Banks and they aren't hurting in their balance sheet and I fully understand the charges but I don't know of many banks around the world charging what Thailand banks are charging. It is like the due pricing at Amusement park for foreigners. This is the mentally of the Thai government and banks. So I put in what I need for a emergency in my Thai bank account out of principal and keep everything overseas.

The one Bank which I thought was a bank until recently is Aeon,  a Japanese company only two in Pattaya, as many know they are charging 150 and doing just fine. In my research I also found they provide the best rates. Example:  If the exchange rate is at 35, the rate is around 34.60, out of the ATM, with 150 fee, go to Bangkok Bank, it would be a charge of 220, plus the rate was 33.40, they not only hit you with the 220, but short you on the exchange rate. So for years, Whenever I need money I just plan my trip to one of the Aeon.

A few months ago, I noticed at the Pattaya Lotus Branch they were putting in new machine, thereafter I found my Visa Debit card wouldn't work, after minutes the card would return saying the machine is off line, happen over and over again? No money was ever given but looking online the money was taken out and put back in.

After several times I contacted Aeon, they did the research while I was on the phone and came back with this.. the current new machine NO LONGER TAKE VISA OR M/C DEBIT CARDS even my Charles Schwab for large amounts like I was doing for years 18,000 plus, it now only for amounts lower than 8,000 baht. Recently tried it for 10,000 spit back out reset the amount 3,000 baht, got money? 

I also told the clerk at Aeon , can I do the withdraw with my card over the counter "said they had no money on hand " only in machines.  I was just about to try and open a account and ship 10 million baht, told me they aren't a bank but a Financial institution!

So I'm looking for a foreign bank proven that I can ship that amount to Thailand.

In the end, sorry so long but as far as I'm concern Thai banks are a big rip off, greed. I wonder how a Thai bank official visiting U.S. if they put their Bangkok Bank card into a ATM, and told them your are Thai that is 20.00 U.S.?

Dont accept any rate offered by an ATM in any country. It is a real international scam! Just say 'no' or 'continue without conversion' or however deviously they word it. You will then get the much better Visa or Mastercard exchange rate which will not vary whichever bank's ATM you use.

Edited April 26, 2017 by SunsetT

[bandito]

On ‎4‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 6:58 PM, ubonjoe said:

Been 220 baht for a while now at all banks for foreign ATM card transactions.

 Aeon still Baht 150-

[bandito]

On ‎4‎/‎22‎/‎2017 at 3:15 PM, sanemax said:

Withdraw money over the counter at banks, to avoid ATM fees

 

Only if you withdraw more than Bht 20000- in one go.

My bank will not allow withdrawing more than Euro 500- a day so it is of no use to go in a bank and withdraw over the counter.

They will tell you " use the ATM".

[Chou Anou]

It was a joy to travel in Japan recently and find out there are no ATM fees for foreign cards.  Same in Indonesia.

[elgenon]

On 4/23/2017 at 10:31 PM, Genericnic said:

I use the Capital One Venture Reward card. I use it to pay for just about everything - food, Internet, airfare, travel, etc. It has an annual fee of US$59. I get 2 miles per dollar spend. While their interest rate on a carried balance is a bit high, I never carry a balance so it doesn't matter to me. Even after the annual fee, I manage to net about US$200 per year in rewards. 

 

For getting monthly spending money into Thailand, I use my Schwab ATM card. You get the best rates, no fees, and ATM charge reimbursement. I've used it all over the world and never had a problem.

 

Both are highly recommended.

 

David

 

I stopped using Capital One. Will only do a 30 day vacation alert and the credit limit is less than 1/3 what BofA gave me and they also have no foreign trans fees. 

[Ross Macdonald]

On 4/24/2017 at 4:16 PM, Wandr said:

You have thrown in several items in your post.

Can you clarify the above?

Do you mean you have an account with a Thai bank that allows you to use their ATM card anywhere in Thailand without any fees? Withdrawals, at ATMs or counter with no fee even outside your base area?

If so which bank and what type of account.

Thanks.

