mogoso

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

Muslim fundamentalists will keep chipping away at the freedom of the Thai people until, one day, your avarage Thai will awake to the 5:00am call to prayer.

When will the Thai people stand up for themselves?

Virgil, Out!

Here Here, what you said

Maybe corny..but my wife... best wife, I swear, in the world! Thai food, my favorite and the list goes on.

Now I beg to differ, in my humble opinion, my wife is the best wife in world. Although I might concede that yours is the best wife in the world for you, as mine is for me, and mine is one of the better thai cooks in the world.

Tiger Woods momma

Lots of rice exported, maybe #1 I think

Many rare floras and faunas

How about some of their festivals, Songkran was alot fun

Folk dances (Lanna for example)

How about the average joe thai person, you got lottsa bad apples in any society, but most folks are pretty decent there

Beer Chang

Som Tom

Some really neat ruins showing the greatness that comes and goes in any society

Wonderful Wats in Thailand and the world, I think the world of our abbot and the monks at my local wat in the US

Fun loving people

Did I mention many beautiful women

Beer Chang (I just like thinking about it)

How female caddies

The wonderful Issan music

I gotta quit writing I'm trying to pass a kidneystone and I keep losing my train of thought as I've drank three gallons of liquid today, and gotta keep getting up and going to hong nam.

the government will never be able to stop the attacks.

the muslim extremists will succeed , even if it takes them 100 years , in wrecking southern thailand and taking it back to the middle ages , and their he11ish vision of a truer form of extreme islam.

within 2 or three generations , large portions of asia will be heading the same way , as will parts of europe.

holland , france and the uk spring to mind.

i agree with this as i live in london and have allready seen and tasted there ways and once they become stronger in numbers they be telling us what to do and in england we dont want to annoy so they get what they want its there human rights why cant we all live in peace

We could, but they can't and I wonder why. Why can't they accept that others have their human rights too?

Europe allowed the Muslims to come into their countries with open arms. Saying we are a secular society, we welcome all to live as they feel best. We have very liberal laws and rules to protect all . Islam entered but didn't intergrate into society, looked at society and found it evil, seeing it allowing the sins of drug use, free fornication among consenting adults, nud_e beaches, alcohol consumption, working on their days of sabbath, etc.

Slowly they've had laws changed, that in reality aid in their expansion. Europe keeps putting western mores on Islam, which of it self is the definition of insanity (keep making the same mistake hoping for a different outcome) I've feel as many that the tipping point in Europe isn't too far off. France, Germany, the UK Spain will fall under the crescent moon first, then the rest will follow. It doesn't take 50% or more of the population to allow a political takeover look no further than Malaysia to see how it occurs.

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One of the biggest lies especially regarding anti-retrovirals and AIDS research is the development costs of those drugs. First of all, most was not financed by the pharma companies, but by universities through government funds, and pharma companies only financed clinical trials. Many patents do not even belong to the pharma companies, but the universities. But the pharma companies spend a lot of effort any money to prevent generic providers from finding out to whom these patents actually belong.

I am not gonna waste my time with you anymore to go into any more details. All this information is freely available if you make the effort to actually familiarize yourself with the problem. For you this may be just an armchair warrior issue, for me though it isn't.

Many people i love are infected, and do only survive because the existence of generic medicine. If it were for people like you, they would be dead. Fortunately though the world does not only consist of coldhearted uncompassionate animals like you.

[/quote

Let me get this right its ok for the US to fund these universities to do the research. But when the gov't turns the research over to US Pharma companies hoping to recoup the monies given to the universities through taxes on the company through the sales of new drugs, but thats not allowable. I do agree that the profit is great, but we live in a litagious society where every drug company worries about the next vioxx or other drug suits.

Actually many of the top pharma companies aren't even US companies Bayer. Roche, Glaxosmithkline, Novartis, Aventis, Astrazeneca arent they all Euro companies, yet the tone of the postings always seem to have an antiamerican slant. It really curious how so many posters on this board color their thoughts with an underlying antiamericanism, without a passing jab at their own counties (companies) shortcomings.

