New roof advice

[simoh1490]

BTW when laying the RB, don't carry it down to the roof overhang, stop where the roof meets the wall. That is so that the cool air can enter the vented eaves boards which in turn allows the hot air between the RB and the roof to rise and exit via the exhaust vent - creating that route for cold air in and hot air out drags cooler air across the underside of the roof surface which helps keep the roof surface cooler. Also, you don't show pictures of the ends of your house, just front and rear, presumably there are no exhaust vents on those surfaces but perhaps if there is a future need to increase exhaust venting, that might be the place to put them thus creating a cross flow. And of course, always a good idea to put mosquito netting on the back of the exhaust vent to keep mossies etc out.

Edited November 3, 2017 by simoh1490

[longball53098]

See this SCG link for an example of the plastic eave fillers. SCG has many different ones. These are marketed by SCG but I bought some from my local building supply for about 200 baht per box of 10. You need to know the curvature of your roof tile in order to get the correct ones as they have many different ones.

 

http://www.scgbuildingmaterials.com/th/products/SCG-Eaves-Filler-Unit-for-Excella-Classic-Roof-Til/8852439002719

[carlyai]

The thinggies to fit between the rafters ti stop the birds come in a pack of about 12. One box or 'nung kon'. Sorry for my Thai/English transliteration.

They are called 'peen kan nok krajok'. Or, 1 stop the bird window. 'Peen' is the classifier, 'nok' is the bird and 'krajok' is the window.

Even though they are plastic they are still classed as a window.

There are different ones for CPAC tiles, and the various types of metal roofs.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[simoh1490]

Many thanks for that, I was looking everywhere but couldn't find it.

[Kwasaki]

16 hours ago, Sheryl said:

1 - Wire mosquito mesh comes in rolls?  Any idea what it is called in Thai or any pix of it? I have never seen it and in fact at times resorted to cutting up mosquito nets when the mesh was what I really needed. As this is turning into a lot of work, what do you think of not replacing all the eaves boards but just some on each side of the house?

 

2 - Unfortunately no not all at clear. When you say beams do you mean the rafters or the purlins? To my understanding the metal beams that run vertically are rafters and the horizontal ones are purlins.  Normally would attach the roofing to the purlins (beams that run parallele to the eaves, at 1 meter inervals and attacged to the rafters) . If going to use top hat channel  affixed at bottom to  RB and on top to the roofing then it surely needs to run the whole  length of all the purlins, doesn't it? Otherwise may not be sufficient support for the roofing panels. And in order to attach to the purlin would need to not be wider than it. OR am I missing something? If used under the beams solely to affix the RB, with the roofing attached to the purlins as usual, then can use far fewer on them because no need to also hold the weight of the roof.

 

3- Plastic thingies: My roofing guys do not know and I am also having trouble communicating  what it is I need to the roofing suppliers. Please someone, tell me what is it called in Thai? Or provide a pix of it?  I wish I had known about eons ago, as you may observe on the pictures of my eaves I jerry rigged somnthing else when this is what would have been ideal, that was done due to major bat infestation, the guano of which cost me new ceilings.

1.  Yes a lot of unnecessary work I suggest why not just vent existing soffit.

 

2.  Correct not made clear and confusing IMO.

 

You have box channel steel rafters this pix has an i-shaped girder rafter.

There are Zed purlins &  'C' channel purlins, you have 'C' channel purlins.

The usual practical method in roof construction is vapour barrier or whatever product you use is installed top of purlins fixing a suitable spacer to the top of the purlin, then top sheet is fixed to spacer preferably at the top of the profile roof sheet roll.

Zed spacer can be used if a top hat spacer is too wide for fixing to the purlin.

 

3.  Plastic thingys   hope illustrations help.

Eaves under roof sheet profile fillers/closures pieces can be used vented or un-vented and there are many different type some types used on concrete tiled roofs can be used with profile metal roofing.

If a profile ridge flashing are not available with a metal profile roof sheet then reverse  profile fillers/closures pieces can be used.

