Private Dancer By Stephan Leather

[tc101]

I am reading Private Dancer by Stephan Leather. In other topics, people have said this book gives a very accurate picture of the sex industry in Thailand. That is probably true since so many people have said it, but I am wondering about the accuracy of some of the other things in the book.

For example when Pete and Joy go to her village and the house she grew up in, about page 65-70, it says all the young men are sprawled around watching TV, don't work, and expect the women to support them. Is this true? It sounds kind of hard to believe in a farming community.

I have a bunch of questions, but I'll just start with that one.

Also one more general question. Do you think the book is a completly accurate look at a segment of Thai life?

[ProfessorFart]

Do you think the book is a completly accurate look at a segment of Thai life?

No it isn't and nor is it supposed to be.

Its a question of perspective.

The book is written from the Westerner's perspective and this is indeed an accurate description of how many Westerners would perceive rural Thai life.

However you must ask yourself; how would Peter know what the men have been doing? For all he knows they could have been working in the fields since dawn or up all night tending to sick buffalos etc. On the other hand they could have girlfriends who are working the bars in Bangkok or Pattaya and could well be living off their income.

Use novels like this to gain a Westerners perspective on Thailand, not to paint an accurate description of Thai life.

for the Thai perspective try reading some Thai literature in translation.

Chart Korpjitti's 'Now Way Out' and 'The Judgement' and Wimon Sainimnuan's 'Snakes' are fairly easy to find in Bangkok and a very good starting point.

[Maigo6]

For example when Pete and Joy go to her village and the house she grew up in, about page 65-70, it says all the young men are sprawled around watching TV, don't work, and expect the women to support them. Is this true?

No, it isn't true.

ALL the men are sprawled around watching expecting women to support them?

You are right to doubt this, best to go to a village yourself to see.

[Jai Yen Yen]

Put it this way: you will meet farangs who will say that they have had the same experiences as those depicted in the book. My own girlfriend says a family in her village don't work because the mother's sister has a farang husband who gives her money, and she then gives money to her sister so that none of them work.

But the book is a very good read.

[Pink Mist]

This book has been the subject in a few threads over the years, treat it as it is, fiction based loosely on life in LOS

[lampard10]

It's a book.........it's fiction

Do you really think there's a race of people with hairy feet called Hobbits.

[Pink Mist]

It's a book.........it's fiction

Do you really think there's a race of people with hairy feet called Hobbits.

yes and they come from yorkshire and every now and again a giant one escapes

[britmaveric]

Fiction - like reading the sun, star or mirror. (tabloid style read)

[tc101]

It's a book.........it's fiction

Do you really think there's a race of people with hairy feet called Hobbits.

I did a search on it, as someone else here suggested. There are several threads on the book, and the thing people rave about over and over is how accurate it is. That is why I asked the question.

[OldAsiaHand]

The people who rave about its 'accuracy' are, by and large, people who spend every night in a bar and know no one here other than bar girls and of course other farangs who spend every night in a bar.

[Ulysses G.]

The people who rave about its 'accuracy' are, by and large, people who spend every night in a bar and know no one here other than bar girls and of course other farangs who spend every night in a bar.

The first half of the book is based on a true events although Leather calls the book fiction. The rest is a story.

Of course, the people who say it is accurate spend a lot of time in bars. That is their stomping grounds.

The bar culture for white foreigners is what the book is about and it captures that segment of Thailand pretty well even though Stephen Leather is no F. Scott Fitzgerald and doesn't pretend to be.

Edited May 3, 2006 by Ulysses G.

[ProfessorFart]

So what were your other questions?

[Jai Yen Yen]

The people who rave about its 'accuracy' are, by and large, people who spend every night in a bar and know no one here other than bar girls and of course other farangs who spend every night in a bar.

Almost word for word what I was going to say!

Looks like 3 of us posted simultaneously!

Edited May 3, 2006 by Jai Yen Yen

[Ulysses G.]

So what were your other questions?

How did you get that elegant nickname?

[ProfessorFart]

How did you get that elegant nickname?

My mother...................

You made a valid point.

Although the book is twaddle it does certainly give an accurate description of the bar scene.

[britmaveric]

How did you get that elegant nickname?

My mother...................

You made a valid point.

Although the book is twaddle it does certainly give an accurate description of the bar scene.

stereotypical description of the bar scene.

