Getting a new passport to "reset your SETV count" sounds too good to be true

[CaptainKiiNiaw]

I have three SETVs from Vientiane in my passport, so I'm probably close to the limit.  I've read on this site and others that you can simply get a new passport and the count is reset.  This seems like a very convenient way to stay in Thailand for quite some time. Get 3-4 SETVs then spend a few weeks in Laos while you renew your passport before starting the cycle again.  Are there any catches to this plan?  Are you at the risk of a IO refusing entry even if you do have a new SETV?  I would like to get a multi re-entry permit and take a few trips to Myanmar, but that would increase my exposure to IOs and the risk of being refused entry.  I'd like to hear stories from people who have replaced their passports and gotten more SETVs.

[Cletus]

From what I understand the new passport reset will work only at the embassy/consulate when applying for a new visa (they don't link old and new passport). Immigration instead will link your passports on their computers, so they will be able to see your history of in and out of Thailand on their monitor easily.

[JackThompson]

This has worked to allow people to get additional Tourist Visas at nearby consulates for years.  The staff at the Vientiane consulate will tell you this is the "solution" to the red-stamp they issue (usually on the 3rd or 4th Tourist Visa), which otherwise prevents you from getting another Tourist Visa from them.

[darrendsd]

Why would you have to stay in LAos for a few weeks while you renew your PP?

[CaptainKiiNiaw]

14 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

This has worked to allow people to get additional Tourist Visas at nearby consulates for years.  The staff at the Vientiane consulate will tell you this is the "solution" [...]

Good to hear. That makes it sound like a legitimate solution rather than a sneaky hack.

 

9 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

Why would you have to stay in LAos for a few weeks while you renew your PP?

I thought that it would be better do it in Laos because I wouldn't have to worry about transferring my exit stamp to the new passport.  How does that work if you renew in Thailand?  Do you leave Thailand with a new passport containing an exit stamp but no matching entry stamp, or do they transfer your entry stamp to the new passport so that it contains an entry and an exit stamp.  Maybe I'm overthinking this part given @JackThompson 's comment about passport renewal being an acceptable solution in the eyes of the Vientiane consulate.

 

If anyone has had success renewing their passport in Thailand and getting a new SETV in Laos, please leave a comment.

[tropo]

4 minutes ago, CaptainKiiNiaw said:

 

27 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

This has worked to allow people to get additional Tourist Visas at nearby consulates for years.  The staff at the Vientiane consulate will tell you this is the "solution" [...]

Good to hear. That makes it sound like a legitimate solution rather than a sneaky hack.

 

It is indeed a "sneaky hack" and hardly a legitimate solution. They may not honour your visa at point-of-entry in Thailand when they bring you up on the computer and notice your many previous entries. The immigration officers will immediately make the assumption you're working illegally and send you home. There have been a number of threads recently about people who have been held at the airport for these reasons. If they did notice a frequent change of passports they may even blacklist you.

 

Apart from that, how many passport replacements will your Embassy allow before they start to question you about why you keep requiring replacements. I know there's a notice about passport renewals at the Australian Embassy explaining that each one within a certain period of time costs more - it's actually very expensive.

[PoorSucker]

Consulates outside thailand are under the ministry of foreign affairs, they have no access to immigration database. 

When you enter Thailand your old passport and new one will be linked and it will be up to the officer to let you enter, does not matter if you managed to pay for a visa before. 

[BritTim]

It has long been a convenient loophole which the Ministry of Foreign Affairs has not seen fit to close. To eliminate it, they would need an efficient and reliable computer system to track all visa applications. Thailand struggles to create such systems. It might happen, but does not seem likely in the near future.

[lkv]

3 hours ago, tropo said:

The immigration officers will immediately make the assumption you're working illegally and send you home.

....

If they did notice a frequent change of passports they may even blacklist you.

 

Who told you that? Heard it at the bar?

 

[jeab1980]

7 hours ago, tropo said:

It is indeed a "sneaky hack" and hardly a legitimate solution. They may not honour your visa at point-of-entry in Thailand when they bring you up on the computer and notice your many previous entries. The immigration officers will immediately make the assumption you're working illegally and send you home. There have been a number of threads recently about people who have been held at the airport for these reasons. If they did notice a frequent change of passports they may even blacklist you.