 

I have a BKK Bank account, my home branch is Chiang Mai, I can use my card anywhere in Thailand without paying ATM fees. I haven't tried using it outside of Thailand though so I can't comment on that. I have found this account to be the best way to access money from my Australian account as I transfer A$10,000 at a time to my BKK Bank account at a cost of only A$22, and then i don't have to pay ATM fees every time i withdraw 5 or 10,000฿

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 minutes ago, elgenon said:

I stopped using Capital One. Will only do a 30 day vacation alert and the credit limit is less than 1/3 what BofA gave me and they also have no foreign trans fees. 

 

Regarding their credit cards, Capital One actually has changed their policy on travel notices in the past year, apparently since they started issuing new chip-enabled credit cards.

 

They used to be very fussy about demanding cardholders file travel notices anytime they planned on using the card outside the U.S. or face getting their transactions blocked as potential fraud. Now lately, C1 confirmed to me that for their credit card holders with chipped cards, they don't need to file travel notices at all any more. But they do advise providing a reachable phone number so their fraud department can contact you in case of any issues. I've tested their advice and thus far found it to work as promised.

 

As for BofA, yes, although their debit cards are HORRIBLE in terms of fees for using outside the U.S.,, they do have at least two credit cards that some time back switched to having no foreign currency conversion fees, namely their Cash Rewards and Travel Rewards VISA credit cards. Both of those are perfectly fine for use in Thailand, along with C1 cards. Now even the Chase issued Amazon Rewards VISA card has no FCF. Same with Wyndham Rewards VISA from Barclay's.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, Ross Macdonald said:

I have a BKK Bank account, my home branch is Chiang Mai, I can use my card anywhere in Thailand without paying ATM fees. I haven't tried using it outside of Thailand though so I can't comment on that.

There are foreign currency conversion fees charged by BKKB when attempting to use the BKK Bank debit card outside Thailand.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

13 hours ago, thailand49 said:

I will only speak for myself and my direct research in Pattaya, where I've live for 10 plus years. Years ago I did a personal research as to what Thai Banks were charging in general out of their ATM, compare it with the exchange rate of the day.

It's a common misconception that people think that they will get different exchange rates from different ATMs, depending on which bank company they belong to -- the same way different banks post different exchange rates every day for cash exchanges and wire transfers.

 

But, for ATM use, it doesn't work that way.  When you go to use a Thai bank ATM with a VISA or MC logo debit card (unless you voluntarily agree to Dynamic Currency Conversion with the MasterCards, which you should NEVER do), the rate you'll get will be the VISA or MC network rate for the day.  The Thai banks own internal rates have nothing to do with ATM withdrawals.

 

Now, the reason a lot of people think different banks give different ATM rates is actually because their home country, card-issuing banks may have different fees for using those cards abroad, different foreign currency conversion fees. So, depending on the fees of your card issuing bank, you may get higher or lower actual net exchange rates depending on the card you use after the card-issuing bank's fees are added/deducted from your account. But if you use that same card on the same day/time of day at any Thai bank ATM, you should get the same exact rate.

Edited April 27, 2017 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Langsuan Man]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Regarding their credit cards, Capital One actually has changed their policy on travel notices in the past year, apparently since they started issuing new chip-enabled credit cards.

Here is the actual announcement of the policy change:

 

Quote

Travel Notifications are no longer needed!

With the added security of your Capital One chip card, you don’t have to tell us when and where you’re traveling, inside or outside the United States.

Your chip card is 100% covered for fraud while you’re traveling, and we will alert you if we see anything suspicious. Make sure your security alerts are up to date with your current email and mobile phone information before you go.

If you need a PIN for cash advances or while traveling, you can  request one here. Please note it will take 7-10 business days for your PIN to arrive in the mail. Remember, your card doesn’t require a PIN to make purchases outside of the U.S. Speak to the merchant if a terminal prompts you to enter a PIN when traveling abroad.

Capital One doesn’t charge foreign transaction fees!

source: https://services1.capitalone.com/ui/#/services/travelNotification

[Wandr]

55 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

It's a common misconception that people think that they will get different exchange rates from different ATMs, depending on which bank company they belong to -- the same way different banks post different exchange rates every day for cash exchanges and wire transfers.

