oldcpu

Reference tips .. Timing to apply for the LTR for Income Proof: Depending on your LTR visa type, you may need to prove a certain level of annual income, and to do that, the Thai BoI (who provide the financial approval part for the LTR ) may ask for tax returns from the source country of your income, to prove an an annual income. In the case of the LTR-WP visa, you may be able to get around that with appropriate paper work showing a pension, but that may take a few iterations to get BoI to approve. If you go the route proving income via foreign income tax assessments, then timing could come into play. In Jan-2023 i applied for an LTR-WP visa, and I provided year 2020 and 2021 tax returns. That was not good enough for BoI. They wanted my 2022 returns, where I could not realistically obtain that until the ~March-2023 or April-2023 time frame. That added extra time for me to get the LTR-WP. In hindsight, if i wanted a quicker approval, I should have applied for the LTR-WP in May-2023, after having received an April-2023 tax assessment (for a year 2022 return) from the source country of my income. Health Insurance: Also for health insurance, i went the $100k US$ equivalent cash in a bank account to self insure (as I did not believe BoI would accept my Cigna International/Global health insurance). As it turned out, BoI would NOT accept $100k cash in any sort of account where one could trade equities. It had to be in a proper bank account in cash. I went through a few needless iterations with BoI until i no longer stubbornly refused but reluctantly accepted i had to show the cash in an actual bank account. As it turns out thou, my approach was not the best reference self health insurance. i subsequently learned from a forum member, who was kind enough to share, that i could have instead obtained a custom letter from Cigna International for health insurance, that would have the detail in the letter to show Cigna insurance met the requirements to BoI's satisfaction. So in 2028 when i re-prove my finances, I plan to switch to using my Cigna health insurance with such a 'custom' letter that meets the Boi requirements. Phone - don't email IMHO: Also, i found if one has questions, simply pick up the phone and call BoI. They have staff who speak English. I found the email query route rarely worked. Plan on the worst for timing to get the LTR: I recommend you plan for the worst length of time needed to get the LTR. I took a conservative approach. I renewed my Type-O non-immigrant visa permission to stay in Dec-2022, and in January-2023 I applied for the LTR-WP visa. I did not actually get my LTR visa until June-2023 ! ... That was MUCH longer than most, but given my permission to stay in Thailand was good until Dec-2023, I felt no time pressure. Something for you to keep in mind.

Typically the federal government bonds are safer than ANY bank in a country. So if your choice is between keeping your money in a Thai bank account in cash, or keeping your money in Thai Government Bonds, where immediate liquidity is not an issue, then federal government bonds are almost always safer than any bank. I am NOT saying to keep one's money in cash. Further, interest on bonds (any bonds that do not have horrendous risk) is relatively pathetic compared to a decent stock portfolio and bond interest pathetic compared to a basic ETF that mostly tracks a market such as S&P-500. However i have read recommendations that one nominally should have some money in bonds as part of one's portfolio. i am not saying that is a good recommendation, i just note something that some say is a good strategy as part of overall diversification. Until recently, I have not owned any bonds for a very long time. My last bond transaction (until a Dec-2022 Thai government bond purchase - and other than some crazy but successful speculation on Irish and Greek bonds) was somewhere around 1980, when i sold the last of my Canadian Savings bonds. But back in 2022 in Thailand i purchased 2-million THB in Thai government bond ( equal to ~ $62,000 USD) which have a 7 year term . This was so to contribute to my meeting the $250K US$ investment in Thailand for an LTR-WP (ie the criteria that goes along with a $40K US$ passive income). I do not plan to replace these bonds when they mature. Instead, when I reprove my achieving the LTR-WP visa financial requirements in 2028, more "pension" style funds coming my way, will have long before kicked in, pushing me over the $80 K US$ yearly passive income, so having to prove a Thailand investment no longer be needed.. If you do buy the bonds, you could try to get a bond certificate (which is what BoI wanted and insisted for the longest time from me), but like myself, you may find that getting a bond certificate is next to impossible. In the end, to get BoI to accept my 2-million THB in Thai government bonds, I ended up getting Bangkok Bank to write a one page later noting indeed I was the owner of the bonds, and further they inserted additional entries into the last page of the bond book, providing the specification of the bonds. Only then, with no bond certificate, did the BoI accept the 2-million THB in Thai government bonds I owned, would contribute to my investment in Thailand. Also - the Bangkok bank branch where i bought the Thai government bonds, insisted that i have a yellowbook and a Thai pink ID. i suspect that is policy of only that particular Bangkok Bank branch, but i do not know if that is for certain.