 

Apart from that, how many passport replacements will your Embassy allow before they start to question you about why you keep requiring replacements. I know there's a notice about passport renewals at the Australian Embassy explaining that each one within a certain period of time costs more - it's actually very expensive.

UK wont ask you any questions about how many passports you have changed. Simple reason there could be certain countries stamps in there you dont want other countries to see so a change of passport is done. Before i came to live in Thailand i changed my passport about every three months untill they finaly issued me with a second one never a raised eyebrow.

As for you other assumptions you read to much into threads here. Cant find one where it says people were blacklisted for frequent change of passport to many TV yes agreed.

Edited September 15, 2017 by jeab1980

[phuketrichard]

so ur going to get a new 10 year  passport every year??

Americans can get a second passport easy enough ( with a good reason)  and its good for 4 years now.

[JackThompson]

7 hours ago, CaptainKiiNiaw said:

Good to hear. That makes it sound like a legitimate solution rather than a sneaky hack.

 

I thought that it would be better do it in Laos because I wouldn't have to worry about transferring my exit stamp to the new passport.  How does that work if you renew in Thailand?  Do you leave Thailand with a new passport containing an exit stamp but no matching entry stamp, or do they transfer your entry stamp to the new passport so that it contains an entry and an exit stamp.  Maybe I'm overthinking this part given @JackThompson 's comment about passport renewal being an acceptable solution in the eyes of the Vientiane consulate.

 

If anyone has had success renewing their passport in Thailand and getting a new SETV in Laos, please leave a comment.

When you renew your PP in Thailand, they put a stamp in your new passport which reflects the last-stamp in your previous one.  So, if in Thailand on a Tourist Visa when you do the renewal, upon stamp-transfer they will put a stamp indicating a 60-day Tourist Visa was transferred.  The advantage to renewing your passport out of Thailand, is that this stamp would not be present, so consulates would have one less point of reference to previous Thai history to consider.

 

Whether it is "sneaky" depends on what branch (and sub-set of that branch) of the Thai Govt you are speaking to.  Immigration has a full-record of all your entries/exits when you enter the country, and a new passport does not change this.  They recently changed the rules (per police-order) such that a visitor can only obtain 2 Visa Exempt entries at Land Borders per calendar year.  Getting a new passport will not get you additional border entries. 

 

But note that the authorities chose NOT to change the "Unlimited Tourist Visa entries" status-quo, when they implemented the latest rule-changes.  Therefore, it is the directors of some consulates, not Immigration (at the top level), who have decided to be restrictive in the issuance of Tourist Visas - using red-stamps to limit (in Vientiane) the count to 3 or 4 per-passport.  But note that Vientiane doesn't check anything about the traveler - no plane-tickets, bank-balance, or proof of where one will stay in Thailand.  Savanakhet's solution is to issue Tourist Visas indefinitely (according to many reports), but they check all those things upon every application.  The difference in these policies / reason for Vientiane's red-stamp may boil-down to the relative volume of Tourist Visas issued at each, for which a different filtering-strategy has been implemented.  Getting a new passport is a type of filtering, as anyone with a criminal-warrant in their home-country would fail to obtain one.

 

It would appear that a great deal of tension exists between Immigration/Police, the MFA, and TAT regarding the "appropriate" policy towards longer-staying under-50s using Tourist Visas.  A clique of Immigration which operate out of Airports and at Poipet/Aranyaprathet seem to have a problem with "too many Farangs" staying here longer-term (without paying them off through agents or the elite-visa).  We have several reports of IOs at those locations stating non-rules as real-rules to applicants whom they are considering rejecting-entry.  But this attitude is not present (or command-operational, at least) at other points of entry. 

[acenase]

20 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

When you renew your PP in Thailand, they put a stamp in your new passport which reflects the last-stamp in your previous one.  So, if in Thailand on a Tourist Visa when you do the renewal, upon stamp-transfer they will put a stamp indicating a 60-day Tourist Visa was transferred.  The advantage to renewing your passport out of Thailand, is that this stamp would not be present, so consulates would have one less point of reference to previous Thai history to consider.

