oldcpu

Keep that up ... and I will ask moderators delete this entire thread (not that they will listen to me) but that is simply uncalled for.

Who is stating that? Again - fabricating the views of others. Another sign of a lost argument. I type a long post detailing some of what changed and some of what didn't. Again - I ask you. Are you just arguing for the sake of arguing? Or are you interested in learning the actual situation re: taxation?

What was done in the past illustrates Thai RD policy. And if nothing has changed in a certain area, then nothing has changed. I wrote a lot of text to show you where nothing has changed in the aspect of DTAs being exempt income and hence not to be considered assessable. That has not changed in regards to the income remitted in the year of earning.

Wow. You really did misunderstand that video. And again - you resort to insults. You have lost the discussion.

Yes ... but being subject to... does not mean assessable. It means it is subject to consideration for assessability. You are reading things into these documents that are not there.

No. he doesn't. Neither does POR-162. Did you read por-162?

Let me try to explain to you. In the past any foreign income remitted to Thailand, was clearly taxable in Thailand if the income was remitted in the year of earning. OK ? Further, in some cases, remitted income to Thailand was not taxable due to DTAs. OK? Have I lost you? Now the practice of many people was to NOT remit income into Thailand in the year in which it earned, but wait a year (keep as savings for one year) and only then bring into Thailand. That way a case could be made that the income was not taxable. Por.161/162 closed that loop hole. It is written to ensure that any income earned AFTER 1-Jan-2024 is potentially taxable, no matter when it is brought into Thailand. But that did not under any circumstances change the enforceable FACT (by Thai RD) that if one brought income into Thailand (before 1-Jan-2024), where the income was brought into Thailand in the year in which it was earned, that said income needed to be considered if assessable and hence put on a Thai tax form if assessable. That has NOT CHANGED. Current year income (as assessed at that time) remitted into Thailand in the year of earning, was in the past and actually still is, potentially taxable by Thailand. NOTHING has changed there. So in the past, (say year 2021 tax year for example) if one brought foreign pension into Thailand (that was not taxable by Thailand due to a DTA ,ie it was exempt for the Thai tax calculation) and if one mistakenly tried to place such income on their tax return form (for year 2021 for example) there was no place for such tax exempt income in an exemption field on the year 2021 Thai tax form. Ok? That was true in 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023 and 2024 (Thai language form thus far). So that begs the question, given such was potentially taxable (as brought into Thailand in the year of earning) why was there no place in those tax year tax forms. Again , the same is true today (look at year 2024 Thai language tax form). Why is this? It is because such foreign exempt remitted income is not to be treated as assessable income. And if not treated as assessable income, it does not factor into the calculation if an income tax return is required. OK? Por. 161/162 did not change that. OK ? It did not. Rather it expanded on what was already in place ! So your stating "It does not matter a jot what is on previous tax forms prior to tax year 2024. " is simply wrong in an area where nothing has changed. Are you really trying to find the truth here (to help you with properly addressing your tax obligations) or are you just arguing for the sake of arguing?

If you understood por.161/162 you would not have typed: Tax forms cover a lot , and you just claimed it doesn't matter a jot as to what is on the past ones. incredible. Trying stating EXACTLY that to an RD official and see what their response is.

Did you re-read the documents? if you did ... then you should understand.

Did you forget what you typed? Let me remind you: So who are these people who are going to tell me that income specified as being under exclusive taxing rights was not assessable income? No one on this forum other than you seems to be arguing that. I pointed out an RD official noted exempt income is not included in assessable. When you claimed DTAs don't mention exempt income I pointed out RD-18 stated such was exempt. Anyway - when you FINALLY get around to putting your non-assesable UK income (where you claim it is not taxable in Thailand due to DTA) on a Thai tax form for year 2024 tax year, let us know where it was exempted in the tax form. I suspect you have many curious.

I don't think you read and fully understand what was in por.161.162, based on that comment. Serious. You need to reread those and think about what you typed.

So far , the "people" is only you. So you think the Thai RD made a mistake there? Wow. You disagree with the Thai RD approach of the past? Ok? Is that really the case? if so - well I rest my case. You can go argue with the Thai RD on that.

Thats the crux of the different views. Note again - exempt income (as identified via Royal Decree-18) has not been in an exemption list on a Thai tax form going back to 2017 that i could check, and likely going back LONGER than that. Most likely going back to when Royal Decree-18 issued. Over and over again, you refuse to accept that. Have you even taken the time to look at those tax forms to confirm what I stated? You should take that up with the Thai Revenue department then, that you wish to ignore Royal Decrees. Let me know what they say back to you. I understand that perfectly. If assessable income meets the threashold of a Thai tax resident (including foreigners) then an income tax return is required. You are simply fabricating views of others because you have lost the discussion. No - we disagree further. You fabricate aspects of my view (I just gave you an example above). We disagree there. You post irrelevant videos as to the assessblity definition discussion , and you claim such substantiates your view.They don't. You ignore 2017 to 2023 tax return forms (which have no entry place for exempt foreign remitted income to be recorded as exempt) because you think ?? I don't know what you think there. Do you think the RD made a mistake in the past in those forms? Despite Thai language tax forms nominally being close to English language, and despite the 2024 (and 2025, I might add) Thai language tax forms having no entry locations for exempt foreign income to be listed as exempt, you still cling to a belief that the year 2024 tax form will have such. We have a number of disagreements in the details.