Good practice at ridge is to turn up the valley part of the metal roof sheet too.

 

[Sheryl]

OK thanks all, and a specially big thanks for the pix of the plastic thingies and their name.

 

I think I will put the RB behind the rafters for a number of reasons:

 

-  I am wary of putting the roof atop a THspacer in terms of being sure it is strong enough whereas I know the purlins are

-will create problems with more space under the eaves

-  In case of subsequent tearing, easier to repair/replace if it is inside the attic space

- less supplies to buy and seemingly less work: instead of enough spacers to completely cover all purlins I can just use enough of a fixing strip to keep the foil in place

- It is the approach suggested by my workers

 

Will likely also go with installing vents in the exisiting eaves boards but will wait and see what shape they are in after the new roof is up, since I think that can be done last after the roof?

 

[carlyai]

OK thanks all, and a specially big thanks for the pix of the plastic thingies and their name.
 
I think I will put the RB behind the rafters for a number of reasons:
 
-  I am wary of putting the roof atop a THspacer in terms of being sure it is strong enough whereas I know the purlins are
-will create problems with more space under the eaves
-  In case of subsequent tearing, easier to repair/replace if it is inside the attic space
- less supplies to buy and seemingly less work: instead of enough spacers to completely cover all purlins I can just use enough of a fixing strip to keep the foil in place
- It is the approach suggested by my workers
 
Will likely also go with installing vents in the exisiting eaves boards but will wait and see what shape they are in after the new roof is up, since I think that can be done last after the roof?
 

While not raining on the parade, all these pics are Googled images or such.

I looked in the mess I call the garage this morning for those plastic, stop the birds (and they don't completely stop those beautiful little birds,) that's why the brand No Nails, from a previous poster, was recommended. Respectfully, non of those images show the correct one you buy here. All mine are in the roof, so couldn't get a pic.

Again, respectfully, those bored out eves, to let the heat in/out (personally I'm not sure if their value in the overall scheme of things), are not the right way to go. I will be corrected on this if anyone has done this in practice, not just posted an image....good intentions meant.
I have a reasonable extensive outside speaker set up in the eves around the house. With 6 switchable speakers in all. Seemed like a good plan at the time, but every spider and insect has built their house in the speaker vents, where as the purpose built slatted eves are vermin free. My slatted vents are spider etc free. I personally, would not go with those vents, but could be wrong.

So this is how I see the usefully/uslessness of the eves slatted thinggies in the grand scheme of things. I am trying to be helpful. [emoji3]

I've got a high pitched roof, with a very small roof air space, thermal barrier, 2" below roof tiles, red monier concrete roof tiles (maybe out of fashion, but red roofs were considered to be the best, that's why every house in Australia had red roofs in my era). Cavity brick wall, really expensive British Paints paint, thick bat insulation in the roof ends, a house full of ceiling fans, and my house still gets hot. In the hot season you can hardly keep your hand on the house outside wall, but the inside walls are/don't seem to be affected.
The trick, would seem, to not let the sun shine on your house, because whatever you do after that is just catchup. So if your house gets direct sunlight, putting in those slatted eves may not decrease the temperature...ie if it's a pain to put in all slatted vents (try and get a few in), if your house gets to 27 C then the slatted vents bringing it down to 26.5 C, may be overkill?



Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[simoh1490]

Kwasaki - I looked all over for those plastic grill inserts but couldn't find them in Thailand, easy enough to find in the UK however, especially on Ebay/Amazon. One of the problems with using those grills is that you need a lot of them to get the overall square footage up to a decent level. I started off using cooker hood vent grills but even those didn't amount to much in terms of square feet.

 

Sheryl - good choice for the RB. But you shouldn't be worried about the load capacity of the TH, my entire roof of concrete tiles is hanging off them! Ditto tears of the RB, it's pretty durable stuff which is not going to rip.