[tc101]

So what were your other questions?

When the farangs are talking, what they say rings true for certain types of people I have actually known. What I wonder about is the things he has Joy, the Thai bar girl saying, since I have not known any Thais. For example, is it true that in Thai culture a man and women rarely say "I love you" but instead express their love by doing things for each other? If that is true it sounds really healthy to me, but I don't know enough about Thai culture to know if it true or if it is just Leathers idealization.

Does Leather speak Thai?

[pepsi666]

Anyone read the book above (Private Dancer, Stephen Leather)

I have just finished it, its quite an interesting read, just wondering if its a true life book or a book made to be real life.

It just mentioned getting involved with bargirls, but never really went into if you moved to Thailand (Bangkok in this case) with a European wife and didnt have a great intrest in the bargirls

It did paint a bleak picture of the bargirls and their outlook on 'farangs' and life in general

Just would like other views on the book (if anyone has read it)

[britmaveric]

Fiction - tabloid style. Lot of stuff in it does ring true with stereotypical stuff some of the BG spout and do. However remember this portrayal is a stereotype and doesnt fit every bg or lad who finds himself in a relationship with one.

[udon]

It's no literary masterpiece but it should be essential reading for all newbies to Thailand.

Let's not forget, Thailand has more great actresses than Hollywood & Bollywood combined.

[Kerryd]

This topic is almost as bad as all the "Moving to Thailand, need Advice" threads that pop up on a regular basis.

It is also being discussed (again) in the General Forum.

Private Dancer By Stephan Leather

[udon]

I guess some peeps are too lazy to use the Search button. Results

[Arsenal]

It's no literary masterpiece but it should be essential reading for all newbies to Thailand.

Let's not forget, Thailand has more great actresses than Hollywood & Bollywood combined.

It's certainly sloppily written.However perhaps I should remind you that many newbies have zero interest in the bar scene, and for them it's certainly not compulsory reading.

[Tippaporn]

So what were your other questions?

For example, is it true that in Thai culture a man and women rarely say "I love you" but instead express their love by doing things for each other? If that is true it sounds really healthy to me, but I don't know enough about Thai culture to know if it true or if it is just Leathers idealization.

Does Leather speak Thai?

My wifey has told me on more than one ocassion that I only need to tell her that I love her once. After that she knows. And yes, we do things for each other. But that's a healthy aspect in any relationship. So the book's depiction there holds true for me.

[cdnvic]

Duplicate topics merged.

[tc101]

I finished it yesterday. There are some things in the book that I think must be inaccurate.

On page 246, Damien, the bar owner says: "Most of these girls lose their virginity before they're 13, and then it's to their father or their brother or one of their brother's friends"

Earlier in the book Joy said her father started having sex with her when she was a teenager, then when her little sister got old enough the father started having sex with the little sister and the brother started on Joy.

Now I know incest exists in every society, and there is more incest than most of us want to think about. However, is there any more in Thailand than in the USA or Europe? Isn't incest a universal taboo? Aren't fathers who do this is Thailand looked down upon with the same contempt we feel in the west?

I may be ignorant on this subject, but I thought incest was a universal taboo. I don't see any reason to think Thai fathers love there daughters any less than fathers in the west.

Tell me if I am wrong.

[tc101]

The one thing I can think of on the incest subject is that Damian is saying this, and the author meant to show Damian's cynicism, rather than say something about Thai society. However, Damian is accurate about most of the other things he says, and there is the earlier story in the book about Joy's father and brother, which is not told by Damian.

[britmaveric]

I've heard this from a few thai women before, I'm not certain this is the case everytime. I'd have to think this pattern probably follows some same stats more or less to most countries.

[Ulysses G.]

Now I know incest exists in every society, and there is more incest than most of us want to think about. However, is there any more in Thailand than in the USA or Europe? Isn't incest a universal taboo? Aren't fathers who do this is Thailand looked down upon with the same contempt we feel in the west?

I may be ignorant on this subject, but I thought incest was a universal taboo. I don't see any reason to think Thai fathers love there daughters any less than fathers in the west.

Incest is very taboo in Thailand, but I have been told numerous times that many men here look for women with attractive daughters to marry because they end up with both.

[chuchok]

I know of one woman who's first time was with her brother. It does happen, and probably more than most people realise.

If you want more information about things like this, ask Kat.