Britain could still reverse Brexit, former minister Heseltine says

[nauseus]

30 minutes ago, nanglong218 said:

Nontabury, we joined the EEC in 1973

That's what he said!

 

[nanglong218]

Khun Han, now I appreciate your comment and understand your view regards yellow face expressions. I accept your point. I'm reluctant but I give in. Best regards to you.

[Scott]

Please stay on topic and cease with the personal commentary.   It's off-topic.   

[Khun Han]

11 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Daily Mail and Daily Express dinosaur fans calling out to decent journalism is a real hoot.

 

Did you see the Reuters report on the NIESR forecast (0.4% growth third quarter) before it got buried? I's not even coming up in Google searches now. How strange. Anyway, if you can be bothered to read it beyond the sign-up banner, the report is discussed on this backwater of the 'net:

 

https://www.investing.com/news/economic-indicators/uk-economy-picking-up-rate-hike-possible-in-early-2018-niesr-526838

 

Meanwhile, the beeb chooses as its top politics story some twaddle by a lying, has-been war criminal that Germany will allow the UK control of it's immigration if we remain .

[Khun Han]

11 minutes ago, nanglong218 said:

Khun Han, now I appreciate your comment and understand your view regards yellow face expressions. I accept your point. I'm reluctant but I give in. Best regards to you.

[Jaysisaket]

I have always been of the opinion that two major countries constantly sabotage the EU's evolution: the U.K. and Russia. And if the EU wants to move further these two countries must be broken and transformed into smaller states devoid of empirical ambitions. And what do you know. They seem to have brought this fate upon themselves and seem to be on the right path now.

 

i am looking forward to the time when the EU will be able to accept into its ranks an independent Scotland, the little England and the Wales as separate states. And also possibly a number of smaller states which are left after Russia has broken down.

 

While the opinion of the British people must be respected and their government must give them what they voted for. The whole Brexit thing is heading for a wreck. The U.K. politicians of course are to blame for fooling their own folks into believing that the U.K. will be able to easily cherry pick every best trade deal. The argument was that the U.K. is so important for the EU that it will be the U.K. who will be setting the conditions, in short the U.K. will do whatever it wants and enrich itself at the expense of hundreds of millions of the EU citizens. 

But the reality seems to be quickly catching up. My bet is that the public opinion will not change and the British people would rather become twice or more as poor rather than agree to the EU conditions. The U.K. will leave with no deal. The nation will lose all of its competitive advantages and will gradually see its standards of life and business opportunities inside the country deteriorate. That will be the doom of the U.K. Nobody wants to live with the poor when you have rich neighbors with a lot more opportunities. 

 

 

[pitrevie]

6 hours ago, nontabury said:

The referendum in 1975 was to confirm our application to join a trading block. The 2016 referendum was whether we should remain in a so-called Union.

Wrong,  even at that time the EEC also included the CAP so it was more than just a trading block as you called it. 

[pitrevie]

6 hours ago, nontabury said:

The referendum in 1975 was to confirm our application to join a trading block. The 2016 referendum was whether we should remain in a so-called Union.

This is just some of what we joined in 1973, "Trading Block", hardly

 

The European Economic Community (EEC) was a regional organisation which aimed to bring about economic integration among its member states. It was created by the Treaty of Rome of 1957

The Community's initial aim was to bring about economic integration, including a common market and customs union, among its six founding members: Belgium, France, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands and West Germany. It gained a common set of institutions along with the European Coal and Steel Community (ECSC) and the European Atomic Energy Community (EURATOM) as one of the European Communities under the 1965 Merger Treaty (Treaty of Brussels).

Then we also have the CAP so much for the oft repeated nonsense from Brexiters that we were only joining a Trading Block.

[pitrevie]

Apparently we were never told what EEC membership meant in 1973 and in the referendum in 1975.