 

carlyai - as said I used seven of that style of grill initially and then stopped because of the size limitation and cost, one of the cooker hood external vents is 225 baht or so and you need loads of them. They do however have a mesh screen incorporated into the design so it's bug free, slotted eaves boards are all round a better way to go in terms of a solution, cost and design.

[wayned]

If I were Sheryl by now I would be so confused about putting on a new roof that I would have sold my house and built/bought a new one.

[simoh1490]

19 minutes ago, carlyai said:

So this is how I see the usefully/uslessness of the eves slatted thinggies in the grand scheme of things. I am trying to be helpful.

I've got a high pitched roof, with a very small roof air space, thermal barrier, 2" below roof tiles, red monier concrete roof tiles (maybe out of fashion, but red roofs were considered to be the best, that's why every house in Australia had red roofs in my era). Cavity brick wall, really expensive British Paints paint, thick bat insulation in the roof ends, a house full of ceiling fans, and my house still gets hot. In the hot season you can hardly keep your hand on the house outside wall, but the inside walls are/don't seem to be affected.
The trick, would seem, to not let the sun shine on your house, because whatever you do after that is just catchup. So if your house gets direct sunlight, putting in those slatted eves may not decrease the temperature...ie if it's a pain to put in all slatted vents (try and get a few in), if your house gets to 27 C then the slatted vents bringing it down to 26.5 C, may be overkill?



Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk
 

8

The physics of roof ventilation is absolutely undeniable, as is its application in lowering internal temperatures in a house. But like all physics you've got to do it properly, not take short cuts and calculate air flow in and out, none of which is difficult in this day and age. 

 

Regarding 27 degrees: my exhaust fan that is set into a gable end is on a thermostatic switch which typically activates at about 37 degrees and it will run for four or five hours after the sun goes down. If all we were talking about is upper floor temperatures of 27 degrees we wouldn't need any of the above, but we're not, we're talking easy 10 degrees more for sustained periods and that is with vented soffits!

[Sheryl]

OK. Do we all agree that whatever I do with the eave boards it can be done later, after the roof is on?

[simoh1490]

Agreed.

[Sheryl]

OK. If I can now turn the subject slightly, I am having huge headaches in terms of actually getting the roofing material.  Due to the far distance to supplier, I am not able to get the dealer to come to the house to measure and help me figure out what I need, will have to rely on measuring and providing drawings -- and the discussion around same all in Thai, dealer speaks no English at all and the workers are Khmer, speak less Thai than I do.

 

For the .760m panels I am not too concerned, I am sure we can measure accurately enough. It is the flashings that have me worried, and from brochures there seems to be a dizzying array of them. And it is a rather complicated roof as shown below. Obviously I need ridge cover flashing and measuring that should not be too hard. But there seem to be 7 other kinds of flashing as well: "steel junction flashing", "gable flashing", "eaves flashing",  "concrete junction flashing",  "end wall flashing", "corner covering" and "hip capping". I have no idea which of these I need, why, and where they go.

 

Because the material will be be delivered from a far distance (at 5,000 baht delivery cost on top of cost of materials) I would really, really like to avoid a situation where I discover after the fact that something more is needed.

 

Could someone familiar with this sort of roofing look at the pix above and tell me what type of flashing I need to put where? As you can see there are basically 4 roof sections that come together. On either end are   standard pitched roofs. In the front, these then join with a smaller/shorter pitched roof. There are very large (custom-sized, you  can guess why!) rain gutters on either side of the valley where the side roofs meet this middle roof. Unlike the two roofs at either end of the house, this smaller middle roof does not extend all the way back. Instead, in the back, there is yet another roof. Normal sized rain gutters in the valley between  the middle roof in the back and the roofs on either side.

 

Having never seen my house from the top I have no idea what there is in the place where the small middle roof in the front meets the middle roof in the back. Presumably a gutter that connects to the side gutters?

 

I had assumed I would just need ridge flashing and then some sort of flashing along all the seams where  roofs meet but after seeing this ling list of different flashing types I am no longer sure....