I'm sorry you've many loved ones suffering from Aids. from what I've seen its a horrible disease. But to be truthful I know no one in my lifes travels that has it, I read about it how its affecting so many people, and have seen in visits to the clinic a few people that were suffering from it, but they weren't in my life. I wish them well, but unless its a child who had no say in the matter it was a lifestyle choice.

I se my primary physician every six months for the past 35 years and I get my blood tested at the same time . About ten years back after a visit to Thailand I was told I had Hep C. I don't use drugs, I don't hang with people who do. I didn't get a tatoo, so I was at a loss on how I might have gotten this disease. After four years of tests at 6 month intervals where it'd show up on one test and not another a final determination was made that I did indeed have it. I was sent to a class where I was given info on transmittal of disease. The cure rates and of the ten percent it'd just go away.

I did learn not to let anyone use your razor (not a problem there) or of all things your toothbrush. Fortunately for me I'm one of the lucky ten percent.

But I did learn not to let any casual overnight guest use your toothbrush, a word of warning to those who have that occasional visitor. Not a problem to me any more as my wife keeps talking about ducks.

The Thai Police could fall into a bucket of tits and still come out sucking their thumbs.

The "bombs" were just fireworks by terrorist standards. Any terrorist organisation claiming responsibility for those would be laughed at.

Its just some recently disenfranchised members of the military / police / business groups spitting the dummy about not getting their slice of pie from the new new government carve-up.

I guess a few months back in the south of Thailand where a series of I believe 14 bombs set off in an almost simultaneously, injuring many and killing just two were fireworks also. They weren't powerful bombs and weren't made to take down an entire block but to cause damage, and more importantly "terror"

The whole purpose is to cause fear, injuries are certainly an effect of the bombs but not the main purpose. So will you laugh at those who set off those bombs?

Probably. So who is your money on then, Sherlock?

You'll "probably" laugh at people who caused death and injury due to the placement of small bombs that you consider puny because they dont cause massive amounts of destruction and death. The people injured aren't laughing because of the bombs size. Have you ever seen up close what a hand grenade does to the human body (One report of a hand grenade being used)

As for the whom set off these devices I do have an opinion, but will wait for more evidence.

Who really did it? This is the same tactic that G.W. Bush and his administration did after 9/11. Look now at the results. The U.S. government made it legal to go after Muslims from any country and the former PM followed suit.

From what I have heard from the local Thai population here and around Bangkok, they feel that is the new CNS government who planned it and did it, in order to raise some support for their failed cause to liberate Thailand from the "Evil Ways of Thaskin and his disciples".

Since it has been shown in the last decade, that to blame a religious organization such as Islam for these attacks, it's easy and a very old proprangda trick. Look at the U.S.

The new Thai government is losing control day by day and they will do anything to keep themselves in power.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Lets note the US made it legal to hunt down terrorists whom have acted against the US. There is no provision to hunt down Islamics, just to hunt those who commit terrorist acts against the US. It is not a license to hunt down specifically Muslims as you suggest.

I'll not comment on the present Thai gov't

Its pretty easy to blame Islam for attacks of terror for the last forty years as mostly a few Muslims are committing these acts. If it raining you don't blame sunlight for causing rust.

The Thai Police could fall into a bucket of tits and still come out sucking their thumbs.

The "bombs" were just fireworks by terrorist standards. Any terrorist organisation claiming responsibility for those would be laughed at.

Its just some recently disenfranchised members of the military / police / business groups spitting the dummy about not getting their slice of pie from the new new government carve-up.

I guess a few months back in the south of Thailand where a series of I believe 14 bombs set off in an almost simultaneously, injuring many and killing just two were fireworks also. They weren't powerful bombs and weren't made to take down an entire block but to cause damage, and more importantly "terror"

The whole purpose is to cause fear, injuries are certainly an effect of the bombs but not the main purpose. So will you laugh at those who set off those bombs?

Muslims are no more terrorists than your precious Christians who invaded the Holy Lands bent on converting the people there to Christianity...not any worse than that...just a bit of rape, pillage, murder, and mayhem...but it's OK, because that was in the name of God...not Allah... Hmmm...

The name Allah IS the Muslim name for GOD! Muslims believe in one God the same as most of the christians. The problem is that the christians and the muslims dont think its the same god. Why they don't is anyone's guess, but there you go.

