Retirement ext in another province?

[MJKT2014]

Hi, I normally extend retirement stay in Bangkok where I own a home but this time I have been staying on an extended stay upcountry with wife/in-laws (at the wife's parents home) and due to renew the retirement ext. I've already got a 90 day in the upcountry immigration office under my belt, so my question is will doing a extension of stay be any extra hassle there?

 

I expect to be back in Bangkok for following years ext application.

 

I have to do another 90 day report upcountry before the extension so can ask specifically at the office at that time about retirement extension, but wanted some feedback/knowledge upfront about it first thanks.

[ubonjoe]

If you have already done a 90 day report then it should not be any problem to do your extension at that office.

Just check what their requirements are to be sure you have everything they want since it could well be different.

[Dan5]

Well, just from reading posts here, I see that many provinces add their own requirements for visa extensions. Requirements that don't exist in Bangkok which seems to just follow the basic law. Bangkok is where I've always gotten my extensions. But in another province you might run into things like a 30 day waiting period once you've filed., a home visit, pictures of the place you live, etc. It really depends on the province.

[Dan5]

I even saw a post about a province that wouldn't accept someone's proof of income from their embassy. Good luck.

[Dan5]

1 minute ago, Dan5 said:

I even saw a post about a province that wouldn't accept someone's proof of income from their embassy. Good luck.

Also things like TM30s and I think TM28s. I wouldn't have even known they exist if it wasn't for posts here. And I've gotten a lot of extensions in Bangkok.

[spambot]

1 hour ago, Dan5 said:

I even saw a post about a province that wouldn't accept someone's proof of income from their embassy. Good luck.

I have made a post some time ago - How this happened to me, proof of income letter was rejected after I did all the right things supplied documents of evidence / paid the requested fees at the UK Embassy - Got the letter for proof of income and then got it rejected - But this was in Bangkok. 

[amvet]

18 minutes ago, spambot said:

I have made a post some time ago - How this happened to me, proof of income letter was rejected after I did all the right things supplied documents of evidence / paid the requested fees at the UK Embassy - Got the letter for proof of income and then got it rejected - But this was in Bangkok. 

Reading your other post in fact your letter did not get rejected Immigration said you could not use the combination method next year.  And that was in 2013.  So what happened the next year?  Did you successfully use the combination method or do the 800,000 baht method?

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, Dan5 said:

Well, just from reading posts here, I see that many provinces add their own requirements for visa extensions. Requirements that don't exist in Bangkok which seems to just follow the basic law. Bangkok is where I've always gotten my extensions. But in another province you might run into things like a 30 day waiting period once you've filed., a home visit, pictures of the place you live, etc. It really depends on the province.

Not for the retirement extension which the OP is doing.

[Parsve]

 

As we all know, the rules are different in different provinces. I live in Phitchit and for a couple of months ago I was down in Jomtien when it was time to report my 90-days. I get to the immigration in Jomtien and they told me that I have to make the report in Phitchit.Obvisoley, you have not had that problem, but here is a link to a movie about reporting that is made with the assistance of Jomtien Immigration Office, maybe it can give you any idea of how to handle your case. http://fabulous103.com/immigration-thailand-visitors-home/

[barryofthailand]

4 hours ago, Dan5 said:

Also things like TM30s and I think TM28s. I wouldn't have even known they exist if it wasn't for posts here. And I've gotten a lot of extensions in Bangkok.

Yes when I was staying in Kanchanaburi for a short time and had to do a 90 day report they wanted a tm 30 and a tm 28. Every office is not the same.

[Dan5]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Not for the retirement extension which the OP is doing.

Very definitely for retirement extensions. No doubt about it. All the extra requirements I listed I saw in posts for retirement extensions.  Why do you thing it doesn't apply for retirement extensions?

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, Dan5 said:

Very definitely for retirement extensions. No doubt about it. All the extra requirements I listed I saw in posts for retirement extensions.  Why do you thing it doesn't apply for retirement extensions?

I think that was in one province and they have stopped doing it now as far as I know.

It is certainly not a normal requirement for extensions based upon retirement.

[Suradit69]

5 hours ago, Dan5 said:

Well, just from reading posts here, I see that many provinces add their own requirements for visa extensions.

 

Visas are not extended. Your permission to remain in the country is extended.

No that's not the same as a visa.

Yes, everyone knows what you mean, but there are important distinctions between being here on a visa entry as opposed to being here on an extension of stay ... as is demonstrated in so many threads where people complain about problems they've experienced by failing to appreciate the distinction.

[Dan5]

11 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I think that was in one province and they have stopped doing it now as far as I know.