 

 

[simoh1490]

I'm sorry I can't help with your latest query but please feel free to email me if I can help with anything else in going forward. I think you might want to consider finding a new supplier since his lack of willingness to visit the site to specify the materials and his exorbitant delivery charge suggest he his trying it on....it may be a good move to do that in going forward as gaps in your requirements appear (as they do to all of us). All the best.

[carlyai]

I cant help either. Hopefully you can source a new supplier, and we all know getting someone good to do that tricky roof, is going to cost, and unfortunately may not be done correctly.

I think I read that you're getting Bluescope steel room, so there must be representative contractors around that roof for Bluescope.

Your roof looks like a specialist roof plumbing job, as you don't want any leaks and correct flashing.

You already know this, but you need to be patient and source the bluescope contractors, and, check over their job before you get them. (I waited months to get QCon 10 cm block installers and they were hopless, ended up doing it myself, and these were the recommended installer team for my area of Isaan.)

Just thinking, that shop in Burriram, Ransit...something, run by Bob I think, seems to have a very good reputation and can probably put you onto a contractor and supply your stuff.

If you are still having sourcing probs,@grollies may have a suggestion.

Sorry again.


Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, simoh1490 said:

I'm sorry I can't help with your latest query but please feel free to email me if I can help with anything else in going forward. I think you might want to consider finding a new supplier since his lack of willingness to visit the site to specify the materials and his exorbitant delivery charge suggest he his trying it on....it may be a good move to do that in going forward as gaps in your requirements appear (as they do to all of us). All the best.

Unfortunately the only other supplier who has what I need in stock and is within 8 hour roundtrip travel, is trying to charge even more. The 5000 delivery charge is sending from Rayong, it will be a 7 hour roundtrip drive of about 500 km.  From experience I would expect to pay about 3000 for that, so while it is excessive it is not that bad. 

 

The distance is also why I can't get them to send anyone here, even though I offered to pay.

 

There is only 1 supplier I have found (and I have called all of them that are within 8 hour travel) willing to come to the house to determine the needs, but he is asking 330 baht per sq meter versus 270 from the Rayong Supplier.  Bluesource co told me to expect about  270-290 per sq meter depending on dealer so Rayong price seems OK whereas the only other option (who would come to house) is outrageous and thus far refusing to bargain.

 

So I am sort of between a rock and a hard place. Either overpay for the material, or not have dealer help in estimating needs.

[Sheryl]

18 minutes ago, carlyai said:

I cant help either. Hopefully you can source a new supplier, and we all know getting someone good to do that tricky roof, is going to cost, and unfortunately may not be done correctly.

I think I read that you're getting Bluescope steel room, so there must be representative contractors around that roof for Bluescope.

Your roof looks like a specialist roof plumbing job, as you don't want any leaks and correct flashing.

You already know this, but you need to be patient and source the bluescope contractors, and, check over their job before you get them. (I waited months to get QCon 10 cm block installers and they were hopless, ended up doing it myself, and these were the recommended installer team for my area of Isaan.)

Just thinking, that shop in Burriram, Ransit...something, run by Bob I think, seems to have a very good reputation and can probably put you onto a contractor and supply your stuff.

If you are still having sourcing probs,@grollies may have a suggestion.

Sorry again.


Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk
 

 

There are some Bluesource trained contractors but, as with dealers, none remotely near where I live.

 

I have a team of contractors already and they are as good as it gets, in my (long and bitter) experience in home repairs and construction.. They are all Cambodian (which creates some time pressure as they have to travel here to do it and have limited timeframe) and  while they have never worked with Blusource they have done metal sheet roofs before. They also did a tile roof for me very, very well - in fact the only contractors I have ever had for whom I have not a single complaint.

 

The problem is that they speak only limited Thai and will not know, any more than I do, which of the various Bluescope flashings to request by name or exactly how they come.