My point is this... the Muslims are not any more to blame for this going on than any christian was to blame for the action of a bunch of religious extremists in the 13th century. So don't come over all "holier-than-thou" 'cos it doesn't wash!

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I believe that there are over 130 shooting conflicts in the world today, all but a handful involve Muslims, showing how well and how peaceful they can get along with their neighbors. Look at how well they treat the black christians and animists in the Sudan.

Allah is the name given to their god, not mine. Islam means submission to the Islamic god, not mine. I don't believe its a just or fair god that gives a Muslim three choices on how to deal with those he meets, convert them, enslave them, or kill them. What about leaving them alone in peace to enjoy their lives.

As for the Crusades, you may call them extremists, but consider that those who were going on pilgramage or trade to the holy lands were oft killed, enslaved, converted by force or necessitiy, or the ever popular ransomed. Throughout the middle ages Europe on its eastern and southern borders was invaded by Islamic armies from time to time, and they just wanted it to cease. So it was only internal and external political expedicy which brought on the Crusades.

In the early 1800's the US invaded the Barbary coast of northern Africa to stop the kidnapping of its sailors and citizens. The amount of people of all nations over a two hundred years period was over two million that were once again enslaved, converted, killed or the ever popular ransomed, by the Barbary Pirates.

Sorry as a nonbeliever in the three major mideast religions, I find faults with all, but in one in this day and age one in particular.

Nagasima had parts of two fingers missing, a common trait among Yakuza members, who are often forced to slice off parts of their own digits for disobedience or failing to properly carry out their criminal tasks.

Suwat said Nagasima was punished in such a way for embezzlement.

- Associated Press

===================================================

I guess when you add things up, he came up a little short

[Prosecutors say a former manager of the factory, Woravit Mektrakarn, likely killed Garcia, an immigrant from Veracruz, Mexico, over a pay dispute and then disposed of the body.

In 2003, police uncovered evidence suggesting Garcia, 24, was likely killed in an office at the factory.

Mektrakarn was charged with murder.

Plengsangtip, the factory manager and a friend of Mektrakarn's, was at the factory on the night of the disappearance, but told police he knew nothing about what happened to Garcia. Prosecutors charged him as an accessory to the murder under the theory that he is lying about what he knows and is helping the killer by keeping quiet.

San Bernardino County Superior Court Judge Barry Plotkin ruled in October 2005 that prosecutors had ample evidence to try Plengsangtip on the charge.

But another judge, Ingrid Uhler, overruled that decision three months later, saying Plengsangtip's mere denials of knowledge - even if untrue - don't make him an accessory to any crime.

Prosecutors are now asking the state appeals court to decide which judge is correct.

Mektrakarn remains at large.

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I gotta go with Judge Uhler on this ruling. Just because he was on the factory grounds during the time the crime was committted doesn't mean he had any knowledge of it. Afterall it is a factory, things are fairly noisy and people are moving things around. Plengsangtip could've been on the floor doing things, he was at work afterall.

Might be raspberries on the lead detective as the murder suspect is still at large, why not blame the friend as an accessory. Just a convient way to gain some kind of conviction on the case.

But then again theres the maybe.........catch Mektrakarn and possible the truth could come out.

Meanwhile if I'm Plensangtip and innocent I stay tuck away in a relatives home till the courts decide, it'll save him a lot of hassle.

Anyone who has anything to do with drugs in Thailand or SEA is stupid.

That's a bit harsh. Perhaps just ignorant. But yeah, if you know what the consequences can be, then it's stupid. But many are just ignorant.

To respond to the original poster's question, I think it'd be a rare case that was banned from Thailand for a minor pot bust.

We all know drugs can get you in big trouble in Thailand, or should, and it does happen. However, a Thai friend of mine got caught at one of those club raids where they test everyone's urine. She had taken ecstacy. Finally, five years later she had to serve about 20 days in a drug rehab place and that was it. She had a good lawyer, though.

Just saying you're not always going to get the short end of the stick. The law in writing is often more harsh than the actual application in Thailand.

Lets examine the other side of the stick. Five years of stress and worry about what may or not occur at some point in the future. The expense and hassle of having an attorney that you must visit with occasionally taking away from other more fruitful activities. Then at the end, twenty wasted days in a drug rehab center. To me theres easier ways to live, just don't do drugs.