 

But, for ATM use, it doesn't work that way.  When you go to use a Thai bank ATM with a VISA or MC logo debit card (unless you voluntarily agree to Dynamic Currency Conversion with the MasterCards, which you should NEVER do), the rate you'll get will be the VISA or MC network rate for the day.  The Thai banks own internal rates have nothing to do with ATM withdrawals.

 

 

Does the above mean that there is only one exchange rate set per day by Visa or MC, and I will get that rate irrespective of the prevailing rate?

Exchange rates fluctuate throughout the day, sometimes by a significant margin. When I withdraw cash from an ATM with a Visa card, will the Visa rate not reflect these continual changes?

 

Also, what is a good place to check the prevailing Visa/MC rate?

Thanks.

[mesquite]

On 4/24/2017 at 0:31 PM, Genericnic said:

I use the Capital One Venture Reward card. I use it to pay for just about everything - food, Internet, airfare, travel, etc. It has an annual fee of US$59. I get 2 miles per dollar spend. While their interest rate on a carried balance is a bit high, I never carry a balance so it doesn't matter to me. Even after the annual fee, I manage to net about US$200 per year in rewards. 

 

For getting monthly spending money into Thailand, I use my Schwab ATM card. You get the best rates, no fees, and ATM charge reimbursement. I've used it all over the world and never had a problem.

 

Both are highly recommended.

 

David

 

I, too, use the Cap One Venture Rewards card in the same manner.  My ATM card is from State Farm Bank and is like the Schwab card.   Second the recommendation.

Edited April 27, 2017 by mesquite

[BEVUP]

13 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

If you're using a debit card, then obviously, the withdrawal limit is going to be the daily withdrawal limit set by the bank that issued your debit card. For U.S. folks, that's typically $300 to $500 per day, but can be up to $1000 with some banks.

 

Unlike ATM withdrawals, the Thai banks don't have any withdrawal limit on counter withdrawals. They'll let you take out as much as your card will allow. And generally there is no local fee for counter withdrawals, but there have been some reports that some SCB branches are charging a fee and/or providing a lower exchange rate for such transactions.

 

You can increase your daily amount if you have online banking ' this is in Auss where it starts at a 1000 , & a debit Master card is actually just a glorified savings card as it is your money anyway not like a credit card 

 

[Wandr]

2 hours ago, Ross Macdonald said:

I have a BKK Bank account, my home branch is Chiang Mai, I can use my card anywhere in Thailand without paying ATM fees. I haven't tried using it outside of Thailand though so I can't comment on that. I have found this account to be the best way to access money from my Australian account as I transfer A$10,000 at a time to my BKK Bank account at a cost of only A$22, and then i don't have to pay ATM fees every time i withdraw 5 or 10,000฿

Bangkok Bank (especially) is sure to be getting its money from you in some way. Either the fee is not transparent, or you have a type of account that gets them money - e.g. a large deposit with a low interest rate.

In Thailand, if you do any transaction outside your home district, the bank charges you a fee for everything.

I have first hand knowledge of four leading banks. I have a Bangkok Bank account in Chonburi. I wanted to deposit money in it after a transaction in Bangkok. The counter staff wanted to charge a significant fee just for this simple transaction. I declined and made the deposit later in the home area.

Kasikorn charges a minimum 25 baht for ANY transaction if made outside home district. This is for small amounts. Obviously it will be more for larger amounts.

Thanachart staff, who know me well, informed me candidly that it will be much better for me to close their account and open new ones if I move outside the home district area because of the fees charged.

And do on...

 

Which is why I was interested when a poster said he pays no fees for transactions made outside home base. I will visit CIMB and report back. I hope this feature is still available and  there is no catch.