A common complaint from those who voted to remain in the EEC in 1975 is that they were hoodwinked

 
Enoch Powell, the maverick right wing Tory who had just become an Ulster Unionist MP, and left wing Labour cabinet minister Tony Benn - the loudest voices in the Out campaign - talked endlessly about it.

In the decisive debate on the European Communities Bill in 1972, Powell explained yet again that the real purpose of the “project” we were being asked to sign up to was to create a political government for Europe; and that our own elected Parliament had no right to subordinate itself in perpetuity to an unelected supranational body, which could impose on us laws not in our national interest.

 

Tony Benn

But we must recognise that the European Community has now set itself the objectives of developing a common foreign policy, a form of common nationality expressed through a common passport, a directly elected assembly and an economic and monetary union.

 

So you would have to be deaf dumb and blind not to have known the direction the EEC was heading in 1975, so please Brexiters no more of this we didn't know nonsense the two most prominent, vocal opponents of the EEC repeated it ad nauseum.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2016/03/29/no-britain-wasnt-lied-to-when-we-joined-the-eu-we-knew-what-we-w/

Edited September 11, 2017 by pitrevie
adding more

[bert bloggs]

Soon we will get to page 100 of this debate , and you know what ?

we will still have voted to leave , so give it a rest boys 

[nanglong218]

Petrivie, your quote is out of context. Bert, if you are bored, go get a beer, a girl, just go away

[bert bloggs]

19 minutes ago, nanglong218 said:

Petrivie, your quote is out of context. Bert, if you are bored, go get a beer, a girl, just go away

Don't want a beer its to early ,my wife doesn't let me have girls and i wont go away , why should i?

[nanglong218]

So hang around, enjoy the debate, even contribute your experience,  c'est la vie

[bert bloggs]

[nanglong218]

Bert, I know I'm a dinosaur but a green face heading a football goes completely "over my head"

I just love the English language and enjoy communicating in it.  Don't worry young folk, I'll be dead soon

[nanglong218]

Petrivie, again I agree, it's not out of context. I've read the whole thing now.  But as a young man at the time, Parliament not televised, the country falling apart, the glowing uplands of Europe beckoned, join us they said, De Gaulle is dead, you will enrich your nation, stabilise it.   What alternative was there,   more of the same chaos.   Don't quote lines from a page to me, you had to be there and feel the shame of a great nation brought low.

[baansgr]

4 hours ago, pitrevie said:

Apparently we were never told what EEC membership meant in 1973 and in the referendum in 1975.

A common complaint from those who voted to remain in the EEC in 1975 is that they were hoodwinked

 
Enoch Powell, the maverick right wing Tory who had just become an Ulster Unionist MP, and left wing Labour cabinet minister Tony Benn - the loudest voices in the Out campaign - talked endlessly about it.

In the decisive debate on the European Communities Bill in 1972, Powell explained yet again that the real purpose of the “project” we were being asked to sign up to was to create a political government for Europe; and that our own elected Parliament had no right to subordinate itself in perpetuity to an unelected supranational body, which could impose on us laws not in our national interest.

 

Tony Benn

But we must recognise that the European Community has now set itself the objectives of developing a common foreign policy, a form of common nationality expressed through a common passport, a directly elected assembly and an economic and monetary union.

 

So you would have to be deaf dumb and blind not to have known the direction the EEC was heading in 1975, so please Brexiters no more of this we didn't know nonsense the two most prominent, vocal opponents of the EEC repeated it ad nauseum.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2016/03/29/no-britain-wasnt-lied-to-when-we-joined-the-eu-we-knew-what-we-w/

And I think we got our first TV in December 1973, I remember it well how many households actually had access to media, especially with the way the media looked at Enoch its unlikely hardly anyone got to know what he was saying.

[chang50]

6 hours ago, pitrevie said:

Wrong,  even at that time the EEC also included the CAP so it was more than just a trading block as you called it. 

This persistent myth of 'just a trading block' gets trotted out time and time again.Goebbels would heartily approve.I may of only been 19 but I was aware we were voting for more than confirmation of membership of a trading block.WW2 was only 30 years finished and gradual closer political and economic ties to bind us all together was a noble and worthy project.Still is.