Perhaps he was being generous?

Perhaps he was trying to earn "merit" for all the riders he has overcharged.

For me I can only think of one thing that stands out: The loss of democracy and with that the loss of political stability and international recognition as a modern nation. I'll leave it up to each and everyone's political persuasions to decide for yourselves if this loss happened in September last year, or gradually during the last few years under the previous PM, or that it was all merely a democratic facade from the get-go; take your pick. But the result is that Thailand is not (and perhaps never was) a nation to bet your life on, to make serious investments in, or make a living in long term.

A lot of the posts above seem to deal with a particular place that changed. I'd say that's only natural; you can't expect to go back to Paradise-X and expect it to have stayed the same; you will need to go find your current paradise.. Same with 'too many farangs'. Where, Sukhumvit? Chiang Mai even? Sure.

Cheers,

Chanchao

"you don't know what you've lost till it's gone

they've paved paradise and put in a parking lot" joni mitchell

I'm in central Pattaya, Thailand. It's now 90 degrees F/30 degrees C.

I'm usually in Montreal, Canada which is beautiful but cold for 7 months of the year.

Where are you and do you have a photo? Cheers.

I'm in Atlanta wishing I were in Thailand or even at Mt Tremblatt or visiting friends in Verdun P.Q. or at Biddles if he's still alive and running his jazz club.

But maybe you do not come from a modern society and therefore have difficulties to understand the concept of human rights and due process, and its advantages.

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Your probably right I don't come from a modern society, I come from the US and as most western euros will tell you we're a backwater third world country. But I didn't say summarily executed, just that they should be, you put the human rights due process in there. But then again as English may not be your native tongue or maybe the your schools don't have good english departments, I'll certainly over look the interpretation

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And basically, no, hill tribes are not allowed to grow these substances and use them. They do that clandestinely, and get punished when caught. It is not just hill tribes who traditionally use Ganja, ethnic Thais do as well.

Opium was a relatively recent introduction into the area. It was introduced by the British who made lots of money by selling it to China in exchange for tea. Two wars in the mid 19th century were fought over this issue with China, which tried to refuse the British policy of selling opium. China lost the opium wars.

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I thought that Thailand a few years back changed the laws on this, but as I've seen it in several villiages in years past, including the touristy one at Doi Setup in Chiang Mai, it hasn't been more than 10 years ago. I did take photos and have them somewhere in my boxes of photos.

I did know of the opium wars, but really the illegalization of drugs began in the 1930's in the US and grew very quickly throughout the world.

Samuel Clemens in the 1800's liked cocaine so much he thought of going to South America to become an importer, but instead turned to literature.

It seems a great many people come to the shores of SEA bringing their and their countries particular values on drug useage and punishment,

I do somewhat agree on people needing to inform themselves about possible punishment's beforehand.

But - they do not bring "their country's values" on drug usage to SEA, particularly Thailand. There are many substances in Thailand that have been commonly grown, used and traded by large sectors of society until very recently. They have never carried any social stigmata, and still today, as soon as you get out of the urban areas, substances such as ganja or bai kratom do not carry any negative social stigmata.

The further you go, the more openly people, especially the old folks, disregard the laws do still use ganja, as it has always been part of their tradition.

Basically, the repressive drug politics in Thailand (and most parts of SEA) are a result of western government's (especially the US) political pressure linking drug laws with the highly coveted most favoured nation status and other economical development aids.

You speak of locals whom partake of these substances, I speak of farangs. Its been several years since I visited a hill tribe villiage, but they grew ganga and poppies openly and as I was led to believe legally at that point in time. An example of this in the US allows Indians to utilize the Peyote cautus among other things not allowed to the general populace. (religious purposes)

I would agree the repressive nature is due to western pressure.

I also personally don't care if people do drugs, just let Darwinism take care of the stupid hard drug user without society having to pay for illness obtained from their useage. (This excludes yaa bah users and dealers who should be shot as a menace to society)

That being said I don't use drugs, and don't condone their usage.