It is certainly not a normal requirement for extensions based upon retirement.

I don't know, but I've seen numerous posts over the last year or so with one of them in the last week or so about all these strange requirements I never have to deal with in Bangkok. I assume it just depends on the particular province and there are many provinces. I assume these requirements are in provinces where there aren't many expats and the immigration people have a lot of time on their hands, but that's just guess.

[spambot]

5 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Not for the retirement extension which the OP is doing.

Hi Tanoshi

 

I went to British Embassy for explanation - sent letter to head of immigration - this was sent back unopened - I used a tourist triple entry - then other tourist visas - Now back in UK - applying for O-A visa. 

[Tanoshi]

7 minutes ago, spambot said:

Hi Tanoshi

 

I went to British Embassy for explanation - sent letter to head of immigration - this was sent back unopened - I used a tourist triple entry - then other tourist visas - Now back in UK - applying for O-A visa. 

Are you saying you tried to get an extension based on retirement from a Tourist Visa?

[spambot]

7 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Are you saying you tried to get an extension based on retirement from a Tourist Visa?

Hi Tanoshi

Nope - I already had an existing visa (based upon retirement) I got this from using the same revenues I had from all previous applications (at the British Embassy) using income letters method - But then realised from this incident that nothing was guaranteed in Thailand even when you follow the rules - So I purposely made the future a little more difficult and decided to move to staying through a series of tourist visa - I wanted to convince myself I was not going to be dependent upon immigration - Really I wanted to see if I could stay by  being nimble rather than entitled because that would mean I had generated extra choice if immigration did say no again in the future.

 

 

[jacko45k]

Slightly off question, but did you have to submit a TM30?

Did your wife's parents have to submit anything to say they had a foreigner living at their home?

[Tanoshi]

6 hours ago, spambot said:

Hi Tanoshi

Nope - I already had an existing visa (based upon retirement) I got this from using the same revenues I had from all previous applications (at the British Embassy) using income letters method - But then realised from this incident that nothing was guaranteed in Thailand even when you follow the rules - So I purposely made the future a little more difficult and decided to move to staying through a series of tourist visa - I wanted to convince myself I was not going to be dependent upon immigration - Really I wanted to see if I could stay by  being nimble rather than entitled because that would mean I had generated extra choice if immigration did say no again in the future.

 

 

What you had then was an extension of stay based on retirement (not a Visa).

 

On what grounds were you refused?

I know since the Brexit announcement the £ has dropped almost 20% in value.

Depending on your UK income, and using the Pension Income letter method from the British Embassy, it's possible your income did not meet the 65,000 baht PM requirement.

Immigration use the Bangkok bank TT exchange rate for their calculations.

 

65,000 baht last year would have been equivalent to £1,250 per month income.

This year 65,000 baht is the equivalent of £1,495 per month income.

[bobonzo]

just reading this thread..

 

is it normal for the Letter of Proof of Income, notarized by Embassy, to be rejected ?

 

Thanks

[amvet]

10 hours ago, spambot said:

Hi Tanoshi

Nope - I already had an existing visa (based upon retirement) I got this from using the same revenues I had from all previous applications (at the British Embassy) using income letters method - But then realised from this incident that nothing was guaranteed in Thailand even when you follow the rules - So I purposely made the future a little more difficult and decided to move to staying through a series of tourist visa - I wanted to convince myself I was not going to be dependent upon immigration - Really I wanted to see if I could stay by  being nimble rather than entitled because that would mean I had generated extra choice if immigration did say no again in the future.

What year did you get refused a retirement extension based on the income letter from the British embassy? Did you ever actually get refused an extension or just told not to use the income method the next year you applied?

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, bobonzo said:

is it normal for the Letter of Proof of Income, notarized by Embassy, to be rejected ?

No it is not normal.

Even if it did not meet the income requirements it would not be rejected but the application would be denied.

[spambot]

7 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

What you had then was an extension of stay based on retirement (not a Visa).

 

On what grounds were you refused?

I know since the Brexit announcement the £ has dropped almost 20% in value.

Depending on your UK income, and using the Pension Income letter method from the British Embassy, it's possible your income did not meet the 65,000 baht PM requirement.

Immigration use the Bangkok bank TT exchange rate for their calculations.

 

65,000 baht last year would have been equivalent to £1,250 per month income.

This year 65,000 baht is the equivalent of £1,495 per month income.

Hi Tanoshi - And yes I know it was an extension of stay based on retirement (not a Visa). My apologies I wasn't precise in the terminology - I thought  that this could not be confused with anything else available.