Thats wrong. I am surprised you typed that. Foreign remitted income (covered by DTAs) has always been potentially subject to taxation if remitted in the year of earning, long before por.161/162. Yet there has never been a place to include remitted foreign income (not taxable due to a DTA) as an exemption on a Thai tax form. This all pre-dates 1-Jan-2024. I recommend you take a step back and think a bit more about you incorrectly typed.

Royal decrees? using words 'exempt' - nope - you ignore such DTA as referenced by Royal decree? nope - you ignore such

I don't know why you use that as a reference. It fails to support your view in the detailed "assessability" aspect we are discussion. As Mr.Hart states, it depends on the underlying fundamentals. I fully agree with that. I am beginning to think you do not. I pointed out the fundamentals to you re: Tax Code, Royal Decree-18 (and appropriate DTA words), and Royal Decree-743. Are you just picking out videos of the thin air hoping it supports your untenable position? Because that what it looks like. Further I pointed out to you in the latest video where the RD representative stated in Thai language that there are exemptions to assessable income (where that very important tidbit was NOT translated by the translator). You need to do better if you wish to point to videos that do not support what i noted. Instead those videos support what I posted. When you resort to such statements ? It means you lost the argument. OK? Yes - in that tax section it notes 'exempt income' is 'exempt for taxation calculation purposes'. OK? Important words. Exemption is not limited to those 29-types. Do you disagree with Royal Decrees? Do you disagree with Ministerial instructions? If you disagree with those documents, then you should take such up with the Thai Revenue department. Have you forgotten ?? - < sigh > once again, the references I have been posting to you, over and over, are: Royal Decree-18 (labeling non-taxable income as Exempt despite your ignoring such), and relevant sections in some DTAs (those that note income source country can exclusively (or only) tax a pension , and Royal Decree-743 (labeling selected LTR visa holders income as tax exempt), and 2017 to 2024 Thai tax forms - I pointed out tax forms (both English language and Thai language) going back to year 2017 (I did not know where to find those prior to year 2017 to check) have no place for exempt DTA income to be listed as an exemption. OK ? Why do you think? Well I will tell you. Because if exempt in the noted above cases, it is not to be considered as assessable. And if it is not to be considered assessable it doesn't belong in the calculation for whether a tax return is required. Well - as I stated before... best wishes to you in placing your not-assessable income on a 2024 tax submission (using perhaps a 2023 form if 2024 not available), where there will be no place to deduct such income in an exemption section. I think many of us are curious as to how that will work out for you. i do urge others thou, do not follow Cyclists approach. If his paranoia has you worried, then I provided above in an earlier approach a suggestion to go to your local Thai RD, bring Thai language copies of your relevant DTA (with relevant income section highlighted) and bring copy (Thal language) of Royal Decree-18. There are 61 different DTAs with Thailand. Don't force your local RD to dig though them while you have no clue as to what they are looking at (unless you are a fluent Thai speaker/reader). Rather go prepared with relevant section highlighted in advance. Good luck in your efforts.

Because I am afraid others, who do not have the time to research this, and who share his paranoia, will blindly follow them, and it could cost them both time and money. That would be a shame. I think he honestly believes his approach - despite being show where its not valid.

I never stated it did not. You do understand that you are inaccurate. right? The Royal Decree-18 states that if such is not taxable it is exempt. How many times must I post that (Royal Decree-18 noting non-taxable income in a DTA is tax exempt) for you understand. Exempt. Exempt. Exempt. OK? Exempt. And then as i pointed out, the RD official noted there is exempt income associated with defining assessable income. You remember that. Right? I even pointed the precise spot in the video for you. Did you not check that out? I agree a DTA (dependent on income and DTA wording) may exempt a Thai resident from paying tax on those income sources, but i don't agree with your interpretation to include such as assessable income (when I have shown its not to be included as assessable income, ... shown in practice going back years in terms of how Thailand RD implements this, and also shown by providing you the appropriate references why). It does exempt one if such means exempt from the Thai tax calculation, which means not to go in the tax tax return form. now ... Don't get me wrong. I hope this works out for you, despite my believing your approach/interpetation is wrong. It may cost you money. And if others follow your approach it may cost them money. Where legally they should not be paying any money. That is your choice and their choice. I am most curious to learn how you manage to list your non-assessable income (due to Royal Decree/DTA) as being exempt in a Thailand tax form , where you insist you need to file such a tax form, despite there being no place to list the income as exempt. I remind you again, DTAs and Royal Decree-18 have been around for a very very long time. ok? A long time. Where there has always been a requirement in Thailand to file income tax returns if money (pensions) remitted into Thailand in the year such earned. Ok ? And despite that, with many years of tax return forms, there has never been a place to list DTA/Royal-Decree exempt income as being exempt. Lets all hope that your wish that the 2024 tax form in English language (unlike the Thai language 2024 tax form) has a field to list as an exemption your income. I, for one, would not bet on that.

