jamhar

This article suggests that the younger brother may have indeed contributed to the older one's death. http://boston.com/metrodesk/2013/04/21/new-details-wild-shootout-with-bomb-suspects-watertown-chief-believes-older-brother-was-killed-younger-brother-desperate-getaway/jaIyrXr8fSnf5Pu4xnRbvM/story.html Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Seems some conflicting info on that.

BOSTON (AP) — A doctor involved in treating the Boston Marathon bombing

suspect who died in a gunbattle with police says he had injuries head to

toe and all limbs intact when he arrived at the hospital.

Dr. David Schoenfeld said 26-year-old Tamerlan Tsarnaev was unconscious

and had so many penetrating wounds when he arrived at Beth Israel

Deaconess Medical Center early Friday that it isn’t clear which ones

killed him, and a medical examiner will have to determine the cause of

death.

Source

I read an officers account of the action where he said that the younger brother looked like he deliberately tried to run over the officers trying to subdue the older brother that was lying in the street. The officers were able to jump out of the way at the last moment, but the vehicle ran over the older brothers body and dragged it some 30 feet before the body came to rest. I see that as attempted murder, several counts.

Jingles, most of us do not live in Lebanon. I think the information would be more relevant if the countries surveyed were the UK, Australia, USA etc.

I want to have some reliable info before I embark on a pogrom.

Thanks.

.

Jingles

I thought your stats looked just fine. I did see some omissions tho. US and EU i could understand. Those areas are outside the Region. but how about some of the prosperous Middle Eastern Countries. SA, Kawait, UAE ect? I'm certain those countries would not want to be surveyed. but why weren't they? was it a matter of permission?

just thinking out loud.

And yes, you are now "Jingles"

Note that the article says, "...requests a study to determine the feasibility of collecting a fee...".

In the U.S. just about all fees are increasing.

Note that on an international air ticket the following fees are collected:

US International Departure Tax (US) $17.20

US September 11th Security Fee (AY) $2.50

US Passenger Facility Charge (XF) $4.50

USDA APHIS Fee (XA) $5.00

US Immigration Fee (XY) $7.00

US Customs Fee (YC) $5.50

I assume both U.S. and Canadian citizens would have to pay any fees, were they to be implemented? (The article appears to be authored from solely the Canadian perspective.)

When i tell people that Freedom isnt Free,

This is NOT what i was referring to!

But I do love the dedication to freedom in the US

and apparently that includes

freedom for some blankety blank middle manager

to spend MY tax dollars on a really ill-advised study

Its ok and even encouraged to think out of the box

but do it quietly so that i dont have to keep explaining for ill-advised action!

Christ almighty, someone get me a bat!

OK since the mods did not give me mercy

let me say that i dont think this is that great of an idea

No entrance fee will make up the loss in revenue from lowered border crossings

and you might have to do this for all international travels (mexico?) once the lawsuits starts

and all will do is give the US bashers fodder to play with.

You really dont need a study for this one, but the bureaucrats needs to justify their jobs somehow.

(tame enough for ya? lol)

PS

I had hoped that i would get points for artistic merit on the post that was deleted, but i guess not

In other words the expiration date of your visa is not a factor - but the expiration date on your arrival permitted to stay made in February is the date you must leave (have departed) if not extended 30 days so you either can extend 30 days (if not done) or you may be on overstay as you did not provide the date of entry in February or advise if you have extended this final entry we can not be sure of your status. It appears you have never extended so have lost 2 months of possible stay so now this last 30 day extension and then a trip to Vientiane for overnight stay and obtain a new single entry for those two missing months may be required.

Can you get a 3 entry tourist visa with an overnight trip Vientiane?

I'm an American in a similar situation.

In all probability the vast majority of the Muslim community know absolutely nothing of what goes on within the terrorist community. They have no knowledge of it, don't agree with it and would never support it. In fact they are just the same as other members of the population.

Depends on how you define vast majority.