 

I have been debating if I should apply for a new PP in Thailand or back home in the US, but then I realized, I can't erase my history in the computer monitors so even if I wait so I avoid having that extra stamp by renewing my PP in Thailand, they will still know when I get to immigration of my history.

 

I keep reading about Vientiane only allowing 3-4 Tourist Visas before you get the red stamp.. but does that mean "back to back" or TOTAL in your passport? 

 would it make a difference if you have 2 TR Visas from Vientiane, then 1 in HK or Penang, then go back to Vientiane for 2 more compared to if you just did 4 straight runs to Vientiane for the TR Visa?

 

 

Edited September 15, 2017 by acenase

[JackThompson]

19 minutes ago, acenase said:

 

I have been debating if I should apply for a new PP in Thailand or back home in the US, but then I realized, I can't erase my history in the computer monitors so even if I wait so I avoid having that extra stamp by renewing my PP in Thailand, they will still know when I get to immigration of my history.

 

Correct - though it might help with getting additional Tourist Visas in the region from Thai Consulates.

 

Quote

I keep reading about Vientiane only allowing 3-4 Tourist Visas before you get the red stamp.. but does that mean "back to back" or TOTAL in your passport? 

 would it make a difference if you have 2 TR Visas from Vientiane, then 1 in HK or Penang, then go back to Vientiane for 2 more compared to if you just did 4 straight runs to Vientiane for the TR Visa?

Based on reports when I first began reading this forum, some sort of "reset" by using another consulate used to exist.  My experience was, even after a 7-mo "out of Thailand" break, Vientiane still counted old Tourist Visas and gave me the red-stamp on my 4th.   They also honored a red-stamp from another consulate, and would not issue me a Tourist Visa due to this "remark" on an old Tourist Visa (which was ignored in Savanakhet).

 

The best solution seems to be to use Savanakhet (showing air-ticket, bank-balance, and proof-of hotel or lease) after you have 2 or 3 from (easy / no docs) Vientiane.

Edited September 15, 2017 by JackThompson

[Love66]

 

[Love66]

[tryasimight]

7 minutes ago, Love66 said:

And the point of this log is?

No holiday snaps to bore us with?

[tryasimight]

Make one wonder about the low count posters asking immigration/visa questions and then either replying once or twice or disappearing altogether.

Perhaps immigration officials are joining tv to see what creative loopholes people come up with so that they can be shut down.

 

That's my conspiracy theory for the day anyway.

[CaptainKiiNiaw]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Savanakhet's solution is to issue Tourist Visas indefinitely (according to many reports), but they check all those things upon every application. 

Interesting.  I hadn't heard that, but I'm not as up to date on the issue as some of the TV regulars.  In that case, I might just go get a SETV from Savannakhet.  I only have 3 SETVs in my passport (plus six or seven visa exempt entries).  Seems like a pretty safe bet as long as I have the required documentation.

[jeab1980]

2 hours ago, phuketrichard said:

so ur going to get a new 10 year  passport every year??

Americans can get a second passport easy enough ( with a good reason)  and its good for 4 years now.

Case of having to if your asking me? Then after 3 changes they decided i had good reason to have 2 passports problem solved.

Edited September 15, 2017 by jeab1980

[thecyclist]

I did that for decades, keep the old passport till it was full or till I got the first red warning stamp.Then you apply for a new one at your embassy in Bangkok, but ask them to send the new one to an embassy in a neighboring country for pick-up,which they will do for a fee:This way you get a completely 'clean' passport, that doesn't even have the transferred Thai visa from your old passport in it.

With the current crackdown on serial TV runners that might not be a foolproof solution to long-term stay anymore.

[thecyclist]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

 

Correct - though it might help with getting additional Tourist Visas in the region from Thai Consulates.

 

Based on reports when I first began reading this forum, some sort of "reset" by using another consulate used to exist.  My experience was, even after a 7-mo "out of Thailand" break, Vientiane still counted old Tourist Visas and gave me the red-stamp on my 4th.   They also honored a red-stamp from another consulate, and would not issue me a Tourist Visa due to this "remark" on an old Tourist Visa (which was ignored in Savanakhet).

 

The best solution seems to be to use Savanakhet (showing air-ticket, bank-balance, and proof-of hotel or lease) after you have 2 or 3 from (easy / no docs) Vientiane.

