North Korea says U.S. bomber flights push peninsula to brink of nuclear war

[webfact]

North Korea says U.S. bomber flights push peninsula to brink of nuclear war

REUTERS

By Ju-min Park

 

FILE PHOTO: A pair of B-1B Lancer bombers soar over Wyoming in an undated file photo. Staff Sgt. Steve Thurow/U.S. Air Force/Handout via REUTERS/File photo

 

SEOUL (Reuters) - North Korea accused the United States on Tuesday of pushing the Korean peninsula to the brink of nuclear war after a pair of strategic U.S. bombers flew over the area in a training drill with the South Korean air force.

 

The two supersonic B-1B Lancer bombers were deployed amid rising tensions over North Korea's dogged pursuit of its nuclear and missile programmes in defiance of United Nations sanctions and pressure from the United States.

 

The flight of the two bombers on Monday came as U.S. President Donald Trump said he was open to meeting North Korean leader Kim Jong Un in the appropriate circumstances, even though Pyongyang suggested it would continue with its nuclear tests.

 

South Korean Defence Ministry spokesman Moon Sang-gyun told a briefing in Seoul that Monday's joint drill was conducted to deter provocations by the North and to test readiness against another potential nuclear test.

 

The U.S. air force said in a statement the bombers had flown from Guam to conduct training exercises with the South Korean and Japanese air forces.

 

North Korea said the bombers conducted "a nuclear bomb dropping drill against major objects" in its territory at a time when Trump and "other U.S. warmongers are crying out for making a preemptive nuclear strike" on the North.

 

"The reckless military provocation is pushing the situation on the Korean peninsula closer to the brink of nuclear war," the North's official KCNA news agency said on Tuesday.

 

Tensions on the Korean peninsula have been high for weeks, driven by concerns that the North might conduct its sixth nuclear test in defiance of pressure from the United States and Pyongyang's sole major ally, China.

 

China's Global Times, a state-backed tabloid that does not necessarily reflect national policy, said in an editorial late on Monday that the United States should not rely on China alone to pressure Pyongyang into giving up its nuclear ambitions.

 

April could prove a "turning point", the paper said, but "Washington ... must also continue to exert its own efforts on the issue".

It was widely feared North Korea could conduct its sixth nuclear test on or around April 15 to celebrate the anniversary of the birth of the North's founding leader, Kim Il Sung, or on April 25 to coincide with the 85th anniversary of the foundation of its Korean People's Army.

 

The North has conducted such tests or missile launches to mark significant events in the past.

 

Instead, North Korea conducted an annual military parade, featuring a display of missiles, on April 15 and then a large, live-fire artillery drill 10 days later.

 

"MAJOR CONFLICT"

 

Trump said on Monday he would be "honoured" to meet the North's young leader.

 

"If it would be appropriate for me to meet with him, I would absolutely, I would be honoured to do it," Trump told Bloomberg News in comments that drew criticism in Washington.

 

Trump did not say what conditions would needed for such a meeting to occur or when it could happen. The White House said later North Korea would need to meet many conditions before it could be contemplated.

 

"Clearly conditions are not there right now," White House spokesman Sean Spicer said.

 

"I don’t see this happening anytime soon."

 

Trump warned in an interview with Reuters on Thursday that a "major, major conflict" with North Korea was possible, while China said last week the situation on the Korean peninsula could escalate or slip out of control.

 

In a show of force, the United States has already sent an aircraft carrier strike group, led by the USS Carl Vinson, to waters off the Korean peninsula to conduct drills with South Korea and Japan.

 

The U.S. military's THAAD anti-missile defence system has reached initial operational capacity in South Korea, U.S. officials told Reuters, although they cautioned that it would not be fully operational for some months.

 

North Korea test-launched a missile on Saturday that appeared to have failed within minutes, its fourth successive failed launch since March. It has conducted two nuclear tests and a series of missile-related activities at an unprecedented pace since the beginning of last year.

 

The North is technically still at war with the South after their 1950-53 conflict ended in a truce, not a treaty, and regularly threatens to destroy the United States, Japan and South Korea.

 

(Additional reporting by James Pearson in SEOUL, Christian Shepherd in BEIJING, and Ayesha Rascoe in WASHINGTON; Writing by Jack Kim; Editing by Paul Tait)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-05-02

[TKDfella]

I thought we were already on the 'brink'?

