Sharp tax hike on alcohol and tobacco effective immediately

[nong38]

3 minutes ago, A Skeptic said:

If I understand this correctly, a B500 bottle of proper wine made from grapes is subject to a B1,500 tax per litre of alcohol. Assuming an ancoholic content of 12% therefore, a 0.7 litre bottle would be:

1,500 x 0.13 x 0.7

= 136 Baht more expensive. Or an increase of 27.2%

 

A 5L box of Mont Clair, made from "fruits" would be:

10% of 990 (approx) = 99     plus

5 x 150 x0.13 = 97.5

= 196.5 Baht more expensive. Or an increase of 19.85%

 

A crate of beer (24 cans 0.33liters each) costing B820 would rise as follows:

Assumesd cost B820 x 22% = 180    plus

24 x0.33 x  0.5 (alcohol content) x 430 = 170.3

= B350.3 more expenisive. An increase of 42.6%

 

Of course, to know what the real increase in price is we need to know how much tax is paid NOW and deduct that figure from the above, as the leader article indicates there are the new applicable tax rates. Have I got this wrong?

 

Time to join AA. Or restart the art of brewing - so well practiced in my youth, but Boots here does not sell the kits. There's a market out there just waiting for exploiting.

 

 

 

 

Boots in the UK seem to have discontinued the brewing lines as well.

[SupermarineS6B]

4 minutes ago, Happyman58 said:

Cambodia Laos and Vietnam all have big smiles today Come to us they will be saying to the tourists.  We will give you better deal Than Thailand Guess somebody has to pay for the crappy subs

Don't forget Penang as well, better music nightlife and plenty of alcohol and other attractions......... probably more to come looking at the latest move from the pongo...... 

[LatPhrao]

Fruit Wine.      This is the part of my interest, on price of wines and the perpetuation of a fake category created in Thailand:   "fruit wines" or "grapes mixed with other fruits".

"Wine priced higher than Bt1,000 will be taxed at 20 per cent of its price and Bt1,500 per liter of alcoholic content.

The rate for wine made from grapes mixed with other fruits is 10 per cent of the price and Bt150 per litre of alcoholic content. These rates are effective from now onwards."

 

It's criminal what they do with taxation on wine in Thailand.  That said it seems an indication of what they provincially think is a 'foreigner's' drink and therefore feel free to have at the foreigner's pocket, imho.  Viciously I'd say.

The phenomenon I've been watching as wine has caught on in Thailand is the creation of a  category called 'fruit wine' which supposedly are wines where another fruit has been added to adulterate pure wine.  This category has had a tax rate per 750 ml bottle of 84 thb, now going to 150 thb, which has resulted in wines like Belleville, Mar y Sol among others on the shelf at 295 to 300 thb per bottle up to  349 to 389 thb (these are comparable prices to e.g., U.S. supermarket prices).  The label must be marked fruit wine and the producers co-operate in the scheme by adding back label text that insinuates fruity aromas and flavors as if juice from other fruits had been added.  But it's a Thailand government endorsed scam that qualifies for  a low level tax.  No fruit juice has been added! and as far as I can tell not sugars have been added to sweeten them up to appear more 'fruity'.  Also, conveniently, no indication of the percentage of fruit juice added. Grape juice by the way is a 'fruit' if they need the ultimate dodge.       

Whether it's pure paper scam or in the case of negotiants like Siam Winery who bring in good quality foreign wine and bottle the wines in Thailand, maybe the winemaker stands over the vat with an eye dropper of (pick your Thai fruit)  to technically make it 'fruit added'.   But these companies do the least necessary to meet the phony category which appears to be labeling insinuating fruit characteristics.

It's a travesty as the wine business generally has a good code about labelling wines so you know where it comes from and what's inside.  Why Thailand felt it needed to create this tax dodge on cheaper wines and subvert the international norms lacks common sense at the least, but there it is.

If you want to see what the tax effect is on this category, watch the in-store prices for wines like Belleville red and white (wines from the Rhone, France - imported to Vietnam and bottled before shipping to Thailand) and Mar y Sol (wine imported in bulk probably from Chile and bottled in Thailand.

The good news is the wines in this tax category are well made basic, dry wines from France, Chile, Spain, New Zealand and more. And they're not tricked up with added sweetness.  Good table wines.  Making them good value considering what Thailand does to wines of higher quality and appellation that fly honestly under their own labellings.  