[simoh1490]

My last thought on this,

 

Only option I can see is that you have someone get up on your roof with a tape measure pen and paper and measure every surface and make a very detailed plan, having them take photo's from different angles will also help. Then, plan a day or two day trip to see a supplier who can speak English and who is prepared to do the estimations and produce a product list of materials - you can then theoretically order from any supplier once you have those things. And if you get that estimation done at a central or head office, they may be able to help further in identifying the source and may be able to get a better rate for the transport. 

[carlyai]

My last thought on this,
 
Only option I can see is that you have someone get up on your roof with a tape measure pen and paper and measure every surface and make a very detailed plan, having them take photo's from different angles will also help. Then, plan a day or two day trip to see a supplier who can speak English and who is prepared to do the estimations and produce a product list of materials - you can then theoretically order from any supplier once you have those things. And if you get that estimation done at a central or head office, they may be able to help further in identifying the source and may be able to get a better rate for the transport. 

Great idea simoh1490.

With that information, the main Bangkok supplier of the roofing material should be able to make up a CAD drawing and estimate exactly what is required.

For my pool project I ordered Kera tiles, and the company reps visited, measured, made a computer generated drawing and supplied the tiles, cement, grout etc at about B 100/m2 less than I could buy at the big suppliers.

I'm 26 km from Kuchinari in a small village.

Hopefully you can get the same service.

Great you have a good crew...so difficult to find.

I'll contact a friend and see if he has an idea.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[Kwasaki]

15 hours ago, Sheryl said:

OK. If I can now turn the subject slightly, I am having huge headaches in terms of actually getting the roofing material.  Due to the far distance to supplier, I am not able to get the dealer to come to the house to measure and help me figure out what I need, will have to rely on measuring and providing drawings -- and the discussion around same all in Thai, dealer speaks no English at all and the workers are Khmer, speak less Thai than I do.

 

For the .760m panels I am not too concerned, I am sure we can measure accurately enough. It is the flashings that have me worried, and from brochures there seems to be a dizzying array of them. And it is a rather complicated roof as shown below. Obviously I need ridge cover flashing and measuring that should not be too hard. But there seem to be 7 other kinds of flashing as well: "steel junction flashing", "gable flashing", "eaves flashing",  "concrete junction flashing",  "end wall flashing", "corner covering" and "hip capping". I have no idea which of these I need, why, and where they go.

 

Because the material will be be delivered from a far distance (at 5,000 baht delivery cost on top of cost of materials) I would really, really like to avoid a situation where I discover after the fact that something more is needed.

 

Could someone familiar with this sort of roofing look at the pix above and tell me what type of flashing I need to put where? As you can see there are basically 4 roof sections that come together. On either end are   standard pitched roofs. In the front, these then join with a smaller/shorter pitched roof. There are very large (custom-sized, you  can guess why!) rain gutters on either side of the valley where the side roofs meet this middle roof. Unlike the two roofs at either end of the house, this smaller middle roof does not extend all the way back. Instead, in the back, there is yet another roof. Normal sized rain gutters in the valley between  the middle roof in the back and the roofs on either side.

 

Having never seen my house from the top I have no idea what there is in the place where the small middle roof in the front meets the middle roof in the back. Presumably a gutter that connects to the side gutters?

 

I had assumed I would just need ridge flashing and then some sort of flashing along all the seams where  roofs meet but after seeing this ling list of different flashing types I am no longer sure....

 

 

The terminology is a bit different in UK & Europe a bit like American differences.

I need a bit of time to explain what you need be that some of it are google illustrations which have been poo-poo'd already.

Many western materials as pix are available in Bkk.

As Annie Swats said l'll be back. 

[carlyai]

Just a thought on the picture from the top. Try Google Earth or Google Maps (google maps may be better). I discovered I can get a close up of my roof from Google Maps.
Discovered by accident when planning our walks up the trails to the mountains behind us.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[carlyai]

Sorry, I'm not a builder, but our house has a similar valley where the roofs meet. You have those two small roofs meeting the bigger roof, with 2 valleys going to the large guttering.