[BEVUP]

2 hours ago, Ross Macdonald said:

I have a BKK Bank account, my home branch is Chiang Mai, I can use my card anywhere in Thailand without paying ATM fees. I haven't tried using it outside of Thailand though so I can't comment on that. I have found this account to be the best way to access money from my Australian account as I transfer A$10,000 at a time to my BKK Bank account at a cost of only A$22, and then i don't have to pay ATM fees every time i withdraw 5 or 10,000฿

Yes i do the same & pay $18 but a smaller amount 

But go & use your Auss card here make sure health policy is up to date. From Ausses No: 1 bank they will only charge you $30 from Atm for your own cash & then you get to pay the Thai Atm fee & a percentage for O/S purchases 

Australia would have to be the dearest place in the world for banking . All the usual fees $60 - $100 yrly //up to $6 monthly account fee p/ mth// Fly by reward fees maybe $70 a yr // limited free use of banks own Atm p/ mth // $ 2.50 if use other banks Atm ( a great scam when you out shopping ) // Withdrawing money over the counter fee // & the list goes on but at least you know they made the money from  the peoples monies many years ago to build their buisinesses to this day to only continuosily charge you to acces your own cash that helped them be there in the first place 

So it is not only Thailand that double charges

& now that the Auss Gov. has directed the banks to have a much larger balance sheet they (the banks ) have to go back to the table to see where they can find it 

PS : oh Thailand $ 1 at other banks

[Laza 45]

4 hours ago, bandito said:

 

Only if you withdraw more than Bht 20000- in one go.

My bank will not allow withdrawing more than Euro 500- a day so it is of no use to go in a bank and withdraw over the counter.

They will tell you " use the ATM".

I normally draw 20 or 25k but have withdrawn smaller amounts over the counter.. I find that some banks are more helpful than others.. Kasikorn Bank has been good for me.. Bangkok Bank.. sometimes... others have just told me to use the ATM.. I don't know why.. maybe just can't be bothered.. ?? Shop around.. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, Wandr said:

Does the above mean that there is only one exchange rate set per day by Visa or MC, and I will get that rate irrespective of the prevailing rate?

Exchange rates fluctuate throughout the day, sometimes by a significant margin. When I withdraw cash from an ATM with a Visa card, will the Visa rate not reflect these continual changes?

 

Also, what is a good place to check the prevailing Visa/MC rate?

Thanks.

AFAIK, for ATM purposes, both VISA and MC set their network exchange rates only once per 24 hour period -- but what they consider a day is different than the Thailand time because of time zone differences. I think member Pib here in the past has looked into the exact hour/time zones that VISA and MC use for changing their rates, but I don't recall the specifics, except to know that it's NOT based on Thailand time.

 

Here are the two websites for VISA and MC USA to check their daily rates for ATM withdrawal purposes:

 

https://www.mastercard.com/us/personal/en/cardholderservices/currencyconversion/index.html

 

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

 

The two card networks may have different exchange rate websites for Europe or other home country regions.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, Laza 45 said:

I normally draw 20 or 25k but have withdrawn smaller amounts over the counter.. I find that some banks are more helpful than others.. Kasikorn Bank has been good for me.. Bangkok Bank.. sometimes... others have just told me to use the ATM.. I don't know why.. maybe just can't be bothered.. ?? Shop around.. 

Yes... For counter withdrawals, there should be no lower limit about the amount you can withdraw.

 

If the bank teller is refusing to do a counter withdrawal for under 20K, it's most likely because they're lazy or don't want to be bothered with taking the time to assist you, when they figure the ATM machine would work just as well. (Of course, the 220b ATM fee isn't coming out of their pocket!)

[Farang hunter]

5 hours ago, Ross Macdonald said:

I have a BKK Bank account, my home branch is Chiang Mai, I can use my card anywhere in Thailand without paying ATM fees. I haven't tried using it outside of Thailand though so I can't comment on that. I have found this account to be the best way to access money from my Australian account as I transfer A$10,000 at a time to my BKK Bank account at a cost of only A$22, and then i don't have to pay ATM fees every time i withdraw 5 or 10,000฿

no way, because BKK bank charges 10 baht if withdraw is done through another bank ATM.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 hours ago, Wandr said:

Bangkok Bank (especially) is sure to be getting its money from you in some way. Either the fee is not transparent, or you have a type of account that gets them money - e.g. a large deposit with a low interest rate.

In Thailand, if you do any transaction outside your home district, the bank charges you a fee for everything.

I have first hand knowledge of four leading banks. I have a Bangkok Bank account in Chonburi. I wanted to deposit money in it after a transaction in Bangkok. The counter staff wanted to charge a significant fee just for this simple transaction. I declined and made the deposit later in the home area.