But the punishment despite why the laws are there and when and whom they pretain to is real, especially for the farang. If you come here and use drugs, you'll get what you deserve if caught.

cheers

Anyone who has anything to do with drugs in Thailand or SEA is stupid.

please ...........................

refine your blatant generalization ,

in the interests of peace and harmony on this thread

I certainly think its a valid statement, and echos my sentiments, notwithstanding your tongue in cheek comment.

It seems a great many people come to the shores of SEA bringing their and their countries particular values on drug useage and punishment, despite knowledge given to them on their (generally) if no where else, flight into the region. To be forewarned is to armed with knowledge there's is a different mindset in SEA.

Yet in these Thai Visa pages we read a continuous stream of those who get their teats caught in a wringer and end up in the Bangkok Hilton. And we see a bunch of folk whining about the unfairness of it, even though these people caught knew it was a harsh punishment, but they felt the crime might be worth the time.

Now I do feel bad for those set up by locals for whatever reason, but really thats a small amount of folks.

you can run but u cant hide, nowhere is safe anymore... they are coming after me, big brother is watching... quick get in and lock the doors....

its death by falling coconut.......

bina

israel

in a fit of wierdness (spent last nite chasing marauders trying to steal my very pregnant goats. getting rather sick of that actually.)

I believe Koh samui has 2 million coconut trees, which inconviently drop their rather large and heavy fruit occasional on the noggins of the unbeware below. I think its an average of three deaths per year by coconut.

Here's the deal; France (and numerous other countries) realised that Iraq had zilch to do with 9/11.

But Brain Dead Bush, who may it be said avoided the Vietnam conflict by dodgy means, managed to convince a whole bunch of people who do not even know where Iraq actually is that it was Saddam who done it!.

Oh- My Grandmother was a Socialist - she fought and fought to get the National Health Service introduced to UK.

Know why?. She had five daughters: Four died, the last at 18 from meningitis as you had to pay doctors in those days.

Shipyard workers didn't earn much and were hired by the day and that's what her husband worked as.

My Mother is 75 and a Socialist - she would kick your red neck arse around the block.

Oh by the way I got the cheese eating part of sentence from a oft repeated Bart Simpson (that applied to the french) quote that was "cheese eating surrender monkeys" it kinda went with the avatar I was replying to, the rest was mine.

I believe it was Churchhill who said something like if your not a liberal when young you have no heart and if your not a conservative when older you have no brain. Which are you?

What you want is something for nothing, the ability to take with the force of gov't from those who succeed through hard work and good choices giving to those who do neither. Oh you'll go on about those who were born unto the manner who haven't had to work for it, but those are really small in number. But class envy abounds.

We gotta pay for doctors in this country, not cheap, but we live ok, we survive and many folks come from their countries to ours to get speedy or specialized care, and although its not free they still come. The standard of health care professionals in Canada is very good, but the wait can be lengthy, so some people with the werewithal just cross over and "get er done" (google the details) Those that need to obtain care here without money also get it under whatever gov't program covers it medicare I think

I've got no quarrel with the folks from the UK, my moms dad family history is quite British. First British Sherriff of New York City in the 1600's is family as well as grand dad wife. I've visited with my great aunt and uncle several times before their deaths as well as other relatives there throughout great Britain and Ireland from both sides of family.

My beef is with the thought that I should pay to support people who simply make bad choices. Having children without the cash to provide for the totallity is just stupid, wait save and then reproduce.

Working a 40 hour job mostly will pay the bills but it won't as a rule make you rich. The 70 hours or more work weeks put in by those who obtain wealth is the rule not the exception. They work to keep others in work, to suceed. I've an acquaintance whom while worth many millions told me that he envied me.

That certainly made me curious, but he went on to explain the burdens of business were many, you can fill in the blanks.

I was taking two months of vacation every year at that time. My business is mostly stress free and seasonal and while physical not too hard. But he hadn't had two months of vacation in total over a twenty year period. Oh sure he traveled alot but thats not too restful, when you get to your destination someone there picks you up to start your work cycle after you've been using your laptop the whole trip. And while he was a few years younger than I he looks 15 years older and in bad health. But hes worked for that sucess not pissed his time and money away at the pub. Everything you do comes with an opportunity cost or loss or gain.

I think of a socialist and a capitalist walking down a street, they pass a beggar. The socialist will say we need to help that unfortunate soul then reach into the capitalists pocket to get the cash to donate, and consider it fair and just that he does. The socialist may have some money of his own, but since you have more its his right, his belief that you pay, not him.