You might want to rethink the theory that SUPPORT for extremism in Islam is at all rare:

http://www.pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

I do think the numbers of actual active terrorists are indeed small.

Thats really disturbing

But on a brighter note,

I was just watching DW after my hike. I think I just heard a Qatar emissary say 2 things

1) The Arab world needs to come to some peace with Israel

(and find a long lasting solution with the Palestinians)

2) Syria has always been known to be a source for terrorism in the region and the world.

Can someone verify PLEASE?

Maybe i need to lay off the Chang beer

or maybe, just MAYBE i'll see some progress in my lifetime!

Sorry to say this but you have got this one totally ass about face....

Here's the BBC item you mentioned:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22191030

What the Muslim community of Boston was fearing was a backlash of anti-Muslim sentiment if the bombers proved to be co-religionists. It had nothing to do with Muslims being cowed and weak in the face of Muslim extremists, quite the opposite. What they feared were bigoted numb nuts like the jerks who abused and assaulted Sikh cabbies in NYC after September 11th.

f, regarding the "ass about face" (love the phrase) comment,

for me, it wouldn't be the first time and it wont be the last

not afraid of failure or ridicule.

one teaches me a lesson

and the other reminds me not to forget it! lol

Thanks for digging up that link.

I'll respond a bit later when i can,

but i stand by my statement, as convoluted as it was.

One of the dangers of posting in hast.

Edit, sorry the quotes are too messed up to save the post

Been there also dude.

But on a different note,

I for one, think that the suspects uncle deserves all my respect (whether he wants it or not! lol)

He's one of the rare muslim that has openly spoken out against other muslims (his nephews) and in favor of his country, the US. His disgust was palpable. I truly felt sorry for this man, who at least on the surface, looks to be the typical american regardless of religion, and just trying to lead a good life. He will also be ever stained by his nephews. My hope is the this stain on him is soluble somewhat and he will be able to move on. Probably not until well after the trial, however.

There was even a statement by some Pakistan taliban that they would not make such bombings.

I don't think that it is a RARE Muslim who think such bombings are not good.

Agreed, on the muslims that think so. But I'll go further. I believe most muslims, moderate or not, believe so also.

but it is rare, for a muslim to go against another muslim in support of the US, esp. with such conviction. and that includes muslims that currently have immigrated to the US.

There was a piece in the BBC, prior to information about the suspects being released, about how the Muslim community of Boston was hoping that the purps were not Muslim (selfish thought or not they realized). They seemed like meek and cowed groups. but that's how the fundamentalist Muslims groups work, i believe. They submit the will of any opposing groups or ideas with threats of harm or death. So yes, from what I've seen, Any Muslim that is willing to come out publicly and stand with his other fellow countrymen of the US, against the fundamentalist Islamist is rare.

If i'm wrong, please show me.

We all make choices in life. The apologists will say that the bombers were oppressed, but they were not. They were not repressed either, but they were conditioned by their culture and religion to do exactly what they did. However, behind all that conditioning was a choice. The choice was that they could have become Americans and lived a good life, but instead they chose to become Muslim terrorists.

Well said bro

Timothy McVeigh was a self described "patriotic" American. It can be argued that his culture and religion caused him to do exactly what he did.

I am not an apologist for the Boston murderers and I shed no tears over the death of the older brother who it seems was one nasty piece of business. However, it is simplistic to look for one single factor as the cause.

I fail to see how simplistic U's comments are, and what being a patriotic american has to do with U's comments.

You dont have to be a patriot to enjoy being in America, or being American. I can show you plenty in california

And I dont see how culture and religion can be disputed as a major factor for the personal decisions made by these two brothers.

Interesting account of the younger brother running over his older brother

rat bastard runs over his rat bastard brother

""[Tamerlan] all of a sudden comes out from under cover and just starts walking down the street, shooting at our police officers, trying to get closer," Deveau said. "Now, my closest officer is five to 10 feet away, and they're exchanging gunfire between them. And he runs out of ammunition -- the bad guy -- and so one of my police officers comes off the side and tackles him in the street.