In my house, where the two roofs meet, there is a large sheet of bent metal colorbond, in the shape of a paper aeroplane coming at you. Two large wings, and a channel in the middle. This piece of 'flashing' goes the length of the channel. The wings need to be large because of all that water.
My first roofer built the flashing wings too small and it leaked, the second roofer removed the tiles around the valley, installed the bigger winged flashing and no more leaks.

Fortunately we had a fabricating place in Kuchinari, so you give them the dimensions of the bends etc and they make it.

If your roof didn't leak, why not use the same design flashing as used already?
Just need to remove a few valley tiles to have a look. Please tell me if I'm not being helpful and I'll stop.

I'll try and find my archived house pics if you need to see what I mean.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[Kwasaki]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Obviously I need ridge cover flashing and measuring that should not be too hard. But there seem to be 7 other kinds of flashing as well: "steel junction flashing", "gable flashing", "eaves flashing",  "concrete junction flashing",  "end wall flashing", "corner covering" and "hip capping". I have no idea which of these I need, why, and where they go.

To get accurate measurements and % pitches of the existing roof lengths an on site survey with a ladder is required if you do not have drawings of your existing house.

Your too far for me to carry that out as it is an easy task as it looks from pix it can mostly be done from the eaves with a ladder.

 

https://roofingsheetsbyrhino.com/flashings/

This site although not Thai shows most standard flashing's used in the construction of house adapted requirements.

Many people re-roof using what originally was for industrial builds.

Estimates can be made on lengths required barring in mine whether using 3 or 4 metre length flashing's, you can't always avoid cut off waste.

 

Here's other illustrations and descriptions l've written below.

OK Ridge capping obvious where this goes comes from different manufacturers in different press shaped profiles and different degrees to suit roof pitch (slope).

You need for your main roof and protruding gables on front elevation of house. 

Could be closely estimated from ground level measurements in your case. 

 

Eave flashing is use around all the perimeter of the house eaves.

Your existing fascia board needs to be inspected at roof removal time to determine whether reusable, if so renovate with treatment. 

Again could be closely estimated from ground level measurements in your case.

 

Two pictures of Gable flashing's or barge-boards (edge-trim) outside corner etc.

They come from different manufacturers in different press shaped profiles.

These are for your front protruding gables, looks like you could estimate length from your existing balcony.

 

The Fascia flashing could be used to cover your existing one which l don't know of what material after treatment, if fascia OK it will save painting maintenance if your existing needed doing so. Same measure as eaves flashing's.

 

Valley flashing's you will need either side of your front protruding gables best to renew if yours are 20 years, can be laid on old valley if suitably in reasonable condition. Measurement will be more than 1 gable length barge-board could be estimated maybe from loft area.  

 

Side / End wall flashing's will be used at the top of roof sheets within your front gable recesses where roof ends at recess gable wall.

Measurement could be estimated at ground level.

 

If you require further technical advice or more explanation no worries.

 

[grollies]

@Sheryl you tried these guys, based in Chachengsao. They are industrial but may do domestic.

 

https://www.thaisyncon.com/insulateroof-metalsheet

 

There must be suppliers closer by. There's a biggish roofing supplier near us about 40 mins south of Chachengsao. He presses his own steel. Don't know if he'll do a site visit but I can get the number if you want and ask him.

 

Also a friend in Nakon Nayok built a house last year with steel roof. I'll ask her where she sourced her materials.

 

Edited November 4, 2017 by grollies

[Sheryl]

8 hours ago, grollies said:

@Sheryl you tried these guys, based in Chachengsao. They are industrial but may do domestic.

 

https://www.thaisyncon.com/insulateroof-metalsheet

 

There must be suppliers closer by. There's a biggish roofing supplier near us about 40 mins south of Chachengsao. He presses his own steel. Don't know if he'll do a site visit but I can get the number if you want and ask him.

 

Also a friend in Nakon Nayok built a house last year with steel roof. I'll ask her where she sourced her materials.