I suspect it depends on the individual and their personal financial situation. Not all of us are the same in this regard. Like most (I suspect) I keep most of my money outside of Thailand. Having typed that, I used to have five accounts with Bangkok Bank (now I am down to only four). I used to have with Bangkok Bank (1) regular THB account (2) fixed THB account (I used to keep my 800k THB in this account for a Type-O/OA visa support ( but I have since closed this account )) , (3) US$ Foreign currency account, (4) Canadian $ Foreign currency account (5) Euro account. I suppose if one considers the Bangkok Bank credit card guarantee account that could be #6 with Bangkok bank .. ... And I have other accounts as well with other banks (SCB, Krungsri). Why? I diversify. Never all one's eggs in one basket. Especially IMHO with banks. Obviously that is an absolutely silly strategy for many - but again, it really depends on one's own finances. Our financial situations can be very different.

My view? Not true. You will be lucky to get 3% per year from this unknown Thai Mutual fund (?) ... and likely IMHO less. 10% ?? I have swamp land in Florida in the middle of nowhere that i can also sell you. It gives 11%. lol ! But if it is a mutual fund, there is a good possibility that either (1) any interest from the fund is taxed via a withholding tax before you are credited the interest or (2) any interest is then subsequently taxed via a withholding tax. This (being taxed) is not as bad as it sounds, as per Thai tax law that means your Thai tax obligations on that interest (if withholding tax already applied) is basically met, and it need not be counted toward your assessable income in terms of calculating if a Thai tax return is required. At least that is the conclusion I came thru after digging thru Thai tax law (translations of such). I don't want to spam the forum, but i am happy to share my research on this taxation specific assessment of mine ( in regards to Thai derived interest ) with any who ask.

That would fit in with my experience, with the exception in 2016, when I opened my account Visa Exempt, I was requested to show up at the bank as soon as I had a Long Term visa so that they could update their records. ... It reads like my branch in Phuket Town might have been the only branch then (and maybe only just me ?? ) asking that be done. I do recall, back in 2016, i visited many banks in Phuket town (SCB, UOB, K-Bank, Krungsri) trying to open a bank account Visa Exempt (so to purchase a foreign freehold condo ... as I wanted money in Thailand prior to the purchase due to T&C of the purchase offer), and only Bangkok Bank then in 2016, let me open the account. Bangkok Bank in Phuket town, of course back then in 2016 required a Certificate of Residence page (with my image on it) from Phuket immigration. Plus passport info. My Thai wife was with me, which helped a LOT in the translation of Thai/English. Later, a few years later, in the year 2019 timeframe, when I obtained a Yellow Book , the Bangkok Bank branch was happy to accept the Yellow Book instead of an Immigration certificate (with my pink-ID) when they updated my Bank Records (and also accepted my new, at that time in 2019, Type-OA visa in my Passport). Because I opened multiple accounts in Bangkok Bank at different times in that first half of 2019 (3 different foreign currencies, a fixed account for 800k THB, and a nominal separate account in THB for all my expenditures) i ended up visiting that Bangkok Bank branch multiple times. I confess, i was disorganized so I needed a trip each time, due to my own lack of planning. Each time I offered up my passport, pointed to my current visa & permission to stay and even offered up my yellow book, which they took, copied and I think entered something into their computer). They were always very polite, and I recall on one occasion, my wife and I brought their staff a big box of chocolates to share (which they devoured quickly among all the staff before it melted). ... anyway ... i diverge. I do have a suspicion, if one's records were in order, and IF the Bank entered such correctly into their system, and if the branch employees remember the person, that one should hopefully not be at risk of having accounts frozen which is what I have read on this thread happened to some forum users, with Bangkok Bank accounts. But who knows ... This is Thailand, and tomorrow the same could happen to me.

As noted I opened my Bangkok Bank account back in 2016 visa exempt. I used it then to help transfer my money to buy a somewhat pricy luxury condo. I haven't put as much money in since, but some might consider the account(s) in Thai and foreign amounts significant. I have tried to keep the bank updated with my Visa changes and passport renewal over the years. When I do visit the bank a few of the staff always remember me. I wonder if that ( being remembered) is part of the reason why I have not been forced to endure ( as of yet) this account freeze that others have endured.

Out of curiousity, where is your BKK Bank branch?

I keep the vast % of my money outside of Thailand in a mix of banks and equity trading accounts. In Thailand I have multiple accounts with Bangkok bank, Krungsri, and SCB in Thai baht and foreign currencies so to be able to live off any one bank's accounts for a short while in event others not accessible. I try hard not to put all my eggs in one basket. This approach works for me but not everyone has the luxury of my situation. I believe the optimal approach to adopt very much depends on each person's financial situation. The accounts I have frozen were my Canadian accounts ( for my being a non resident to Canada) and the Canadian financial institution not having a Thai TIN from me.