[Happyman58]

1 minute ago, SupermarineS6B said:

Don't forget Penang as well, better music nightlife and plenty of alcohol and other attractions......... probably more to come looking at the latest move from the pongo...... 

 

1 minute ago, SupermarineS6B said:

Don't forget Penang as well, better music nightlife and plenty of alcohol and other attractions......... probably more to come looking at the latest move from the pongo...... 

also somebody has to pay for 600 Generals and 500 committees doing nothing Oh the medals would cost lots of money also All the Generals seem to have lots

[SunsetT]

9 minutes ago, Namplik said:

No

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30326861

Thanks....Thats not too bad.

 

Why the hell are they so down on imported wine? Is it to protect the domestic sales of the 'Spy' type full of sugar sh*te.

[Dmaxdan]

11 minutes ago, A Skeptic said:

If I understand this correctly, a B500 bottle of proper wine made from grapes is subject to a B1,500 tax per litre of alcohol. Assuming an ancoholic content of 12% therefore, a 0.7 litre bottle would be:

1,500 x 0.13 x 0.7

= 136 Baht more expensive. Or an increase of 27.2%

 

A 5L box of Mont Clair, made from "fruits" would be:

10% of 990 (approx) = 99     plus

5 x 150 x0.13 = 97.5

= 196.5 Baht more expensive. Or an increase of 19.85%

 

A crate of beer (24 cans 0.33liters each) costing B820 would rise as follows:

Assumesd cost B820 x 22% = 180    plus

24 x0.33 x  0.5 (alcohol content) x 430 = 170.3

= B350.3 more expenisive. An increase of 42.6%

 

Of course, to know what the real increase in price is we need to know how much tax is paid NOW and deduct that figure from the above, as the leader article indicates there are the new applicable tax rates. Have I got this wrong?

 

Time to join AA. Or restart the art of brewing - so well practiced in my youth, but Boots here does not sell the kits. There's a market out there just waiting for exploiting.

 

 

 

 

Look at the link in the post previous to yours. That contains an official announcement by the government today!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, wchris said:

Asoke Bangkok.  Just been to 7/11  and alcohol prices not changed … yet!  In fact they also still had 3 bottles of Bells Whiskey on the shelf at THB349 a Bottle (70cl) so I took  all 3.  (Well could be the last of the Bells?)  Also checked the cool cupboards and Chang was 74 for 2 small bottles (37 Baht a bottle).  So … seems like 7/11 is using up old stock before whacking on any tax increase.  No complaints about that.

 

This afternoon, I checked a bunch of beer prices for online sources such as Villa Market, Tesco, Gourmet Market, etc.  And at least thus far, any price hikes haven't yet surfaced in their online pricing.

 

But as anyone who knows Thai websites knows, and this being a weekend, they may well not update their prices so fast...

[SunsetT]

6 minutes ago, LatPhrao said:

Fruit Wine.      This is the part of my interest, on price of wines and the perpetuation of a fake category created in Thailand:   "fruit wines" or "grapes mixed with other fruits".

"Wine priced higher than Bt1,000 will be taxed at 20 per cent of its price and Bt1,500 per liter of alcoholic content.

The rate for wine made from grapes mixed with other fruits is 10 per cent of the price and Bt150 per litre of alcoholic content. These rates are effective from now onwards."

 

It's criminal what they do with taxation on wine in Thailand.  That said it seems an indication of what they provincially think is a 'foreigner's' drink and therefore feel free to have at the foreigner's pocket, imho.  Viciously I'd say.

The phenomenon I've been watching as wine has caught on in Thailand is the creation of a  category called 'fruit wine' which supposedly are wines where another fruit has been added to adulterate pure wine.  This category has had a tax rate per 750 ml bottle of 84 thb, now going to 150 thb, which has resulted in wines like Belleville, Mar y Sol among others on the shelf at 295 to 300 thb per bottle up to  349 to 389 thb (these are comparable prices to e.g., U.S. supermarket prices).  The label must be marked fruit wine and the producers co-operate in the scheme by adding back label text that insinuates fruity aromas and flavors as if juice from other fruits had been added.  But it's a Thailand government endorsed scam that qualifies for  a low level tax.  No fruit juice has been added! and as far as I can tell not sugars have been added to sweeten them up to appear more 'fruity'.  Also, conveniently, no indication of the percentage of fruit juice added. Grape juice by the way is a 'fruit' if they need the ultimate dodge.       