Americans tend to be nervous overseas unless they are

covered by the "chain of command" and have an M16

in their hands.

With these attributes they can still be nervous but they

add lethal to the mix.

Be more understanding please. Don't confuse them with

complex political/social issues they could never understand.

I'm an American. I don't need no chain of command to wander around where and when I please. I ain't no cheese eating appeasement monkey and while I

was an expert with a M-16 at one time I don't carry anything around with me other than my wits. I been in a great deal of odd places at odd times throughout the world and haven't had to do much other than to crunch up a couple of drunk germans on Koh Samui over the last 30 years.

I don't need no socialist pantywaist psuedointellectual euro bullcrap to tell me what ways the wind blowing and insult my countrys people.

We happily send 10k each month. It goes a long way in providing for the needs of my mother in law, her mother in law, and my step son.

While, my step son is still attending school he does work as an electricians apprentice with his uncle. He makes good money at that for a 17 year old, not to mention a valuable skill.

My mother in law has some health issues so she works spordically, but does work. Happily she has no bad habits( smoking, drinking, gambling) that seem to affect many Thai families. She does spend alot of time helping around the Wat, but I certainly bring no fault in that. She has asked for very little, and that only in times of family emergencies a couple of times.

On the money she's recieved over the years shes renovated her home adding a large sitting room and a bedroom with a western style bath for our usage. She drives my wifes old motor bike from time to time refusing to let my wife buy her a new one as she drives it only around the village and takes a bus into Chiang Mai when she goes to town.

She takes good care of my step son and soon his fiance will be a part of our little family ( oh their too young) and she will care for her. Were hoping our son will arrive here in the states within the next 6 months, so the fiance will be staying with her until we get the fiance here on a student visa to study at the local community college and then university.

In short the little money we send isn't wasted or misused. Its eased the life of a few loved ones, but not enriched them. Theres still a work ethic, and a sense of community responsibility and personal responsibility. My small Thai family's good people.

Hiya All,

yeah it was a nice moon last night, very clear and white. I was walking across a bridge on a rig in Norway before I left and said the same. Glad someone else noticed.

Its bigger and brighter because of global warming.

and once again the bad guy gets out of it easy by being executed.

look boys,

its got to be a better plan to lock him up in the big tiger for the term of his natural life.

he got out it to easy did'nt he ?

Yes he got out easy, but it'll spare a fortune on keeping him under lock and key for another 20 years, the expense of many additional trails, not to mention, the lifes of his defense attorneys who seem to meet their God sooner than they would've liked too.

Myself I would've at least honored his request to be shot rather than hung, first one in a kneecap, then the other kneecap, the each elbow, then each hand, then get creative till he bled out.

Could have been worse publicity though , if a beheading would've been ordered.

So I am guessing it was a "###### them muslims, lets get them back" and then attack some people totally disconected with the attacks. Now causing reaction from those of muslim faith who DO retaliate. Yay a volley of attacks for New Years.

I'm not saying yea or nay on Islamic guilt, but lets not exonerate them or anyone else until the facts are in.

I don't know who is behind these bombings, naturally I look first at the usual suspects, but won't cast aspersions until indeed its known for certain.

I regret the loss of life and suffering caused by these Bangkok bombings, but I notice a huge surge og news and postings on these, and rightfully so, its a tragedy, that I fear will only escalate.

Friday morning appx 5:30 am (5:30 pm thai time)we were awakened by a phone from my wifes mother in the Chiang Mai area. Her my son and his girl friend were attending an affair at their new Wat when a youngman approached my 17 year old son and asked if he wanted to hold a bomb. Our son replied man your crazy and turned and walked away. Alas our son was a bit slow as the next thing he knew was laying on the ground with a ruptured eardrum. Others were not as lucky with one person losing some fingers, another a broken arm, another had both legs broken.

Curiously nothing on Thaivisa or the Chiangmai forum have been posted on this. As far as I know (which admittedly) is very little. My wife doesn't seem to ask the questions I'd like answered about who what why (we know the where and when) as her main concern has been for our son.

Any enlightenment by those knowing more would be appreciated