 

Thanks, the problem is I want Bluescope Colorbond, not conventional metal sheet, and they don't carry it (I called).  I think I have at this point pretty well run to ground every place with Colorbond within a days drive of me. Most either did not have white/off-white color or had too little of it and were unwilling to order more (they have to order it in a giant roll and are afraid of being stuck with excess they can't sell).  One Bangkok supplier had it but staff were lethargic and ultra-disinterested, stated flatly they could not/would not arrange delivery and basically made it clear the last thing they wanted to do was make a sale (presumably these were not the owners!).  I have one more lead to chase down that was closed today, but otherwise it comes down to 2 suppliers, one willing (he says - communication is awful) to send someone out to look at the roof but charging an excessive price for the materials, the other reasonably priced but very far away (Rayong), charging a lot for delivery  and won't make site visit.

 

For now I went ahead and asked the former place to send someone out Monday, figure I'll see if he materializes and if so, how he gets on/communicates with my contractors (who arrive from Cambodian tomorrow - -with no roofing supplies yet here!)  and what sort of recommendations come out of it, if it seems sound then may again try to bargain a bit on the price.  If it doesn't then my only likely recourse is  working long distance with the Rayong place.  It is just hard to be sure when relying in pix and drawings sent by Line and all discussion in Thai, that they have really understood, and if there proves to be any piece lacking or in excess dealing with that will be costly and time consuming. (The roof design is unusual because a 4th roof was retrofitted over what was designed as an open area.) I might even simultaneously send drawings to Rayong and compare what the two places advise...usually I hate to do that (put businesses to a lot of trouble knowing I may not buy from them) but I'm getting pressed for options here.

[Sheryl]

10 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

To get accurate measurements and % pitches of the existing roof lengths an on site survey with a ladder is required if you do not have drawings of your existing house.

Your too far for me to carry that out as it is an easy task as it looks from pix it can mostly be done from the eaves with a ladder.

 

https://roofingsheetsbyrhino.com/flashings/

This site although not Thai shows most standard flashing's used in the construction of house adapted requirements.

Many people re-roof using what originally was for industrial builds.

Estimates can be made on lengths required barring in mine whether using 3 or 4 metre length flashing's, you can't always avoid cut off waste.

 

Here's other illustrations and descriptions l've written below.

OK Ridge capping obvious where this goes comes from different manufacturers in different press shaped profiles and different degrees to suit roof pitch (slope).

You need for your main roof and protruding gables on front elevation of house. 

Could be closely estimated from ground level measurements in your case. 

 

Eave flashing is use around all the perimeter of the house eaves.

Your existing fascia board needs to be inspected at roof removal time to determine whether reusable, if so renovate with treatment. 

Again could be closely estimated from ground level measurements in your case.

 

Two pictures of Gable flashing's or barge-boards (edge-trim) outside corner etc.

They come from different manufacturers in different press shaped profiles.

These are for your front protruding gables, looks like you could estimate length from your existing balcony.

 

The Fascia flashing could be used to cover your existing one which l don't know of what material after treatment, if fascia OK it will save painting maintenance if your existing needed doing so. Same measure as eaves flashing's.

 

Valley flashing's you will need either side of your front protruding gables best to renew if yours are 20 years, can be laid on old valley if suitably in reasonable condition. Measurement will be more than 1 gable length barge-board could be estimated maybe from loft area.  

 

Side / End wall flashing's will be used at the top of roof sheets within your front gable recesses where roof ends at recess gable wall.

Measurement could be estimated at ground level.

 

If you require further technical advice or more explanation no worries.

 

Thanks. So if I understand what you are saying, I do need gable and eaves flashing, and also need fascia flashing,  and should have had it in the first place (and possibly as a result, the fascia will prove in need of replacement - it seems to be wood). 

 

Q: Am I understanding rightly that gable flashing, eaves flashing etc are basically  the same thing, just trim on the edges of the roof and named according to where it goes?

 

Q. Do eaves flashing seal the eaves space? Because I thought it was important to leave that for ventilation??? (Hence the long discussion around the plastic wavy thingies to keep out birds and rats).