[MadMuhummad]

It's the brinkier brink now. Totally brinked out...

[sujoop]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Trump said on Monday he would be "honoured" to meet the North's young leader.

 

"If it would be appropriate for me to meet with him, I would absolutely, I would be honoured to do it," Trump told Bloomberg News in comments that drew criticism in Washington.

 

Trump did not say what conditions would needed for such a meeting to occur or when it could happen. The White House said later North Korea would need to meet many conditions before it could be contemplated.

 

"Clearly conditions are not there right now," White House spokesman Sean Spicer said.

 

"I don’t see this happening anytime soon."

Ok, so just like Obama, no direct talks without meeting conditions first (although apparently Trump would be 'honoured' to meet lil Kim). Also no mention of what his conditions might be - although many suspect both Trump & Lil Kim suffer from similar man-child, narcissist & fragile ego conditions, thus have something in common...

 

3 hours ago, webfact said:

The U.S. military's THAAD anti-missile defence system has reached initial operational capacity in South Korea, U.S. officials told Reuters, although they cautioned that it would not be fully operational for some months.

More on the THAAD anti-missile defense system:
 

"The 10 million people living in Seoul will also not be protected by THAAD, since it is being installed 125 miles south of the city. "It cannot engage missiles fired at Seoul, so it offers no additional protection of the city"
 

"In the case of a saturation attack, or a large volume of missiles as Postol described, THAAD's defense capabilities "can be expected to be very low, probably zero or close to that"

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/experts-north-korean-nukes-defeat-182100642.html

Edited May 2, 2017 by sujoop

[Credo]

I doubt that little Kim dares to travel outside of N. Korea, except maybe to China, so the security issues for Trump to meet Kim are pretty daunting.   I can't see Trump making a trip to N. Korea.   I can't see Kim risking a plane ride to the US or any other country.

 

Kim had his brother assassinated in Malaysia, so I am sure he's pretty paranoid that if he steps foot outside the country, someone will kidnap or kill him.   

[uptheos]

8 minutes ago, Credo said:

I doubt that little Kim dares to travel outside of N. Korea, except maybe to China, so the security issues for Trump to meet Kim are pretty daunting.   I can't see Trump making a trip to N. Korea.   I can't see Kim risking a plane ride to the US or any other country.

 

Kim had his brother assassinated in Malaysia, so I am sure he's pretty paranoid that if he steps foot outside the country, someone will kidnap or kill him.   

I think there will be a whole pile of people setting up something for his arrival. IMO if he leaves, he doesn't and shouldn't come back.

[Andaman Al]

 

Nuff said ! 

 

[anon4546543]

I am waiting for a Baboon reply to defend Nth Korea again. It is not extraordinary for Nth Korea to conduct military drills on its own soil. Nor is it extraordinary for Sth Korea and allies to conduct exercises around Japan and Sth Korea. Drills are a normal part of self defence when the 1953 hostilities ceased. Everyone quotes a truce between the combatants.This is not correct. Armistice is the factual word, in reality it means that the US and allies are still in a war situation (deferred) with Nth Korea. The fact that some really good military hardware flew in Sth Korea should make Uncle Kim wake up instead of issuing more threats.

The difference between Nth Korea exercises is that they actually fire on Sth Korea islands, sink ships in neutral territory and kidnap citizens of Japan and Sth Korea. No sanctions have been made against Nth Korea for these blatant indiscretions. In addition, Nth Korea makes these constant threats to bomb other countries, either now with what they have, or in the future with what they may develop.

Uncle Kim should understand that no one poses a threat to Nth Korea except himself. No one wants his bankrupt country with no assets, no resources except coal (on the nose in the west), little strategic value, and a totally mind indoctrinated zombie workforce. Not China, not Russia and especially the US and western countries.

 Uncle Kim should just go away. 

[Jonmarleesco]

Psychotic he is. Stupid, though, is unlikely. Any strike by NK would bring down a rain of fire upon its collective head, the leadership would scurry for cover, the rest of the populace would be left to fend for itself, and on poking its head above the turrets, said leadership, apart from treading on now dangerous ground, would have few weapons left, and even less of the masses to whom to dictate.

[hawker9000]

A psychopath violating international mandates to develop & test nuclear weapons and ICBMs all the while repeatedly threatening war and 4000 artillery pieces on rail transport targeting your neighbor's densely populated capital across a DMZ is ok but merely flying a bomber in that neighboring country's airspace with their express permission is what's bringing the peninsula "to the brink".   Yeah, fatboy, ok.  Got it.