Whether it's pure paper scam or in the case of negotiants like Siam Winery who bring in good quality foreign wine and bottle the wines in Thailand, maybe the winemaker stands over the vat with an eye dropper of (pick your Thai fruit)  to technically make it 'fruit added'.   But these companies do the least necessary to meet the phony category which appears to be labeling insinuating fruit characteristics.

It's a travesty as the wine business generally has a good code about labelling wines so you know where it comes from and what's inside.  Why Thailand felt it needed to create this tax dodge on cheaper wines and subvert the international norms lacks common sense at the least, but there it is.

If you want to see what the tax effect is on this category, watch the in-store prices for wines like Belleville red and white (wines from the Rhone, France - imported to Vietnam and bottled before shipping to Thailand) and Mar y Sol (wine imported in bulk probably from Chile and bottled in Thailand.

The good news is the wines in this tax category are well made basic, dry wines from France, Chile, Spain, New Zealand and more. And they're not tricked up with added sweetness.  Good table wines.  Making them good value considering what Thailand does to wines of higher quality and appellation that fly honestly under their own labellings.  

Common sense? Sorry, you're in the wrong country mate!

 

[Shiver]

2 minutes ago, SunsetT said:

Thanks....Thats not too bad.

 

Why the hell are they so down on imported wine? Is it to protect the domestic sales of the 'Spy' type full of sugar sh*te.

I was gifted a bottle of "Chateau de Loei" some 10 - 11 years ago.  I know it's criminal to pour wine down the sink, but I was forced to break the unwritten law on that one.  It made the art of making Lao Khao appear positively amazing.  I remember thinking "mental note: try again in 20 years when they've sorted out the variables".

[Bastos60]

6 hours ago, Techno Viking said:

the new rates are based on the existing retail price.

No, the rates are not based on existing retail price, the prices are based on retail prices minus the previous taxes.

The calculation is no longer made when it exits the factory but when the retailer has added its profit margin on top of it first. Based on the retailers profit margin, you could be paying more taxes.

And this calculation is from the wholesaler, not the final retailer.

 

Can you imagine that a agogo bar has to add taxes on it based on their prices? 170 Baht beer would  earn far more taxes in a agogo bar then when it is bought at a 7-11. 

Edited September 16, 2017 by Bastos60

[Techno Viking]

Just now, Bastos60 said:

No, the rates are not based on existing retail price, the prices are based on retail prices minus the previous taxes.

 

Been searching for just that but it is elusive, got a link ?

[GLewis]

This is the most encouraging report I have seen on the subject. Also was in Foodland at noon today and all liquor prices were still the same.

BANGKOK, Sept 16 (Reuters) - Thailand’s new excise tax law will see higher prices of certain goods, including some alcoholic beverages and cigarettes, and should generate about 12 billion baht ($360 million) in tax revenue, a senior government official said on Saturday.

The law, effective on Saturday, is aimed at making tax collection more transparent and should not have a big impact on overall product prices, Somchai Poolsavasdi, director-general of the Thailand’s Excise Department, told a briefing.

“Overall, this will increase tax revenue by 2 percent,” he said.

The tax on alcohol will increase by up to 30 baht per bottle, while beer will rise by 0.50 baht per can and 2.66 baht per bottle, the official said.

The tax on imported wine will rise at least 110 baht per bottle, and cigarettes will increase by 2 to 15 baht per pack, the official said.

Thailand sets new excise tax on alcohol, cigarettes | Reuters

 

Edited September 16, 2017 by GLewis
trying to get rich text.

[Bastos60]

Just now, Techno Viking said:

Been searching for just that but it is elusive, got a link ?

Got a link that states different?

The text states it clearly, not based on price leaving factory, but instead retail price. That means from the point of the wholesaler which is still retail.

[Bastos60]

2 minutes ago, Bastos60 said:

Got a link that states different?

The text states it clearly, not based on price leaving factory, but instead retail price. That means from the point of the wholesaler which is still retail.