"We're trying to get him handcuffed. There's two or three police officers handcuffing him in the street -- the older brother. At the same time, at the last minute -- they obviously have tunnel vision, it's a very, very stressful situation -- one of them yells out, 'Look out!' and here comes the black SUV, the carjacked car, directly at them. They dive out of the way, and he (the younger brother) drives over his brother and drags him a short distance down the street."

We all make choices in life. The apologists will say that the bombers were oppressed, but they were not. They were not repressed either, but they were conditioned by their culture and religion to do exactly what they did. However, behind all that conditioning was a choice. The choice was that they could have become Americans and lived a good life, but instead they chose to become Muslim terrorists.

Borrowed from a Facebook friend: Dear Boston Bombers.

We paid to have you educated at some of our finest schools; schools that are out of the reach of the vast majority of our own native born children.

Interesting . . . I wonder if it is true

No, but it makes it easier to beat one's chest and scream for revenge.

If this was 100 years ago, the injured accused would have been lynched by now.

Borrowed from a Facebook friend: Dear Boston Bombers.

You came to our country from a war ravaged hell hole and asked for asylum. We generously gave you and your family sanctuary. We fed you, clothed you and housed you when no one else would. We paid to have you educated at some of our finest schools; schools that are out of the reach of the vast majority of our own native born children. We gave you opportunity, prosperity, and freedom. You have repaid our hospitality with an act of murderous savagery directed at the same innocent people who welcomed you as one of their own. This is a violation of some of the most ancient laws and customs of of every religion and culture on the planet and we would be well within our rights as a people to subject to you and immediate and final sanction; much as we have done with your murderous degenerate brother.

However we are a civilized people and now that you have been captured for your crimes you will come to know a different form of our hospitality. Don't worry we will still ensure that you have food, clothing, and a place to live...in prison where you shall only lack freedom. I am sure your new neighbors will be just as welcoming as the people of Boston whom you have betrayed in that I am certain that they will embrace you as "one or theirs" or at least one of their possessions. Indeed I hope that you will spend many long years with your fellow inmates getting to know you regularly in a very deep and intimate way.

So just relax to the "pressures" of you new life; as after all you are now on your way to a place where every night is valentines day in the cell block and desire falls like rain in the showers.

some do not like vaccinations. I get it.

I personally have no problems with it.

I get the annual flu vaccination when i can remember to. NO Problem!

but given what i've learn about TL's pharmaceutical industry

Neither myself nor my baby (if i had one) will be first in line.

I'll still let my baby get it. but maybe i'll take a quick vacation to Oz or the US.

for vaccinations for myself, i'll make sure the vaccine is "mature" first

They can get him on hit and run charges.

The dumbshit accidently ran over his brother in the get-away.

We don't know for sure that it was an accident.

So, will they charge him with a hit and run?

Absolutely! Regardless of what happens, that's one charge that is a slam dunk. Judging from the body language of the Federal Attorney, She appeared to think the other charges were slam dunks also.

But i would in her shoes. Hit and run, and running over a body that later died, That should at least be good for xx years, yes? if the corner can say the run over was the leading cause of death they should be able to get more years yes? (Again I'm not a lawyer)

(i'm an engineer, I've never had a problem with overkill)

So the solution is a neo-con clash of civilizations? If that's your reality you are welcome to it....

Demonising entire religious groups produced the Holocaust.

I agree F.

Thats why i'm troubled by my thoughts. But still its hard to look at the data and not see a trend. Take a look at a map of all the Islamic fundamentalist nations. Its a who's who of intolerance and chaos. Worse its a whos who of where a good portion of the worlds chaos originates.

I realize the danger of singling out a religion. but can you give me opposing thoughts? I'm trying to come up with new arguments (rationalizations) myself. maybe i can have them all collected tonight.

Edit:

Sorry gang, I f***** up the text box and had to improvise. I hope i got it right lol

Timothy McVeigh was convicted on murder charges under federal law for the bombing of the United States Federal Building in Oklahoma City.