 

Hard to believe Trump would even consider a sitdown with this nutjob.  The mere suggestion must be driving his advisors crazy.

 

Fatboy IS a walking, talking, and most unfortunately breathing ... "provocation".

[sirmud63]

[anotheruser]

Must be kind of alarming to have them flying above you. On one hand you are rambling about how you will defeat the cowards decisively. On the other hand the two aircraft that could shut your mouth permanently in a matter of minutes are flying around freely under the protection of 100% air space dominance. 

 

You think it occurs to Kim what those planes payloads could be? Hope he has nerves of steel because the realization your country is less than 10 minutes away from being put out it's pathetic existence must be a bit unsettling.

 

It is almost to the point the USA has to move first if things don't change very soon. Striking first buys that first volley of surprise to blow away as much artillery on the DMZ as humanly possible. You won't get them all but if you can get a high percentage that are closest and capable of doing the most damage it is a small win.

 

 

[stevenl]

12 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

Must be kind of alarming to have them flying above you. On one hand you are rambling about how you will defeat the cowards decisively. On the other hand the two aircraft that could shut your mouth permanently in a matter of minutes are flying around freely under the protection of 100% air space dominance. 

 

You think it occurs to Kim what those planes payloads could be? Hope he has nerves of steel because the realization your country is less than 10 minutes away from being put out it's pathetic existence must be a bit unsettling.

 

It is almost to the point the USA has to move first if things don't change very soon. Striking first buys that first volley of surprise to blow away as much artillery on the DMZ as humanly possible. You won't get them all but if you can get a high percentage that are closest and capable of doing the most damage it is a small win.

 

 

"It is almost to the point the USA has to move first"

 

So the USA shows its force, others would say provokes, and that is a reason to strike first?

 

Why is the USA there in the first place?

[Andaman Al]

15 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

Must be kind of alarming to have them flying above you. On one hand you are rambling about how you will defeat the cowards decisively. On the other hand the two aircraft that could shut your mouth permanently in a matter of minutes are flying around freely under the protection of 100% air space dominance. 

 

You think it occurs to Kim what those planes payloads could be? Hope he has nerves of steel because the realization your country is less than 10 minutes away from being put out it's pathetic existence must be a bit unsettling.

 

It is almost to the point the USA has to move first if things don't change very soon. Striking first buys that first volley of surprise to blow away as much artillery on the DMZ as humanly possible. You won't get them all but if you can get a high percentage that are closest and capable of doing the most damage it is a small win.

 

 

All true, but lets be serious, NK is not 10 mins away from complete destruction, it would be a few days at least. I imagine Trump would want to have it occur during dessert at Mara Lago with a suitable Head of State that may find it amusing, lets say Duterte.  Either that or Trump will order the pre-emptive nuclear strike to coincide with the next episode of SNL so that he can beat their ratings.

[anotheruser]

4 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

All true, but lets be serious, NK is not 10 mins away from complete destruction, it would be a few days at least. I imagine Trump would want to have it occur during dessert at Mara Lago with a suitable Head of State that may find it amusing, lets say Duterte.  Either that or Trump will order the pre-emptive nuclear strike to coincide with the next episode of SNL so that he can beat their ratings.

 

Okay maybe not NK in general but Pyongyang for certain. NK artillery would get one barrage in before positions are located and eliminated. The rest of the positions would have to hide between volleys. What NK could do though is drop some dirty nukes on Seoul.

 

Can you imagine being a NK artillery man trying to wheel your tubes in and out of their hiding places between being carpet bombed to death?

 

You stay in the open you are not going to last long. You can't fire from hiding. 

Edited May 3, 2017 by anotheruser

[ilostmypassword]

24 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

Must be kind of alarming to have them flying above you. On one hand you are rambling about how you will defeat the cowards decisively. On the other hand the two aircraft that could shut your mouth permanently in a matter of minutes are flying around freely under the protection of 100% air space dominance. 

 

You think it occurs to Kim what those planes payloads could be? Hope he has nerves of steel because the realization your country is less than 10 minutes away from being put out it's pathetic existence must be a bit unsettling.

 

It is almost to the point the USA has to move first if things don't change very soon. Striking first buys that first volley of surprise to blow away as much artillery on the DMZ as humanly possible. You won't get them all but if you can get a high percentage that are closest and capable of doing the most damage it is a small win.