Let me correct it little bit : An article I read this morning on bangkokpost.com. Can not link articles from there, so......

------

The law introduces a new calculation method for excise taxes, including those on sugary drinks, tea and coffee. Taxes are calculated based on suggested retail prices and on volumes 

-----

Edited September 16, 2017 by Bastos60

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

Previously the alcohol component was 100 baht/L, and now it is 430 baht/L, so assuming 5% and a small bottle 330 ml and a large 630 ml, that's an increase of 5.4 baht and 10.4 baht respectively.

 

 

And yet we have this today from the government via The Nation:

 

Quote

The tax per can of beer will be Bt0.50 higher, and for bottles of beer it will be Bt2 .66 more. For higher-priced beer, the tax will decrease by between Bt0.99 and Bt2.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30326861

 

How they arrive at those kind of predicted retail price changes, given the much larger percentage increases in the supposed tax rates, I have not the slightest clue.

 

[ukrules]

3 minutes ago, GLewis said:

The tax on imported wine will rise at least 110 baht per bottle, and cigarettes will increase by 2 to 15 baht per pack, the official said.

Thailand sets new excise tax on alcohol, cigarettes | Reuters

 

When they announced the 5 Baht tax increase on a pack of cigarettes the last time they did this the price of Marlboro red increased from 95 Baht to 125 Baht.

 

I wonder how much it will go up by this time.

[Techno Viking]

3 minutes ago, Bastos60 said:

Got a link that states different?

The text states it clearly, not based on price leaving factory, but instead retail price. That means from the point of the wholesaler which is still retail.

does not state anything about current retail price not having this tax added on top.

[Bastos60]

1 minute ago, ukrules said:

When they announced the 5 Baht tax increase on a pack of cigarettes the last time they did this the price of Marlboro red increased from 95 Baht to 125 Baht.

 

I wonder how much it will go up by this time.

Retails and manufacturers always use the excuses of increased taxes to also increase their profits. 
Marlboro being so popular with foreigners........they know where their main market is, and they could care less if thai aren't smoking their brand anymore or less.

[wavemanwww]

6 hours ago, maeab101 said:

This is good news for Thailand.

This news sucks

[Bastos60]

3 minutes ago, Techno Viking said:

does not state anything about current retail price not having this tax added on top.

Yes it does, but I was talking with the bangkokpost article in mind. In a reply below you will see I did quote the one line that explains it.

Another article they had even explained it far better.

Edited September 16, 2017 by Bastos60

[Frotting]

6 hours ago, jvs said:

So what will be the increase per bottle of beer?I guess that is what a lot of people would like to know.

It will not last long anyway,as soon as they find out this increase will actually make them less money they will revoke this real fast.

 

Now 17:15 and I just went to the local mom and pop shop in the moobaan.  The price now for a bottle of <deleted> LEO beer is 108 baht, same for CHANG.  Heineken is kind of weird as they are charging the same price of 108 baht.  Yesterday LEO was 48 baht, and CHANG about the same, Heineken 75 baht (all for large bottles).  For the LEO alone, by my calculations is an overnight increase of 125%.

 

This is in the shops, but what about bars and restaurants?  Once this news gets around we can expect a serious drop in tourism this year (on top of the downturn ongoing for the last 3 years - despite the BS that TAT tell us).  Then when people stop drinking the beer, what happens to the breweries?  This is the thin end of the wedge.  What is next?  Food probably and also petrol/diesel.  This country is now well and truly f**ked.  But my guess is all part of the plan.

 

Thailand is being groomed and manoeuvred into a position where China can just come in and take it over.  They already own it in everything but name; soon they will get the whole thing and this country becomes the rice bowl of the great socialist republic, and the people become slaves and woe betide anyone who complains.  Just waiting for when the killings start, should not be much longer now.  Saw the same thing years ago in Cambodia, with a slightly different scenario but same game plan being played out.  Everyone have an exit strategy?

[Ltcolumbo]

29 minutes ago, Namplik said:

No

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30326861

"The tax per can of beer will be Bt0.50 higher, and for bottles of beer it will be Bt2 .66 more. For higher-priced beer, the tax will decrease by between Bt0.99 and Bt2."

 

As quoted above, can anyone say what is this "higher price beer"? 

