007 RED

1 minute ago, Aditi Sharma said:

What if she has lost that as well?

Immigration will get her to fill in a new one and cross reference the new number with her original one.

2 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

She is not planning to return though. She hasnt said anything about not having the TM6 card, what is it?

TM6 is the departure card which is the second part of the card you give the IO on your arrival.

56 minutes ago, timendres said:

This stamp looks very similar to the stamp I get if I file my 90 day report late. I believe it is simply documenting payment of a fine that is related to immigration. The image is not clear enough for me to read the Thai, so I cannot tell you what it says exactly.

If you go back to page 1...Post No. 7 you will see what a 'banned' stamp looks like.

6 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

How long will this thread be running...until she has safely landed in HBO or something?

FYI - HBO is only a transit stop where she will change flights to South Africa.

1 minute ago, Aditi Sharma said:

Red, I have a question. How would she be digging her hole any deeper? You mean by picking and choosing and not doing what she should do to get out of the hole ie by working at the Language Centre whatever that is?

She already has a problem because of her overstay - the metaphorical hole she is already dug for herself. 

If it now comes to immigration's attention that she is teaching English at the language centre without a work permit (which she won't have), she is then working illegally and this could result in her being arrested, taken to Court, fined and deported - this would be digging the metaphorical hole even deeper.

2 hours ago, The Girl said:

Actually, Red, I did not say I am currently working. I said I may take the suggestion of working at a Language Center to raise money. Seeing that it is illegal, I will not do it. There is no case of investigation without illegal commission (except financing my overstay - which WU receipts should do the talking). Instead, I will channel that "working" towards fundraising from family and friends from SA. That's the only hard "work" I will be doing. 

Sorry but you seemed to have changed your story again... I notice that in your post 183 you have deleted the first paragraph which originally stated:

"Hi. In as much as it is very risky to do so, I have resorted to spending at least 7-8 hours at the language center per day (incl. weekends). I have raised an additional of 2k after pawning some stuff. So I need 8k  by next week. Remember that I had 10k already".

If you are not working, then what is so risky to spend 7-8 hours at the language centre per day (including weekends)?

As I, and other contributors, have said before....  having dug yourself into a hole, stop digging it any deeper.

If your friends and relatives are able to send you funds to support you, and you have recent WU receipts to confirm this all the better for you.

Once again, best of luck.

FYI.... RED = Retired & Extremely Dangerous 

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

Nonsense, they have other things to do.

So what is the purpose of immigration?

15 minutes ago, The Girl said:

What if I have Western Union receipts proving that I have received money from SA? Could they examine and question me further than the point of complying with their departure rules? Documents: check. Fine: check. Flight: check. Remorse: check.

 

I just have to hope for the best since I haven't been the best tourist.   

If you produce a Western Union receipt make sure that it is for a plausible amount and very recently dated.... whatever you do don't dig the hole any deeper.

Good luck.

21 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I think you are a bit over the top with your assumption that immigration would even bother trying to identify the OP on departure. Do you really think immigration has that much spare time or interest to do that.

The max fine is 20,000 baht for overstay so how would the 3rd degree raise the fine.

Do you really think immigration has that much spare time or interest to do that?.  ..... Yes - How many IOs are there?  It only takes one to pick this discussion up and notify the senior IO at BKK, who then just need to put a notice up on the 'fine counter' to look out for a 7 month overstay travelling on KQ861and question them about illegal working.

The max fine is 20,000 baht for overstay so how would the 3rd degree raise the fine.  Agreed the maximum fine for overstay is 20K, but what is the fine for working illegally which could be imposed additionally?

6 minutes ago, BritTim said:

I know immigration does sometimes browse this board. Also, I agree that further discussion of illegal working should best be avoided. Better just to say"getting the extra funds I need is now under control". That said, I cannot see immigration going to any great lengths to identify the OP and give her the third degree when she leaves through the airport.

It only takes one IO to even casually look at this forum and pick up on this discussion to start the 'ball rolling' and tip of BKK IO.  It won't be that difficult to identify her during departure.  How many people on a Kenyan Airways flight are going to have 7 month's overstay?   3rd degree = additional fine.

13 hours ago, Aditi Sharma said:

How long can they hold you in there? Good God, it seems you can be in there for as long as 5 years!!! So one is basically an undertrial right? How can The Girl inform the South African embassy when she is sent there - God Forbid. And what can the embassy do to get her out of there?

Sorry I couldnt help relating this to this other story on the forum:  Overstay: Flight booked but not enough money to pay fine.