 

There was no difficulty in the amounts of funding - I had well over the required amounts using joint methods from funding in a Thai bank deposit and UK incomes. 

 

I went through the figures with the first official at immigration (i.e first that  process the application and places the first stamp in the passport) and  since he checked everything was correct  as normal he then entered the process into your computer profile immigration records, handed me my passport and the white official paper (in Thai) with his signature and date upon - This was then taken to a more senior immigration officer sitting 10 meters behind the first officer - This officer is supposed to sign the freshly made stamp in the passport ("Extension of stay permitted up to....") This is the final step in getting Extension of stay. 

 

She refused to sign - and spoke no English - She could just say "Not correct" and after 20 mins trying to understand what the problem actually was  I requested to see someone that could speak English -The person who was found then after talking with Thai officer simply said that she couldn't provide further details for the reason for rejection - I requested that they ring the British Embassy since I have no control on the letter - I simply  provided the embassy with what immigration previously agreed as what should be required in order to get the letter - Hence if the process has broken down they should  negotiate this with them. They refused to speak with the British Embassy. They then needed to stop  for lunch and the senior officer who refused to sign told the person who translated to English that she needed to take advice and see a more senior officer.

 

I realised that it was going to be a bit of a stalemate since I had the  stamp ("Extension of stay permitted up to....") now in my passport, but without a signature - Hence the extension had not yet been fully granted since it was not signed but the stamp however did exist and would be difficult to take away.

 

Long story made short - Face saving was employed by the officer that would not sign - I was told I needed to write out a statement and sign / date the statement before I could get the signature of the officer. This statement was to be my declaration that I could not any further use the earning letter route in further applications. However once the English speaking immigration officer moved away since I had to dictated my own statement - Rather than write down "would not" I wrote "would" (apply for an extension using the income letter method) - Hence the statement was confusing and I also hoped non restricting. I  then handed the signed statement to the senior official - But since she couldn't speak English I had presume that she could not read English either - She signed my passport and the extension was complete.

 

I latter wrote to the British Ambassador ((high commissioner) and also then visited the British Embassy -  I asked them to qualify what had taken place and why their letter for earnings was rejected since I had no explanation provided by Thai immigration - The outcome from the meeting was - They had no idea why the letter might be refused, but they also refused to talk with immigration directly to find out why - The senior officer at the British Embassy agreed however that she would  take a phone call from Bangkok immigration if this could be arranged by me - However as I  said no  immigration officials were prepared to do this. The senior officer at the British Embassy said she could do nothing until she had an understanding what the problem was for the rejection - But since that this was the reason I was attending the British Embassy the conversation simply went cyclic and nowhere.

 

I then wrote to the Head officer at Bangkok immigration asking for details for why the letter had been rejected - The letter was returned back to me a few weeks latter  - It had been opened and stuck back down with sellotape - printed on the back "Returned to sender".

 

In short - I think I was just unlucky - And it's simply a problem that could happen to anyone - The positives I got from this was... Nothing is guaranteed in Thailand (not matter how good you think your case might be) - And you must always have a plan B.

[spambot]

4 hours ago, amvet said:

What year did you get refused a retirement extension based on the income letter from the British embassy? Did you ever actually get refused an extension or just told not to use the income method the next year you applied?

Hi Amvet - Nov 2013 - answers to your other questions contained in post #16

[amvet]

17 minutes ago, spambot said:

Hi Tanoshi - And yes I know it was an extension of stay based on retirement (not a Visa). My apologies I wasn't precise in the terminology - I thought  that this could not be confused with anything else available.

 

There was no difficulty in the amounts of funding - I had well over the required amounts using joint methods from funding in a Thai bank deposit and UK incomes. 

 

I went through the figures with the first official at immigration (i.e first that  process the application and places the first stamp in the passport) and  since he checked everything was correct  as normal he then entered the process into your computer profile immigration records, handed me my passport and the white official paper (in Thai) with his signature and date upon - This was then taken to a more senior immigration officer sitting 10 meters behind the first officer - This officer is supposed to sign the freshly made stamp in the passport ("Extension of stay permitted up to....") This is the final step in getting Extension of stay. 

 

She refused to sign - and spoke no English - She could just say "Not correct" and after 20 mins trying to understand what the problem actually was  I requested to see someone that could speak English -The person who was found then after talking with Thai officer simply said that she couldn't provide further details for the reason for rejection - I requested that they ring the British Embassy since I have no control on the letter - I simply  provided the embassy with what immigration previously agreed as what should be required in order to get the letter - Hence if the process has broken down they should  negotiate this with them. They refused to speak with the British Embassy. They then needed to stop  for lunch and the senior officer who refused to sign told the person who translated to English that she needed to take advice and see a more senior officer.