My understanding from that statement is that tax paid is being reduced for higher priced beer due to a lower tax rate, or is this a flat rate tax deduction per can/bottle??

[Techno Viking]

Just now, Bastos60 said:

Yes it does, but I was talking with the bangkokpost article in mind. In a reply below you will see I did quote the one line that explains it.

 

My bad, did not read the existing taxes will be abolished and replaced by the new.

[Bastos60]

Just now, Techno Viking said:

My bad, did not read the existing taxes will be abolished and replaced by the new.

No problem, they talk about tax increases, so you would immediately assume it is the current tax that is increased, while the whole calculation has been changed.

[MyFriend You]

5 hours ago, Roger Harris said:

Now Cambodia does look interesting to live

Cheap beer and Liquor there for sure  -  50cents US for a bottle of beer

[car720]

6 hours ago, z42 said:

Absolutely appalling. I don't drink much and don't smoke.. But the prices in line with what your rank and file earn is a joke.

A lot of speculation abound that the coffers are running really low. These ridiculous hikes are going to be used to plug the hole, or are we going to expect denials on both fronts (not broke and sin taxes used in proper way) ?

Isn't it amazing how governments from all countries always hit the little guy who only has limited pleasures in life anyway.  REVENUE is the only word they understand because without it they cannot increase their own salaries.  The Ducal system never really did die.  They just gave it a new name.

[MyFriend You]

41 minutes ago, SupermarineS6B said:

Typical bar girl mentality......... No customers, let's put the price up.......

Soi Cowboy last week, a mate of mine & I were out, he asked a Coyote girl the price, she said 7,000 baht, I asked why??  2000 for me, 5000 for tax.  Then she said 'this is what I get in Hong Kong,  '

I can see beer prices all over the place as people won't be able to decipher the new tax law.  my local 7/11 stopped selling beer last night right after 2100, put chains on the cooler doors, I assume to          re-price the packages on existing beer??

Edited September 16, 2017 by TunnelRat69

[Bastos60]

What it comes down to is that the wholesaler will suggest a retail price for the product, and that price is used to start the calculation. 
If a retailer suggests a retail price for example Singha, 25 baht, the tax will be calculate ontop of that, 25 baht * 22% + (225 Baht * 5%) = 44 baht = 19 baht taxes

 

[ukrules]

12 minutes ago, Frotting said:

Now 17:15 and I just went to the local mom and pop shop in the moobaan.  The price now for a bottle of <deleted> LEO beer is 108 baht, same for CHANG.  Heineken is kind of weird as they are charging the same price of 108 baht.  Yesterday LEO was 48 baht, and CHANG about the same, Heineken 75 baht (all for large bottles).  For the LEO alone, by my calculations is an overnight increase of 125%.

 

This is in the shops, but what about bars and restaurants?  Once this news gets around we can expect a serious drop in tourism this year (on top of the downturn ongoing for the last 3 years - despite the BS that TAT tell us).  Then when people stop drinking the beer, what happens to the breweries?  This is the thin end of the wedge.  What is next?  Food probably and also petrol/diesel.  This country is now well and truly f**ked.  But my guess is all part of the plan.

 

Thailand is being groomed and manoeuvred into a position where China can just come in and take it over.  They already own it in everything but name; soon they will get the whole thing and this country becomes the rice bowl of the great socialist republic, and the people become slaves and woe betide anyone who complains.  Just waiting for when the killings start, should not be much longer now.  Saw the same thing years ago in Cambodia, with a slightly different scenario but same game plan being played out.  Everyone have an exit strategy?

 

Considering the price of beer is supposed to rise by just a couple of Baht something seems very wrong here.

 

Their customers should remember their dumbness once the truth finally comes out.

 

[Bastos60]

3 minutes ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Soi Cowboy last week, a mate of mine & I were out, he asked a Coyote girl the price, she said 7,000 baht, I asked why??  2000 for me, 5000 for tax.  Then she said 'this is what I get in Hong Kong,  '

I can see beer prices all over the place as people won't be able to decipher the new tax law.  my local 7/11 stopped selling beer last night right after 2100, put chains on the cooler doors, I assume to          re-price the packages on existing beer??

that was actually illegal, they are not allowed to do that, the new taxes are only applied to new stock. There will be many retailers with very large stocks now hoping to cash in extra in the short run.