[pitrevie]

2 hours ago, nanglong218 said:

Petrivie, again I agree, it's not out of context. I've read the whole thing now.  But as a young man at the time, Parliament not televised, the country falling apart, the glowing uplands of Europe beckoned, join us they said, De Gaulle is dead, you will enrich your nation, stabilise it.   What alternative was there,   more of the same chaos.   Don't quote lines from a page to me, you had to be there and feel the shame of a great nation brought low.

I was there, I remember it well.

[pitrevie]

2 hours ago, nanglong218 said:

Petrivie, your quote is out of context. Bert, if you are bored, go get a beer, a girl, just go away

It would help if you could include the post to which you are referring.

[nanglong218]

Pitrevie, the Tony Benn quote.  Chang 50, shame on you, goebbels ??  how many of your countrymen died to rid the world of such filth, 

[nanglong218]

Pitrevie, you were there aged ??. what did you feel at the time. Remember Barbara Castle "In place of strife"  an attempt to bring the industrial chaos to a halt with sensible head to head agreement with bosses and unions as Europeans seemed capable of.  That was our aim at the time, no mention of single currency, political union, direct rule from bureaucrats in Brussels and judges in the ECJ from such well respected places like Latvia and Lithuania. No disrespect intended there but Brits should judge Brits.

[citybiker]

I'm aware the source is self acclaimed King Brexit campaigner however I'd have thought top three:

Germany
France
Italy
Report reveals which countries dominates EU Parliament - and what it could mean for Brexit - Express
https://apple.news/A2oZHQQR6PUm0AHaKVE0Q5w


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SheungWan]

8 hours ago, bert bloggs said:

Soon we will get to page 100 of this debate , and you know what ?

we will still have voted to leave , so give it a rest boys 

Unfortunately a few punctuated by inanity.

[Khun Han]

Tony Benn and Enoch Powell were routinely presented as the pantomime villains of politics in the 1970s. Everything they said was distorted and ridiculed by the msm. The idea that their views on the EEC were even taken seriously by the masses is just another gross misrepresentation by the forum's remainers.

[SheungWan]

9 hours ago, baansgr said:

And I think we got our first TV in December 1973, I remember it well how many households actually had access to media, especially with the way the media looked at Enoch its unlikely hardly anyone got to know what he was saying.

Hello! Its the Alf Garnett clones come out to play.

[SheungWan]

7 hours ago, nanglong218 said:

Pitrevie, you were there aged ??. what did you feel at the time. Remember Barbara Castle "In place of strife"  an attempt to bring the industrial chaos to a halt with sensible head to head agreement with bosses and unions as Europeans seemed capable of.  That was our aim at the time, no mention of single currency, political union, direct rule from bureaucrats in Brussels and judges in the ECJ from such well respected places like Latvia and Lithuania. No disrespect intended there but Brits should judge Brits.

In Place Of Strife was an utter failure and led to the fall of the Wilson Government in 1970. Pre-EU triumph indeed! PS Try a slightly different vapid analysis....

Edited September 11, 2017 by SheungWan

[SheungWan]

Gina Miller stuffs Theresa May for a second time.

[citybiker]

Gina Miller stuffs Theresa May for a second time.

Seen it, the Woman is a magnet for trouble.

Gina Miller launches legal challenge over Tory-DUP deal - Evening Standard
https://apple.news/AX-aNUou9Q2auMYaXcQai1A


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Khun Han]

1 hour ago, citybiker said:

1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

Gina Miller stuffs Theresa May for a second time.

Seen it, the Woman is a magnet for trouble.

Gina Miller launches legal challenge over Tory-DUP deal - Evening Standard
https://apple.news/AX-aNUou9Q2auMYaXcQai1A

 

That woman should spend her money on putting her views to the electorate. She would then be fully exposed for the Walter Mitty character that she is.