Canada asked for such from me in a couple of trading accounts. And years back when opening accounts in Canada I had to provide such (and sign some forms).

i thought of that. But the problem i see is if one's income is exempt Thai tax income (per DTAs and Royal Decree-18) where can one list the declared exempt income in an exemption list? There is no place for such. Believe me. I looked. [The reply was for Cyclist who appears determined to list his exempt income (exempt per the DTA) in a Thai tax return form).

They not only want that, they want you to sign a very specific form with that information. Don't forget - banks have a massive bureaucracy behind them , and bureaucracies love paperwork.

That's why i put a 'question mark' at the end of that sentence as I was not certain. I had though you stated somewhere por.161/162 covered your 2024 income, but likely I have you confused with someone else. Regardless, if you take the time to check, you will discover there is not always a lot of difference between Thai language Thai tax return forms and English language Thai tax return forms. The Thai language year 2024 tax return forms have been out for a long time. If you do still believe you meet the assessable remitted income requirement needing you to file a Thai tax return for the 2024 tax year, you may wish to start giving some thought now as to what you will do if it ends up being only a handful of days away before the tax return submission due date, with no English language year 2024 Thai tax forms. I hope for those in your situation it does not come down to that, but it might, so its best to have a backup plan. As I posted previous, if it were me, if no English language Thai tax return, in the few days prior to the tax return submission due date, and IF I had remitted assessable income to Thailand, I would show up at the local Thai RD office, with (in addition to passport, residence information ... ) : * all one's pertinent financial records showing remitted income * proof (best possible) showing source of the remitted income * copy (in Thai !! language ) of Double Tax Agreement with source country of one's income - WITH the relevant section HIGHLIGHTED that states one's 'civil service or military' pension can only be taxed in the source country (which is NOT Thailand), * copy (in Thai !! language ) of por.161.162 in case of any remitted any pre-1-Jan-2024 savings (together with all relevant bank statements as of 31-Dec-2023 proving the money was credibly savings from before 1-Jan-2024) * copy (in Thai i!! language ) of Royal Decree-18 (to prove income not to be taxed by Thailand in a DTA is considered exempt income). In your case, given the English language 2024 Thai tax return form is likely to be similar to the English language 2017 to 2023 tax return forms, or like the CURRENT Thai language 2024 Thai tax return form (with no location for the DTA exempt income to be listed as exempt), I suspect the RD officials will either (1) conclude you not owe any tax and that they will tell you a tax return is not needed, or (2) put in your exempt income in the tax form, not deduct the income and try to double tax you on it, much to your chagrin and annoyance, or (3) pull their hair out at there being no place to place your exempt (via DTA) remitted foreign income as being exempt, and thus phone Bangkok begging for help, or (4) place the exempt income deduction in the wrong place of the tax return, claim you owe no money and then a few months later call you back on the phone and note your income tax return (that they helped fill out) failed a quality check, and you need to come into their office to sort the mess they created with you (else you may owe money). Good luck.

lol ... Thats a joke, right? I think think Banks are required to report certain deposit amounts to the Thai Revenue Department. The RD can then decide if they wish to do something. Its best everyone follow Thai tax law. If the RD is suspicious (based on Thai bank information they are provided), they can call an audit, ask about tax returns if any or if none, .. and compare the information they have received from Thai banks, with the records the foreigner can produce. Its not rocket science, and it may not be perfect, but having an audit could be a major PIA. Its best IMHO to follow Thai tax law.

I believe there are CRS requirements that banks (Financial Institutions) have to provide ID information on their clients to CRS. I may have details slightly incorrect , but I think this includes tax-ID and passport information. And at some < I don't know exactly > intervals provide limited information on bank account sum amount to CRS on same individuals to CRS. However NOT ALL bank accounts need information be provided - for example an individual's government regulated account information need not be provided to CRS (which for Canadian's means registered retirement funds such as RRSPs, RRIFS, ... plus some other Canadian registered (with government) savings funds). There is some sort of account reporting exemption for Thais also. This is ultimately to detect tax evasion, but such information in itself probably does not help all that much. Only if put together with other countries information might CRS start to get a picture. There is massive exaggeration by some on this forum, claiming CRS over reach which doesn't exist. But I believe you know that. If one is legal there is no worry here.

I suspect that was for different reasons.