Do they lock up women separately at the immigration detention centre (IDC)? .... Males and females are kept in separate areas.

How can The Girl inform the South African embassy when she is sent there?  .......  Immigration will automatically notify her Embassy that she is being held at the IDC and the reason for her detention.

What can the embassy do to get her out of there?  ...... Basically nothing.  They will give her a list of lawyers, contact her family to let them know what is happening and ensure that she is detained within the terms of the legal procedures.

6 minutes ago, The Girl said:

Hi. In as much as it is very risky to do so, I have resorted to spending at least 7-8 hours at the language center per day (incl. weekends). I have raised an additional of 2k after pawning some stuff. So I need 8k  by next week. Remember that I had 10k already.

 

Everyone seems to be confused by my story, and rightly so. Basically, I allowed myself to overstay with the hopes  that upon my passport arrival I will exit via land boarder, pay a small fine and then return. When I applied for a new passport, I had 1 month valid visa. When the embassy extended the passport arrival date to 4-6 months (which is the height of my issue) - I still decided to wait hoping it might be sooner than 6 months (most regrettable mistake ever). Right there and then, I should have just left Thailand immediately as I was already aware of the ETD - but they need a confirmed flight ticket to issue an ETD.  Now low on cash, I started fundraising from family and friend. This is why it took long for me to leave. I couldn't obtain an ETD without a flight ticket.  Now that I have a flight ticket and an ETD - I can't leave without 20k fine. 

 

Also, my embassy is NOT to be blamed for this, I am. Rules are subject to change without notice. My fault was waiting for the passport AFTER I was notified that it will no longer take 2 months but 6 months. I still waited because of flight bookings an ETD. Now I am in mess that could have been avoided much earlier. I hope others learn to leave asap because "Hope deferred makes the heart sick" 

Many thanks for clarifying your situation and admitting that it was your own fault.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, you've openly informed the world (including any Thai immigration officials who may be monitoring this forum) that you have overstayed by 7 months and will be travelling out of BKK on Kenyan Airways in the next week or so.  So given that information, and the fact that there is only one Kenyan Airways flight per day,  it is not going to be very difficult to identify you as you attempt to clear immigration at BKK.  I previously advised that you not make further comments regarding work.

Given the fact that you have also now admitted to the world that you are working (assumable without a work permit) to raise the funds for your fine, it is possible that the IO's at BKK may start asking questions regarding your finances during that past 7 months and they may well hit you with additional problems, namely illegal working and additional fines.

All I can say is that I wish you the very best and hope that you do get back to SA without further problems.

6 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

A Kenya Airways economy class flight on October 1 , 2017 from BKK to NBO costs 35, 918 Bahts. So then...

I suspect that because of the OP's limited financial situation, she purchased the cheapest economy fare available.  Unfortunately such fares carry a very heavy penalty for cancelation/no-show prior to departure... in some cases it can be as much as 50% of the original fare.  She would need to look very carefully at the airlines T&C of booking before making any such decision. 

3 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

What are the chances that they will waive off the part of the fine she wont be able to pay on the strength of the ETD and the ticket to Kenya?

On a scale of 1 to 10.... where1 is little chance and 10 is every chance.... I would suspect ZERO chance that immigration will waive all or part of the fine.   Common sense would indicate that if they did it would open the floodgates for everyone to claim that they only have 100Baht when departing and confronted with a overstay fine.

10 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

I think OP's country's mission have a lot to answer for. They have got to help her in this. No country should allow its citizens to be exposed to prosecution for no apparent fault of their own . The Thais have their rules and we ought to respect them even if it extends to being arrested questioned and jail time but foreign missions have a role to play in bailing their citizens out. I think OP should petition her embassy for financial assistance. Surety can be obtained from her relatives back home. 

I think that you need to go back and read what the OP said in her previous posts.  She indicated that there was a miscommunication between her and the Embassy ..... but she also accepts that the 7 month overstay was her own fault.   IN posy No. 96 she states:  "The issue spiraled out of control and before I knew it's 7 months. The calender is an enemy of an overstayer. My fault for treating it with no sense of urgency. My fault. Period".

I am fairly sure that when she reported the loss of her passport to the Embassy they would have automatically suggested an ETD to enable her to get back home, but no doubt her focus was on replacing her passport.

Regarding her Embassy assisting her.... Like all Embassies and Consulates around the world they only offer very limited assistance in cases like the OP.  Yes, as a last resort they sometimes are able to assist financially, but the OP would need to have a reasonable credit history back in SA and have guarantors that will pay back if she defaults.