 

I realised that it was going to be a bit of a stalemate since I had the  stamp ("Extension of stay permitted up to....") now in my passport, but without a signature - Hence the extension had not yet been fully granted since it was not signed but the stamp however did exist and would be difficult to take away.

 

Long story made short - Face saving was employed by the officer that would not sign - I was told I needed to write out a statement and sign / date the statement before I could get the signature of the officer. This statement was to be my declaration that I could not any further use the earning letter route in further applications. However once the English speaking immigration officer moved away since I had to dictated my own statement - Rather than write down "would not" I wrote "would" (apply for an extension using the income letter method) - Hence the statement was confusing and I also hoped non restricting. I  then handed the signed statement to the senior official - But since she couldn't speak English I had presume that she could not read English either - She signed my passport and the extension was complete.

 

I latter wrote to the British Ambassador ((high commissioner) and also then visited the British Embassy -  I asked them to qualify what had taken place and why their letter for earnings was rejected since I had no explanation provided by Thai immigration - The outcome from the meeting was - They had no idea why the letter might be refused, but they also refused to talk with immigration directly to find out why - The senior officer at the British Embassy agreed however that she would  take a phone call from Bangkok immigration if this could be arranged by me - However as I  said no  immigration officials were prepared to do this. The senior officer at the British Embassy said she could do nothing until she had an understanding what the problem was for the rejection - But since that this was the reason I was attending the British Embassy the conversation simply went cyclic and nowhere.

 

I then wrote to the Head officer at Bangkok immigration asking for details for why the letter had been rejected - The letter was returned back to me a few weeks latter  - It had been opened and stuck back down with sellotape - printed on the back "Returned to sender".

 

In short - I think I was just unlucky - And it's simply a problem that could happen to anyone - The positives I got from this was... Nothing is guaranteed in Thailand (not matter how good you think your case might be) - And you must always have a plan B.

You got the extension and really the only problem was in your mind.  To prevent actually testing the hypothesis that you really didn't have a problem you decided not to get another extension the next year which would have proved you really didn't have a problem.  I suggest if the same thing happened to a less confrontational person he would have simply said OK and came back the next year with the 800,000 in the bank.  We are only talking 10 thousand US dollars deposited in a Thai bank account for 3 months - not really much of a risk. 

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, amvet said:

You got the extension and really the only problem was in your mind.  To prevent actually testing the hypothesis that you really didn't have a problem you decided not to get another extension the next year which would have proved you really didn't have a problem.  I suggest if the same thing happened to a less confrontational person he would have simply said OK and came back the next year with the 800,000 in the bank.  We are only talking 10 thousand US dollars deposited in a Thai bank account for 3 months - not really much of a risk. 

That's not the point.

It's the principal that the IO refused to accept a Proof of Income Letter issued by the British Embassy.

 

I think there were previous posts that a certain Immigration office insisted on Embassy income letters being notarised by the MFA, or perhaps it was just in the case of one Embassy. UJ may recall better than I can.

 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

21 minutes ago, spambot said:

Hi Amvet - Nov 2013 - answers to your other questions contained in post #16

 At which Immigration office did this take place.

[amvet]

24 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

That's not the point.

It's the principal that the IO refused to accept a Proof of Income Letter issued by the British Embassy.

 

I think there were previous posts that a certain Immigration office insisted on Embassy income letters being notarised by the MFA, or perhaps it was just in the case of one Embassy. UJ may recall better than I can.

I think you may have missed it.  He got the extension. So Immigration must have accepted it.  The fact that Immigration asked him to write a letter that they couldn't read is just an agent having a bad day.

[Tanoshi]

11 minutes ago, amvet said:

I think you may have missed it.  He got the extension. So Immigration must have accepted it.  The fact that Immigration asked him to write a letter that they couldn't read is just an agent having a bad day.

Yes he got it, but the experience has diminished his faith in Immigration so much so, that he's now returned to the UK to apply for an O-A Visa.

[amvet]

1 hour ago, Tanoshi said:

Yes he got it, but the experience has diminished his faith in Immigration so much so, that he's now returned to the UK to apply for an O-A Visa.

Have you figured in the time frame?  His story takes place 4 years ago.    Ubonjoe wrote, "No it is not normal. Even if it did not meet the income requirements it would not be rejected but the application would be denied" I think you can bank on his advice.  Reading your posts it is obvious that you involved with the Visa business in some way and would know all of this anyway.  Sorry if I sounded sanctimonious. 

Edited July 29, 2017 by amvet