 

 

Yes, he's so terrified he did another missile test despite Trump's warning.  How threatening is hot air?

[anotheruser]

10 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Yes, he's so terrified he did another missile test despite Trump's warning.  How threatening is hot air?

It's all hot air until the air really gets hot. He is shitting his pants and playing with fire. Or he is just too batshit crazy to realize what he is doing.

 

I found this article quite interesting reading on how or what might occur should things get ugly. There are 4 sections to it and it is a bit lengthy but if you have the time or interest it's a worthwhile read.

 

https://www.stratfor.com/article/what-us-would-use-strike-north-korea

Edited May 3, 2017 by anotheruser

[Andaman Al]

5 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

 

Okay maybe not NK in general but Pyongyang for certain. NK artillery would get one barrage in before positions are located and eliminated. The rest of the positions would have to hide between volleys. What NK could do though is drop some dirty nukes on Seoul.

 

Can you imagine being a NK artillery man trying to wheel your tubes in and out of their hiding places between being carpet bombed to death?

 

You stay in the open you are not going to last long. You can't fire from hiding. 

Okay, my comments were a bit tongue in cheek

9 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

 I imagine Trump would want to have it occur during dessert at Mara Lago with a suitable Head of State that may find it amusing, lets say Duterte.  Either that or Trump will order the pre-emptive nuclear strike to coincide with the next episode of SNL so that he can beat their ratings.

However, whilst Kim Jong Uns forces would indeed face a trouncing do not underestimate what he could do in 10 mins. He may have around 4000 artillery pieces aimed at Seoul. 10 mins would be a reasonable time to expect he could operate them before hell fire rained down on their positions. in that time they could get maybe 40-80 000 rounds in on Seoul. That would change the game. Then while the South Koreans and Americans bomb the hell out of him he has 1 mill troops come into S Korea in the estimated 80 tunnels they have dug (only 4 or 5 discovered). Any conflict would be extremely bloody and messy and the number of casualties would be huge on both sides. This is NOT a conflict worth fighting. Leave the fat child alone to live in isolation (and do the same for Kim Jong ), and we will all be safe. The alternative - war - is very very bad.

[anotheruser]

4 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

Okay, my comments were a bit tongue in cheek

However, whilst Kim Jong Uns forces would indeed face a trouncing do not underestimate what he could do in 10 mins. He may have around 4000 artillery pieces aimed at Seoul. 10 mins would be a reasonable time to expect he could operate them before hell fire rained down on their positions. in that time they could get maybe 40-80 000 rounds in on Seoul. That would change the game. Then while the South Koreans and Americans bomb the hell out of him he has 1 mill troops come into S Korea in the estimated 80 tunnels they have dug (only 4 or 5 discovered). Any conflict would be extremely bloody and messy and the number of casualties would be huge on both sides. This is NOT a conflict worth fighting. Leave the fat child alone to live in isolation (and do the same for Kim Jong ), and we will all be safe. The alternative - war - is very very bad.

 

Many of those weapons are not capable of hitting Seoul if they even still fire at all. Yeah he would do a lot of damage but not level Seoul like some people say. The ones that are have to expose themselves and wouldn't be able to fire continuously. Every shot fired would lead to diminished capability to fire again. A lot of people would die. 

 

Anyway my original point was it must be quite ominous to know there are bombers circling waiting to make your country the next Hiroshima Nagasaki should they be given one order. So why does Kim seem to keep begging for this? 

 

Imagine the little fat man came to the realization he wasn't God, cooperated and let the UN in. He would he a hero Nk would become the darling of international aid. His legacy would be he single handedly brought his country to the modern age. 

 

But he is a raving lunatic who continually threatens at least 25 million innocent people. He is the epitome of the Hollywood super villain. 

[Andaman Al]

10 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

Imagine the little fat man came to the realization he wasn't God, cooperated and let the UN in. ................................

 

But he is a raving lunatic who continually threatens at least 25 million innocent people. He is the epitome of the Hollywood super villain. 

Difficult to distinguish which leader you are talking about.

[anotheruser]

2 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

Difficult to distinguish which leader you are talking about.

 

Okay let me clarify, the one who has the most to lose. 