A large percentage of the time, i scan a payment using Bangkok Bank or Krungsri mobile phone app (on my mobile phone) to pay a bill. And yes, I too have a wise digital card. However after encountering multiple instances when trying to use a digital card on my phone (which as i note I have) caused confusion, I found a digital card caused far more issues with the seller than it was worth my time to sort , and it became blatantly obvious a single easy to carry physical credit card made it a lot easier, and i mean a LOT easier, and hence it made more sense. IMHO YMMV.

Indeed. I suspect part may be language barrier. When I opened my account visa exempt, in 2016 !! Bangkok Bank staff made it clear at that time, that i had to update my account details as soon as I obtained a proper visa, and then each time visa changed and/or passport changed, show up at the Bank for them to update their records. I had my Thai wife with me to translate. Recently that has been updated even more re: phone numbers are now required to be verified. i dare say most with Bangkok Bank accounts don't know this (timely updates of one's passport, visa are required as Bank policy in many branches), and that their local bank branches have not made any effort to implement that policy. .

Why carry a wallet full of cards around? I decide in the morning which cards I need (typically only one card). FAR FAR lighter than a phone. .

i tried that during the COVID years. The app refused to let me send the card to Thailand. (maybe card didn't want to catch anything ... lol !! ).

That being the case, then from a tax perspective, not having the money transferred direct to Thailand has no obvious tax relevancy (other than maybe avoiding having to file a Thai tax return - albeit that also may not be relevant). Perhaps it just boils down to one gets better interest in UK banks, and also to a view that UK banks are more secure than Thai banks. That is my view with regards to my Canadian pensions which are only taxable in Canada.

I have a number of different personal accounts with Bangkok Bank, most opened in 2016 timeframe (and with a lot of money transferred to Thailand around that time-frame). Recently (in mid-July this year) I transferred 30k-euro from a Bangkok Bank foreign currency account to a SCB foreign currency account. I ran into the signature matching " shenanigans (?) " where the local Bangkok Bank branch advised the Bangkok HQ branch (which had to approve the transfer) did not like how I signed my signature (and hence local branch could not proceed with the transfer of 30K-euros). I ended signing and resigning 1/2 dozen times, until my signature almost precisely matched the one I originally signed back in 2016. ... We are talking VERY VERY VERY minor differences here. So yes - Bangkok Bank can be fussy at times, to the point of annoyance. OK - its a bit off topic, but i think it relevant to the Redit post that you noted.

I don't receive a UK pension of any sort. Rather I receive pension from Canada and from Europe. The Canadian pension is not relevant to your post, but the European pension may be. My European pension consists of part from an European government organisation and part from a German pension (not a civil nor a military service German pension). The European government organisation is only taxable per the law of the country where I reside. The German pension (per the Thai-German DTA) is only taxable by Thailand. In both cases (European government/German pension) the funds are only taxable by Thailand if remitted to Thailand. So if I leave both amounts outside of Thailand, they are not taxed (since I am a Thai tax resident). I try to travel internationally 2 to 3 months per year (sometimes 4 months) and when I do, I pay for my expenses of expenditures outside of Thailand, with funds that are outside of Thailand. I am not sure, but if UK private pensions are not taxable in UK, but only in Thailand, then some may NOT wish to bring the money into Thailand where it may be taxed by Thailand. It 'may' , for some, be better to leave that money outside of Thailand, such that neither the UK nor Thailand, legally per the UK tax law, per the Thai tax law, and per the UK-Thai tax agreement, tax such. Hence for private pensions, it may not make sense to have such immediately deposited into a Thai bank as it may then become taxable. Rather only transfer it (and risk being taxed) when it makes sense/becomes necessary per one's lifestyle. I am speculating here. ... Speculating... but that would be my consideration here, if I have the DTA and tax law aspects correct (and I may have such wrong).

No. It was not. Clearly you missed the discussions - else you would not be posting that. Anyway, its mostly not relevant until such appears in the Royal Gazette. Something to watch but will it happen? One can speculate about such Government wishes ad infinitum.

It works when my phone is dead or forgotten.