5 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Correct.  If the ETD cannot be used to enter another country (in some cases they can) - as in, "stamp in and stay" - then my suggestion cannot help. 

 

Ok - I read back a few pages but missed that. 

FYI - It very much depends upon the Embassy (country) issuing the ETD.... Normally the ETD specifies the country of departure, country of destination and if applicable any countries of transit (maximum 5).   So if someone was stranded in Spain for example and returning to UK by train their ETD would specify transit via France and possible Belgium.

In the case of the OP she will depart BKK and transit in NBO for onward flight to SA.

1 minute ago, Aditi Sharma said:

Well transiting is what she needs to do now before getting back home and dry and as she promised getting the proper visa and return ticket. 

Transiting = getting off one flight, remaining airside at the airport, and then departing on another flight - not entering the country.  The OP will do this when she flies from BKK to NBO where she will transit onto a flight to SA.

9 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Just 2 questions to the OP:
1. Is your existing flight refundable in whole or part?
2. Is it permissible to use your ETD to travel anywhere other than to your home-country?

If yes to both, consider refunding the expensive ticket, taking a cheap flight to Cambodia or Vietnam, and using the remaining money from the ticket-refund and cash you have to pay Immigration. 

Better teaching gigs are available in both Cambodia and Vietnam, and it is easier stay legal doing so, and stay in general, than it is in Thailand.

JT... good suggestion, but...... most ETD are only valid to enable the person to travel back to their home country.... it is very unlikely that another country will allow entry on an ETD other than transiting.

OP... Please be cautious what you say on an open forum, especially regarding working without a work permit given the problems that you already face concerning your overstay.

You have already informed the world that you have overstayed by 7 months and that you have a ticket booked on Kenyan Airways in a couple of weeks time.

As there is only one flight per day departing BKK at 01:30am, you could be tipping immigration off of your pending departure and they could start asking additional questions regarding your finances during your overstay etc.

Good luck with sorting things out.

5 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

The new TM7 form says it in english.

Wow... another enhancement... now in Thai & English... wonders will never cease.

I agree with lopburi3... 4x6cm is the photo size (shown in Thai) on the back page of the TM7.  It is best to get an up-to-date photo as my local IO sometimes check your previous application.

2 hours ago, Mattd said:

Not really on topic, however, this subject of APIS or APPS (as the Thai's call it) raises an interesting thought, if a person, such as the OP, purchases a non-refundable ticket in good faith with an airline and boarding is subsequently denied due to the country of destination sending the 'do not board' message to the airline, then would you be able to legitimately claim a refund, as it is entirely feasible that you may not know that you are not allowed to enter the destination country, or, as it appears to be in the case of the OP, it is a mistake.

Seems to me the system is inherently flawed in someways, the refusal should come at the time of booking and the booking then refused, unless the reason for denial happens after booking the ticket.

An interesting point.... But I would wager that buried in the small print of the airlines terms & conditions of carriage there will be a clause that says they are not responsible for a passenger being denied travel by an official government agency.  I suspect the same will apply to travel insurance.

FYI .... Although many airlines collect the passenger information at the time of booking, most send it in 'bulk' via APIS to the port of arrival approximately 24 hours before departure, so they would not would not be able to 'block' a booking.  Only last minute bookings are sent individually within the 24 hour period up to 1 hour before boarding. 

3 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

I think this post is correct as to why he did not have a problem before.

New passport number was used the first time for APIS. Now old and new numbers are linked.

I suggested earlier that he have is old passport with him the next time he travels to show if there is a problem.

Joe .... FYI .... when a passport number is passed to the Thai Immigration via APIS, the immigration system will do it's normal checks.  If the passport number is known the immigration system checks to see if there is anything untoward or not and then sends back the appropriate code to board/not to board.  If the passport number is not known the immigration system then cross checks against other data e.g. Country Code; Gender; Date of Birth; Family & First names.  If there is no match the immigration system records the new information.  If there is a match with an old passport number then the immigration system links the two numbers together and sends back a corresponding code to accept or deny travel.

In the OP's case, when he travelled in May the APIS was not operational for TG so TG would not have been made aware that there  may be a problem regarding his immigration status.  The system became active in June, hence when he tried to travel in September TG would have sent his details to the Thai Authorities via the APIS (which would have linked his old & new passport numbers together) and TG would have received a feedback code back indicating deny boarding.

FYI ..... APIS not only send passenger information to the immigration system, but also customs and various security agencies, any of whom could put a block on a person travelling.