[ilostmypassword]

26 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

 

Many of those weapons are not capable of hitting Seoul if they even still fire at all. Yeah he would do a lot of damage but not level Seoul like some people say. The ones that are have to expose themselves and wouldn't be able to fire continuously. Every shot fired would lead to diminished capability to fire again. A lot of people would die. 

 

Anyway my original point was it must be quite ominous to know there are bombers circling waiting to make your country the next Hiroshima Nagasaki should they be given one order. So why does Kim seem to keep begging for this? 

 

Imagine the little fat man came to the realization he wasn't God, cooperated and let the UN in. He would he a hero Nk would become the darling of international aid. His legacy would be he single handedly brought his country to the modern age. 

 

But he is a raving lunatic who continually threatens at least 25 million innocent people. He is the epitome of the Hollywood super villain. 

And yet despite Trump's warning, he went ahead and did another missile test. And actually he is reforming the North Korean economy.  https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/30/world/asia/north-korea-economy-marketplace.html

[anotheruser]

5 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

And yet despite Trump's warning, he went ahead and did another missile test. And actually he is reforming the North Korean economy.  https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/30/world/asia/north-korea-economy-marketplace.html

So the guy has a death wish. What does he gain by pushing things to the brink? He is beginning to put Trump in a position where it is no longer possible to call off the dogs. People like you gleefully saying Trump doesn't have the balls to do it just makes it escalate. Not you in particular but you get the drift. 

 

There is a carrier there now and bombers are beginning to circle. This doesn't tell you anything?

 

Reforming the economy? hahaha sure. 

Edited May 3, 2017 by anotheruser

[anotheruser]

You might want to read the last paragraph of the article you quoted.

 

“North Koreans always called Kim Jong-un’s grandfather and father ‘the Great Leader’ or ‘the General,’” Mr. Jung said. “Now, when they talk among themselves, many just call Jong-un ‘the Kid.’ They fear him but have no respect for him.”

“They say, ‘What has he done for us?’” Mr. Jung said.

[ilostmypassword]

15 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

You might want to read the last paragraph of the article you quoted.

 

“North Koreans always called Kim Jong-un’s grandfather and father ‘the Great Leader’ or ‘the General,’” Mr. Jung said. “Now, when they talk among themselves, many just call Jong-un ‘the Kid.’ They fear him but have no respect for him.”

“They say, ‘What has he done for us?’” Mr. Jung said.

Did you read the rest of the article?

[anotheruser]

2 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Did you read the rest of the article?

Yeah even in the title of the article it says that the economy of NK is changing now that the state can no longer strangle it death. Quite a bit different than the notion you suggest of Kim reforming it.

 

But yeah it looks like their state run shop is quite an innovation....

 

 

Edited May 3, 2017 by anotheruser

[ilostmypassword]

24 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

So the guy has a death wish. What does he gain by pushing things to the brink? He is beginning to put Trump in a position where it is no longer possible to call off the dogs. People like you gleefully saying Trump doesn't have the balls to do it just makes it escalate. Not you in particular but you get the drift. 

 

There is a carrier there now and bombers are beginning to circle. This doesn't tell you anything?

 

Reforming the economy? hahaha sure. 

This is from Chekhov: "If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there." But that's for plays, and this is real life. So, no, a carrier and bombers don't tell us anything about the future.

As for "Reforming the economy. hahaha sure...you prognosticate from bombers and an aircraft carrier, but hard soberly reported facts mean nothing to you.  Fake news victim?

[ilostmypassword]

4 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

Yeah even in the title of the article it says that the economy of NK is changing now that the state can no longer strangle it death. Quite a bit different than the notion you suggest of Kim reforming it.

 

But yeah it looks like their state run shop is quite an innovation....

 

 

Here's the title once again:  As Economy Grows, North Korea’s Grip on Society Is Tested

How do you reconcile this  "it says that the economy of NK is changing now that the state can no longer strangle it death." with that headline?  Remarkable.

[anotheruser]

Just now, ilostmypassword said:

Here's the title once again:  As Economy Grows, North Korea’s Grip on Society Is Tested

How do you reconcile this  "it says that the economy of NK is changing now that the state can no longer strangle it death." with that headline?  Remarkable.

"North Korea's grip on society is tested." That seems to imply the economy is doing better because NK state can not control it like they used to.

[ilostmypassword]

3 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

"North Korea's grip on society is tested." That seems to imply the economy is doing better because NK state can not control it like they used to.

It's quite clear in the article that was a decision made by the leadership - not a loss of control the leadership had no say in..