That is correct:From personal experience and from what others told me Vientiane not only pays attention to warning stamps from other embassies, they tend to count total TVs in you current passport.

[baansgr]

With the hassle and cost of getting a new UK passport, is it really worth the effort for any Brits

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, thecyclist said:

I did that for decades, keep the old passport till it was full or till I got the first red warning stamp.Then you apply for a new one at your embassy in Bangkok, but ask them to send the new one to an embassy in a neighboring country for pick-up,which they will do for a fee:This way you get a completely 'clean' passport, that doesn't even have the transferred Thai visa from your old passport in it.

With the current crackdown on serial TV runners that might not be a foolproof solution to long-term stay anymore.

That is an interesting option I had not considered when I was doing the TV-shuffle.  Thanks for sharing - may help many others.

 

Good thing for longer-stayers, the "crackdown" is only occurring at airports and the Aranya/Poipet border crossing thus far.

[darrendsd]

3 hours ago, thecyclist said:

I did that for decades, keep the old passport till it was full or till I got the first red warning stamp.Then you apply for a new one at your embassy in Bangkok, but ask them to send the new one to an embassy in a neighboring country for pick-up,which they will do for a fee:This way you get a completely 'clean' passport, that doesn't even have the transferred Thai visa from your old passport in it.

With the current crackdown on serial TV runners that might not be a foolproof solution to long-term stay anymore.

Seems pointless to be honest, one transferred stamp has no bearing on how many visas you can obtain in your new PP,  speaking from experience 

 

 

[smccolley]

I just have to wonder why the OP doesn't get a visa that reflects his real status in Thailand. If you really want to be here, a valid long term visa is probably available. I get really tired of posters trying to "beat the system" when I, my friends, and many posters here on TV have lived in Thailand for decades without resorting to trickery or outright fraud to stay here.

[jeab1980]

No trickery or fraud involved. They get lawfull visa's issued by consulates or embassies. Or the get lawful VEE issued by Thai Immigration. The old chesnut "we do it right". Now if they use the Visa system correctly and do not break the law they do it right as well. 

[darrendsd]

11 minutes ago, smccolley said:

I just have to wonder why the OP doesn't get a visa that reflects his real status in Thailand. If you really want to be here, a valid long term visa is probably available. I get really tired of posters trying to "beat the system" when I, my friends, and many posters here on TV have lived in Thailand for decades without resorting to trickery or outright fraud to stay here.

It is not trickery or outright fraud, how exactly is it?

 

Are you yet another poster who thinks they are superior to those who stay here on LEGITIMATE Tourist Visas?

 

Let me remind you that you are here for the 12 months your visa extensions allow, when you apply again the rules for gaining another year may have dramatically changed meaning that it may be impossible for you to attain

 

You, like all of us are here at the whim of the Thai Government, nothing more, the rules could change at any time, you would do well to remember that

 

[tropo]

15 hours ago, lkv said:

19 hours ago, tropo said:

The immigration officers will immediately make the assumption you're working illegally and send you home.

....

If they did notice a frequent change of passports they may even blacklist you.

 

Who told you that? Heard it at the bar?

(wrong guy for a joke like that dude. I don't drink or spend time in bars)

 

Yeah, I heard about it on here - guys held at the airport and sent home for having too many entries, even with visa in hand. You should keep up with the recent reports. The second part was a theory, therefore I used the word "may".

Edited September 15, 2017 by tropo

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, smccolley said:

I just have to wonder why the OP doesn't get a visa that reflects his real status in Thailand. If you really want to be here, a valid long term visa is probably available. I get really tired of posters trying to "beat the system" when I, my friends, and many posters here on TV have lived in Thailand for decades without resorting to trickery or outright fraud to stay here.

The opportunity for trickery and fraud is primarily prevalent on ED, Retirement, Marriage and Business-based visas, where agents (or a school) can fenagle things for a fee shared with corrupt IOs.  I believe Tourist Visas are picked-on at certain locations, because they do not enable this profitable fraud.

That is not to imply that everyone using the other options is participating in fraud - only to point out that those on Tourist Visas are the only ones who must follow the law to obtain their visas.  Some may work illegally in water-sports or as teachers (easy to catch, if anyone wanted to do so) - but working without a work-permit is a potential violation with any visa-type.