What means clarity and whose clarity? I believe the saying This Is Thailand applies here. BoI (Board of Investment) for Thailand are clear - no Thai tax on remitted income for some LTR categories. ie Exempt from Thai tax on remitted foreign income are Wealthy Global Citizens, Wealthy Pensioners and Work-from-Thailand Professionals (while the Highly-Skilled Professionals category pay 17% Thai tax on remitted foreign income (if not protected by a DTA)). However ... in practice ... in Thailand ... the 'devil can be in the details' ... or in how this is (or is not) applied. One of the users on this forum, noted they called a Thai Revenue Department help line and asked that very question about LTR visa being exempt from Thai tax and the Thai tax calculation. My recollection, after a bit of waiting (while the Thai Revenue Department person answering the help line went to check) they subsequently received a verbal answer that there was no Thai tax on the noted selected LTR visa holders remitted foreign income to Thailand. Now - having typed that, an official at a local RD office where I live, never heard of the LTR visa. Further, a user JackGats, on this forum, who has an LTR visa, reported on this thread he ended up having his remitted income in 'essence taxed'. If I understand his post correctly, at a local RD office (when he filed a tax return) the local RD official used JackGat's foreign remitted income to Thailand, to cancel out his request to have a refund of the withholding tax on his interest from a Thai bank. ... Which in essence means he was taxed equal to the withholding tax refund he had coming to him. My understanding this was from a LOCAL RD office (and not the main RD office in Bangkok). My view is each local RD office quite possibly goes their own way here. What is encouraging thou, is the main RD office in Bangkok, have been clear no Thai tax on remitted income for selected LTR visa holders. ... Its just some local RD offices either do not know of the LTR visa, or they see the tax situation differently (than the main Bangkok RD office). As I noted, This is Thailand. That can often mean 100% clarity is an elusive thing.

There have been other posts about senior officials in the RD saying things that never came to pass. I believe that was mostly pushed by 1 or maybe 2 rather prolific posters - who insisted it would happen. They were adamant it would be necessary, and one even paid an agent to get them a totally unnecessary tax clearance certificate. I think many disagreed with these users. So i myself would not say "in January the word was" unless one happened to believe only 1 or 2 users while most other users who took the time to reply stated otherwise. The only word about tax submission proof for extensions. being stated in January, was from what many of us considered to be 'scare mongers'. It never came to pass (as of yet). I agree wait and see is a good approach if one (like us) has the luxury to do so. .

As I noted, years back (2016) when i opened an account Visa exempt, I was advised by Bangkok Bank staff (a Phuket branch in Phuket town), that as soon as i obtained a Long Term visa (such as Type-O or OA or other) I was to come to the bank ASAP and show them my passport with its visa and permission to stay. And i did this. I find it strange your 'agent' was not advised of such by Bangkok Bank, or maybe the agent failed to recommend such to you even thou they knew ? .... It reads like only now (given Bangkok Bank has a good excuse with government pressure/effort to cut down on mule accounts) that Bangkok Bank is deciding to try to enforce that which was a policy (provide up to date long term passport info) for sometime with some Bangkok Bank branches. Given the agent was involved in this process - can they now dig you out of it? ie send the agent your up to date passport image, with long term visa image, and permission to stay image? ... and see if they can unfreeze such that you need not make the trip? Do your best to give them what the want as soon as you can. Best wishes and Good luck!

Assuming she is innocent, glad to read she is out. Maybe the 'mule' accounts are left open on a temporary basis so to help the authorities track the perpetrators down better?

Yes - and also, Hellfire, can you confirm whether you offered to send an electronic copy (of current Long Term Visa with passport info, visa stamp, and permission to stay stamp) as an interim measure until you could show up in person?

Absolutely true IMHO, albeit with many caveats. If the money transferred AFTER 1-Jan-2024 can be shown to be savings from BEFORE 1-Jan-2024, then even thou remitted to Thailand in future years, the Thai RD ministerial documents POR.161.162 say its not taxable by Thailand (and hence likely not to be included in the Thai tax calculation). Further if such income is excluded Thai taxation under the DTA between Thailand and the source country of the income, then it is not taxable by Thailand and likely need not be included in the Thai tax calculation. Examples here are most foreign civil-servant/military pensions, when the money is remitted to Thailand are not taxable by Thailand. I say 'most' as it really depends on the wording of the DTA between Thailand and the pension income source country. Often foreign state pensions (which are not civil-servant nor military) are taxable in Thailand, but again it depends on the relevant DTA. I say "often" above , but it is not 'always'. For example, the Canada-Thai DTA makes it clear Thailand can not tax any Canadian pensions nor similar Canadian remunerations (ie Canadian OAS, CPP, company pensions, RRIF income, RRSP income are not taxable by Thailand and likely not to be included in the Thai tax calculation). Given there are MANY different DTAs, i find this all a bit confusing to know exactly what applies unless on knows the very specific ins-and-outs of their own situation.

Its something to watch - but its old news and at present, it is likely to be considered a bit speculative. The Thai news (in English language) post many things about taxation possibilities that do not come to pass. As noted, it is something to watch, but don't bet the farm on it happening.

Further to this ... i would ask if there is any witholding tax on dividends of equities held via Interactive Brokers. i read somewhere it is 30% withholding tax held by Interactive Brokers on dividends for non-tax-residents of the USA - but I could be wrong.