Kasikorn charges a minimum 25 baht for ANY transaction if made outside home district. This is for small amounts. Obviously it will be more for larger amounts.

Thanachart staff, who know me well, informed me candidly that it will be much better for me to close their account and open new ones if I move outside the home district area because of the fees charged.

 

 

That's pretty common with Thai banks, what you describe above. Anytime you're trying to do anything with money from an account in one region and taking it from or moving it to somewhere in another region, they'll often tack on a fee of some kind.

 

With ATM withdrawals using their own cards, however, there are some exceptions. For Thai banks and their own ATM cards, I think most of them will allow users up to 4 or 5 ATM withdrawals per month from a DIFFERENT Thai bank without any fee. But I'm not sure if that no fee waiver applies to using the SAME bank's ATMs outside the region of your home branch.

 

However, there are some exceptions to that general fee practice: I seem to recall TMB having one particular account that supposedly has no use/transaction fees inside Thailand. And perhaps some of the other banks have some similar arrangements, though I suspect they're more the exception than the rule.

 

Edited April 27, 2017 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[thailand49]

6 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

It's a common misconception that people think that they will get different exchange rates from different ATMs, depending on which bank company they belong to -- the same way different banks post different exchange rates every day for cash exchanges and wire transfers.

 

But, for ATM use, it doesn't work that way.  When you go to use a Thai bank ATM with a VISA or MC logo debit card (unless you voluntarily agree to Dynamic Currency Conversion with the MasterCards, which you should NEVER do), the rate you'll get will be the VISA or MC network rate for the day.  The Thai banks own internal rates have nothing to do with ATM withdrawals.

 

Now, the reason a lot of people think different banks give different ATM rates is actually because their home country, card-issuing banks may have different fees for using those cards abroad, different foreign currency conversion fees. So, depending on the fees of your card issuing bank, you may get higher or lower actual net exchange rates depending on the card you use after the card-issuing bank's fees are added/deducted from your account. But if you use that same card on the same day/time of day at any Thai bank ATM, you should get the same exact rate.

You sound like you know better than me but.. explain this.. as noted many times my own unprofessional test. In Pattaya, at Big C extra lower level there are four ATM machines,  with same card Charles Schwab.. I put in Bangkok, told conversion is 33.20 for this transaction, I cancel, take the same card put in into the Siam Commercial Bank, rate for same amount requested by same card, 33.31? I cancelled take card next machine (green one) different rate again all done within 5 minutes. If I got the above right why am I getting 3 differ exchanges using the same card?

[thailand49]

13 hours ago, SunsetT said:

Dont accept any rate offered by an ATM in any country. It is a real international scam! Just say 'no' or 'continue without conversion' or however deviously they word it. You will then get the much better Visa or Mastercard exchange rate which will not vary whichever bank's ATM you use.

As far I know, if I don't except the transaction and push NO,  cancel and the card return!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

You sound like you know better than me but.. explain this.. as noted many times my own unprofessional test. In Pattaya, at Big C extra lower level there are four ATM machines,  with same card Charles Schwab.. I put in Bangkok, told conversion is 33.20 for this transaction, I cancel, take the same card put in into the Siam Commercial Bank, rate for same amount requested by same card, 33.31? I cancelled take card next machine (green one) different rate again all done within 5 minutes. If I got the above right why am I getting 3 differ exchanges using the same card?

Do you have a MasterCard or VISA logo card from Schwab?

 

I'm asking, because mine is a VISA card. And normally, if you use a Schwab VISA card is any Thai ATM, it's NOT going to show you any exchange rate info on the ATM screen. You just enter the amount of baht you want, and it gives you that baht. No mention of exchange rates at all is ever shown on the bank ATM screens.

 

Unless, you're using a MasterCard logo card, and have agreed to Dynamic Currency Conversion when asked on the ATM screen dialog (though the screen won't use that name).  It will just ask if you want to see the transaction in your own home country currency.  ONLY in that case, the exchange rate WILL show on the bank's ATM screen, and the exchange rate may differ from bank to bank, because with DCC, you're getting their lower/poor exchange rates set by that particular bank, instead of the better MasterCard network rate you'd get without DCC. The DCC rate is usually 3-4% lower than the standard MC network rate.