My statement above is correct.

We can add to it if we like that the venue of the trial was Denver - the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado, in Denver.

Yes, both Colorado and Oklahoma are in the 10th Circuit. Mass. & Boston are in the 1st Circuit. As in most high profile cases, the McVeigh case was tried in Denver under the grant of a Change of Venue to obtain a fair and impartial jury. Certainly we would see that in this case too, and the case will likely be tried not in Boston District Federal Court but in either Maine or Rhode Island for the same reasons.

The idea is the home crowd natives are bad jurors. In terrorism cases like this, I have my doubts as any American probably feels the same toward this defendant.

There's been some talk already of changing the venue of the trial to the U.S. District Court for the Western District of Massachusetts, in Springfield, rather than the venue of initial jurisdiction, the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Massachusetts, in Boston. An unfilled three-year vacancy on the Springfield court however has that court and venue severely backlogged, so that possible venue likely would be ruled out.

You're not going to find an impartial jury in Maine or Rhode Island either, or in any other venue of the 1st Circuit. Last time I looked Puerto Rico was still in the 1st Circuit. As outlandish as it may sound, and if the case must remain within the 1st Circuit, the Territory of Puerto Rico may be the only possible place. I wouldn't be sure about a jury there either. Nor would I be sure a U.S. citizen can be tried in a U.S. Territory even if it is within a U.S. Judicial Circuit.

3 states had a Muslim population of 100K. California, New York, and Michigan. (2000 census)

I would not advise NY

lots of gun lovers in Mich.

That leaves one remaining state.

But i dont know if they can move that far.

I have no expertise in law other than SOW's and NDA's lol

This case is a watermark for me. I always thought that if you took intelligent people, brought them to the west, gave them good life, good education and a chance at a great life, Almost no one would turn to this type of deviant behavior.

This is a clear case where i am totally wrong. There are some people that are wired in such a way that even with all the assets available to them, they still chose to hurt other people.

What is it about the Islamist Muslims that make them so different from moderate Muslims and the rest of humanity? I dont think any other religious subset causes so much pain. please correct me if i am wrong.

Is it that they believe and obey their religious clerics without question? Do they? If so, does that make them more susceptible to deviant ideology?

I'm not even sure about moderate Muslims now. It seems that these young men started out as moderate Muslims they suffered no injustices in the US, but still were turned to radicalism without anyone moderate knowing it. If someone noticed something, they are not saying it, there by perpetuating the radicalism of others.

I'll probably get flame for this, showing my ignorance and all, but i'm really at a wall here. Any enlightening thoughts from any one? I'm really troubled by my conclusion that even all moderate Muslims could be radicalized, and the only warning sign is a showing of slight discontentment.(who hasn't felt disenchanted at one time or another?) And if any moderate could be radicalized, its not really deviant behavior, but something that is a part of the religious nature, albeit a minor part.

I hope the investigations in the next several days, weeks months, years, will add some clarity to my thoughts.

The suspect was not mirandized at the time of arrest according the federal attorney. The federal attorney stated that in cases of national security or act of terror, they have the ability to not mirandize the suspect initially, and they exercised it.

just relaying what i heard on a press conference.

Stop this nonsense, please!

What nonsense are you talking about?

The people were applauding the first responders as they were driving off.

One of the cruisers chirped their sirens in response to the applauding folks as he drove off.

lol there's a gauntlet of applauding folks that the first responders have to drive thru to get out of the neighborhood. really brings out the goosebumps

They will not be giving out sweets in Gaza at the sight of all these Americans cheering the police/swat/fbi officals

Live gunfire presently.

JT, i think the primary focus is public safety.

This guy is thowing IED's into the streets

Stopping the guy is the main priority, not necessarily taking him alive.

The Feds definitely want him alive

Boston Police just wants him stopped.

Also tranquilizer darts has limited range, and requires line of site.

A live local feed

http://www.necn.com/pages/necn_streampage

It looks like they have a house surrounded.