 

Bluescope does not use the term "valley flashing", this is the sort of thing that is driving me bonkers knowing that I have to order long distance. I think (but not totally sure) that what they term "steel junction flashing" would be the same thing, as I was told this goes wherever 2 different steel sheets meet.

 

I am assuming all these flashings come in different shapes and have to be ordered by the correct name., which is a big worry when ordering from far away -iIf  in fact all these flashings are the same starting material and just applied differently to fit the specific location then less concern...

 

Q: are these flashings different in size and shape to begin with (from the supplier) or is are they just molded to shape onsite out of lengths of metal sheet

 

 Since the contractors who did my original roof applied no flashings except in the valleys and on the roof ridges, I am not sure I can take it for granted my contractors will know to do so unless I specify I want it.  Even today, contractors where I live  do not seem to routinely apply eave,  gable or fascias flashings from what I have seen. In fact, none of the houses around me have them, thisis the first I have heard of the existence of such things.  And I have been in blissful (but perhaps soon to be shattered) innocence of any adverse effect from their lack these past 20 years...

 

 

 

 

[Sheryl]

12 hours ago, carlyai said:

Sorry, I'm not a builder, but our house has a similar valley where the roofs meet. You have those two small roofs meeting the bigger roof, with 2 valleys going to the large guttering.

In my house, where the two roofs meet, there is a large sheet of bent metal colorbond, in the shape of a paper aeroplane coming at you. Two large wings, and a channel in the middle. This piece of 'flashing' goes the length of the channel. The wings need to be large because of all that water.
My first roofer built the flashing wings too small and it leaked, the second roofer removed the tiles around the valley, installed the bigger winged flashing and no more leaks.

Fortunately we had a fabricating place in Kuchinari, so you give them the dimensions of the bends etc and they make it.

If your roof didn't leak, why not use the same design flashing as used already?
Just need to remove a few valley tiles to have a look. Please tell me if I'm not being helpful and I'll stop.

I'll try and find my archived house pics if you need to see what I mean.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk
 

Oh it leaked all right! Think of the final scenes inside the ship in "Titanic" and that was the interior of my house after the 4th (small, middle) roof was retro-fitted on.  It was a nightmare ultimately resolved by special ordering some gigantic sized custom gutters, and my biggest fear in this replacement is of that system which has (knock on wood) functioned well ever since being in any way disturbed On the other hand if it is a chance to put in a wider valley that may be for the better. The truth is that it is a huge design flaw, there should not be,  as there is, 4 roofs coming together near the front of the house (which is the direction all the rain comes from). It was designed to have only 3 come together and that already was a huge mistake for this location, realized too late, and the only way to address it without major structural revisions was to add a fourth.

[carlyai]

Maybe a visit to the BlueScope factory in Map Ta Phut is required? With your drawings and Cambodian foreman.

Did you get a pic of your roof top from Google Maps? You need mobile reception, then click on your location on the map and zoom in.




Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[simoh1490]

My ten cents on this: I strongly suspect that very few flashings in Thailand are standard off the shelf designs, the huge variations in roof design, pitch and angles means a standard design is not possible in many cases. If you visit a shop that makes rainwater gutterings and downpipes you will likely see that they also fabricate flashings, it's the same material in many cases, the shop I use for guttering certainly does. The other thing is that flashing is not rocket science and rolls of zinc oxide coated steel are available very cheaply, any roofer who is also handy can almost certainly fabricate his own in many cases. In terms of importance I think the ridge and valley flashings are extremely important, the side/end flashing are important but the eaves and fascia flashings much less so, in fact, I don't think I've ever seen them installed on a roof here. Also, a cement ridge can be easily substituted for the gable flashing, it is on my house and it works well.

[carlyai]

I just looked at YouTube and they have many videos on colorbond roofing flashing and metal roof flashing.
They also show the roof underlay, which I'm not sure got a mention before. Underlay will help prevent leaks into the house.


Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk